History WMG / FinalFantasyX2

* This could explain why Yuna breaks up with Tidas in Will. She noticed there is something very wrong with Tidas. Or maybe it was just she realizes just how dangerous bringing back the dead really is.

'''Yuna:''' "You didn't disapear."

* This could explain why Yuna breaks up with Tidas in Will. She noticing there is something very wrong with Tidas.

Most of the story revolves around a conflict of ideals between two organisations with different ideas on how Spira should progress following the defeat of Sin. The leaders of the three main organisations- following their confrontation at the Den of Woe before the story began- could not let go of their mistrust of each other, inadvertently allowing the real villain to push his agenda forward.

Shuyin is an even greater example of someone whose inability to move on caused great pain and suffering. First, he refused to let go of Lenne, which indirectly led to their deaths. Later, trapped in the Den of Woe, he was unable to relinquish his despair and hatred of that moment- a moment in the past that he could not change- and transformed into a vengeful shade as a result. Shuyin is ''the embodiment'' of what happens if you refuse to accept and move on from past tragedies.

This brings us to Yuna, who is trying to move onto a new life as a Sphere Hunter. The entire story is about her trying to move on from the death of Tidus in ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyX''. Yes, he was her true love and the ending was incredibly tragic, but ''that's life''. You have to move on from such things, lest you become bitter and trapped in the past as Shuyin has. The second half of the game has her fight and defeat the Dark Aeons, twisted manifestations of her former life; a life that she must move on from. The final boss fight- one in which Yuna fights the mirror image of Tidus- is her final hurdle: she is not fighting Shuyin, but the memory of Tidus that is holding her back and refusing to let her move on with her life.

--> '''Tidus:''' "Maybe I'm still just a dream"

* Alternatively: The Faith powered the sphere grid, when they were allowed to die, it was destroyed.

TakeThat - Near the beginning, Yuna and co. arrive at Zanarkand, to find that it'ss become a tourist trap. Yuna is disappointed, and Rikku is disgusted. After all, in ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyX'', Zanarkand was an immaculate story—er, site with a contained history and they should have just left it alone and not let new things happen there, right? Too late, we—er, Cid went there!

Psychologically, everything makes sense. The poor girl's been repressing both normal emotions ''and'' grief since she was eight years old, and she even admits that her whole happy-go-lucky sphere hunter persona is just another mask. Example: When her father died, everyone was too busy PARTYING to remember that their savior had an unusual thing called a "daughter"--to the point where it took Yuna herself a while to realize that she had no parents, and led to ''one of three times in her life'' that she cried. Then when Tidus dies, she deals with yet another loved one's death by sphere-hunting... and solving religious conflicts. For [[ChronicHeroSyndrome TWO AND A HALF YEARS.]]

It's only natural that Yuna finally starts cracking under it all and affecting drastic changes in her personality, because [[BreakTheCutie she's had her parents, her beliefs, and her boyfriend savagely ripped away from her]]--most people would have at least a close friend to turn to, but even Lulu and Wakka are too focused on their new baby to spend much time with her. Or maybe she doesn't spend time with them on purpose (due to fixing everyone else's problems), so they have no idea in the first place how she's feeling.

