Follow TV Tropes

Following

History WMG / TheLionKing1994

Go To

OR

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None





to:

\n\n*Having a crown princess makes a lot more sense than trying to superimpose the human tradition of male heirs onto this lion pride. Imagine that Nala was the crown princess, and that Scar killed Mufasa solely for the sake of overthrowing Mufasa--with the added bonus that it helped him drive off Simba, which he would have done anyway (Disneyfication of the IRL lion habit of killing the old alpha male's progeny). Furthermore, it explains what happened to Kopa between films--he simply grew up (being Kiara's older brother) and went off to find a pride of his own to rule. Meanwhile, Kiara became the new crown princess, and it was expected that she would marry a Pride lion or a rogue male (such as Kovu pretended to be) and eventually rule beside him.


Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


The lionesses refuse to hunt for Scar as part of a protest. So the ones that ARE loyal to him are the ones to go out and hunt. This causes them to be away for the fight scene. During one of these extended hunts, they come across a rogue. Lionesses sometimes mate with other males when the leader isn't around. Zira mates, as she wants to make sure the genepool stays diverse enough so that none of Scar's heirs have to leave, especially if the child he has impregnated Nala's mother with is female. (Despite the whole reprise thing, it couldn't be Nala, due to her obvious non-pregnantness when she finds Simba) Scar is so delighted at both this and her loyalty, she names the child heir instead of Nuka, who was incompetent and frail, which is why he did nothing for Scar during the battle with Simba, opting to tell the Scar-Loyalists instead so they could be prepared (pun not intended) upon returning, and his frailty and stupidity are also why Simba drives him out instead of killing or at least severely injuring him, as Simba knows he will never pose a threat. When the lionesses return from their interrupted hunt, they are banished, along with Nuka and the newly-born, recessively-eyed Vitani, who would technically be Nala's half-sister. Zira's rogue pregnancy could have happened near the end of the hunt before the one they go on at the time of the battle, putting Kovu's conception right around the time of Kiara's, if you assume that she was conceived during 'Can You Feel the Love Tonight' and that the lionesses went on multiple hunts within a short time, as crossing the desert probably took at least a week, and with the food shortage, hunts would need to be more frequent to feed everybody. Unfortunately, I could not work this to also include Kopa. I wish I could've.

to:

The lionesses refuse to hunt for Scar as part of a protest. So the ones that ARE loyal to him are the ones to go out and hunt. This causes them to be away for the fight scene. During one of these extended hunts, they come across a rogue. Lionesses sometimes mate with other males when the leader isn't around. Zira mates, as she wants to make sure the genepool stays diverse enough so that none of Scar's heirs have to leave, especially if the child he has impregnated Nala's mother with is female. (Despite the whole reprise thing, it couldn't be Nala, due to her obvious non-pregnantness when she finds Simba) Scar is so delighted at both this and her loyalty, she names the child heir instead of Nuka, who was incompetent and frail, which is why he did nothing for Scar during the battle with Simba, opting to tell the Scar-Loyalists instead so they could be prepared (pun not intended) upon returning, and his frailty and stupidity are also why Simba drives him out instead of killing or at least severely injuring him, as Simba knows he will never pose a threat. When the lionesses return from their interrupted hunt, they are banished, along with Nuka and the newly-born, recessively-eyed Vitani, who would technically be Nala's half-sister. Zira's rogue pregnancy could have happened near the end of the hunt before the one they go on at the time of the battle, putting Kovu's conception right around the time of Kiara's, if you assume that she was conceived during 'Can You Feel the Love Tonight' and that the lionesses went on multiple hunts within a short time, as crossing the desert probably took at least a week, and with the food shortage, hunts would need to be more frequent to feed everybody. Unfortunately, I could not work this to also include Kopa. I wish I could've.could've.

[[WMG: Mufasa caused the drought.]]
Recall the clouds Mufasa used to show himself to Simba with? I say he has been saving it up for a long time, drying out the Pride Lands.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None



to:

* Scar and Mufasa are full siblings. Scar's appearance comes from his father Ahadi according to the text of ''A Tale of Two Brothers''(despite what's depicted in the art). Kovu might be related to one of Scar's Half Siblings(whoever they are).

Added: 1869

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Guess edited

Added DiffLines:



[[WMG: Alternative Kopa/Kiara explanation]]
The end of The Lion King takes place after The Lion King 2. Instead of Kopa being murdered by Zira as typically assumed, he wasn't born yet. Kiara was born during the "reconstruction era" of Simba's reign, where the defecting lionessess would have been a force equal to the loyalists.

Evidence against canon:
*Canon “truth” is that Kiara was the cub born at the end of Lion King.
**The story books that included Kopa should either be disregarded or reimagined with Kiara.

*Cubs are born at different times of the day.
**Self-explanatory.

*Cubs are given different coloration
** Compare Simba to Mufasa or the cub at the end of Lion King to Simba at the beginning of Lion King. Even if we included Scar/Kovu/Nuka in the equation it’s fairly obvious that male and female Lions are given different colorations (Male: Gold and Brown/Red and Black) (Female: Offwhite/Pale/Peach). Kiara’s “feminine” coloration is obscured yet visible at the beginning of Lion King 2.

Evidence against the “Kiara is the younger cub” theory:
*Official fanon states that Kiara the younger cub.

*Kovu was born before Scar died.
** Kovu knew who Scar was (or at least what he looked like). And unless Zira was lying, Scar chose him as his Heir.
*Kovu and Kiara are around the same age
** We can assume Kovu is a bit older, yet we see them grow up around the same time in the Movie’s timeline (Kovu is a cub while Kiara is a cub, rather than being in the “teenage” Lion stage we saw with Simba in Lion King (1 and 1.5)).

*Timon and Pumbaa
** They seem to be more concerned about Kiara’s birth more so than the cub at the end of Lion King. With Kiara’s birth they fanaticize about the old days with Simba. With “fluffy’s”(Kopa’s) birth they are more concerned with the fanfare.

*Simba likely wouldn’t ignore the death of his first cub if he died by Zira’s hands (paws).

Removed: 845

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Folder is successful, revamping my old guess


[[WMG: Another Kopa/Kiara explanation]]
The end of The Lion King takes place after The Lion King 2. Instead of Kopa being murdered by Zira as typically assumed, perhaps he wasn't born yet. Kiara was born during the "reconstruction era" of Simba's reign, where the defecting lionessess would have been a force equal to the loyalists.
* Simba had only recently become King and things weren't much better than they were under Scar's reign (sort of like what happens between presidential elections).
** On the other hand, maybe they attributed the miraculous regrowth to Scar's wisdom of remaining on pride rock.
* The end of lion king 2 takes place a few moments after the cub is introduced in the original film. While the new cub is introduced as Simba's heir, Kiara and Kovu roar with Simba and Nala before pride rock signifying their royal status.

Added: 20313

Changed: 13

Removed: 20271

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Folder test


[[folder: Guesses about Simba’s offspring]]



Nala was having her new baby when Kopa was still alive. One day, he came up to her and asked her if the baby could be a girl, because he liked the name Kiara. Nala told him that there was no way of knowing if the baby was a boy or a girl, and Kopa persisted that he wanted a sister so they could name her Kiara. For added sweetness, this was just minutes before his death by Zira, so it doubled as a final request.

[[WMG:The incest problems going on in the pridelands are worse than they seem.]]
Sarafina gave birth to Nala, who was the daughter of Scar. Now, Sarafina may not have cared for Scar, but Mufasa was already taken. (in this universe, lions are meant to be monogamous) Perhaps she agreed to it because of the shallowing gene pool due to Mufasa's, err, prominent genes. Nala was never intended to be betrothed to the Prince she was related to, but Sarafina didn't want to admit to having a cub with such an unpopular lion. Nala looks like her, so she just said it was a wandering rogue. When Nala was chosen as Simba's future mate, Sarafina couldn't object without revealing her secret. When Scar became leader, who did he want as a mate in the broadway show and longer rough draft? Nala, his own daughter. Scar was a vain, egotistical lion, and who better to be the mother of his lineage than someone who shared his own genes? As well, she, again, looks like Sarafina, who he apparently didn't find bad-looking. If he had succeeded in raping Nala, this would have went even further.
If Kovu is also fathered by Scar, then that means his original goal of having his lineage carry on actually worked and he in fact succeeded in a sick kind of way.

[[WMG:Kovu just shares Scar's coloring: not related]]
Not just Word of God, either. Scar's pelt could be recessive to Mufasa's dominant golden, or they could both be equally likely, and the lack of other Scar-pelted lions in the pride is because of Scar's lack-of-Kingship means he doesn't get to spread his genes.
* Somewhat amusingly, Scar and Kovu's fur color would be considered a sign of being very healthy. Ironically this is also explainable in-universe. Scar gets plenty of food and does nothing strenuous (other than put up with the hyenas). Kovu is supposed to be capable of killing Simba when he grows up so Zira is going to try to make sure he is as healthy as can be. Its not like she has any more reasonable candidates to choose from for potential king.

