History YMMV / FateApocrypha

20th May '18 4:17:50 PM eagle108
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** The haunting and almost melancholic beginning that gradually climbs to a determined resolvement of "[[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ensGipNnSU La Pucelle]]".
14th May '18 4:39:55 PM keyblade333
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** There has been debate about Jeanne's growing feelings for Sieg. While the final episode makes it clear [[spoiler: any romantic feelings come from Jeanne herself]], there's debate on how much Laeticia had to do with bringing them out in the open.

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** There has been debate about Jeanne's growing feelings for Sieg. While the final episode makes it clear [[spoiler: has Laeticia state that any romantic feelings come from Jeanne herself]], herself, there's debate on how much Laeticia had to do with bringing them out in the open.open. While Laeticia says it was all from Jeanne, it is important to note that Laeticia does influence a bit of Jeanne's personality, so it its possible that Laeticia might of developed some amount of feelings for Sieg that rubbed off on Jeanne.
11th May '18 9:17:36 PM ergeis
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*** A minor point but Shirou [[spoiler: was originally a servant to an Einzbern homunculous and was distraught when the latter was killed by Darnic. Anybody who was fond of the other Einzbern homunculi tend to be slightly biased in favor of Shirou.]]
11th May '18 3:43:38 PM mizorefan
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** Taking aside the fact that it's being made by [[Creator/A1Pictures A-1]] [[BrokenBase Pictures]], the Apocrypha anime gets hit with this hard when compared to the Creator/{{Ufotable}} anime adaptations of ''LightNovel/FateZero'' and ''VisualNovel/FateStayNight''. Heck, it's even compared to the 2006 FSN anime by Creator/StudioDEEN which some consider to be still better than the Apocrypha anime. It doesn't help that the story and characters of Apocrypha are considered lacking in comparison to FSN and Zero. It reached the point that several people were bashing ''Nasu himself'' for giving praise to the fight scenes in [[CriticalDissonance Episode 22]], despite the fact that if ''anyone'' would be qualified to judge the series, it would be him.

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** Taking aside the fact that it's being made by [[Creator/A1Pictures A-1]] [[BrokenBase Pictures]], the Apocrypha anime gets hit with this hard when compared to the Creator/{{Ufotable}} anime adaptations of ''LightNovel/FateZero'' and ''VisualNovel/FateStayNight''. Heck, it's even compared to the 2006 FSN anime and 2010 FSN UBW movie by Creator/StudioDEEN which some consider to be still better than the Apocrypha anime. It doesn't help that the story and characters of Apocrypha are considered lacking in comparison to FSN and Zero. It reached the point that several people were bashing ''Nasu himself'' for giving praise to the fight scenes in [[CriticalDissonance Episode 22]], despite the fact that if ''anyone'' would be qualified to judge the series, it would be him.
8th May '18 10:34:16 PM Nouct
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** The idea of Shirou Kotomine, being an AlternateUniverse version of [[LightNovel/FateStayNight Shirou Emiya]] that was raised by Kotomine and thus grew up to become a member of the Church, is an interesting idea that could of been used by the story to explore the ideas of an AlternateUniverse that still has connections to the original story, while also providing a {{Deconstruction}} of Shirou's beliefs and actions. It would of been unique to have the protagonist of the original continuity face off with the protagonists of the new setting, and help develop the world more than it was already. [[spoiler: Instead, Shirou Kotomine is the Heroic Spirit Amakusa Shirou Tokisada, meaning that the entire point of his name was a RedHerring to bait viewers, leaving Shirou Emiya's fate a mystery as a result]].

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** The idea of Shirou Kotomine, being an AlternateUniverse version of [[LightNovel/FateStayNight Shirou Emiya]] that was raised by Kotomine and thus grew up to become a member of the Church, is an interesting idea that could of been used by the story to explore the ideas of an AlternateUniverse that still has connections to the original story, while also providing a {{Deconstruction}} of Shirou's beliefs and actions. It would of been unique to have the protagonist of the original continuity face off with the protagonists of the new setting, and help develop the world more than it was already. [[spoiler: Instead, Shirou Kotomine is the Heroic Spirit Amakusa Shirou Tokisada, meaning that the entire point of his name was a RedHerring to bait viewers, leaving viewers. The real Shirou Emiya's Emiya is only given lip service in the material books, having not gone through the same fate a mystery as a result]].his counterpart.]]
7th May '18 9:37:34 PM Prometheus117
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** Sieg is this for Western and Chinese fans. Some like him and consider him an interesting take on Nasuverse protagonists with a good arc that fleshes him out into a hero, but others think of him as a bland, badly-written CanonSue character whose presence in the story is barely felt and takes time away from other, more interesting characters (most prominently, Siegfried himself), and keeps getting undeserved power ups from characters that don't even know him (most blatantly, Fran's sacrifice that ''somehow'' empowered him). Comparisons to the worst traits of [[VisualNovel/FateStayNight Shirou Emiya]] are common. His pairing with Jeanne is also controversial--either it's enjoyable and similar to Shirou and Artoria's relationship, or it's forced and cringey. It's to the point that his voice actor Creator/NatsukiHanae has promised to try and make Sieg as likeable as possible. On the other hand the Japanese like him well enough, to the point that he managed to score 6th place in a popularity poll held by the Newtype magazine.[[note]]Though thanks to the magazine's reputation among some circles, people call into question how accurate said poll was.[[/note]] [[TakeAThirdOption There's also another camp]] that believes that Sieg as a protagonist could work and had potential, but the writer was unable to convey it well, so they depend for an eventual collaboration with ''VideoGame/FateGrandOrder'' to unleash his potential.