** Perhaps related to what you're saying: Yuna's been under massive amounts of restrictions since she was little, following in her father's footsteps every step of her life, and has never really had anyone in her life who didn't remind her that people were counting on her to do so. While folks like Lulu, Wakka, and Kimahri all care for her dearly, they are still part of the whole Summoner shtick and thus she doesn't want to disappoint. Tidus was really the first person in Yuna's life where she could forget about the Summoner title, and just be Yuna. He didn't have anything to do with Yevon, and his part as a Guardian was simply to fight and protect Yuna, nothing more. When he faded away, Yuna lost not only her main purpose in life (Defeat Sin), but she lost the one person in her life who never saw her as anything but Yuna. Two years later, Yuna's kind of drifting around with nothing to give her roots. Then Rikku shows up with this sphere and an offer for something new. Naturally, this appeals to Yuna since she's been only relatively happy so far, and this new spherehunting thing could give her a purpose again. So High Summoner Yuna is left behind, and Sphere Hunter Yuna, with a new outfit, new haircut, and new attitude takes her place, allowing Yuna to be entirely different from the old Yuna. She's now making choices for herself, deciding her future, instead of letting tradition make them for her. VideoGame/FinalFantasyX2 was basically her time to recover and be her own person for once. She wasn't forced into fighting Shuyin, that was her own choice, (mainly because she has a rather impressive case of ChronicHeroSyndrome, but I digress.) She's making idiot choices simply because she ''can'', and that's probably more exciting to her than fighting even the biggest of fiends.
*** Extremely good point. Also, to add to my original one: Maybe people [[RealityIsUnrealistic are too used to Heroic BSODs and Bewaring The Nice Ones]] to realize that she's behaving like an actual PERSON. Not everyone "snaps" in the sense that they [[HeroicBSOD go blank]] or on a RoaringRampageOfRevenge--in fact, only a small percentage of real people do. It's because most of us are decent people who can't get past our aversion to wanton murder/torture, even if the targets are the ones who killed or hurt our own loved ones: We know that almost ''everyone'' has someone who cares about them. (Also, there'd be a lot less people to go AxCrazy on if everyone who snapped under tragedy bombed cities or went on killing sprees.) The fact that it takes several years for soldiers to even ''temporarily'' ignore the knowledge that their enemy is another person proves the point. Since Yuna will only consider hurting someone if it means helping/protecting someone else, she can't go on a rampage or lie around in an unfeeling heap; she cares too much about others for those to be viable courses of action. So that leaves her with the idea of taking the WORST solutions to things--which, as you said, is something she was never able to do before because she was busy being held on a pedestal as the [[Literature/TheBible Sacrificial Lamb Of]] [[strike: God]] [[Literature/TheBible Yevon]].

*** Another difference between Tidus and Rikku is Tidus's innocence. Rikku is her family yes but she too has grown up around Sin. Tidus however has not and that makes him such an otherworldly creature to everyone. I remember when Lulu just goes "you really do come from a world where there is no Sin". Tidus and Rikku represented two different kinds of hope: Rikku represents making the best of your situation and finding hope in where you are now. Tidus however represents desiring more, as in giving Yuna the chance to aim for more out of life. While both of them protest against the pilgrimage, when the chips are down it is Rikku who eventually caves and accepts it as Yuna's decision while Tidus refuses to and tries to find another way. Yuna remembers that after Sin is gone so that's why she's so keen to jump into an adventure instead of living a quiet life.

** Many people blamed the Al Behd ascent. After all, Rikku grew quite a lot of hair too.
** It might not be real - we never see it unwrapped, after all. Suppose it's a really weird sort of extension? Of course, the upper part is clearly braided from her actual hair, and there is a tuft on the end, so the game is probably implying that it's real. Barbers on Spira must make a fortune if everyone else's hair grows that fast.

Or, well, to be more specific, Tidus was borne of the dream of the Fayth, where Zanarkand of the past, prior to the war, was perfectly preserved. We know very little of Shuyin beside that he fought to save Lenne - maybe in reality he was the son of Jecht, and his dayjob was playing Blitzball? In this case, although Shuyin died and went onto the farplane, someone who became one of the Fayth on Mt. Gagazet remembered him. Tidus' physical aspects, his style - and arguably many aspects of his personality (They're both a little short-sighted and selfish and refuse to bow down to outside authority) - are all because of the fact that he was someone's dream of remembering Shuyin. And this would make his attraction to Lenne - who was very similar to Yuna in several respects - no accident whatsoever.
[[WMG: The Garmet Grid is the same as the Sphere Grid, just with a different use.]]
Think about it. Both of them use nodes that powers up the user. Chances are Yuna or Rikku accidently broke the Sphere Grid into little pieces, and Shinra came up with the Dresspheres to compensate.

Which isn't to say she thinks Brother has a chance in hell, that's envy. Rather she's jealously guarding her claim. She's willing to back off in regards to Tidus because the whole true love thing, but so long as he's out of the picture she's occupying that territory and will defend it to the death.

The spheres have a lot of flat surfaces and jagged edges due to the graphical limitations, and one day the resident Anglophile (hey, us westerners have Otakus...) among the developers was watching an episode of TheCrystalMaze, noticed the PS2's graphical limitations made the spheres look like the crystals and pitched the idea of FFX-2 being a game in which you run around puzzle dungeons collecting these "crystals."

The whole plot is actually a fake act of terrorism organized by Tidus and the Fayth so that the factions would stop fighting like idiots and stop Yuna from being such a Mary Sue helping people who are afraid of using their feet. Having learned of Shuyin, Tidus became his Shadow as hinted by the Fayth which explains why Square was so lazy designing his moves. After the mission is completed, Tidus is rewarded by being revived and acts like he knows nothing about what happened.