[[WMG:Zira wasn't mad that Kovu killed Nuka as much as she was mad that he did so with everyone watching.]]
If she was bringing him up to be like Scar, he did a very good job of "taking care" of Nuka and she should have rewarded him.

[[WMG: Zira and her followers were out hunting during the final battle in the 1st film]]
I can't believe no one has thought of this - they weren't at Pride Rock because they were out hunting. Unlike Sarabi and the others, they had not given up hope, and wished to please Scar by actually finding something to eat. Too bad Scar was dead when they came back (unsuccessful)

[[WMG:Simba and Nala have an incestuous relationship.]]
Riddle me this: Simba and Nala are from the same pride. How many adult males are there? Just two- Scar and Mufasa, who are brothers. Nala is either Simba's cousin born from Scar or his half-sister born from Mufasa (but from another lioness, rather than Sarabi). The latter might seem like Mufasa's cheating on his mate, but male lions mate with every single lioness in their pride (very often), so it's not too far-fetched. Lion incest is perfectly normal, but it's not the sort of thing Disney wants you to think about.
* This also means that the original intention of the writers to make Kovu Scar's son (instead of just his protege and heir) is true; he and Kiara are indeed having an incestuous relationship of their own.
* Every lioness in the new generation would have to be sired by Simba, and later Kovu. This is what happens when you try to superimpose a monogamous marriage-based relationship onto a traditional pride structure.
* Unless Nala's Mom left her pack and was taken in by Mufasa while she was pregnant with Nala.
* There's also the possibility that ''Scar'' is Nala's father. Which would make his attempt to rape her in the musical [[MoralEventHorizon even more dastardly]].
* You can take this even farther. Lion prides are typically made up of a group of lionesses who are all sisters or otherwise closely related, plus a single male who mates with all of them. Female cubs stay in the same pride while juvenile males are kicked out to find another pride to call their own. Based on this information we can reasonably assume that Simba and Nala are at least cousins (as children of sisters Sarabi and Sarafina, respetively). Now if Mufasa is expected to have sired all of the cubs in the pride, this would make Simba and Nala somewhere between half-siblings and full brother-sister in relatedness. Even if Mufasa isn't Nala's father, the only other reasonable alternative is for Scar to be her father - making Simba and Nala close to half-siblings.
* This troper once read a fanfic where Nala's father was a rogue lion.

[[WMG:Mufasa's death was [[MyDeathIsJustTheBeginning deliberately planned by Mufasa]], so Simba could develop as a leader on his own without being able to constantly rely on Mufasa.]]
When Mufasa confronts Scar about not being at Simba's presentation at the beginning of the film and Scar calls Simba "the little hairball," Mufasa replies "That 'hairball' is my son--and your future king." Whoa, whoa whoa. At that point, the only way Simba would be Scar's future king is if Scar outlived Mufasa--which did come to pass, but how would Mufasa know that at the time, unless he were planning exactly that? While it's reasonable to assume that Mufasa is the older brother, presumably Mufasa and Scar aren't widely different in age, so the only reason Mufasa could be so certain that Scar would outlive him is if he were arranging it.
* Is it ever actually stated that the king has to die to pass on the throne? Maybe Mufasa had retirement plans.
* While that is a strange thing to say, now that you mention it, Mufasa would have needed a much stronger motivation than that. Even if he was willing to sacrifice himself for such a nebulous goal, he couldn't have expected Simba to survive a royal coup.
** Except Mufasa survived and ''knew'' he would. Maybe he ''and'' Scar planned the events ''together'' for some reason we don't know...
*** Apart from that being fantastically unlikely beyond all traditional forms of reason, Mufasa's survival would invalidate the premise, such as it was, of the original theory. So no.
** Why couldn't he have expected Simba to survive a royal coup? He figures Simba is strong enough to do it, and tenacious enough to kill Scar. Neither does Mufasa necessarily endorse this plan; it is sufficient that he suspects Scar will kill him.
** It doesn't mean that Mufasa ''expects'' to die before Scar (though as Scar is the younger brother, Mufasa might think that he will), but... well, if he was to get pedantic about it, he'd just end up sounding like a colossal jerk. "That hairball is my son, and your future king. Well, that is, unless you die before I do. Come to think of it, with how frail and weak you are you are, you're very likely to snuff it long before me, so I guess there's no actual chance you'll ever live to see him on the throne." Doesn't seem much like something Mufasa would say, does it?

[[WMG:Scar didn't fail as a king because he was an evil tyrant, but because he had no idea of the responsibilities of being a king, only the perks.]]
While we don't necessarily see how Scar handles his failings as King of the Pridelands in the movie, the musical shows that he has absolutely no idea how to rule a kingdom; he's completely baffled why things have turned out so poorly, starts to doubt his own ability to lead and gain the adoration of his subjects, and even asks for Zazu's advice on how to solve the problem. Clearly, he - like Simba as a kid - only knew of the major perks to being king, not the massive responsibilities that come with those perks. Don't get it wrong, Scar's ambition and jealousy are what lead him to a fall, but if he was halfway-competent enough in the affairs of state, it's likely he could've become a Main/VillainWithGoodPublicity instead of someone with a Main/ZeroPercentApprovalRating, making his continued reign - and Simba's defeat - iron-clad.
* The musical did a good job fleshing out his madness, but the movie still had his scene with Sarabi to paint a clear picture of how bad a job he was doing. In particular, as noted above, his declaration that "I am the king! I can do whatever I want!" can be seen as a callback to Simba's juvenile "just can't wait to be king" philosophy. Then the grown-up, sane (not to mention alive and legitimate heir to the throne) Simba showed up... either way, is this even a WMG?

[[WMG: Scar was neglected by his and Mufasa's father because he was supposed to be a female lion.]]
This is completely alternative to the short stories, but I came upon those after my theory so I am ignoring any mention of their father, because I really like my theory. This takes a while but it's totally worth it. Okay. So there are two clues in the movie: "There's more to being king than getting your way all the time" versus "I am the king I can do whatever I want." If we're assuming past behavior from present--and Mufasa's dad had a HUGE influence on him, via the "kings of the past" scene--that means Mufasa's wisdom was passed down from HIS father, and Scar's lack of wisdom points to a negligent father. So Mufasa was the favorite child.

Now, Simba and Nala are (apparently) half-siblings, and already betrothed as chidren--probably from birth, if our nobility are anything to go on; in short, an arranged marriage. When Scar was born, there was probably talk of another arranged marriage back in
his day as well, and Scar, if a female, would have been the chosen mate. I can imagine their father having high hopes for whatever dynasty that would come of a Mufasa-Scarina marriage if he had been a she. But, as so often happens, Scarina turned out to be Scar, the disappointed parent scorned him, and the rest is The Circle Of Life.

[[WMG:The Outlanders are Amazons.]]
During Scar's reign, a small [[AmazonBrigade Pride of Lioness']] come to the Pridelands from the desert, they have no male, no king. Hense the name really. They came because while the worsening situation in the Pridelands were bad, things were worse in the desert. Scar let them stay supposedly to help the Pridelanders to adapt to the growing leaniency of game. Eventually [[UnHolyMatrimony Scar and their leader became smitten]].

to:

Nala was having her new baby when Kopa was still alive. One day, he came up to her and asked her if the baby could be a girl, because he liked the name Kiara. Nala told him that there was no way of knowing if the baby was a boy or a girl, and Kopa persisted that he wanted a sister so they could name her Kiara. For added sweetness, this was just minutes before his death by Zira, so it doubled as a final request.

[[WMG:The incest problems going on in the pridelands are worse than they seem.]]
Sarafina gave birth to Nala, who was the daughter of Scar. Now, Sarafina may not have cared for Scar, but Mufasa was already taken. (in this universe, lions are meant to be monogamous) Perhaps she agreed to it because of the shallowing gene pool due to Mufasa's, err, prominent genes. Nala was never intended to be betrothed to the Prince she was related to, but Sarafina didn't want to admit to having a cub with such an unpopular lion. Nala looks like her, so she just said it was a wandering rogue. When Nala was chosen as Simba's future mate, Sarafina couldn't object without revealing her secret. When Scar became leader, who did he want as a mate in the broadway show and longer rough draft? Nala, his own daughter. Scar was a vain, egotistical lion, and who better to be the mother of his lineage than someone who shared his own genes? As well, she, again, looks like Sarafina, who he apparently didn't find bad-looking. If he had succeeded in raping Nala, this would have went even further.
If Kovu is also fathered by Scar, then that means his original goal of having his lineage carry on actually worked and he in fact succeeded in a sick kind of way.

[[WMG:Kovu just shares Scar's coloring: not related]]
Not just Word of God, either. Scar's pelt could be recessive to Mufasa's dominant golden, or they could both be equally likely, and the lack of other Scar-pelted lions in the pride is because of Scar's lack-of-Kingship means he doesn't get to spread his genes.
* Somewhat amusingly, Scar and Kovu's fur color would be considered a sign of being very healthy. Ironically this is also explainable in-universe. Scar gets plenty of food and does nothing strenuous (other than put up with the hyenas). Kovu is supposed to be capable of killing Simba when he grows up so Zira is going to try to make sure he is as healthy as can be. Its not like she has any more reasonable candidates to choose from for potential king.

