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** I've always found it sort of weird that in the second female verse the spirit says "always your mother will watch over you..." If she really was his mother, and he knew that, wouldn't she use first person? To me, that sentence comes across as promising that it is defiantly his mother that is watching over him. Sort of like the spirit still has to convince him of this fact. It could just be for songwriting and tempo, I guess, but it bugs me.
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Changed line(s) 44,45 (click to see context) from:
William is a seed trapped in an area of the forest that has bad soil ("Trapped in a cradle of clay"), and the Queen of the forest dug him up and gave him a dual Faun/Human form. Margret is in fact the daughter of the river spirit (Annan Water) whom fell in love with William, against the wills of both parents. Making this less of a fantastic pantomime than a straight-up RomeoAndJuliet story with fantastic elements.
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William is a seed trapped in an area of the forest that has bad soil ("Trapped in a cradle of clay"), and the Queen of the forest dug him up and gave him a dual Faun/Human form. Margret is in fact the daughter of the river spirit (Annan Water) whom fell in love with William, against the wills of both parents. Making this less of a fantastic pantomime than a straight-up RomeoAndJuliet Theatre/RomeoAndJuliet story with fantastic elements.
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Changed line(s) 6 (click to see context) from:
** In addition to the higher-pitched female voice, the mother's vocal parts have a quiet, almost raspy whisper backing them and echoing the words. It is not especially noticeable but is slightly louder in the second female verse and as the mother addresses her son directly. It gives a subtle VoiceOfTheLegionEffect typical to demons.
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** In addition to the higher-pitched female voice, the mother's vocal parts have a quiet, almost raspy whisper backing them and echoing the words. It is not especially noticeable but is slightly louder in the second female verse and as the mother addresses her son directly. It gives a subtle VoiceOfTheLegionEffect VoiceOfTheLegion effect typical to demons.
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[[WMG: In "The Mariner's Revenge Song", the spirit that drove the Mariner to revenge was not his mother]]
* The theory is as it sounds: the female voice in the song does not belong to the Mariner's late mother, but to an evil spirit (possibly a demon) pretending to be her in order to drive her son to madness.
** In addition to the higher-pitched female voice, the mother's vocal parts have a quiet, almost raspy whisper backing them and echoing the words. It is not especially noticeable but is slightly louder in the second female verse and as the mother addresses her son directly. It gives a subtle VoiceOfTheLegionEffect typical to demons.
** As well, while we don't know how old the rake and the mother were together, but it seems unlikely a rake would've stuck around in any one place/with any one woman for very long. If the son was three when he met the rake, he can't have been more than a young child when his mother died. And what mother would spend her last words to prompt her own son- a young child, no less- to dedicate his entire life to an overly colorful revenge scheme? On her last breath, even. It would take a pretty evil person to do that.
Which leads me to one of two conclusions:
***The mother we hear is NOT the boy's mother, but rather a demon impersonating her for the purpose of corrupting her son's spirit. A demon would know to take advantage of someone's emotionally precarious position in order to drive them to evil and reap the person's soul while it was on fertile land, so to speak. And the young boy was lost, impressionable, and emotionally devastated without his mother; his mind would be easy to manipulate. If the demon could alter minds at all, the mother's last words may have been entirely different, maybe comforting her son. The demon would have tampered the memory and inserted the revenge scheme in its stead.
***Alternatively, it IS the mother, somewhat... who herself became a restless demon/spirit for a different goal (revenge at any cost) but to essentially the same end. The rake not only ruined the woman's life, he ruined her very decency along with it.
***
* The theory is as it sounds: the female voice in the song does not belong to the Mariner's late mother, but to an evil spirit (possibly a demon) pretending to be her in order to drive her son to madness.
** In addition to the higher-pitched female voice, the mother's vocal parts have a quiet, almost raspy whisper backing them and echoing the words. It is not especially noticeable but is slightly louder in the second female verse and as the mother addresses her son directly. It gives a subtle VoiceOfTheLegionEffect typical to demons.