This brings us to Yuna, who is trying to move onto a new life as a Sphere Hunter. The entire story is about her trying to move on from the death of Tidus in ''FinalFantasyX''. Yes, he was her true love and the ending was incredibly tragic, but ''that's life''. You have to move on from such things, lest you become bitter and trapped in the past as Shuyin has. The second half of the game has her fight and defeat the Dark Aeons, twisted manifestations of her former life; a life that she must move on from. The final boss fight- one in which Yuna fights the mirror image of Tidus- is her final hurdle: she is not fighting Shuyin, but the memory of Tidus that is holding her back and refusing to let her move on with her life.

This troper was seriously considering adding this entry, but [[RuleOfCautiousEditingJudgment there would probably be some who don’t agree, and vehemently]]. Here goes:

TakeThat - Near the beginning, Yuna and co. arrive at Zanarkand, to find that it’s become a tourist trap. Yuna is disappointed, and Rikku is disgusted. After all, FinalFantasyX—er, Zanarkand was an immaculate story—er, site with a contained history and they should have just left it alone and not let new things happen there, right? Too late, we—er, Cid went there!

** Perhaps related to what you're saying: Yuna's been under massive amounts of restrictions since she was little, following in her father's footsteps every step of her life, and has never really had anyone in her life who didn't remind her that people were counting on her to do so. While folks like Lulu, Wakka, and Kimahri all care for her dearly, they are still part of the whole Summoner shtick and thus she doesn't want to disappoint. Tidus was really the first person in Yuna's life where she could forget about the Summoner title, and just be Yuna. He didn't have anything to do with Yevon, and his part as a Guardian was simply to fight and protect Yuna, nothing more. When he faded away, Yuna lost not only her main purpose in life (Defeat Sin), but she lost the one person in her life who never saw her as anything but Yuna. Two years later, Yuna's kind of drifting around with nothing to give her roots. Then Rikku shows up with this sphere and an offer for something new. Naturally, this appeals to Yuna since she's been only relatively happy so far, and this new spherehunting thing could give her a purpose again. So High Summoner Yuna is left behind, and Sphere Hunter Yuna, with a new outfit, new haircut, and new attitude takes her place, allowing Yuna to be entirely different from the old Yuna. She's now making choices for herself, deciding her future, instead of letting tradition make them for her. FinalFantasyX2 was basically her time to recover and be her own person for once. She wasn't forced into fighting Shuyin, that was her own choice, (mainly because she has a rather impressive case of ChronicHeroSyndrome, but I digress.) She's making idiot choices simply because she ''can'', and that's probably more exciting to her than fighting even the biggest of fiends.

It's a little easier to make this theory by comparing the two games to different generations. FinalFantasyX resembles last generation, where people didn't have as much distractions to think about compared to the world of X-2. X-2 resembles today's generation, where people are much more loose, pop culture has evolved, and politics has become a warzone. Itemized list:

1. People's behavior: The world of FinalFantasyX was a lot more serious, and people were genuinely more concerned by Sin. Now people are more loose, let's talk about the Gullwings' clothes. Before, the girls dressed so they didn't show too much skin, not that they didn't look suggestive to begin with. Now they look like sluts, and everybody is a little more flirty than before.

Which isn't to say she thinks Brother has a chance in hell, that's envy. Rather she's jealously guarding her claim. She's willing to back off in regards to Tidus because the whole true love thing, but so long as he's out of the picture she's occupying that territory and will defend it to the death.

Which isn't to say she thinks Brother has a chance in hell, that's envy. Rather she's jealously guarding her claim. She's willing to back off in regards to Titus because the whole true love thing, but so long as he's out of the picture she's occupying that territory and will defend it to the death.