[[WMG:Zira wasn't mad that Kovu killed Nuka as much as she was mad that he did so with everyone watching.]]
If she was bringing him up to be like Scar, he did a very good job of "taking care" of Nuka and she should have rewarded him.

[[WMG: Zira and her followers were out hunting during the final battle in the 1st film]]
I can't believe no one has thought of this - they weren't at Pride Rock because they were out hunting. Unlike Sarabi and the others, they had not given up hope, and wished to please Scar by actually finding something to eat. Too bad Scar was dead when they came back (unsuccessful)

[[WMG:Simba and Nala have an incestuous relationship.]]
Riddle me this: Simba and Nala are from the same pride. How many adult males are there? Just two- Scar and Mufasa, who are brothers. Nala is either Simba's cousin born from Scar or his half-sister born from Mufasa (but from another lioness, rather than Sarabi). The latter might seem like Mufasa's cheating on his mate, but male lions mate with every single lioness in their pride (very often), so it's not too far-fetched. Lion incest is perfectly normal, but it's not the sort of thing Disney wants you to think about.
* This also means that the original intention of the writers to make Kovu Scar's son (instead of just his protege and heir) is true; he and Kiara are indeed having an incestuous relationship of their own.
* Every lioness in the new generation would have to be sired by Simba, and later Kovu. This is what happens when you try to superimpose a monogamous marriage-based relationship onto a traditional pride structure.
* Unless Nala's Mom left her pack and was taken in by Mufasa while she was pregnant with Nala.
* There's also the possibility that ''Scar'' is Nala's father. Which would make his attempt to rape her in the musical [[MoralEventHorizon even more dastardly]].
* You can take this even farther. Lion prides are typically made up of a group of lionesses who are all sisters or otherwise closely related, plus a single male who mates with all of them. Female cubs stay in the same pride while juvenile males are kicked out to find another pride to call their own. Based on this information we can reasonably assume that Simba and Nala are at least cousins (as children of sisters Sarabi and Sarafina, respetively). Now if Mufasa is expected to have sired all of the cubs in the pride, this would make Simba and Nala somewhere between half-siblings and full brother-sister in relatedness. Even if Mufasa isn't Nala's father, the only other reasonable alternative is for Scar to be her father - making Simba and Nala close to half-siblings.
* This troper once read a fanfic where Nala's father was a rogue lion.

[[WMG:Mufasa's death was [[MyDeathIsJustTheBeginning deliberately planned by Mufasa]], so Simba could develop as a leader on his own without being able to constantly rely on Mufasa.]]
When Mufasa confronts Scar about not being at Simba's presentation at the beginning of the film and Scar calls Simba "the little hairball," Mufasa replies "That 'hairball' is my son--and your future king." Whoa, whoa whoa. At that point, the only way Simba would be Scar's future king is if Scar outlived Mufasa--which did come to pass, but how would Mufasa know that at the time, unless he were planning exactly that? While it's reasonable to assume that Mufasa is the older brother, presumably Mufasa and Scar aren't widely different in age, so the only reason Mufasa could be so certain that Scar would outlive him is if he were arranging it.
* Is it ever actually stated that the king has to die to pass on the throne? Maybe Mufasa had retirement plans.
* While that is a strange thing to say, now that you mention it, Mufasa would have needed a much stronger motivation than that. Even if he was willing to sacrifice himself for such a nebulous goal, he couldn't have expected Simba to survive a royal coup.
** Except Mufasa survived and ''knew'' he would. Maybe he ''and'' Scar planned the events ''together'' for some reason we don't know...
*** Apart from that being fantastically unlikely beyond all traditional forms of reason, Mufasa's survival would invalidate the premise, such as it was, of the original theory. So no.
** Why couldn't he have expected Simba to survive a royal coup? He figures Simba is strong enough to do it, and tenacious enough to kill Scar. Neither does Mufasa necessarily endorse this plan; it is sufficient that he suspects Scar will kill him.
** It doesn't mean that Mufasa ''expects'' to die before Scar (though as Scar is the younger brother, Mufasa might think that he will), but... well, if he was to get pedantic about it, he'd just end up sounding like a colossal jerk. "That hairball is my son, and your future king. Well, that is, unless you die before I do. Come to think of it, with how frail and weak you are you are, you're very likely to snuff it long before me, so I guess there's no actual chance you'll ever live to see him on the throne." Doesn't seem much like something Mufasa would say, does it?

[[WMG:Scar didn't fail as a king because he was an evil tyrant, but because he had no idea of the responsibilities of being a king, only the perks.]]
While we don't necessarily see how Scar handles his failings as King of the Pridelands in the movie, the musical shows that he has absolutely no idea how to rule a kingdom; he's completely baffled why things have turned out so poorly, starts to doubt his own ability to lead and gain the adoration of his subjects, and even asks for Zazu's advice on how to solve the problem. Clearly, he - like Simba as a kid - only knew of the major perks to being king, not the massive responsibilities that come with those perks. Don't get it wrong, Scar's ambition and jealousy are what lead him to a fall, but if he was halfway-competent enough in the affairs of state, it's likely he could've become a Main/VillainWithGoodPublicity instead of someone with a Main/ZeroPercentApprovalRating, making his continued reign - and Simba's defeat - iron-clad.
* The musical did a good job fleshing out his madness, but the movie still had his scene with Sarabi to paint a clear picture of how bad a job he was doing. In particular, as noted above, his declaration that "I am the king! I can do whatever I want!" can be seen as a callback to Simba's juvenile "just can't wait to be king" philosophy. Then the grown-up, sane (not to mention alive and legitimate heir to the throne) Simba showed up... either way, is this even a WMG?

[[WMG: Scar was neglected by his and Mufasa's father because he was supposed to be a female lion.]]
This is completely alternative to the short stories, but I came upon those after my theory so I am ignoring any mention of their father, because I really like my theory. This takes a while but it's totally worth it. Okay. So there are two clues in the movie: "There's more to being king than getting your way all the time" versus "I am the king I can do whatever I want." If we're assuming past behavior from present--and Mufasa's dad had a HUGE influence on him, via the "kings of the past" scene--that means Mufasa's wisdom was passed down from HIS father, and Scar's lack of wisdom points to a negligent father. So Mufasa was the favorite child.

Now, Simba and Nala are (apparently) half-siblings, and already betrothed as chidren--probably from birth, if our nobility are anything to go on; in short, an arranged marriage. When Scar was born, there was probably talk of another arranged marriage back in
his day as well, and Scar, if a female, would have been the chosen mate. I can imagine their father having high hopes for whatever dynasty that would come of a Mufasa-Scarina marriage if he had been a she. But, as so often happens, Scarina turned out to be Scar, the disappointed parent scorned him, and the rest is The Circle Of Life.

[[WMG:The Outlanders are Amazons.]]
During Scar's reign, a small [[AmazonBrigade Pride of Lioness']] come to the Pridelands from the desert, they have no male, no king. Hense the name really. They came because while the worsening situation in the Pridelands were bad, things were worse in the desert. Scar let them stay supposedly to help the Pridelanders to adapt to the growing leaniency of game. Eventually [[UnHolyMatrimony Scar and their leader became smitten]].
request.




[[WMG:Zira is insane, and the Outlanders only follow her out of fear.]]
...Okay, so not really "''wild''" mass guessing, but still counts. It would certainly explain the mass [[HeelFaceTurn Heel Face Turn]] after Kiara's [[PowerOfLove little]] [[PowerOfFriendship speech]], they felt that her deciding to off her only daughter was the last straw.

[[WMG:Zira was the only Scar loyalist among the adult lionesses.]]
Most of the lionesses disliked Scar at best. Zira, Scar's mate, was his only non-hyena supporter. After Nala left to get help, Scar decided to get an heir to solidify his reign in case she returned with a few males in tow (or, you know, Simba). Even though Kovu wasn't Scar's son (that was a random wandering male), he was the youngest, which would give Scar the best chance of molding him in his image.

Kovu was born only a few days before Simba returned. Zira didn't take part in the battle because she was still recovering from birth. Simba, a fairly merciful guy, chose to exile her instead of killing her, along with Nuka, Vitani and the infant Kovu. He continued this policy with other lions who disobeyed his rule, perhaps not realizing he was providing Zira with a steady stream of potential recruits. Most of the Outlanders were probably exiled for trying to eat Pumbaa.



[[WMG:The alliance between the hyenas and the lions actually was successful and beneficial to both parties...at first.]]
Hence why Scar still had diehard loyalists among the lionesses, who would rather allow themselves to be exiled than have Simba replace Scar. Hyenas are powerful predators in their own right, and the mutual hatred between the hyenas and lions mostly stems from the way they're constantly in competition with each other - when the two stongest carnivores in the savannah joined forces and began to help instead of hinder each other, the number of kills made skyrocketed and allowed the pride to enjoy a brief golden age before the drought hit and everything went downhill.
* Actually 'driver ants' are the strongest predator in Africa. So blame the ants.