** As well, while we don't know how old the rake and the mother were together, but it seems unlikely a rake would've stuck around in any one place/with any one woman for very long. If the son was three when he met the rake, he can't have been more than a young child when his mother died. And what mother would spend her last words to prompt her own son- a young child, no less- to dedicate his entire life to an overly colorful revenge scheme? On her last breath, even. It would take a pretty evil person to do that.
Which leads me to one of two conclusions:
***The mother we hear is NOT the boy's mother, but rather a demon impersonating her for the purpose of corrupting her son's spirit. A demon would know to take advantage of someone's emotionally precarious position in order to drive them to evil and reap the person's soul while it was on fertile land, so to speak. And the young boy was lost, impressionable, and emotionally devastated without his mother; his mind would be easy to manipulate. If the demon could alter minds at all, the mother's last words may have been entirely different, maybe comforting her son. The demon would have tampered the memory and inserted the revenge scheme in its stead.
***Alternatively, it IS the mother, somewhat... who herself became a restless demon/spirit for a different goal (revenge at any cost) but to essentially the same end. The rake not only ruined the woman's life, he ruined her very decency along with it.
***
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Changed line(s) 76 (click to see context) from:
The most glaring example is the frequent references to ivy throughout the album. There are lots of allusions to nature, and some bits about Portland (Meloy lives there with his wife and son). There are more if you give it a good listen. The parallels might have been unplanned, but it's fun to think it was intentional.
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The most glaring example is examples are the frequent references to ivy throughout the album. There are lots of allusions to nature, and some bits about Portland (Meloy lives there with his wife and son). There are more if you give it a good listen. The parallels might have been unplanned, but it's fun to think it was intentional.
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Changed line(s) 73 (click to see context) from:
Both songs describe figures that can't figure their lives out, or have a longing desire for something more. Seems similar, but not connected, until you learn the chords - "Here I Dreamt I was an Architect" has two distinct chords that go with the riff, and "The Engine Driver" starts with the exact same two chords.
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Both songs describe figures that can't figure their lives out, or have a longing desire for something more. Seems similar, but not connected, until you learn the chords - "Here I Dreamt I was an Architect" has two distinct chords that go with the riff, and "The Engine Driver" starts with the exact same two chords.chords.
[[WMG: Lyrics from The King Is Dead contain passing shout outs to Wildwood.]]
The most glaring example is the frequent references to ivy throughout the album. There are lots of allusions to nature, and some bits about Portland (Meloy lives there with his wife and son). There are more if you give it a good listen. The parallels might have been unplanned, but it's fun to think it was intentional.
[[WMG: Lyrics from The King Is Dead contain passing shout outs to Wildwood.]]
The most glaring example is the frequent references to ivy throughout the album. There are lots of allusions to nature, and some bits about Portland (Meloy lives there with his wife and son). There are more if you give it a good listen. The parallels might have been unplanned, but it's fun to think it was intentional.
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Changed line(s) 20 (click to see context) from:
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* Or she was freaked out when she first met William and learned what he was, and the world he belonged to, but nine months later she's cool with it. Or she lives in a human settlement where they have long accepted (and feared) the magic and creatures of the forest.
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Changed line(s) 42 (click to see context) from:
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* [[http://archiveofourown.org/series/6867 There is fanfic.]] And it's awesome.
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Changed line(s) 68 (click to see context) from:
Every time they're reborn, they lose their relationship for some reason and keep coming back - "and try one, and try two/ I guess it all comes down to / Alright, okay".
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Every time they're reborn, they lose their relationship for some reason and keep coming back - "and try one, and try two/ I guess it all comes down to / Alright, okay".okay".
[[WMG: The Architect and the Engine Driver are the same people.]]
Both songs describe figures that can't figure their lives out, or have a longing desire for something more. Seems similar, but not connected, until you learn the chords - "Here I Dreamt I was an Architect" has two distinct chords that go with the riff, and "The Engine Driver" starts with the exact same two chords.
