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* An alternative theory. Going under the assumption that the political situation in Russia and East Asia doesn't change, WWII will be the Western Allies vs the USSR and it's allies. The Romanovs will still be deposed and replaced by the Bolsheviks under Lenin, either at around the same time or later than our history. Russia will plunge into civil war, countries like Poland, Finland, etc. will make bids for independence. Eventually, Stalin will rise to power (he had the connections and the determination to get rid of Trotsky). Because Wilson was unwilling to deal with Wilhelm II, Germany will become a republic to get the best peace possible. If Russia becomes Communists early enough, they will be able to make Germany into a Communist satlite state and later turn it's attentions to China. Because of Imperial Japanese ambition, Japan will continue it's aggression in China, making the USSR to want to have a friendly Beijing. Japan will turn to England, it's ally for held. England will either turn against Japan or aid it. Political and economic problems in Europe and North America and weariness of Russia will lead to an UK/France/Poland/US alliance against Russia/China. The wild card in this theory is Japan, but I'm running out of time to flush that out.
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* An alternative theory. Going under the assumption that the political situation in Russia and East Asia doesn't change, WWII will be the Western Allies vs the USSR and it's allies. The Romanovs will still be deposed and replaced by the Bolsheviks under Lenin, either at around the same time or later than our history. Russia will plunge into civil war, countries like Poland, Finland, etc. will make bids for independence. Eventually, Stalin will rise to power (he had the connections and the determination to get rid of Trotsky). Because Wilson was unwilling to deal with Wilhelm II, as in real life, Germany will become a republic to get the best peace possible. If Russia becomes Communists early enough, they will be able to make Germany into a Communist satlite satellite state and later turn it's attentions to China. Because of Imperial Japanese ambition, Japan will continue it's aggression in China, making the USSR to want to have a friendly Beijing. Japan will turn to England, it's ally for held. England will either turn against Japan or aid it. Political and economic problems in Europe and North America and weariness of Russia will lead to an UK/France/Poland/US UK/France/Poland alliance against Russia/China. USSR/China/Communist Germany/Republican Spain. The wild card in this theory is Japan, but I'm running Japan; either it is abandoned by the UK out of fear of it's aggression, or Japan is taken on as the token evil teammate for the Allies. The US will act like it did during WWII, but Russia will most likely attack the US through Alaska, or manage to use aircraft carries like the Japanese. It all depends upon the technology level and when the Russian Revolution happens. With a very short WWI, the technological developments from those four years won't happen, they're more likely to happen later, same with many social and economic changes. So the mentality of the 1920's and the Great Depression will also happen later, but the rise of Chinese Communism under Mao may happen earlier. I am of the camp that WWII will happen more in the mid 1940's for the earliest date and the early 1950's for the latest date. A longer period of strong economic growth will get the technology to the level it should be for WWII, and the social changes should happen some time to flush in the mid 1920's and into the 1930's. I personally think that out.
the natural disasters of the 1930's are unavoidable and will probably exasperate the political and social issues of the day.
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* An alternative theory. Going under the assumption that the political situation in Russia and East Asia doesn't change, WWII will be the Western Allies vs the USSR and it's allies. The Romanovs will still be deposed and replaced by the Bolsheviks under Lenin, either at around the same time or later than our history. Russia will plunge into civil war, countries like Poland, Finland, etc. will make bids for independence. Eventually, Stalin will rise to power (he had the connections and the determination to get rid of Trotsky). Because Wilson was unwilling to deal with Wilhelm II, Germany will become a republic to get the best peace possible. If Russia becomes Communists early enough, they will be able to make Germany into a Communist satlite state and later turn it's attentions to China. Because of Imperial Japanese ambition, Japan will continue it's aggression in China, making the USSR to want to have a friendly Beijing. Japan will turn to England, it's ally for held. England will either turn against Japan or aid it. Political and economic problems in Europe and North America and weariness of Russia will lead to an UK/France/Poland/US alliance against Russia/China. The wild card in this theory is Japan, but I'm running out of time to flush that out.