[[WMG:Scar was not a bad leader, BUT he was hated by the lionesses- because he did what male lions still do in real life.]]
* Remember when we saw [[FridgeLogic all of those cubs]] being licked at the beginning of the movie? Where were they at the ''end'' of this movie? There were ''no cubs'' at all when Simba returned. It's very probable that Scar had killed all of those cubs fathered by Mufasa- This would ''not'' make him popular with the other lionesses.
* That does make a [[MindScrewdriver lot of sense now]]!
* That doesn't explain why Nala is still alive thou, and even if their canonicity is debatable, the Six Adventures books show other cubs as well.
* When did we ever see cubs besides Simba and Nala, in the first movie? This troper spend her entire childhood searching for other cubs in that pride throughout the movie, and wondering why there were only two cubs in the entire pride. The only cubs being licked were Nala and Simba.

[[WMG:The fate of the cubs of the Pridelands]]
Related to the above, the comics based on the first film have a whole slew of cubs (Kula, Tama, Chumvi, Tojo, and Simba's two unnamed cousins), not to mention the fate of the scrapped character Mheetu and an off reference to Simba's cousin Mtoto in a puzzle. These characters can still exist in the film's universe, although not part of the film itself, as unseen members of Mufasa's sprawling pride. While Kula and Tama, who are female, would probably grow up to be part of Simba's pride, Chumvi, Tojo, Mheetu, Mtoto, and Simba's cousins, all of whom are male, would likely have been driven off or killed by Scar.[[note]]To further connect to Shakespeare, Scar would be thinking that they would overthrow him specifically because he became King by overthrowing Mufasa, a concept very present in ''Theatre/{{Macbeth}}''.[[/note]] Since this is a Disney film and adult males are present in both Simba's and Mufasa's prides, we can assume that Simba and Mufasa would not do this, even though it's normal for lions.

[[WMG:''Lion King 1 1/2'' is Timon and Pumbaa embellishing their story.]]
Really, it's the only way half of the movie could make sense. The other half just being RuleOfFunny. Obviously Timon is pulling stuff out of his hind end, and Pumbaa is either playing along, or [[TheDitz just not in one of his more lucid moments]].

For example, Timon and Pumbaa ''could have'' been present at Simba's presentation, but it's highly doubtful that even one of [[{{Gasshole}} Pumbaa's legendary farts]] could start off that kind of chain reaction. And Timon and Pumbaa could've spent the night at the watering hole and left the next day due to the crowds, but there's no way Simba could've grown into a juvenile cub overnight. And being present at the Graveyard, during [[VillainSong Be Prepared]] and the Stampede? Typical Timon making up BS.
* What if they stayed there for Simba's whole early childhood?
* DUH!!!!! This isn't WildMassGuessing. This is stating fact!

[[WMG:The real reason Zira was exiled was because Sarabi and Scar were involved.]]
If you see the story as a parallel to ''{{Hamlet}}'', obviously Sarabi is Gertrude. She was behind her mate's death, or was willing to be with Scar once the murder happened, and Scar used her to legitimize his claim to the throne a la Claudius. Simba isn't upset about this because he wasn't around for it, but Zira was present through the whole thing. She was probably popular with the other lionesses, hence why she has such a large pride in the sequel - her friends left with her. She was banished because there were many pride members who didn't know that Sarabi and Scar were together.



[[WMG:The Hyenas are naturally a ''democratic'' power and their involvement with Scar is just the result of his political seduction.]]
To be more precise, they're intuitively Jacobins, and the only reason they fall for the "fascist leader" Scar is their own political inexperience. However, their first intuition after Scar proposed to kill the king was to kill him ''without'' replacing him - which clearly shows that they intuitively not only oppose the present king, but monarchy ''itself'', and see the death of the king as a means to get rid of monarchy as such. But they're inexperienced and unorganized, and Scar promises to teach them how to organize, so they get behind him without really realizing what they're supporting.
* Which makes it a clear case of TheGoodTheBadAndTheEvil. Also seconded.
* This actually makes a lot of sense, given that they have no clear matriarch (If Shenzi was actually the matriarch, "Be Prepared" would likely have included Scar pretending to share power with her. Also, you'd think she would be able to get other high-ranking females to join her when confronting Scar about the drought, instead of two males, one of which can't speak properly). Thirded.
* Another thing to notice here is that in the last image of "Be Prepared", the placement of the moon sickle in the background reminds a bit of the communist Sickle and Hammer.

[[WMG:In the Elephant Graveyard, some of the "elephant" skeletons are actually the bones of mammoths and mastodons.]]
The skull that the hyenas climb out of is far too large to be that of a modern elephant. Would an elephant's head really be that big compared to Simba? Big enough for hyenas to climb through the eye sockets and nose?
* The graveyard is obviously very old. Many of the bones break easily, suggesting that they've been decaying away for a while. Also, elephants often cover their dead in sticks and leaves. In the case of the Elephant Graveyard, any sticks and leaves have clearly all disintigrated long ago.
* If Africa is the wrong location for mammoths and mastadons, we can say that humans draged the bones down there for cultural reasons, and then wound up abandoning them.

[[WMG:As mentioned on PoisonOakEpilepticTrees, the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_sexual_behaviour#Lions way male lions co-rule with their brothers]] raises several alternative character interpretations: namely, the entire story is just a tragically overblown lovers tiff. Pass the BrainBleach please.]]
* But Scar and Mufasa don't rule together. But maybe that was the problem. Mufasa didn't want to share the power and... umm... other things with his little bro, and Scar takes it personal. And to think all of this could have been avoided with a quickie!

[[WMG:The ruling family of lions in ''Lion King'' are the descendents of the Nemean Lion.]]
This is where their legitimacy comes from. The lion hide in the Hercules movies wasn't actually Scar, he just bares an uncanny resemblance to his ancestor. This is also why Scar needed such an elaborate set-up to kill Mufasa as well as the lack of marks on Mufasa from Scar's claws or the wildebeest's hooves. Also why Simba wasn't particularly bothered by the thorn bushes. Scar figured the hyenas would be able to end Simba's life with a bite though thanks to the spectacular crushing force found in a hyena's jaws. It would also explain the lack of human presence in the setting. Why bother with the area surrounded by wastelands and inhabited by nearly unkillable super lions? Regular lions are bad enough.




[[WMG:Simba was actually being merciful by exiling Zira and her supporters.]]
He could have killed her children, including the one Scar chose to be his successor and would only grow up with a contested claim to the throne if allowed to live, and added all the lionesses to his harem (as male lions do in the real world when they take over a pride), but he didn't. Like Macbeth in "[[WesternAnimation/{{Gargoyles}} City of Stone]]," he chose to exile his now-dead rival's son to eliminate any threat he and his supporters may pose rather than kill him. (In both cases, of course, this backfired.)



** Although they exist in different timelines Kopa and Kovu are around the same age.

[[WMG:Nala was the equivalent of the pride's throne princess.]]
She wasn't betrothed to Simba per se but to the next king, hence Scar's desire to make her his mate in the musical.

to:

** Although they exist in different timelines Kopa and Kovu are around the same age.

[[WMG:Nala was the equivalent of the pride's throne princess.]]
She wasn't betrothed to Simba per se but to the next king, hence Scar's desire to make her his mate in the musical.
age.




to:

[[/folder]]


[[WMG:The incest problems going on in the pridelands are worse than they seem.]]
Sarafina gave birth to Nala, who was the daughter of Scar. Now, Sarafina may not have cared for Scar, but Mufasa was already taken. (in this universe, lions are meant to be monogamous) Perhaps she agreed to it because of the shallowing gene pool due to Mufasa's, err, prominent genes. Nala was never intended to be betrothed to the Prince she was related to, but Sarafina didn't want to admit to having a cub with such an unpopular lion. Nala looks like her, so she just said it was a wandering rogue. When Nala was chosen as Simba's future mate, Sarafina couldn't object without revealing her secret. When Scar became leader, who did he want as a mate in the broadway show and longer rough draft? Nala, his own daughter. Scar was a vain, egotistical lion, and who better to be the mother of his lineage than someone who shared his own genes? As well, she, again, looks like Sarafina, who he apparently didn't find bad-looking. If he had succeeded in raping Nala, this would have went even further.
If Kovu is also fathered by Scar, then that means his original goal of having his lineage carry on actually worked and he in fact succeeded in a sick kind of way.

[[WMG:Kovu just shares Scar's coloring: not related]]
Not just Word of God, either. Scar's pelt could be recessive to Mufasa's dominant golden, or they could both be equally likely, and the lack of other Scar-pelted lions in the pride is because of Scar's lack-of-Kingship means he doesn't get to spread his genes.
* Somewhat amusingly, Scar and Kovu's fur color would be considered a sign of being very healthy. Ironically this is also explainable in-universe. Scar gets plenty of food and does nothing strenuous (other than put up with the hyenas). Kovu is supposed to be capable of killing Simba when he grows up so Zira is going to try to make sure he is as healthy as can be. Its not like she has any more reasonable candidates to choose from for potential king.