[[WMG: The Architect and the Engine Driver are the same people.]]
Both songs describe figures that can't figure their lives out, or have a longing desire for something more. Seems similar, but not connected, until you learn the chords - "Here I Dreamt I was an Architect" has two distinct chords that go with the riff, and "The Engine Driver" starts with the exact same two chords.
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Changed line(s) 7 (click to see context) from:
[[WMG: ''The Mariner's Revenge Song'' is in the same universe as ''SweeneyTodd''.]]
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[[WMG: ''The Mariner's Revenge Song'' is in the same universe as ''SweeneyTodd''.''Theatre/SweeneyToddTheDemonBarberOfFleetStreet''.]]
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Changed line(s) 65 (click to see context) from:
It was a massive effort to get the contents of a safe. But they disguised it by kidnapping a businessman's daughter and threatening to assassinate the businessman. While law enforcement was busy dealing with the hostage situation, they robbed the bank. They still got caught, though, if the lyrics are anything to go by.
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It was a massive effort to get the contents of a safe. But they disguised it by kidnapping a businessman's daughter and threatening to assassinate the businessman. While law enforcement was busy dealing with the hostage situation, they robbed the bank. They still got caught, though, if the lyrics are anything to go by.by.
[[WMG: "Here I Dreamt I Was An Architect" is about a couple who are repeatedly reincarnated.]]
Every time they're reborn, they lose their relationship for some reason and keep coming back - "and try one, and try two/ I guess it all comes down to / Alright, okay".
[[WMG: "Here I Dreamt I Was An Architect" is about a couple who are repeatedly reincarnated.]]
Every time they're reborn, they lose their relationship for some reason and keep coming back - "and try one, and try two/ I guess it all comes down to / Alright, okay".
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Changed line(s) 62 (click to see context) from:
So here's my WMG - William gives up and doesn't try to escape the fortress and the water not just because he's got a code of honor that won't let him renege on the promise that he made in "Annan Water," but also because his beloved and their gestating child are both dead. He's made an enemy of his own mother, and his beloved Margaret is dead, taking with her their hope for a family. He's lost the will to fight anymore. "The Drowned" is William trying to get her to wake up by calling her name, trying to get her to respond. He realizes that she's not going to wake up and he's going to die sometime around when he suggests that they declare themselves married there. The times when we hear Margaret's voice alongside William's is easily explained as her spirit still lingering because he's going to die soon, and him slowly drowning and losing his grip on the mortal world (and sanity).
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So here's my WMG - William gives up and doesn't try to escape the fortress and the water not just because he's got a code of honor that won't let him renege on the promise that he made in "Annan Water," but also because his beloved and their gestating child are both dead. He's made an enemy of his own mother, and his beloved Margaret is dead, taking with her their hope for a family. He's lost the will to fight anymore. "The Drowned" is William trying to get her to wake up by calling her name, trying to get her to respond. He realizes that she's not going to wake up and he's going to die sometime around when he suggests that they declare themselves married there. The times when we hear Margaret's voice alongside William's is easily explained as her spirit still lingering because he's going to die soon, and him slowly drowning and losing his grip on the mortal world (and sanity).sanity).
[[WMG: The crime in "The Perfect Crime" was an elaborate bank heist.]]
It was a massive effort to get the contents of a safe. But they disguised it by kidnapping a businessman's daughter and threatening to assassinate the businessman. While law enforcement was busy dealing with the hostage situation, they robbed the bank. They still got caught, though, if the lyrics are anything to go by.
[[WMG: The crime in "The Perfect Crime" was an elaborate bank heist.]]
It was a massive effort to get the contents of a safe. But they disguised it by kidnapping a businessman's daughter and threatening to assassinate the businessman. While law enforcement was busy dealing with the hostage situation, they robbed the bank. They still got caught, though, if the lyrics are anything to go by.