* Fist of all the ending you're talking about at the end of your rant is the bad ending. Though you would have loved Final Fantasy X-2 International Last Mission. In it Yuna sheds some light of her sphere hunter persona, and in it she pretty much admits that her sphere hunter persona was just a mask, aka not the real her. She just wanted to have some fun after 17 years of being so repressed but in Last Mission which only happens after you get the good ending, she says that after her adventure she just wants to have a quiet life. Later on she says that Rikku sticks to her sphere hunter persona because she is afraid of growing up, which Rikku later on admits to. Which brings us to X-2 the reason for Rikku and Yuna's change in personality were because they were fulfilling some type of wish fulfillment where they were free from their responsibilities and individual pasts. However, the events of X-2 forced Yuna and Paine to face their individual pasts and fears (in Paine's case), or experience the world which they didn't have any time to enjoy (Yuna's case). Which is why you only get the bad and normal ending by exploring the bare minimum of Spira, because Yuna's adventure hasn't ended yet, she has not experienced all the world has to offer and therefore is not ready to settle down.
** The ending I'm talking about is the "Normal" ending, not the "Bad" ending (where Shuyin successfully destroys Spira). You also seem to have completely ignored everything that I've said. My argument is not that Yuna shouldn't settle down, or should remain as a sphere hunter. I'm saying that the true tragedy present in the "Tidus returns" ending is Yuna's ultimate inability to let go of the past and move on with her life like the rest of Spira must do.
*** Someone else already shed some more light on the disagreements, but Yuna was already shown to be able to deal with loss in FinalFantasyX, she's used to loss, in fact that was what her final speech in FinalFantasyX. You forget that Yuna is an orphan whose mother was killed by an attack from Sin, and whose father and his colleagues died holding back. You forgot that the initial introduction to Besaid in X, the villagers revealed that Besaid is frequently attacked by Sin, as was the rest of the world and because of that life expectancy in Spira is unpredictable. By X-2 however Yuna as well as the rest of Spira was tired of losing things, and you can't blame them. By the way your FanDumb is showing, Tidus was shown be on his way back to Spira at the end of X, the only thing the Fayth did for Yuna was probably just tell her where he was at that time, or just launch him in the direction of Besaid.

I'll disagree. The whole point of FFX-2, in my opinion, is in taking charge of one's fate and to {{Earn Your Happy Ending}}. In the first game, Yuna was a tool of the Yevon Church, and Tidus was just a tool of the Fayth. It was their journey, and their romance that got them to ''stop'' getting jerked around by The Powers That Be. Unfortunately, while Tidus succeeded in his mission of getting Yuna to ''not'' accept a death sentence to perpetuate the lie, he wasn't able to save himself. Therefore, it falls to Yuna to pay him back - both by taking on a life of her own as a Sphere Hunter and refusing to be ANYONE'S pawn, and by pulling him back to the living. It also breaks the tragic cycle of sacrifice and senseless death that started with the Zanarkand/Besaid War (of which Shuyin and Lenne were a small part), and continued with Sin. This time, truimph over evil doesn't have to require blood sacrifices.

* Also, see PoisonOakEpilepticTrees. Yeesh.

* Why should you accept a bad situation when you can improve it? If she were to decline the Fayth's offer to bring Tidus back, how would that be any different from just letting him die?

Why isn't Tidus' situation really considered? Doesn't he has as much right to be alive as anyone else? The original poster's saying a guy should die when he could live so his girlfriend can show she can handle grief.

* Did Yuna's defeat of Shuyin indicate personal growth, of moving beyond her past with Tidus? If so, then how does his later return invalidate that? I just don't see it.

* The fact of the matter isn't that Tidus should NOT be brought back when he can be - it's that there shouldn't have been ANY way to bring him back. It's sad that he died, I'll grant you that, but the sudden resurrection of the guy seems incredibly cheap in regards to the previous, darker themes of the first game. Even with the idea of keeping everyone safe now that Sin's gone, it represents a weak, deluded, wish-fulfilling aspect in Yuna that she earns the so-called ''right'' to bring him back. Besides saving the world, what has she done that deserves such a thing - heroes DON'T do that sort of thing for rewards. Besides, I'm sure that heaps of other people could reap the same kind of reward, yet they don't - somehow, Yuna gets special privellige and her boyfriend back. Worse, as the original poster said, this prevents her from moving on n her life. Tidus is a part of the past, and he was gone - for her to be so CLINGY that the Fayth decide to let her bring him back undermines all the growth she goes through during the storyline. It also cheapens the idea of life and death in general - after the serious tone of the previous installment, which is by itself an EarnYourHappyEnding (even with the bittersweetness), the audience is given a wishy-washy fantasy that refuses to look reality in the face in any credible manner. For this troper, it makes the already ludicrous, fanservicy game FanonDiscontinuity of the worse sort. Hell, it makes FinalFantasyTacticsAdvance - with its themes of facing reality and being yourself to become a stronger person, rather than living in a stunted dreamworld - a much more intelligent and credible story than FFX2. Enough said.
* First of all, Yuna saved the world twice. Second, she didn't do it either time expecting a reward. She did it because it was the right thing to do and because she wanted to keep the people of Spira safe and happy. There is even a scene in which LeBlanc and the other Gullwings point this out. And how does the ending undo any growth she has gone through? As said on the Final Fantasy X-2 page, she has proven that she can live her life and save the world without Tidus, it's just that, now, she doesn't have to. Also, the fayth have a history with Yuna. She helped them finally achieve the rest that they yearned for in X. So why is it so terrible that they want to thank her by giving her back the love that she lost because of their slumber? She knows that she can get along without Tidus, but now she gets the time that she didn't get before, even though she knows it won't last forever.
* Okay, three things. First of all: Being reunited with someone you love is not a tragedy. At all. Second: On the subject of moving on; I imagine that after the Perfect Ending, Yuna and Tidus probably settle down somewhere and raise a happy family. If that's not moving on, I don't know what it is. Third: Yuna can't deal with loss? The ''hell!?'' Yuna has had to deal with loss ''her entire life!'' She grew up in a world where settlements got randomly destroyed by a giant monstrosity on a regular basis. Her mom was killed by Sin. Her dad sacrificed himself to bring a temporary peace to the world, following the teachings of a religion that ultimately turned out to be a huge lie. Jech, and probably a bunch of other people she knew as a child, died before the game started, and so on. She can deal with loss just fine, but that doesn't mean it's not extremely painful. That was the entire point of her rant to Nooj at the end - she was ''sick'' of dealing with loss. Just for once, she wanted to ''win.''