[[WMG:Zira wasn't mad that Kovu killed Nuka as much as she was mad that he did so with everyone watching.]]
If she was bringing him up to be like Scar, he did a very good job of "taking care" of Nuka and she should have rewarded him.

[[WMG: Zira and her followers were out hunting during the final battle in the 1st film]]
I can't believe no one has thought of this - they weren't at Pride Rock because they were out hunting. Unlike Sarabi and the others, they had not given up hope, and wished to please Scar by actually finding something to eat. Too bad Scar was dead when they came back (unsuccessful)

[[WMG:Simba and Nala have an incestuous relationship.]]
Riddle me this: Simba and Nala are from the same pride. How many adult males are there? Just two- Scar and Mufasa, who are brothers. Nala is either Simba's cousin born from Scar or his half-sister born from Mufasa (but from another lioness, rather than Sarabi). The latter might seem like Mufasa's cheating on his mate, but male lions mate with every single lioness in their pride (very often), so it's not too far-fetched. Lion incest is perfectly normal, but it's not the sort of thing Disney wants you to think about.
* This also means that the original intention of the writers to make Kovu Scar's son (instead of just his protege and heir) is true; he and Kiara are indeed having an incestuous relationship of their own.
* Every lioness in the new generation would have to be sired by Simba, and later Kovu. This is what happens when you try to superimpose a monogamous marriage-based relationship onto a traditional pride structure.
* Unless Nala's Mom left her pack and was taken in by Mufasa while she was pregnant with Nala.
* There's also the possibility that ''Scar'' is Nala's father. Which would make his attempt to rape her in the musical [[MoralEventHorizon even more dastardly]].
* You can take this even farther. Lion prides are typically made up of a group of lionesses who are all sisters or otherwise closely related, plus a single male who mates with all of them. Female cubs stay in the same pride while juvenile males are kicked out to find another pride to call their own. Based on this information we can reasonably assume that Simba and Nala are at least cousins (as children of sisters Sarabi and Sarafina, respetively). Now if Mufasa is expected to have sired all of the cubs in the pride, this would make Simba and Nala somewhere between half-siblings and full brother-sister in relatedness. Even if Mufasa isn't Nala's father, the only other reasonable alternative is for Scar to be her father - making Simba and Nala close to half-siblings.
* This troper once read a fanfic where Nala's father was a rogue lion.

[[WMG:Mufasa's death was [[MyDeathIsJustTheBeginning deliberately planned by Mufasa]], so Simba could develop as a leader on his own without being able to constantly rely on Mufasa.]]
When Mufasa confronts Scar about not being at Simba's presentation at the beginning of the film and Scar calls Simba "the little hairball," Mufasa replies "That 'hairball' is my son--and your future king." Whoa, whoa whoa. At that point, the only way Simba would be Scar's future king is if Scar outlived Mufasa--which did come to pass, but how would Mufasa know that at the time, unless he were planning exactly that? While it's reasonable to assume that Mufasa is the older brother, presumably Mufasa and Scar aren't widely different in age, so the only reason Mufasa could be so certain that Scar would outlive him is if he were arranging it.
* Is it ever actually stated that the king has to die to pass on the throne? Maybe Mufasa had retirement plans.
* While that is a strange thing to say, now that you mention it, Mufasa would have needed a much stronger motivation than that. Even if he was willing to sacrifice himself for such a nebulous goal, he couldn't have expected Simba to survive a royal coup.
** Except Mufasa survived and ''knew'' he would. Maybe he ''and'' Scar planned the events ''together'' for some reason we don't know...
*** Apart from that being fantastically unlikely beyond all traditional forms of reason, Mufasa's survival would invalidate the premise, such as it was, of the original theory. So no.
** Why couldn't he have expected Simba to survive a royal coup? He figures Simba is strong enough to do it, and tenacious enough to kill Scar. Neither does Mufasa necessarily endorse this plan; it is sufficient that he suspects Scar will kill him.
** It doesn't mean that Mufasa ''expects'' to die before Scar (though as Scar is the younger brother, Mufasa might think that he will), but... well, if he was to get pedantic about it, he'd just end up sounding like a colossal jerk. "That hairball is my son, and your future king. Well, that is, unless you die before I do. Come to think of it, with how frail and weak you are you are, you're very likely to snuff it long before me, so I guess there's no actual chance you'll ever live to see him on the throne." Doesn't seem much like something Mufasa would say, does it?

[[WMG:Scar didn't fail as a king because he was an evil tyrant, but because he had no idea of the responsibilities of being a king, only the perks.]]
While we don't necessarily see how Scar handles his failings as King of the Pridelands in the movie, the musical shows that he has absolutely no idea how to rule a kingdom; he's completely baffled why things have turned out so poorly, starts to doubt his own ability to lead and gain the adoration of his subjects, and even asks for Zazu's advice on how to solve the problem. Clearly, he - like Simba as a kid - only knew of the major perks to being king, not the massive responsibilities that come with those perks. Don't get it wrong, Scar's ambition and jealousy are what lead him to a fall, but if he was halfway-competent enough in the affairs of state, it's likely he could've become a Main/VillainWithGoodPublicity instead of someone with a Main/ZeroPercentApprovalRating, making his continued reign - and Simba's defeat - iron-clad.
* The musical did a good job fleshing out his madness, but the movie still had his scene with Sarabi to paint a clear picture of how bad a job he was doing. In particular, as noted above, his declaration that "I am the king! I can do whatever I want!" can be seen as a callback to Simba's juvenile "just can't wait to be king" philosophy. Then the grown-up, sane (not to mention alive and legitimate heir to the throne) Simba showed up... either way, is this even a WMG?

[[WMG: Scar was neglected by his and Mufasa's father because he was supposed to be a female lion.]]
This is completely alternative to the short stories, but I came upon those after my theory so I am ignoring any mention of their father, because I really like my theory. This takes a while but it's totally worth it. Okay. So there are two clues in the movie: "There's more to being king than getting your way all the time" versus "I am the king I can do whatever I want." If we're assuming past behavior from present--and Mufasa's dad had a HUGE influence on him, via the "kings of the past" scene--that means Mufasa's wisdom was passed down from HIS father, and Scar's lack of wisdom points to a negligent father. So Mufasa was the favorite child.

Now, Simba and Nala are (apparently) half-siblings, and already betrothed as chidren--probably from birth, if our nobility are anything to go on; in short, an arranged marriage. When Scar was born, there was probably talk of another arranged marriage back in
his day as well, and Scar, if a female, would have been the chosen mate. I can imagine their father having high hopes for whatever dynasty that would come of a Mufasa-Scarina marriage if he had been a she. But, as so often happens, Scarina turned out to be Scar, the disappointed parent scorned him, and the rest is The Circle Of Life.

[[WMG:The Outlanders are Amazons.]]
During Scar's reign, a small [[AmazonBrigade Pride of Lioness']] come to the Pridelands from the desert, they have no male, no king. Hense the name really. They came because while the worsening situation in the Pridelands were bad, things were worse in the desert. Scar let them stay supposedly to help the Pridelanders to adapt to the growing leaniency of game. Eventually [[UnHolyMatrimony Scar and their leader became smitten]].


[[WMG:Zira is insane, and the Outlanders only follow her out of fear.]]
...Okay, so not really "''wild''" mass guessing, but still counts. It would certainly explain the mass [[HeelFaceTurn Heel Face Turn]] after Kiara's [[PowerOfLove little]] [[PowerOfFriendship speech]], they felt that her deciding to off her only daughter was the last straw.

[[WMG:Zira was the only Scar loyalist among the adult lionesses.]]
Most of the lionesses disliked Scar at best. Zira, Scar's mate, was his only non-hyena supporter. After Nala left to get help, Scar decided to get an heir to solidify his reign in case she returned with a few males in tow (or, you know, Simba). Even though Kovu wasn't Scar's son (that was a random wandering male), he was the youngest, which would give Scar the best chance of molding him in his image.

Kovu was born only a few days before Simba returned. Zira didn't take part in the battle because she was still recovering from birth. Simba, a fairly merciful guy, chose to exile her instead of killing her, along with Nuka, Vitani and the infant Kovu. He continued this policy with other lions who disobeyed his rule, perhaps not realizing he was providing Zira with a steady stream of potential recruits. Most of the Outlanders were probably exiled for trying to eat Pumbaa.


[[WMG:The alliance between the hyenas and the lions actually was successful and beneficial to both parties...at first.]]
Hence why Scar still had diehard loyalists among the lionesses, who would rather allow themselves to be exiled than have Simba replace Scar. Hyenas are powerful predators in their own right, and the mutual hatred between the hyenas and lions mostly stems from the way they're constantly in competition with each other - when the two stongest carnivores in the savannah joined forces and began to help instead of hinder each other, the number of kills made skyrocketed and allowed the pride to enjoy a brief golden age before the drought hit and everything went downhill.
* Actually 'driver ants' are the strongest predator in Africa. So blame the ants.