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Changed line(s) 57 (click to see context) from:
The narrator is callous, handsome, and deluded. He would rather believe that he's in a tragic love affair with a lower class girl than admit that he's a crazy rapist. Now the girl's pregnant, and he's going to push her off a cliff and scarper. He'll do it romantically, of course. (The baby is Leslie Anne Levine, but that's another story.)
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The narrator is callous, handsome, and deluded. He would rather believe that he's in a tragic love affair with a lower class girl than admit that he's a crazy rapist. Now the girl's pregnant, and he's going to push her off a cliff and scarper. He'll do it romantically, of course. (The baby is Leslie Anne Levine, but that's another story.))
[[WMG: The Rake actually killed Margaret before William/his dead children got to him.]]
Now, I'm only going by the album version here, as I've never seen it. But in the last two songs, we only hear Margaret's voice either alongside William's, or as a wail in the background. You'd think that, if she were still alive, she would have something to say during "The Drowned," at least. There are other lines, like "painting rings around your eyes" that make it seem like he's watching her while she's lying still. Too still.
So here's my WMG - William gives up and doesn't try to escape the fortress and the water not just because he's got a code of honor that won't let him renege on the promise that he made in "Annan Water," but also because his beloved and their gestating child are both dead. He's made an enemy of his own mother, and his beloved Margaret is dead, taking with her their hope for a family. He's lost the will to fight anymore. "The Drowned" is William trying to get her to wake up by calling her name, trying to get her to respond. He realizes that she's not going to wake up and he's going to die sometime around when he suggests that they declare themselves married there. The times when we hear Margaret's voice alongside William's is easily explained as her spirit still lingering because he's going to die soon, and him slowly drowning and losing his grip on the mortal world (and sanity).
[[WMG: The Rake actually killed Margaret before William/his dead children got to him.]]
Now, I'm only going by the album version here, as I've never seen it. But in the last two songs, we only hear Margaret's voice either alongside William's, or as a wail in the background. You'd think that, if she were still alive, she would have something to say during "The Drowned," at least. There are other lines, like "painting rings around your eyes" that make it seem like he's watching her while she's lying still. Too still.
So here's my WMG - William gives up and doesn't try to escape the fortress and the water not just because he's got a code of honor that won't let him renege on the promise that he made in "Annan Water," but also because his beloved and their gestating child are both dead. He's made an enemy of his own mother, and his beloved Margaret is dead, taking with her their hope for a family. He's lost the will to fight anymore. "The Drowned" is William trying to get her to wake up by calling her name, trying to get her to respond. He realizes that she's not going to wake up and he's going to die sometime around when he suggests that they declare themselves married there. The times when we hear Margaret's voice alongside William's is easily explained as her spirit still lingering because he's going to die soon, and him slowly drowning and losing his grip on the mortal world (and sanity).
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Changed line(s) 48 (click to see context) from:
The bride on the cover of the album is wearing Manchu-style clothing whereas the groom is wearing a [[{{Salaryman}} business suit]], which, applying the recent history between the two countries, is apt. The crane referred to is most likely a [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red-crowned_Crane red-crowned crane]], which migrates between the two countries. Oh, and her wedding dress is ''white'' with a ''red'' splotch where the arrow struck her.
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The bride on the cover of the album is wearing Manchu-style clothing whereas the groom is wearing a [[{{Salaryman}} business suit]], which, applying the recent history between the two countries, is apt. The crane referred to is most likely a [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red-crowned_Crane red-crowned crane]], which migrates between the two countries. Oh, and her wedding dress is ''white'' with a ''red'' splotch where the arrow struck her.her.
[[WMG: The whale from The Decemberist's "The Mariner's Revenge Song" is the ghost of the protagonist's mother]]
The protagonist mentions hearing her after her death; the whale appears after the protagonist hears her and gives her son a chance at taking revenge into his own hands.