The spheres have a lot of flat surfaces and jagged edges due to the graphical limitations, and one day the resident Anglophile (hey, we white boys have Otakus...) among the developers was watching an episode of TheCrystalMaze, noticed the PS2's graphical limitations made the spheres look like the crystals and pitched the idea of FFX-2 being a game in which you run around puzzle dungeons collecting these "crystals."

*** Extremely good point. Also, to add to my original one: Maybe people [[RealityIsUnrealistic are too used to Heroic BSODs and Bewaring The Nice Ones]] to realize that she's behaving like an actual PERSON. Not everyone "snaps" in the sense that they [[HeroicBSOD go blank]] or on a RoaringRampageOfRevenge--in fact, only a small percentage of real people do. It's because most of us are decent people who can't get past our aversion to wanton murder/torture, even if the targets are the ones who killed or hurt our own loved ones: We know that almost ''everyone'' has someone who cares about them. (Also, there'd be a lot less people to go AxCrazy on if everyone who snapped under tragedy bombed cities or went on killing sprees.) The fact that it takes several years for soldiers to even ''temporarily'' ignore the knowledge that their enemy is another person proves the point. Since Yuna will only consider hurting someone if it means helping/protecting someone else, she can't go on a rampage or lie around in an unfeeling heap; she cares too much about others for those to be viable courses of action. So that leaves her with the idea of taking the WORST solutions to things--which, as you said, is something she was never able to do before because she was busy being held on a pedestal as the [[Literature/TheBible Sacrificial Lamb Of]] [[strike: God]] [[TheBible Yevon]].

*** Extremely good point. Also, to add to my original one: Maybe people [[RealityIsUnrealistic are too used to Heroic BSODs and Bewaring The Nice Ones]] to realize that she's behaving like an actual PERSON. Not everyone "snaps" in the sense that they [[HeroicBSOD go blank]] or on a RoaringRampageOfRevenge--in fact, only a small percentage of real people do. It's because most of us are decent people who can't get past our aversion to wanton murder/torture, even if the targets are the ones who killed or hurt our own loved ones: We know that almost ''everyone'' has someone who cares about them. (Also, there'd be a lot less people to go AxCrazy on if everyone who snapped under tragedy bombed cities or went on killing sprees.) The fact that it takes several years for soldiers to even ''temporarily'' ignore the knowledge that their enemy is another person proves the point. Since Yuna will only consider hurting someone if it means helping/protecting someone else, she can't go on a rampage or lie around in an unfeeling heap; she cares too much about others for those to be viable courses of action. So that leaves her with the idea of taking the WORST solutions to things--which, as you said, is something she was never able to do before because she was busy being held on a pedestal as the [[TheBible Sacrificial Lamb Of]] [[strike: God]] [[TheBible Yevon]].