[[WMG:Scar was not a bad leader, BUT he was hated by the lionesses- because he did what male lions still do in real life.]]
* Remember when we saw [[FridgeLogic all of those cubs]] being licked at the beginning of the movie? Where were they at the ''end'' of this movie? There were ''no cubs'' at all when Simba returned. It's very probable that Scar had killed all of those cubs fathered by Mufasa- This would ''not'' make him popular with the other lionesses.
* That does make a [[MindScrewdriver lot of sense now]]!
* That doesn't explain why Nala is still alive thou, and even if their canonicity is debatable, the Six Adventures books show other cubs as well.
* When did we ever see cubs besides Simba and Nala, in the first movie? This troper spend her entire childhood searching for other cubs in that pride throughout the movie, and wondering why there were only two cubs in the entire pride. The only cubs being licked were Nala and Simba.

[[WMG:The fate of the cubs of the Pridelands]]
Related to the above, the comics based on the first film have a whole slew of cubs (Kula, Tama, Chumvi, Tojo, and Simba's two unnamed cousins), not to mention the fate of the scrapped character Mheetu and an off reference to Simba's cousin Mtoto in a puzzle. These characters can still exist in the film's universe, although not part of the film itself, as unseen members of Mufasa's sprawling pride. While Kula and Tama, who are female, would probably grow up to be part of Simba's pride, Chumvi, Tojo, Mheetu, Mtoto, and Simba's cousins, all of whom are male, would likely have been driven off or killed by Scar.[[note]]To further connect to Shakespeare, Scar would be thinking that they would overthrow him specifically because he became King by overthrowing Mufasa, a concept very present in ''Theatre/{{Macbeth}}''.[[/note]] Since this is a Disney film and adult males are present in both Simba's and Mufasa's prides, we can assume that Simba and Mufasa would not do this, even though it's normal for lions.

[[WMG:''Lion King 1 1/2'' is Timon and Pumbaa embellishing their story.]]
Really, it's the only way half of the movie could make sense. The other half just being RuleOfFunny. Obviously Timon is pulling stuff out of his hind end, and Pumbaa is either playing along, or [[TheDitz just not in one of his more lucid moments]].

For example, Timon and Pumbaa ''could have'' been present at Simba's presentation, but it's highly doubtful that even one of [[{{Gasshole}} Pumbaa's legendary farts]] could start off that kind of chain reaction. And Timon and Pumbaa could've spent the night at the watering hole and left the next day due to the crowds, but there's no way Simba could've grown into a juvenile cub overnight. And being present at the Graveyard, during [[VillainSong Be Prepared]] and the Stampede? Typical Timon making up BS.
* What if they stayed there for Simba's whole early childhood?
* DUH!!!!! This isn't WildMassGuessing. This is stating fact!

[[WMG:The real reason Zira was exiled was because Sarabi and Scar were involved.]]
If you see the story as a parallel to ''{{Hamlet}}'', obviously Sarabi is Gertrude. She was behind her mate's death, or was willing to be with Scar once the murder happened, and Scar used her to legitimize his claim to the throne a la Claudius. Simba isn't upset about this because he wasn't around for it, but Zira was present through the whole thing. She was probably popular with the other lionesses, hence why she has such a large pride in the sequel - her friends left with her. She was banished because there were many pride members who didn't know that Sarabi and Scar were together.


[[WMG:The Hyenas are naturally a ''democratic'' power and their involvement with Scar is just the result of his political seduction.]]
To be more precise, they're intuitively Jacobins, and the only reason they fall for the "fascist leader" Scar is their own political inexperience. However, their first intuition after Scar proposed to kill the king was to kill him ''without'' replacing him - which clearly shows that they intuitively not only oppose the present king, but monarchy ''itself'', and see the death of the king as a means to get rid of monarchy as such. But they're inexperienced and unorganized, and Scar promises to teach them how to organize, so they get behind him without really realizing what they're supporting.
* Which makes it a clear case of TheGoodTheBadAndTheEvil. Also seconded.
* This actually makes a lot of sense, given that they have no clear matriarch (If Shenzi was actually the matriarch, "Be Prepared" would likely have included Scar pretending to share power with her. Also, you'd think she would be able to get other high-ranking females to join her when confronting Scar about the drought, instead of two males, one of which can't speak properly). Thirded.
* Another thing to notice here is that in the last image of "Be Prepared", the placement of the moon sickle in the background reminds a bit of the communist Sickle and Hammer.

[[WMG:In the Elephant Graveyard, some of the "elephant" skeletons are actually the bones of mammoths and mastodons.]]
The skull that the hyenas climb out of is far too large to be that of a modern elephant. Would an elephant's head really be that big compared to Simba? Big enough for hyenas to climb through the eye sockets and nose?
* The graveyard is obviously very old. Many of the bones break easily, suggesting that they've been decaying away for a while. Also, elephants often cover their dead in sticks and leaves. In the case of the Elephant Graveyard, any sticks and leaves have clearly all disintigrated long ago.
* If Africa is the wrong location for mammoths and mastadons, we can say that humans draged the bones down there for cultural reasons, and then wound up abandoning them.

[[WMG:As mentioned on PoisonOakEpilepticTrees, the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_sexual_behaviour#Lions way male lions co-rule with their brothers]] raises several alternative character interpretations: namely, the entire story is just a tragically overblown lovers tiff. Pass the BrainBleach please.]]
* But Scar and Mufasa don't rule together. But maybe that was the problem. Mufasa didn't want to share the power and... umm... other things with his little bro, and Scar takes it personal. And to think all of this could have been avoided with a quickie!

[[WMG:The ruling family of lions in ''Lion King'' are the descendents of the Nemean Lion.]]
This is where their legitimacy comes from. The lion hide in the Hercules movies wasn't actually Scar, he just bares an uncanny resemblance to his ancestor. This is also why Scar needed such an elaborate set-up to kill Mufasa as well as the lack of marks on Mufasa from Scar's claws or the wildebeest's hooves. Also why Simba wasn't particularly bothered by the thorn bushes. Scar figured the hyenas would be able to end Simba's life with a bite though thanks to the spectacular crushing force found in a hyena's jaws. It would also explain the lack of human presence in the setting. Why bother with the area surrounded by wastelands and inhabited by nearly unkillable super lions? Regular lions are bad enough.



[[WMG:Simba was actually being merciful by exiling Zira and her supporters.]]
He could have killed her children, including the one Scar chose to be his successor and would only grow up with a contested claim to the throne if allowed to live, and added all the lionesses to his harem (as male lions do in the real world when they take over a pride), but he didn't. Like Macbeth in "[[WesternAnimation/{{Gargoyles}} City of Stone]]," he chose to exile his now-dead rival's son to eliminate any threat he and his supporters may pose rather than kill him. (In both cases, of course, this backfired.)


[[WMG:Nala was the equivalent of the pride's throne princess.]]
She wasn't betrothed to Simba per se but to the next king, hence Scar's desire to make her his mate in the musical.


Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None



to:

* Somewhat amusingly, Scar and Kovu's fur color would be considered a sign of being very healthy. Ironically this is also explainable in-universe. Scar gets plenty of food and does nothing strenuous (other than put up with the hyenas). Kovu is supposed to be capable of killing Simba when he grows up so Zira is going to try to make sure he is as healthy as can be. Its not like she has any more reasonable candidates to choose from for potential king.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


I assume that's what the fur on the top of his head is, and he's more muscular than Simba was as in the first part of ''TheLionKing''. I'd pin him at under 2 years of age.

to:

I assume that's what the fur on the top of his head is, and he's more muscular than Simba was as in the first part of ''TheLionKing''.''Disney/TheLionKing''. I'd pin him at under 2 years of age.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


That's why they're outcasts despite the whole "Circle of Life" thing, which essentially refers to the Pridelands' ecosystem. When they first migrated to the Pridelands, they totally messed up the local ecosystem, as invasive species in real life tend to do, creating a situation very similar the one that happened when Scar allied with them. Thus, Mufasa's ancestors led the lions to drive them out, which is why nobody except Scar will even consider letting them back in. The events of the movie are what finally convinced the hyenas to give up and move somewhere else.

to:

That's why they're outcasts despite the whole "Circle of Life" thing, which essentially refers to the Pridelands' ecosystem. When they first migrated to the Pridelands, they totally messed up the local ecosystem, as invasive species in real life tend to do, creating a situation very similar the one that happened when Scar allied with them. Thus, Mufasa's ancestors led the lions to drive them out, which is why nobody except Scar will even consider letting them back in. The events of the movie are what finally convinced the hyenas to give up and move somewhere else.else.