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** Confirmed. This fic here; http://www.fanfiction.net/s/7496482/1/Darwins_Fist
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** Confirmed. This fic here; http://www.fanfiction.net/s/7496482/1/Darwins_Fistnet/s/7496482/1/Darwins_Fist
[[WMG: The future of the Leviathan universe will be {{Cyberpunk}}.]]
* Cyberpunk often includes both highly advanced technology, genetic engineering, and the melding of flesh and technology.
[[WMG: The future of the Leviathan universe will be {{Cyberpunk}}.]]
* Cyberpunk often includes both highly advanced technology, genetic engineering, and the melding of flesh and technology.
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[[WMG: After the War, Tesla's Technology will be put into wide use by America.
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[[WMG: After the War, Tesla's Technology will be put into wide use by America.]]
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[[WMG: After the War, [[spoiler: Tesla's]] Technology will be put into wide use by America.
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[[WMG: After the War, [[spoiler: Tesla's]] Tesla's Technology will be put into wide use by America.
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[[WMG: After the War, [[Spoiler: Tesla's]] Technology will be put into wide use by America.
Although it's implied that [[Spoiler: Goliath didn't work]] the American Army will go through his notes and find designs for everything. Even when not fully charged, [[Spoiler: Goliath's energy release destroyed an entire Frigate.]] The Americans will develop long range artillery guns for ship that purposefully do this, but with operation carefully controlled so that the lightning doesn't see their ships or troops as a better target than the enemy's. Also, with America's mixed technology, they will begin growing Flechete Bats and water creatures around [[Spoiler: Tesla's remote controlled boats and their air equivalent]] in order to better control them. The [[Spoiler: boats]] themselves will be used as anti-[[Spoiler:Kappa]] weapons in the Leviathan equivalent of WWII. Probably as a kamikaze attack to lure [[Spoiler: Kappas]] into attack zones where soldiers can safely kill them.
Although it's implied that [[Spoiler: Goliath didn't work]] the American Army will go through his notes and find designs for everything. Even when not fully charged, [[Spoiler: Goliath's energy release destroyed an entire Frigate.]] The Americans will develop long range artillery guns for ship that purposefully do this, but with operation carefully controlled so that the lightning doesn't see their ships or troops as a better target than the enemy's. Also, with America's mixed technology, they will begin growing Flechete Bats and water creatures around [[Spoiler: Tesla's remote controlled boats and their air equivalent]] in order to better control them. The [[Spoiler: boats]] themselves will be used as anti-[[Spoiler:Kappa]] weapons in the Leviathan equivalent of WWII. Probably as a kamikaze attack to lure [[Spoiler: Kappas]] into attack zones where soldiers can safely kill them.
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[[WMG: After the War, [[Spoiler: [[spoiler: Tesla's]] Technology will be put into wide use by America.
Although it's implied that[[Spoiler: [[spoiler: Goliath didn't work]] the American Army will go through his notes and find designs for everything. Even when not fully charged, [[Spoiler: [[spoiler: Goliath's energy release destroyed an entire Frigate.]] The Americans will develop long range artillery guns for ship that purposefully do this, but with operation carefully controlled so that the lightning doesn't see their ships or troops as a better target than the enemy's. Also, with America's mixed technology, they will begin growing Flechete Bats and water creatures around [[Spoiler: [[spoiler: Tesla's remote controlled boats and their air equivalent]] in order to better control them. The [[Spoiler: [[spoiler: boats]] themselves will be used as anti-[[Spoiler:Kappa]] anti-[[spoiler:Kappa]] weapons in the Leviathan equivalent of WWII. Probably as a kamikaze attack to lure [[Spoiler: [[spoiler: Kappas]] into attack zones where soldiers can safely kill them.
Although it's implied that
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[[WMG: After the War, [[Spoiler: Tesla's]] Technology will be put into wide use by America.
Although it's implied that [[Spoiler: Goliath didn't work]] the American Army will go through his notes and find designs for everything. Even when not fully charged, [[Spoiler: Goliath's energy release destroyed an entire Frigate.]] The Americans will develop long range artillery guns for ship that purposefully do this, but with operation carefully controlled so that the lightning doesn't see their ships or troops as a better target than the enemy's. Also, with America's mixed technology, they will begin growing Flechete Bats and water creatures around [[Spoiler: Tesla's remote controlled boats and their air equivalent]] in order to better control them. The [[Spoiler: boats]] themselves will be used as anti-[[Spoiler:Kappa]] weapons in the Leviathan equivalent of WWII. Probably as a kamikaze attack to lure [[Spoiler: Kappas]] into attack zones where soldiers can safely kill them.