This troper completely agrees with the original poster. I can totally see the original concept of X-2 as Yuna *not* getting Tidus back and how she moved on with her life, and I think that was the game designer's intent. At some point during the process, probably during a board meeting with shareholders, that was deemed too sad/boring, so they added in the ability to come back. Think about it. That's why there's even the *option* of two endings. We all know game designers are lazy, right? Tidus coming back is effectively an {{Easter Egg}}. To get the ending where Tidus comes back, you have to actively press buttons during a cutscene - something pretty obscure, which I only found out through GameFaqs. How would someone on the first run through of the game know this? Despite what you believe, even with all the sequels and marketing, SquareSoft and FinalFantasy is pretty serious about death. When someone is {{Killed Off for Real}} they stay that way. See Aerith (FinalFantasyVII). Tidus coming back just seems like {{Executive Meddling}}.

* Okay, three things. First of all: Being reunited with someone you love is not a tragedy. At all. Second: On the subject of moving on; I imagine that after the Perfect Ending, Yuna and Tidus probably settle down somewhere and raise a happy family. If that's not moving on, I don't know what it is. Third: Yuna can't deal with loss? The ''hell!?'' Yuna has had to deal with loss ''her entire life!'' She grew up in a world where settlements got randomly destroyed by a giant monstrosity on a regular basis. Her mom was killed by Sin. Her dad sacrificed himself to bring a temporary peace to the world, following the teachings of a religion that ultimately turned out to be a huge lie. Jech, and probably a bunch of other people she knew as a child, died before the game started, and so on. She can deal with loss just fine, but that doesn't mean it's not extremely painful. That was the entire point of her rant to Nooj at the end - she was ''sick'' of dealing with loss. Just for once, she wanted to ''win.''

* The fact of the matter isn't that Tidus should NOT be brought back when he can be - it's that there shouldn't have been ANY way to bring him back. It's sad that he died, I'll grant you that, but the sudden resurrection of the guy seems incredibly cheap in regards to the previous, darker themes of the first game. Even with the idea of keeping everyone safe now that Sin's gone, it represents a weak, deluded, wish-fulfilling aspect in Yuna that she earns the so-called ''right'' to bring him back. Besides saving the world, what has she done that deserves such a thing - heroes DON'T do that sort of thing for rewards. Besides, I'm sure that heaps of other people could reap the same kind of reward, yet they don't - somehow, Yuna gets special privellige and her boyfriend back. Worse, as the original poster said, this prevents her from moving on n her life. Tidus is a part of the past, and he was gone - for her to be so CLINGY that the Fayth decide to let her bring him back undermines all the growth she goes through during the storyline. It also cheapens the idea of life and death in general - after the serious tone of the previous installment, which is by itself an {{Earn Your Happy Ending}} (even with the bittersweetness), the audience is given a wishy-washy fantasy that refuses to look reality in the face in any credible manner. For this troper, it makes the already ludicrous, fanservicy game {{Discontinuity}} of the worse sort. Hell, it makes {{Final Fantasy Tactics Advance}} - with its themes of facing reality and being yourself to become a stronger person, rather than living in a stunted dreamworld - a much more intelligent and credible story than FFX2. Enough said.

[[redirect:WMG/FinalFantasyX-2]]

[[WMG: The "Perfect" Ending is a bad ending.]]
The strongest thematic thread running throughout the entire story is progression, or the difficulties associated with moving on from past tragedies.

Most of the story revolves around a conflict of ideals between two organisations with different ideas on how Spira should progress following the defeat of Sin. The leaders of the three main organisations- following their confrontation at the Den of Woe before the story began- could not let go of their mistrust of each other, inadvertently allowing the real villain to push his agenda forward.

Shuyin is an even greater example of someone whose inability to move on caused great pain and suffering. First, he refused to let go of Lenne, which indirectly led to their deaths. Later, trapped in the Den of Woe, he was unable to relinquish his despair and hatred of that moment- a moment in the past that he could not change- and transformed into a vengeful shade as a result. Shuyin is ''the embodiment'' of what happens if you refuse to accept and move on from past tragedies.

This brings us to Yuna, who is trying to move onto a new life as a Sphere Hunter. The entire story is about her trying to move on from the death of Tidus in ''FinalFantasyX''. Yes, he was her true love and the ending was incredibly tragic, but ''that's life''. You have to move on from such things, lest you become bitter and trapped in the past as Shuyin has. The second half of the game has her fight and defeat the Dark Aeons, twisted manifestations of her former life; a life that she must move on from. The final boss fight- one in which Yuna fights the mirror image of Tidus- is her final hurdle: she is not fighting Shuyin, but the memory of Tidus that is holding her back and refusing to let her move on with her life.

