History YMMV / PokemonGoldAndSilver

13th Nov '17 3:38:13 PM MayIncon
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** ''Gold and Silver'' were the first games to introduce time as an integral mechanic to the series. From the pallet shifts between day and night, daily and weekly events in the overworld to affecting Pokémon encounters, how effective certain moves were and even how certain Pokémon evolve. These additions were so important that nearly every game after had some way to keep track of time (although this was downplayed in ''Ruby and Sapphire'' and absent in ''Fire Red and Leaf Green'').

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** ''Gold ''Gold'' and Silver'' ''Silver'' were the first games to introduce time as an integral mechanic to the series. From the pallet shifts between day and night, daily and weekly events in the overworld to affecting Pokémon encounters, how effective certain moves were and even how certain Pokémon evolve. These additions were so important that nearly every game after had some way to keep track of time (although this was time. The day-night cycle being downplayed in ''Ruby ''Ruby'', ''Sapphire'' and Sapphire'' ''Emerald'' and absent in ''Fire Red Red'' and Leaf Green'').''Leaf Green'' is met with negative reception.
13th Nov '17 2:01:44 PM rjd1922
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* GeniusProgramming: In development, the game filled up the entire cartridge despite only being half-finished. Satoru Iwata, former president of Creator/{{Nintendo}}, singlehandedly did some very heavy compression to save the project from being released as an ObviousBeta. When he was done, there was enough space in the cartridge to include all of Kanto. To summarize, thanks to Iwata, this game has twice as big a setting region-wise as every other Pokémon game released until the remakes.

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* GeniusProgramming: In development, the game filled up the entire cartridge despite only being half-finished. Satoru Iwata, former Creator/SatoruIwata, then president of Creator/HALLaboratory and later president of Creator/{{Nintendo}}, singlehandedly did some very heavy compression to save the project from being released as an ObviousBeta. When he was done, there was enough space in the cartridge to include all of Kanto. To summarize, thanks to Iwata, this game has twice as big a setting region-wise as every other Pokémon game released until the remakes.
12th Nov '17 6:33:18 PM Isaac_Heller
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* VindicatedByHistory: At the time of release, ''[=HeartGold=]'' and ''[=SoulSilver=]'' were very well-received, but there was some debate in the fandom on whether they were better than the original Gen II games or not, with many people continuing to support the originals due to [[NostalgiaFilter nostalgia]]. Over time, the Gen II fandom waned, and ''HGSS'' not only became unanimously agreed to be better than the originals, but also became one of the top candidates for the best games in the series.
* WhatDoYouMeanItsForKids: A staple of the series, in this case it's present with [[spoiler:Giovanni's implied suicide]].

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* VindicatedByHistory: At the time of release, ''[=HeartGold=]'' and ''[=SoulSilver=]'' were very well-received, but there was some debate in the fandom on whether they were better than the original Gen II games or not, with many people continuing to support the originals due to [[NostalgiaFilter nostalgia]]. Over time, the Gen II fandom waned, and ''HGSS'' not only became unanimously widely agreed to be better than the originals, but also became one of the top candidates for the best games in the series.
* WhatDoYouMeanItsForKids: A staple of the series, in this case it's present with [[spoiler:Giovanni's implied suicide]].
series.
12th Nov '17 6:23:48 PM Isaac_Heller
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** Many people agree that this is when the ''Pokémon'' game franchise became ''really'' good in terms of playability, and to this day it's still the generation with the highest Gamerankings score along with Generation I (and is widely believed to be superior than Gen I). It's widely agreed that the Johto games and their remakes are among the best games in the series; ''[=HeartGold=]'' and ''[=SoulSilver=]'' are often cited as the best ''Pokémon'' games overall, to the point that they're the only ones that fans of both the older and newer generations tend to agree on.

to:

** Many people agree that this is when the ''Pokémon'' game franchise became ''really'' good in terms of playability, and to this day it's still the generation with the highest Gamerankings score along with Generation I (and is widely believed to be superior than Gen I). It's widely agreed that the Johto games and their remakes are among the best games in the series; ''[=HeartGold=]'' and ''[=SoulSilver=]'' are also often cited as the best ''Pokémon'' games overall, to the point that they're the only ones that fans of both the older and newer generations tend to agree on.