Although it's implied that [[Spoiler: Goliath didn't work]] the American Army will go through his notes and find designs for everything. Even when not fully charged, [[Spoiler: Goliath's energy release destroyed an entire Frigate.]] The Americans will develop long range artillery guns for ship that purposefully do this, but with operation carefully controlled so that the lightning doesn't see their ships or troops as a better target than the enemy's. Also, with America's mixed technology, they will begin growing Flechete Bats and water creatures around [[Spoiler: Tesla's remote controlled boats and their air equivalent]] in order to better control them. The [[Spoiler: boats]] themselves will be used as anti-[[Spoiler:Kappa]] weapons in the Leviathan equivalent of WWII. Probably as a kamikaze attack to lure [[Spoiler: Kappas]] into attack zones where soldiers can safely kill them.
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** Yes, but World War I still happened even though the new technology would alter history so thoroughly that most of the historical people born after divergence shouldn't have been born due to sheer probability (walkers instead of cars altering traffic, changes to communication altering the likelihood of parents meeting, etc.). In this reality, Hitler was born and he'll be doing what he did in real life, albeit with a change for the new technology. After that bizarre meta-theory, I personally think that World War II in the Leviathan universe will be less like the first one described in the books. Some of the nations set up as Darwinist here were in the Axisd during World War II, such as Italy. Thus, I believe that a WWII in this universe would be more like mixed-tech powers colliding with the purely Darwinist or Clanker nations taking sides. The mixed nations will probably use steampunk cyborg animals as vehicles (elephantines grown around a walker with the head being filled by a cockpit instead of a brain for example).
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Removing wick to Did Not Do The Research per rename at TRS.
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* This troper is disappointed that this may be a case of {{DidNotDoTheResearch}}, as Japan borrowed much of it's modernized government (at the time) from the newly formed German state, and went to war with another of the "Darwinist" states only ten years before (Russia, if you need a hint). Besides, Japan will be resoundingly on the Clanker side of things come WWII, so why Darwinist now?
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* This troper is disappointed that this may be a case of {{DidNotDoTheResearch}}, poor research, as Japan borrowed much of it's modernized government (at the time) from the newly formed German state, and went to war with another of the "Darwinist" states only ten years before (Russia, if you need a hint). Besides, Japan will be resoundingly on the Clanker side of things come WWII, so why Darwinist now?
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Eventually, Clanker and Mixed powers will develop heat-seeking missiles, jets, and computers that can outdo anything a fabricated beast can. When space travel starts to be developed, satellite-based weapons and espionage techniques will quickly be able to outdo the Darwinists. Purely Darwinist powers will either be destroyed or be forced to adapt mixed technologies, like in America and Japan.
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Eventually, Clanker and Mixed powers will develop heat-seeking missiles, jets, and computers that can outdo anything a fabricated beast can. When space travel starts to be developed, satellite-based weapons and espionage techniques will quickly be able to outdo the Darwinists. Purely Darwinist powers will either be destroyed or be forced to adapt mixed technologies, like in America and Japan.
Japan.
*Equally, Clanker powers could be forced to adapt mixed technologies in the 21st century in light of climate change. Mixed technologies would just be better for everyone.
*Equally, Clanker powers could be forced to adapt mixed technologies in the 21st century in light of climate change. Mixed technologies would just be better for everyone.
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*[[spoiler:Jossed? Isn't it implied in Goliath that the Great War will have a more satisfactory conclusion and thereby prevent the Second World War from happening?]]
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Fixed a typo in Kappa entry, added a \"darwinists will fall\" WMG, and confirmed the Japanese beasties being awesome
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[[WMG: Purely Darwinist powers such as Britan, France, and Russia will quickly die out]]
Eventually, Clanker and Mixed powers will develop heat-seeking missiles, jets, and computers that can outdo anything a fabricated beast can. When space travel starts to be developed, satellite-based weapons and espionage techniques will quickly be able to outdo the Darwinists. Purely Darwinist powers will either be destroyed or be forced to adapt mixed technologies, like in America and Japan.