[[WMG: The narrator of The Decembrist's "The Mariner's Revenge Song" is on the ''Pequod'' and chasing Moby Dick.]]
The ship does go down. Along the way, Queequeg nearly dies and orders a coffin to be made by the ship's carpenter, which he then decorates with carvings of his own design. After the ship breaks up, the narrator finds it floating and uses it like a canoe. (Oh, and Ahab harpoons himself to the whale.)
[[WMG: The narrator of "We Both Go Down Together" by the Decemberists is the 'lad of eighteen' from "The Mariner's Revenge Song"]]
The narrator is callous, handsome, and deluded. He would rather believe that he's in a tragic love affair with a lower class girl than admit that he's a crazy rapist. Now the girl's pregnant, and he's going to push her off a cliff and scarper. He'll do it romantically, of course. (The baby is Leslie Anne Levine, but that's another story.)
[[WMG: The whale from The Decemberist's "The Mariner's Revenge Song" is the ghost of the protagonist's mother]]
The protagonist mentions hearing her after her death; the whale appears after the protagonist hears her and gives her son a chance at taking revenge into his own hands.
[[WMG: The narrator of The Decembrist's "The Mariner's Revenge Song" is on the ''Pequod'' and chasing Moby Dick.]]
The ship does go down. Along the way, Queequeg nearly dies and orders a coffin to be made by the ship's carpenter, which he then decorates with carvings of his own design. After the ship breaks up, the narrator finds it floating and uses it like a canoe. (Oh, and Ahab harpoons himself to the whale.)
[[WMG: The narrator of "We Both Go Down Together" by the Decemberists is the 'lad of eighteen' from "The Mariner's Revenge Song"]]
The narrator is callous, handsome, and deluded. He would rather believe that he's in a tragic love affair with a lower class girl than admit that he's a crazy rapist. Now the girl's pregnant, and he's going to push her off a cliff and scarper. He'll do it romantically, of course. (The baby is Leslie Anne Levine, but that's another story.)
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Changed line(s) 41 (click to see context) from:
This isn't so much of a theory than a literal interpretation of the lyrics.
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This isn't so much of a theory than a literal interpretation of the lyrics.lyrics.
[[WMG: The Crane Wife is a Chinese woman married to a Japanese businessman]]
And the songs referring to the fable are just an allegory/allusion to the original story when the husband recalls the story after an aggravating, drawn-out divorce.
This mentioned combination most common in the types of inter-racial marriages involving Japanese citizens. Often there's the element of economic inequality involved.
The bride on the cover of the album is wearing Manchu-style clothing whereas the groom is wearing a [[{{Salaryman}} business suit]], which, applying the recent history between the two countries, is apt. The crane referred to is most likely a [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red-crowned_Crane red-crowned crane]], which migrates between the two countries. Oh, and her wedding dress is ''white'' with a ''red'' splotch where the arrow struck her.
[[WMG: The Crane Wife is a Chinese woman married to a Japanese businessman]]
And the songs referring to the fable are just an allegory/allusion to the original story when the husband recalls the story after an aggravating, drawn-out divorce.
This mentioned combination most common in the types of inter-racial marriages involving Japanese citizens. Often there's the element of economic inequality involved.
The bride on the cover of the album is wearing Manchu-style clothing whereas the groom is wearing a [[{{Salaryman}} business suit]], which, applying the recent history between the two countries, is apt. The crane referred to is most likely a [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red-crowned_Crane red-crowned crane]], which migrates between the two countries. Oh, and her wedding dress is ''white'' with a ''red'' splotch where the arrow struck her.