** Gold and Silver were the first games to introduce time as an integral mechanic to the series. From the pallet shifts between day and night, daily and weekly events in the overworld to affecting Pokémon encounters, how effective certain moves were and even how certain Pokémon evolve. These additions were so important that nearly every game after had some way to keep track of time (although this was downplayed in ''Ruby and Sapphire'' and absent in ''Fire Red and Leaf Green'').

to:

** Gold ''Gold and Silver Silver'' were the first games to introduce time as an integral mechanic to the series. From the pallet shifts between day and night, daily and weekly events in the overworld to affecting Pokémon encounters, how effective certain moves were and even how certain Pokémon evolve. These additions were so important that nearly every game after had some way to keep track of time (although this was downplayed in ''Ruby and Sapphire'' and absent in ''Fire Red and Leaf Green'').
7th Nov '17 5:12:58 PM MayIncon
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** Feraligatr is a big one, moreso than any other starter. The entire game can be turned into a giant CurbStompBattle with its surprisingly good movepool for this generation (Ice Punch trivializes both the rival and the last gym). Worse, the only two gyms out of 16 that this Pokémon has a disadvantage at are in the post-game and relatively easy. ThatOneBoss, Whitney, struggles to counter a well-raised Water-type. It can breeze through the Elite Four with its HUGE movepool and [[LightningBruiser fast and strong attacks for this generation]], curbstomping [[UpToEleven EVEN THE CHAMPION]] (Hello, [[AnIcePerson Ice Punch]]). This Pokémon alone is the reason some found this gen easy, and it is even a common criticism of Gen II's balancing issues in the wake of some HypeBacklash. Even in the remakes, with better balancing, it is still one tough Mon to best.

to:

** Feraligatr is a big one, moreso than any other starter. The entire game can be turned into a giant CurbStompBattle with its surprisingly good movepool for this generation (Ice Punch trivializes both the rival and the last gym). Worse, the only two gyms out of 16 that this Pokémon has a disadvantage at are in the post-game and relatively easy. ThatOneBoss, Whitney, struggles to counter a well-raised Water-type. It can breeze through the Elite Four with its HUGE movepool and [[LightningBruiser fast and strong attacks for this generation]], curbstomping [[UpToEleven EVEN THE CHAMPION]] (Hello, [[AnIcePerson Ice Punch]]). It reaches its final form at level 30, the earliest among the starters in the entire series. This Pokémon alone is the reason some found this gen easy, and it is even a common criticism of Gen II's balancing issues in the wake of some HypeBacklash. Even in the remakes, with better balancing, it is still one tough Mon to best.
3rd Nov '17 11:59:07 AM Retloclive
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* ItsTheSameSoItSucks: A common criticism towards this generation is its over-reliance on Gen I Pokémon, making many of Gen II's fall into obscurity. Many of them are [[GuideDangIt not used by trainers]], some can only be found under conditions that are not recorded in the Pokédex[[labelnote: *]]fishing and headbutting trees[[/labelnote]], some are [[MetalSlime swarm-exclusive]][[labelnote: *]] which requires [[ScrappyMechanic some specific trainers' phone numbers in order to trigger said swarm]][[/labelnote]] and some of them are only [[BraggingRightsReward exclusive to the post-game]]. Up to this day there are fans who thought that Skarmory and the Slugma lines for example originate from [[VideoGame/PokemonRubyAndSapphire Hoenn]] as they're much more common over there.

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* ItsTheSameSoItSucks: ItsTheSameSoItSucks:
**
A common criticism towards this generation is its over-reliance on Gen I Pokémon, making many of Gen II's fall into obscurity. Many of them are [[GuideDangIt not used by trainers]], some can only be found under conditions that are not recorded in the Pokédex[[labelnote: *]]fishing and headbutting trees[[/labelnote]], some are [[MetalSlime swarm-exclusive]][[labelnote: *]] which requires [[ScrappyMechanic some specific trainers' phone numbers in order to trigger said swarm]][[/labelnote]] and some of them are only [[BraggingRightsReward exclusive to the post-game]]. Up to this day there are fans who thought that Skarmory and the Slugma lines for example originate from [[VideoGame/PokemonRubyAndSapphire Hoenn]] as they're much more common over there.there.
** A majority of the Johto gym Pokémon being from Gen I is seen as quite disappointing since there's many Johto Pokémon that could have been used on the gym teams. Falkner, Bugsy, Morty and Chuck don't even use a single Johto Pokémon on their team.