Eventually, Clanker and Mixed powers will develop heat-seeking missiles, jets, and computers that can outdo anything a fabricated beast can. When space travel starts to be developed, satellite-based weapons and espionage techniques will quickly be able to outdo the Darwinists. Purely Darwinist powers will either be destroyed or be forced to adapt mixed technologies, like in America and Japan.
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"Mmm...Clanker saile-CUCUMBERS!"
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"Mmm...Clanker saile-CUCUMBERS!"sailo-CUCUMBERS!"
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* Confirmed: The Japanese have Kappa, some of the most powerful naval fabricated beasts. They resemble crocodiles and jump up onto boats to eat all of the sailors. No Europeans except the ones on the Leviathan have seen them in action and lived.
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** I see it now;
"Mmm...Clanker saile-CUCUMBERS!"
(Every Kappa in battle slides away seeking cucumbers).
"Mmm...Clanker saile-CUCUMBERS!"
(Every Kappa in battle slides away seeking cucumbers).
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* But if Westerfeld does, the Eastern European front will liturally be flowing with blood. Millions more there will be killed there than they were in our world. The Nazis will probably turn to Darwinist tech to try to create [[{{SuperSoldier}} supersoldiers]] and will have no qualms about creating [[{{HumanoidAbomination}} human/animal fabs]]. And the Pacific theatre may turn into a much longer conflict than in the real world; it may even be a lot like Vietnam. It also wouldn't be a streach of the imagination for both the Axis and Allies to turn to germ warfare. Maybe instead of the atomic bomb, the Americans devlope a [[{{DoomsdayDevice}} super virus]] to use against the Japanese.
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** Too late on that. Thanks a freaking lot, Westerfeld.
* But if Westerfeld does, the Eastern European front will liturally be flowing with blood. Millions more there will be killed there than they were in our world. The Nazis will probably turn to Darwinist tech to try to create [[{{SuperSoldier}} supersoldiers]] and will have no qualms about creating [[{{HumanoidAbomination}} human/animal fabs]]. And the Pacific theatre may turn into a much longer conflict than in the real world; it may even be a lot like Vietnam. It also wouldn't be a streach of the imagination for both the Axis and Allies to turn to germ warfare. Maybe instead of the atomic bomb, the Americans devlope a [[{{DoomsdayDevice}} super virus]] to use against theJapanese.Japanese.
** Not so sure about that...the way I see it, this universe's version of Hitler would stick with "German pride" and avoid any Darwinist stuff. However, the idea of [[{{SuperSoldier}} supersoldiers]] on the side of America (and possibly Japan, for that matter) isn't to crazy.
* But if Westerfeld does, the Eastern European front will liturally be flowing with blood. Millions more there will be killed there than they were in our world. The Nazis will probably turn to Darwinist tech to try to create [[{{SuperSoldier}} supersoldiers]] and will have no qualms about creating [[{{HumanoidAbomination}} human/animal fabs]]. And the Pacific theatre may turn into a much longer conflict than in the real world; it may even be a lot like Vietnam. It also wouldn't be a streach of the imagination for both the Axis and Allies to turn to germ warfare. Maybe instead of the atomic bomb, the Americans devlope a [[{{DoomsdayDevice}} super virus]] to use against the
** Not so sure about that...the way I see it, this universe's version of Hitler would stick with "German pride" and avoid any Darwinist stuff. However, the idea of [[{{SuperSoldier}} supersoldiers]] on the side of America (and possibly Japan, for that matter) isn't to crazy.
** But America will have it's own, and we get to see the glory of fabricated humans fighting giant mechs. At least, that's what my head canon of the post-Goliath series is.
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*** I'm going with beat down.
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** Too bad we never see anything of the continent. Just like how Philip Reeve forgot to write it into the Mortal Engines Quartet.
*** I'm going with awesome. Japan and America, two hybrid nations duking it out in the Pacific?
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*** Who knows what happens after the books. Thanks for nothing, Westerfeld.