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[[WMG: The Rake in "The Rake's Song" is the same Rake from "The Mariner's Revenge Song"]
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[[WMG: The Rake in "The Rake's Song" is the same Rake from "The Mariner's Revenge Song"]Song"]]
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[[WMG: The Rake in "The Rake's Song" is the same Rake from "The Mariner's Revenge Song"]
*Colin is specific to a fault when it comes to the chronology of both songs, I've figured out that it works very well together: at 18, the Rake seduces the three-year-old Mariner's mother, bankrupts her and gives her a fatal case of tuberculosis before fleeing. Then at 21, he marries and has four children, the last of whom, Myfanwy, is stillborn and her mother dies in childbirth. By this time he'd be about 25, assuming the pregnancies happened in quick succession, although it's possible that Charlotte and Dawn were twins. Presumably, his lack of desire to remain a father after his wife dies causes him to kill his children, and then he kidnaps Margaret. Although his children's ghosts haunt him at the end of The Hazards Of Love, it is never mentioned that he dies, so he could have gone to the sea and eventually become "the captain of [a] ship...known for wanton cruelty." Meanwhile, the Mariner is 18 when he overhears the confession in the church where he works that reveals the Rake's location to him, and he spends 20 months sailing toward him, making the Mariner 19 or 20 when they meet again, and the Rake 34 or 35—and that's where they have the duel to the death in the whale's belly after being swallowed! (copy-pasted from when I wrote it on the Just Bugs Me page)
*Colin is specific to a fault when it comes to the chronology of both songs, I've figured out that it works very well together: at 18, the Rake seduces the three-year-old Mariner's mother, bankrupts her and gives her a fatal case of tuberculosis before fleeing. Then at 21, he marries and has four children, the last of whom, Myfanwy, is stillborn and her mother dies in childbirth. By this time he'd be about 25, assuming the pregnancies happened in quick succession, although it's possible that Charlotte and Dawn were twins. Presumably, his lack of desire to remain a father after his wife dies causes him to kill his children, and then he kidnaps Margaret. Although his children's ghosts haunt him at the end of The Hazards Of Love, it is never mentioned that he dies, so he could have gone to the sea and eventually become "the captain of [a] ship...known for wanton cruelty." Meanwhile, the Mariner is 18 when he overhears the confession in the church where he works that reveals the Rake's location to him, and he spends 20 months sailing toward him, making the Mariner 19 or 20 when they meet again, and the Rake 34 or 35—and that's where they have the duel to the death in the whale's belly after being swallowed! (copy-pasted from when I wrote it on the Just Bugs Me page)
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Changed line(s) 37 (click to see context) from:
[[WMG: ''Collin Meloy is a psychopath''.]]
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[[WMG: ''Collin 'Collin Meloy is a psychopath''.psychopath.]]
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Changed line(s) 35 (click to see context) from:
The final lyrics are "I'll Be Back Again", so one assumes that he's going back home.
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The final lyrics are "I'll Be Back Again", so one assumes that he's going back home.home.
[[WMG: ''Collin Meloy is a psychopath''.]]
This isn't so much of a theory than a literal interpretation of the lyrics.
[[WMG: ''Collin Meloy is a psychopath''.]]
This isn't so much of a theory than a literal interpretation of the lyrics.
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Changed line(s) 32 (click to see context) from:
If you take a step back and consider it from a Meta point of view, as a kind of play or musical, some elements start to make more sense . The entire story is very Shakespearean, and if you consider the characters from the point of view as players on a stage, some of the odd bits start making sense: the reason all the characters are human, for example, is because it's impossible to have singing and dancing trees and water.
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If you take a step back and consider it from a Meta point of view, as a kind of play or musical, some elements start to make more sense . The entire story is very Shakespearean, and if you consider the characters from the point of view as players on a stage, some of the odd bits start making sense: the reason all the characters are human, for example, is because it's impossible to have singing and dancing trees and water.water.
[[WMG: The Legionnaire is rescued at the end of ''The Legionnaire's Lament'']]
The final lyrics are "I'll Be Back Again", so one assumes that he's going back home.
[[WMG: The Legionnaire is rescued at the end of ''The Legionnaire's Lament'']]
The final lyrics are "I'll Be Back Again", so one assumes that he's going back home.