Added DiffLines:

** The remakes were a perfect opportunity to fix up the Johto gym leader teams to have more Pokémon from the region they're in. However, apart from a few level changes, and one of Clair's Dragonairs being replaced with a Gyarados, the teams stayed the same.
31st Oct '17 9:22:30 AM PDL
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** A controversial introduction was Baby Pokemon. Cuteness aside, they are often viewed as utterly irrelevant because they ultimately evolve (usually via [[ScrappyMechanic happiness]]) into an already existing Pokemon, likely one that you had to breed (often with certain incenses in later generations) to get the baby in the first place. Generally, the only incentive to hatching them outside of filling the Pokedex is that they learn good moves that their evolved forms would miss out on, like Pichu learning [[StatusBuff Nasty Plot]].

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** A controversial introduction was Baby Pokemon. Cuteness aside, they are often viewed as utterly irrelevant because they ultimately evolve (usually via [[ScrappyMechanic happiness]]) into an already existing Pokemon, likely one that you had to breed (often with certain incenses in later generations) to get the baby in the first place. Generally, the only incentive to hatching them outside of filling the Pokedex is that they learn good moves that their evolved forms would miss out on, like Pichu learning [[StatusBuff Nasty Plot]]. Breeding Pokémon with baby forms for competitive use also adds an extra step as the babies are unable to breed themselves and need to evolve into a form that can, unlike other Pokémon that can breed automatically.
19th Oct '17 7:02:33 PM MandL27
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** In the Rocket Hideout, at one point you're attacked by two grunts who claim that you cannot take on them both at once. Come next generation, and you have "double battles", with the protagonist routinely taking on two trainers at the same time.

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** In the Rocket Hideout, at one point you're attacked by two grunts who claim that you cannot take on them both at once. Come next generation, and you have "double battles", with the protagonist routinely taking on two trainers at the same time. Appropriately, the same scene in the remakes turns the encounter into a double battle.
3rd Oct '17 11:48:05 AM Kayube
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* BrokenBase: The conspicuous absence of ''Crystal'' on the Virtual Console has caused this. Either one is fine with this as releasing [[UpdatedRerelease what is meant to be the definitive version]] would logically hamper sales of the other two versions, or one sees it as Nintendo holding it back for the sole purpose of releasing it later, prompting buyers to double-dip for it.

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* BrokenBase: The conspicuous absence of ''Crystal'' on the Virtual Console has caused this. Either one is fine with this as releasing [[UpdatedRerelease what is meant to be the definitive version]] would logically hamper sales of the other two versions, versions (note that ''Yellow'' was released at the same time as ''Red'' and ''Blue'' and has been by far the best seller of the three), or one sees it as Nintendo holding it back for the sole purpose of releasing it later, prompting buyers to double-dip for it.
30th Sep '17 8:14:48 AM N8han11
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** Typhlosion is no slouch in the remakes. Fast, access to a lot of strong Fire-type moves early on, benefits more from sunlight, and packs the absolutely devastating Eruption, which will likely [[OneHitKO one-shot anything within five levels.]] It helps that, like Feraligatr, plenty of gyms have a weakness to it, no less than 4 out of 16, compared to Feraligatr's 2 out of 16. (The only three which are resistant are the final gym (fair enough), and the two post-game ones. Prior to the Physical-Special split it even benefits from a great coverage in Thunder Punch! This and Feraligatr's aforementioned Ice Punch is likely the reason elemental punches are much harder to obtain in subsequent generations when they lost their TM status. Although, it is much less this than Feraligatr was in the originals thanks to much better competitive balance, keeping it from being absolutely broken.

to:

** Typhlosion is no slouch in the remakes. Fast, access to a lot of strong Fire-type moves early on, benefits more from sunlight, and packs the absolutely devastating Eruption, which will likely [[OneHitKO one-shot anything within five levels.]] It helps that, like Feraligatr, plenty of gyms have a weakness to it, no less than 4 out of 16, compared to Feraligatr's 2 out of 16. (The only three which are resistant are the final gym (fair enough), and the two post-game ones. Prior to the Physical-Special split it even benefits from a great coverage in Thunder Punch! This and Feraligatr's aforementioned Ice Punch is likely the reason elemental punches are much harder to obtain in subsequent generations when they lost their TM status. Although, it is much less this than Feraligatr was in the originals thanks to much better competitive balance, keeping it from being absolutely broken.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=YMMV.PokemonGoldAndSilver