[[WMG: Tying in a bunch of theories I've seen and a few of my own for Kovu's time period...]]
The lionesses refuse to hunt for Scar as part of a protest. So the ones that ARE loyal to him are the ones to go out and hunt. This causes them to be away for the fight scene. During one of these extended hunts, they come across a rogue. Lionesses sometimes mate with other males when the leader isn't around. Zira mates, as she wants to make sure the genepool stays diverse enough so that none of Scar's heirs have to leave, especially if the child he has impregnated Nala's mother with is female. (Despite the whole reprise thing, it couldn't be Nala, due to her obvious non-pregnantness when she finds Simba) Scar is so delighted at both this and her loyalty, she names the child heir instead of Nuka, who was incompetent and frail, which is why he did nothing for Scar during the battle with Simba, opting to tell the Scar-Loyalists instead so they could be prepared (pun not intended) upon returning, and his frailty and stupidity are also why Simba drives him out instead of killing or at least severely injuring him, as Simba knows he will never pose a threat. When the lionesses return from their interrupted hunt, they are banished, along with Nuka and the newly-born, recessively-eyed Vitani, who would technically be Nala's half-sister. Zira's rogue pregnancy could have happened near the end of the hunt before the one they go on at the time of the battle, putting Kovu's conception right around the time of Kiara's, if you assume that she was conceived during 'Can You Feel the Love Tonight' and that the lionesses went on multiple hunts within a short time, as crossing the desert probably took at least a week, and with the food shortage, hunts would need to be more frequent to feed everybody. Unfortunately, I could not work this to also include Kopa. I wish I could've.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* Simba had only recently become King and things weren't much better than they were under Scar's reign (sort of like what happens between presidential elections).
** On the other hand, maybe they attributed the miraculous regrowth to Scar's wisdom of remaining on pride rock.


Added DiffLines:

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

[[WMG: Another Kopa/Kiara explanation]]
The end of The Lion King takes place after The Lion King 2. Instead of Kopa being murdered by Zira as typically assumed, perhaps he wasn't born yet. Kiara was born during the "reconstruction era" of Simba's reign, where the defecting lionessess would have been a force equal to the loyalists.
* The end of lion king 2 takes place a few moments after the cub is introduced in the original film. While the new cub is introduced as Simba's heir, Kiara and Kovu roar with Simba and Nala before pride rock signifying their royal status.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


I assume that's what the fur on the top of his head is, and he's more muscular than Simba was as in the first part of ''TheLionKing''. I'd pin him at under 2 years of age.

to:

I assume that's what the fur on the top of his head is, and he's more muscular than Simba was as in the first part of ''TheLionKing''. I'd pin him at under 2 years of age.age.

[[WMG:The hyenas are an invasive species that only migrated to the Pridelands two or three generations ago.]]
That's why they're outcasts despite the whole "Circle of Life" thing, which essentially refers to the Pridelands' ecosystem. When they first migrated to the Pridelands, they totally messed up the local ecosystem, as invasive species in real life tend to do, creating a situation very similar the one that happened when Scar allied with them. Thus, Mufasa's ancestors led the lions to drive them out, which is why nobody except Scar will even consider letting them back in. The events of the movie are what finally convinced the hyenas to give up and move somewhere else.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None



to:

** [[WebVideo/TheSpoonyExperiment No, no they don't.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


Even amongst humans people often look like each other. There's only so many variations.

to:

Even amongst humans people often look like each other. There's only so many variations.variations.

[[WMG:Kovu as a cub is starting to grow a mane]]
I assume that's what the fur on the top of his head is, and he's more muscular than Simba was as in the first part of ''TheLionKing''. I'd pin him at under 2 years of age.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


[[WMG:Kovu and Scar are relatives, but not father and son]]
Assuming Scar is only Mufasa's half-brother, he has to have other relatives. Kovu was fathered by a rogue that was related to Scar.



Kiara either hadn't been born at the end of the first movie or was hidden; the version from the sequel is a retcon or what they told Kiara. Kopa died as a very young cub, possibly due to Zira.

to:

Kiara either hadn't been born at the end of the first movie or was hidden; the version from the sequel is a retcon or what they told Kiara. Kopa died as a very young cub, possibly due to Zira.Zira.

[[WMG:Kovu just happens to look like Scar; it's a lucky coincidence]]
Even amongst humans people often look like each other. There's only so many variations.

Added: 225

Changed: 1

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


.

to:

.
[[WMG: Kopa and Kiara are twins]]
Kiara either hadn't been born at the end of the first movie or was hidden; the version from the sequel is a retcon or what they told Kiara. Kopa died as a very young cub, possibly due to Zira.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


[[WMG: The Lion King 1 1/2 is partly two, and partly made up and exaggerated by Timon and Pumba(but mostly Timon)]]
Timon and Pumba's childhoods, and the fact that many of the homes they tried to move into were places Simba had been were true, but they weren't always in the same place at the same time. The whole thing with the hyenas and meerkats at the end was also made up to make Timon and Pumba seem more herioc.

to:

[[WMG: The Lion King 1 1/2 is partly two, true, and partly made up and exaggerated by Timon and Pumba(but mostly Timon)]]
Timon and Pumba's childhoods, and the fact that many of the homes they tried to move into were places Simba had been were true, but they weren't always in the same place at the same time. The whole thing with the hyenas and meerkats at the end was also made up to make Timon and Pumba seem more herioc.
heroic.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None



to:

** And Scar's [[ItsAllAboutMe personality]] and apparent feeling that he should get the throne just because he wants it comes from his power and his status going to his head. He believes that since he's the Avatar, he is entitled to anything he wants, and any measures taken to get it are perfectly justified.



They killed Sarabi, too. That's why she never shows up again, is never mentioned again... Like Kopa, she just kind of... disappeared, without any explanation. Possibly Sarafina too, but Zira only wanted to hurt Simba, so it'd make sense if it was just Sarabi.

to:

They killed Sarabi, too. That's why she never shows up again, again and is never mentioned again...again. Like Kopa, she just kind of... disappeared, without any explanation. Possibly Sarafina too, but Zira only wanted to hurt Simba, so it'd make sense if it was just Sarabi.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


Because he's just so [[CampGay fabulous]]. This would explain why he (possibly) had no direct male heirs, and might even be why he didn't get to be king when his heterosexual male brother was around.[[hottip:*:This actually makes sense in a non-homophobic way; a heterosexual king could produce a bloodline, while a homosexual male could not.]] There's a link elsewhere on the page that says that two ruling male lions will often "strengthen their bond" by feelin' the love. This doesn't apply to Mufasa and Scar, as Mufasa is clearly leading on his own; but maybe Scar wasn't opposed to the idea?

to:

Because he's just so [[CampGay fabulous]]. This would explain why he (possibly) had no direct male heirs, and might even be why he didn't get to be king when his heterosexual male brother was around.[[hottip:*:This [[note]]This actually makes sense in a non-homophobic way; a heterosexual king could produce a bloodline, while a homosexual male could not.]] [[/note]] There's a link elsewhere on the page that says that two ruling male lions will often "strengthen their bond" by feelin' the love. This doesn't apply to Mufasa and Scar, as Mufasa is clearly leading on his own; but maybe Scar wasn't opposed to the idea?



Scar never controlled the hyenas. What happened was this: Some hyenas[[hottip:(!):Who were never exiled, BTW]] had decided to go hunt some wildebeest. Unfortunately, they ran into a cliff, where they screeched to a halt. The wildebeest, however, kept going. Unfortunately, Simba had been chasing a butterfly into that same ravine. Scar saw this, and alerted Mufasa. Skip to the part where Mufasa is dangling off a small ledge. Scar tried to help, but he was too weak (it's strongly implied he's a runt, and Mufasa is a really buff and presumably heavy loin). Mufasa realized so, and told Scar there is no way he (Mufasa) would survive, just before falling. Scar inherited the throne because Simba was a kid at the time, and suffered a severe case of survivor's guilt, driving his bonkers. He spent most of his time crying and just getting more and more insane, shirking his responsibilities. Soon, the Hyenas took over. What happened to Simba? The Hyenas convinced him it was all his fault. Soon, Scar believed the events happened the way the movie presented it. When Simba came back, the Lionesses filled him in, and he exiled Scar. The Hyenas then killed him.

to:

Scar never controlled the hyenas. What happened was this: Some hyenas[[hottip:(!):Who hyenas[[note]]Who were never exiled, BTW]] BTW[[/note]] had decided to go hunt some wildebeest. Unfortunately, they ran into a cliff, where they screeched to a halt. The wildebeest, however, kept going. Unfortunately, Simba had been chasing a butterfly into that same ravine. Scar saw this, and alerted Mufasa. Skip to the part where Mufasa is dangling off a small ledge. Scar tried to help, but he was too weak (it's strongly implied he's a runt, and Mufasa is a really buff and presumably heavy loin). Mufasa realized so, and told Scar there is no way he (Mufasa) would survive, just before falling. Scar inherited the throne because Simba was a kid at the time, and suffered a severe case of survivor's guilt, driving his bonkers. He spent most of his time crying and just getting more and more insane, shirking his responsibilities. Soon, the Hyenas took over. What happened to Simba? The Hyenas convinced him it was all his fault. Soon, Scar believed the events happened the way the movie presented it. When Simba came back, the Lionesses filled him in, and he exiled Scar. The Hyenas then killed him.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


They killed Sarabi, too. That's why she never shows up again, is never mentioned again... Like Kopa, she just kind of... disappeared, without any explanation. Possibly Sarafina too, but Zira only wanted to hurt Simba, so it'd make sense if it was just Sarabi.

to:

They killed Sarabi, too. That's why she never shows up again, is never mentioned again... Like Kopa, she just kind of... disappeared, without any explanation. Possibly Sarafina too, but Zira only wanted to hurt Simba, so it'd make sense if it was just Sarabi.Sarabi.
.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


During 'Be Prepared', he uses earthbending to make the ground open up when he jumps down from the cliff, and to make the rock columns rise up into the air with him on it. He also uses firebending to make fire flare up behind him towards the end of the song for dramatic effect. As he is not a fully realized Avatar, he has only mastered earth and fire, and in trying to learn waterbending and airbending he somehow screwed up badly enough to make the rivers dry up and cause a drought.

to:

During 'Be Prepared', he uses earthbending to make the ground open up when he jumps down from the cliff, and to make the rock columns rise up into the air with him on it. He also uses firebending to make fire flare up behind him towards the end of the song for dramatic effect. As he is not a fully realized Avatar, he has only mastered earth and fire, and in trying to learn waterbending and airbending he somehow screwed up badly enough to make the rivers dry up and cause a drought.drought.