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** Possible relation to Anne Sharp from the Michael Crichton book Pirate Latitudes as well? I mean, admittedly she's from the 1600's, I think, but it's still plausable. She's certainly bad-ass enough to be Deryn's predicesor. Not to mention she's pretty much proto-Darwinist, considering how much sex she has...
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* Yeah, yeah, we all know it's illegal. But did that stop chemical warfare in the real WWI? No. Somewhere, sometime, some fan of Leviathan is going to sit down and think "we need fabricated humans". And then pormptly do it.
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* Yeah, yeah, we all know it's illegal. But did that stop chemical warfare in the real WWI? No. Somewhere, sometime, some fan of Leviathan is going to sit down and think "we need fabricated humans". And then pormptly do it. Most likely creating [[{{SuperSoldier}} supersoldiers]], as stated above.
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Because Stalin rejected Darwinism as "bourgeois science" and sent geneticists to the gulags.
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Because Stalin rejected Darwinism as "bourgeois science" and sent geneticists to the gulags.gulags.
[[WMG: There will be a fanfiction of the series that features fabricated humans.]]
* Yeah, yeah, we all know it's illegal. But did that stop chemical warfare in the real WWI? No. Somewhere, sometime, some fan of Leviathan is going to sit down and think "we need fabricated humans". And then pormptly do it.
** Confirmed. This fic here; http://www.fanfiction.net/s/7496482/1/Darwins_Fist
[[WMG: There will be a fanfiction of the series that features fabricated humans.]]
* Yeah, yeah, we all know it's illegal. But did that stop chemical warfare in the real WWI? No. Somewhere, sometime, some fan of Leviathan is going to sit down and think "we need fabricated humans". And then pormptly do it.
** Confirmed. This fic here; http://www.fanfiction.net/s/7496482/1/Darwins_Fist
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* On the other hand, Hitler was probably a bit insane, so it's possible that he would ''still'' somehow become a dictator. In this case, since [[spoiler: Deryn and Alex join the Zoological Society, which is sort of like an international espionage and peacekeeping corps,]] it's very likely that the two of them, Barlow, and Volger would manage to end WWII early as well, or kill Hitler before he does anything too bad, in something of a subversion of [[Hitler'sTimeTravelExemptionAct this trope]].
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* On the other hand, Hitler was probably a bit insane, so it's possible that he would ''still'' somehow become a dictator. In this case, since [[spoiler: Deryn and Alex join the Zoological Society, which is sort of like an international espionage and peacekeeping corps,]] it's very likely that the two of them, Barlow, and Volger would manage to end WWII early as well, or kill Hitler before he does anything too bad, in something of a subversion of [[Hitler'sTimeTravelExemptionAct this trope]].
Hitler'sTimeTravelExemptionAct.
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* On the other hand, Hitler was probably a bit insane, so it's possible that he would ''still'' somehow become a dictator. In this case, since [[spoiler: Deryn and Alex join the Zoological Society, which is sort of like an international espionage and peacekeeping corps,]] it's very likely that the two of them, Barlow, and Volger would manage to end WWII early as well, or kill Hitler before he does anything too bad, in something of a subversion of [[Hitler'sTimeTravelExemptionAct this trope]].
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* Think about it...
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* Think about it...it...
[[WMG: Following the Russian Revolution the Soviet Union will become a Clanker state]]
Because Stalin rejected Darwinism as "bourgeois science" and sent geneticists to the gulags.
[[WMG: Following the Russian Revolution the Soviet Union will become a Clanker state]]
Because Stalin rejected Darwinism as "bourgeois science" and sent geneticists to the gulags.
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[[WMG: The call away for the Kappas has something to do with fabricated cucumbers]]
* Because it is kinda obscure, especially in WWI, and it would just be cool.
* Because it is kinda obscure, especially in WWI, and it would just be cool.
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** [[spoiler:Psuedo-Confirmed, because although it is implied that the war will end quickly, no truce was implied.]]
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* [[spoiler: Confirmed.]] Except for that second part...