In the Good Ending, Yuna is content and happy. She will always remember Tidus, but she is ready to move on with her life and embrace the future. In the "Perfect" Ending, she once again returns to the arms of Tidus; instead of dealing with her loss normally like every other person on Spira, she finds a way to circumvent it. To cheat it. One wonders what would happen to her if Tidus was to die a second time, considering this proof that she is ultimately unable to deal with loss and move forward to the future.

* While Yuna seems happy in the good ending, the HundredPercentCompletion ending sheds some doubt on Tidus' return, and implies he might not be around for long.
--> '''Tidus:''' "Maybe I'm still just a dream"

* Fist of all the ending you're talking about at the end of your rant is the bad ending. Though you would have loved Final Fantasy X-2 International Last Mission. In it Yuna sheds some light of her sphere hunter persona, and in it she pretty much admits that her sphere hunter persona was just a mask, aka not the real her. She just wanted to have some fun after 17 years of being so repressed but in Last Mission which only happens after you get the good ending, she says that after her adventure she just wants to have a quiet life. Later on she says that Rikku sticks to her sphere hunter persona because she is afraid of growing up, which Rikku later on admits to. Which brings us to X-2 the reason for Rikku and Yuna's change in personality were because they were fulfilling some type of wish fulfillment where they were free from their responsibilities and individual pasts. However, the events of X-2 forced Yuna and Paine to face their individual pasts and fears (in Paine's case), or experience the world which they didn't have any time to enjoy (Yuna's case). Which is why you only get the bad and normal ending by exploring the bare minimum of Spira, because Yuna's adventure hasn't ended yet, she has not experienced all the world has to offer and therefore is not ready to settle down.
** The ending I'm talking about is the "Normal" ending, not the "Bad" ending (where Shuyin successfully destroys Spira). You also seem to have completely ignored everything that I've said. My argument is not that Yuna shouldn't settle down, or should remain as a sphere hunter. I'm saying that the true tragedy present in the "Tidus returns" ending is Yuna's ultimate inability to let go of the past and move on with her life like the rest of Spira must do.
*** Someone else already shed some more light on the disagreements, but Yuna was already shown to be able to deal with loss in FinalFantasyX, she's used to loss, in fact that was what her final speech in FinalFantasyX. You forget that Yuna is an orphan whose mother was killed by an attack from Sin, and whose father and his colleagues died holding back. You forgot that the initial introduction to Besaid in X, the villagers revealed that Besaid is frequently attacked by Sin, as was the rest of the world and because of that life expectancy in Spira is unpredictable. By X-2 however Yuna as well as the rest of Spira was tired of losing things, and you can't blame them. By the way your FanDumb is showing, Tidus was shown be on his way back to Spira at the end of X, the only thing the Fayth did for Yuna was probably just tell her where he was at that time, or just launch him in the direction of Besaid.

I'll disagree. The whole point of FFX-2, in my opinion, is in taking charge of one's fate and to {{Earn Your Happy Ending}}. In the first game, Yuna was a tool of the Yevon Church, and Tidus was just a tool of the Fayth. It was their journey, and their romance that got them to ''stop'' getting jerked around by The Powers That Be. Unfortunately, while Tidus succeeded in his mission of getting Yuna to ''not'' accept a death sentence to perpetuate the lie, he wasn't able to save himself. Therefore, it falls to Yuna to pay him back - both by taking on a life of her own as a Sphere Hunter and refusing to be ANYONE'S pawn, and by pulling him back to the living. It also breaks the tragic cycle of sacrifice and senseless death that started with the Zanarkand/Besaid War (of which Shuyin and Lenne were a small part), and continued with Sin. This time, truimph over evil doesn't have to require blood sacrifices.

* Also, see PoisonOakEpilepticTrees. Yeesh.

* Why should you accept a bad situation when you can improve it? If she were to decline the Fayth's offer to bring Tidus back, how would that be any different from just letting him die?

Why isn't Tidus' situation really considered? Doesn't he has as much right to be alive as anyone else? The original poster's saying a guy should die when he could live so his girlfriend can show she can handle grief.

* Did Yuna's defeat of Shuyin indicate personal growth, of moving beyond her past with Tidus? If so, then how does his later return invalidate that? I just don't see it.