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** Sieg is this for Western and Chinese fans. Some like him and consider him an interesting take on Nasuverse protagonists with a good arc that fleshes him out into a hero, hero from the almost literal BlankSlate he started out as, but others think of him as a bland, badly-written CanonSue character whose presence in the story is barely felt and takes time away from other, more interesting characters (most prominently, Siegfried himself), and keeps getting undeserved power ups from characters that don't even know him (most blatantly, Fran's sacrifice that ''somehow'' empowered him). Comparisons to the worst traits of [[VisualNovel/FateStayNight Shirou Emiya]] are common. His pairing with Jeanne is also controversial--either it's enjoyable and similar to Shirou and Artoria's relationship, or it's forced and cringey. It's to the point that his voice actor Creator/NatsukiHanae has promised to try and make Sieg as likeable as possible. On the other hand the Japanese like him well enough, to the point that he managed to score 6th place in a popularity poll held by the Newtype magazine.[[note]]Though thanks to the magazine's reputation among some circles, people call into question how accurate said poll was.[[/note]] [[TakeAThirdOption There's also another camp]] that believes that Sieg as a protagonist could work and had potential, but the writer was unable to convey it well, so they depend for an eventual collaboration with ''VideoGame/FateGrandOrder'' to unleash his potential.[[note]]Judging from the positive response to the Apo collab ''Inheritance of Glory'', they were quite right.[[/note]]
7th May '18 2:23:56 PM keyblade333
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** The idea of Shirou Kotomine, being an AlternativeUniverse version of [[LightNovel/FateStayNight Shirou Emiya]] that was raised by Kotomine and thus grew up to become a member of the Church, is an interesting idea that could of been used by the story to explore the ideas of an AlternativeUniverse that still has connections to the original story, while also providing a {{Deconstruction}} of Shirou's beliefs and actions. It would of been unique to have the protagonist of the original continuity face off with the protagonists of the new setting, and help develop the world more than it was already. [[spoiler: Instead, Shirou Kotomine is the Heroic Spirit Amakusa Shirou Tokisada, meaning that the entire point of his name was a RedHerring to bait viewers, leaving Shirou Emiya's fate a mystery as a result]].

to:

** The idea of Shirou Kotomine, being an AlternativeUniverse AlternateUniverse version of [[LightNovel/FateStayNight Shirou Emiya]] that was raised by Kotomine and thus grew up to become a member of the Church, is an interesting idea that could of been used by the story to explore the ideas of an AlternativeUniverse AlternateUniverse that still has connections to the original story, while also providing a {{Deconstruction}} of Shirou's beliefs and actions. It would of been unique to have the protagonist of the original continuity face off with the protagonists of the new setting, and help develop the world more than it was already. [[spoiler: Instead, Shirou Kotomine is the Heroic Spirit Amakusa Shirou Tokisada, meaning that the entire point of his name was a RedHerring to bait viewers, leaving Shirou Emiya's fate a mystery as a result]].
7th May '18 2:23:12 PM keyblade333
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Added DiffLines:

** The idea of Shirou Kotomine, being an AlternativeUniverse version of [[LightNovel/FateStayNight Shirou Emiya]] that was raised by Kotomine and thus grew up to become a member of the Church, is an interesting idea that could of been used by the story to explore the ideas of an AlternativeUniverse that still has connections to the original story, while also providing a {{Deconstruction}} of Shirou's beliefs and actions. It would of been unique to have the protagonist of the original continuity face off with the protagonists of the new setting, and help develop the world more than it was already. [[spoiler: Instead, Shirou Kotomine is the Heroic Spirit Amakusa Shirou Tokisada, meaning that the entire point of his name was a RedHerring to bait viewers, leaving Shirou Emiya's fate a mystery as a result]].
3rd May '18 7:16:42 PM n3xus
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* NoYay: Most Astolfo fans don't like to pair him with Celenike at all, due to her [[BadBoss treatment]] [[BondageIsBad towards him]].

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* NoYay: Most Astolfo fans don't like to pair him with Celenike at all, due to her [[BadBoss treatment]] [[BondageIsBad towards towards]] [[RapeIsASpecialKindOfEvil him]].
3rd May '18 7:15:03 PM n3xus
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* NoYay: Most Astolfo fans don't like to pair him with Celenike at all, due to her [[RapeIsASpecialkindOfEvil treatment towards him]].

to:

* NoYay: Most Astolfo fans don't like to pair him with Celenike at all, due to her [[RapeIsASpecialkindOfEvil treatment [[BadBoss treatment]] [[BondageIsBad towards him]].
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=YMMV.FateApocrypha