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*** Thoroughly[[spoiler:, and satisfyingly, {{Jossed}}]]
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** [[spoiler: {{Jossed}}. They are ''completely clueless'' about this. At least until Bovril steps in...]]
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** {{Jossed}}.
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** Confirmed.
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*** {{Jossed}}, I think.
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*** Confirmed, though Russia makes a ''very'' brief appearance, as does Japan, for that matter.
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*** [[spoiler: {{Jossed}}]]
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** [[spoiler: {{Jossed}}]]
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** [[spoiler: {{Jossed}}]]
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** Eh, close enough.
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**** [[spoiler: {{Jossed}}]]
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** [[spoiler: {{Jossed}}]]
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** Alternatively, thanks to some secret undercover missions, anti-war yellow journalism, and Alek taking the throne, WW1 ends early and the Americans never get involved at all, except perhaps to act as mediators during the treaty negotiations.
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* Considering how high this series is on the SlidingScaleOfIdealismVersusCynicism, this actually seems pretty likely to me. After all, it's made abundantly clear that all sides of this fight are at least partially to blame for the conflict and the author's already changed history to save the historical "Sick man of Europe" Ottoman Empire. It's not too out-there to think that this war might end more reasonably for the Clankers than its real-world equivalent did, which would go a long way to preventing both the rise of the Nazi party and WWII in general.
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* WordOfGod says that the Japanese, like the Americans, will be mixing technologies. Which makes a lot of sense when you consider that what Westerfeld has stated to like about the Japanese is how willing they are to adapt the customs and technologies of other nations to their own needs and build on them.
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** He's had just as many successful romances as tragic ones - look at {{Peeps}} and {{So Yesterday}}. It's still up in the air.
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* Westerfeld hinted the Leviathan will head to New York in the third book. Guess who took a tour around the U.S in the war years?
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* Westerfeld hinted the Leviathan will head to New York in the third book. Guess who took a tour around the U.S in the war years?years?
[[WMG: Leviathan is the not-so-distant-past of [[NeonGenesisEvangelion Evangelion.]]]]
* Think about it...
[[WMG: Leviathan is the not-so-distant-past of [[NeonGenesisEvangelion Evangelion.]]]]
* Think about it...
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*** Maybe he'll have been accepted into the Academy of Fine Arts Vienna and become an artist instead of a sociopathic dictator.
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*** Adolf's ''father'' was once named Schicklgruber but changed it before Adolf was born. Still, since this is an alternate history, he could possibly be using the surname.
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*** He ''did'' have a mustache in WWI, although it wasn't a Toothbrush mustache.
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** Perhaps there'll be less anti-Semitism and so more Nazis for invading Russia?
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* And so the Terminator franchise will have adorable little ferret-weasel things instead of robots? AWESOME!
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** And too horrific.
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** Not to mention that the first Russian revolution took place during (and because of) World War One.
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[[WMG: Hitler will make an appearance in Goliath.]]
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[[WMG: Hitler AdolfHitler will make an appearance in Goliath.]]
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** Running with this - it will be under his original last name, Schickelgruber, so more casual readers won't make the link. And of course, he won't have the mustache.
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** Possibly because Japan will follow OTL's path and fight along their allies, the British. After feeling cheated out of the spoils of war, they shall break out the old Clanker tech and become a Hybrid of the two, like the Americans.
Besides, Italy will be allied to Germany come World War II, yet they are obviously a Darwinist Power right now.
Besides, Italy will be allied to Germany come World War II, yet they are obviously a Darwinist Power right now.
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** Possibly because Japan will follow OTL's path and fight along their allies, the British. After feeling cheated out of the spoils of war, they shall break out the old Clanker tech and become a Hybrid of the two, like the Americans.
Americans. Besides, Italy will be allied to Germany come World War II, yet they are obviously a Darwinist Power right now.
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**Possibly because Japan will follow OTL's path and fight along their allies, the British. After feeling cheated out of the spoils of war, they shall break out the old Clanker tech and become a Hybrid of the two, like the Americans.
Besides, Italy will be allied to Germany come World War II, yet they are obviously a Darwinist Power right now.
Besides, Italy will be allied to Germany come World War II, yet they are obviously a Darwinist Power right now.