[[WMG: Zira and her followers didn't just kill Kopa.]]
They killed Sarabi, too. That's why she never shows up again, is never mentioned again... Like Kopa, she just kind of... disappeared, without any explanation. Possibly Sarafina too, but Zira only wanted to hurt Simba, so it'd make sense if it was just Sarabi.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* So Ed is the hyena version of [[{{Batman}} the Joker]]?

to:

* So Ed is the hyena version of [[{{Batman}} the Joker]]?SelfDemonstrating/TheJoker?
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


Bear with me here, I won't try to make a really big explanation. Based on a discussion had with a friend, this WMG happened as such: He literally couldn't move from shock and was trampled by the wildebeest. The only doubt I have about it being a WMG is that this might not actually be that uncommon for really young lion cubs in RealLife. Given the possibility of being small and inexperienced, either the situation I described would happen or the cub would be killed while trying to run.

to:

Bear with me here, I won't try to make a really big explanation. Based on a discussion had with a friend, this WMG happened as such: He literally couldn't move from shock and was trampled by the wildebeest. The only doubt I have about it being a WMG is that this might not actually be that uncommon for really young lion cubs in RealLife. Given the possibility of being small and inexperienced, either the situation I described would happen or the cub would be killed while trying to run.run.

[[WMG: Scar is the [[WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender Avatar.]]]]
During 'Be Prepared', he uses earthbending to make the ground open up when he jumps down from the cliff, and to make the rock columns rise up into the air with him on it. He also uses firebending to make fire flare up behind him towards the end of the song for dramatic effect. As he is not a fully realized Avatar, he has only mastered earth and fire, and in trying to learn waterbending and airbending he somehow screwed up badly enough to make the rivers dry up and cause a drought.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

[[WMG: Scar was neglected by his and Mufasa's father because he was supposed to be a female lion.]]
This is completely alternative to the short stories, but I came upon those after my theory so I am ignoring any mention of their father, because I really like my theory. This takes a while but it's totally worth it. Okay. So there are two clues in the movie: "There's more to being king than getting your way all the time" versus "I am the king I can do whatever I want." If we're assuming past behavior from present--and Mufasa's dad had a HUGE influence on him, via the "kings of the past" scene--that means Mufasa's wisdom was passed down from HIS father, and Scar's lack of wisdom points to a negligent father. So Mufasa was the favorite child.

Now, Simba and Nala are (apparently) half-siblings, and already betrothed as chidren--probably from birth, if our nobility are anything to go on; in short, an arranged marriage. When Scar was born, there was probably talk of another arranged marriage back in
his day as well, and Scar, if a female, would have been the chosen mate. I can imagine their father having high hopes for whatever dynasty that would come of a Mufasa-Scarina marriage if he had been a she. But, as so often happens, Scarina turned out to be Scar, the disappointed parent scorned him, and the rest is The Circle Of Life.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None



to:

** In "Be Prepared", when Scar sings "It's clear from your vacant expressions / The lights are not all on upstairs", Ed winks at the camera as if to say [[ObfuscatingStupidity "Yeah, that's what HE thinks!"]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


Bear with me here, I won't try to make a really big explanation. Based on a discussion had with a friend, this WMG happened as such: [[OhCrap He literally couldn't move from shock or, worse, this reaction was right before being trampled by the wildebeest.]]

to:

Bear with me here, I won't try to make a really big explanation. Based on a discussion had with a friend, this WMG happened as such: [[OhCrap He literally couldn't move from shock or, worse, this reaction and was right before being trampled by the wildebeest.]]wildebeest. The only doubt I have about it being a WMG is that this might not actually be that uncommon for really young lion cubs in RealLife. Given the possibility of being small and inexperienced, either the situation I described would happen or the cub would be killed while trying to run.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
New WMG Theory


While [[DracoInLeatherPants fangirls tend to give Scar]] a FreudianExcuse by saying that he's TheUnfavourite, that doesn't really fit with Scar's [[ItsAllAboutMe personality]]-if anything, he sounds like he was given the right to be king, and could be considered the EvilCounterpart to Simba. His parents pampered him, either because he was originally going to be king or because they wanted to comfort him in the fact that he wouldn't. Being pampered did nothing to make him a capable ruler, and as Mufasa was more focused on actually learning how rulership works was chosen as king instead. Scar believed that he deserved to be king because of this pampering, along with thinking that being ruler=[[ItsAllAboutMe getting what I want.]] He used this to justify killing Mufasa, along with the fact that he believed that Mufasa "stole" his rightful position. [[TheCaligula Unsurprisingly, he had no skill when it came to actually ruling]]. Mufasa was trying to temper Simba because this he didn't want something like Scar happening again, though he didn't think Scar was willing to kill him the way that he did.

to:

While [[DracoInLeatherPants fangirls tend to give Scar]] a FreudianExcuse by saying that he's TheUnfavourite, that doesn't really fit with Scar's [[ItsAllAboutMe personality]]-if anything, he sounds like he was given the right to be king, and could be considered the EvilCounterpart to Simba. His parents pampered him, either because he was originally going to be king or because they wanted to comfort him in the fact that he wouldn't. Being pampered did nothing to make him a capable ruler, and as Mufasa was more focused on actually learning how rulership works was chosen as king instead. Scar believed that he deserved to be king because of this pampering, along with thinking that being ruler=[[ItsAllAboutMe getting what I want.]] He used this to justify killing Mufasa, along with the fact that he believed that Mufasa "stole" his rightful position. [[TheCaligula Unsurprisingly, he had no skill when it came to actually ruling]]. Mufasa was trying to temper Simba because this he didn't want something like Scar happening again, though he didn't think Scar was willing to kill him the way that he did.did.

[[WMG: Simba died when the Stampede initially came towards him. The rest of the movie is what would've happened had he lived.]]
Bear with me here, I won't try to make a really big explanation. Based on a discussion had with a friend, this WMG happened as such: [[OhCrap He literally couldn't move from shock or, worse, this reaction was right before being trampled by the wildebeest.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


Timon and Pumba's childhoods, and the fact that many of the homes they tried to move into were places Simba had been were true, but they weren't always in the same place at the same time. The whole thing with the hyenas and meerkats at the end was also made up to make Timon and Pumba seem more herioc.

to:

Timon and Pumba's childhoods, and the fact that many of the homes they tried to move into were places Simba had been were true, but they weren't always in the same place at the same time. The whole thing with the hyenas and meerkats at the end was also made up to make Timon and Pumba seem more herioc.herioc.

[[WMG: Scar was pampered by his parents.]]
While [[DracoInLeatherPants fangirls tend to give Scar]] a FreudianExcuse by saying that he's TheUnfavourite, that doesn't really fit with Scar's [[ItsAllAboutMe personality]]-if anything, he sounds like he was given the right to be king, and could be considered the EvilCounterpart to Simba. His parents pampered him, either because he was originally going to be king or because they wanted to comfort him in the fact that he wouldn't. Being pampered did nothing to make him a capable ruler, and as Mufasa was more focused on actually learning how rulership works was chosen as king instead. Scar believed that he deserved to be king because of this pampering, along with thinking that being ruler=[[ItsAllAboutMe getting what I want.]] He used this to justify killing Mufasa, along with the fact that he believed that Mufasa "stole" his rightful position. [[TheCaligula Unsurprisingly, he had no skill when it came to actually ruling]]. Mufasa was trying to temper Simba because this he didn't want something like Scar happening again, though he didn't think Scar was willing to kill him the way that he did.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
1 1/2 theory


He is weak and mangy due to Scar being "on the shallow end of the gene pool".

to:

He is weak and mangy due to Scar being "on the shallow end of the gene pool".pool".

[[WMG: The Lion King 1 1/2 is partly two, and partly made up and exaggerated by Timon and Pumba(but mostly Timon)]]
Timon and Pumba's childhoods, and the fact that many of the homes they tried to move into were places Simba had been were true, but they weren't always in the same place at the same time. The whole thing with the hyenas and meerkats at the end was also made up to make Timon and Pumba seem more herioc.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None



to:

**Possibly Jossed in TimonAndPumbaa, since sometimes on the show, Timon and Pumbaa meet humans. There was even a human recurring villian named Quint.

Top