* The fact of the matter isn't that Tidus should NOT be brought back when he can be - it's that there shouldn't have been ANY way to bring him back. It's sad that he died, I'll grant you that, but the sudden resurrection of the guy seems incredibly cheap in regards to the previous, darker themes of the first game. Even with the idea of keeping everyone safe now that Sin's gone, it represents a weak, deluded, wish-fulfilling aspect in Yuna that she earns the so-called ''right'' to bring him back. Besides saving the world, what has she done that deserves such a thing - heroes DON'T do that sort of thing for rewards. Besides, I'm sure that heaps of other people could reap the same kind of reward, yet they don't - somehow, Yuna gets special privellige and her boyfriend back. Worse, as the original poster said, this prevents her from moving on n her life. Tidus is a part of the past, and he was gone - for her to be so CLINGY that the Fayth decide to let her bring him back undermines all the growth she goes through during the storyline. It also cheapens the idea of life and death in general - after the serious tone of the previous installment, which is by itself an {{Earn Your Happy Ending}} (even with the bittersweetness), the audience is given a wishy-washy fantasy that refuses to look reality in the face in any credible manner. For this troper, it makes the already ludicrous, fanservicy game {{Discontinuity}} of the worse sort. Hell, it makes {{Final Fantasy Tactics Advance}} - with its themes of facing reality and being yourself to become a stronger person, rather than living in a stunted dreamworld - a much more intelligent and credible story than FFX2. Enough said.
* First of all, Yuna saved the world twice. Second, she didn't do it either time expecting a reward. She did it because it was the right thing to do and because she wanted to keep the people of Spira safe and happy. There is even a scene in which LeBlanc and the other Gullwings point this out. And how does the ending undo any growth she has gone through? As said on the Final Fantasy X-2 page, she has proven that she can live her life and save the world without Tidus, it's just that, now, she doesn't have to. Also, the fayth have a history with Yuna. She helped them finally achieve the rest that they yearned for in X. So why is it so terrible that they want to thank her by giving her back the love that she lost because of their slumber? She knows that she can get along without Tidus, but now she gets the time that she didn't get before, even though she knows it won't last forever.
* Okay, three things. First of all: Being reunited with someone you love is not a tragedy. At all. Second: On the subject of moving on; I imagine that after the Perfect Ending, Yuna and Tidus probably settle down somewhere and raise a happy family. If that's not moving on, I don't know what it is. Third: Yuna can't deal with loss? The ''hell!?'' Yuna has had to deal with loss ''her entire life!'' She grew up in a world where settlements got randomly destroyed by a giant monstrosity on a regular basis. Her mom was killed by Sin. Her dad sacrificed himself to bring a temporary peace to the world, following the teachings of a religion that ultimately turned out to be a huge lie. Jech, and probably a bunch of other people she knew as a child, died before the game started, and so on. She can deal with loss just fine, but that doesn't mean it's not extremely painful. That was the entire point of her rant to Nooj at the end - she was ''sick'' of dealing with loss. Just for once, she wanted to ''win.''

[[WMG: There is no Bag of Spilling]]
* The entire cast just did a No Sphere Grid run through all of FFX, thus leaving Yuna and Rikku at roughly the same power level throughout the entire time from the start of FFX to the start of X-2. Yuna just doesn't use her healing magic because it has too strong of a connection to her past.
** This troper always figured that after FFX, Yuna and her Guardians either gave away or sold off most of their old supplies and gil, since they weren't off fighting fiends 24/7, so when X-2 came around, they had to more or less start over.
** The group got their powers from the Sphere Grid, which is noticeably absent from X-2, since they don't have it with them, they lose the Bonuses from it.
[[WMG: Alternate No BagOfSpilling guess:]]
Since the Garment Grids are not subject to GamePlayAndStorySegregation, it's possible that the Sphere Grid from the first game works in a similar way, allowing normal characters like a not-inhumanly above average athlete or a seemingly physically fragile priestess to become strong enough, simply by dispersing Pyrefly fiends, to bash giant monsters to pieces. The Garment Grid works on a similar process, but it's incompatible with the [=original/upgraded=] Sphere Grid from X, and to use it (or allow Payne, not on the X Sphere Grid, to use it concurrently), they had to disconnect themselves from the Sphere Grid that had all the other teammates connected from X.
* Alternatively: The Faith powered the sphere grid, when they were allowed to die, it was destroyed.

[[WMG: Payne is in the Gullwings to pay off a deep, deep debt.]]
In This Troper's opinion, Payne's characterization as seen in the cutscenes and win quotes indicates that she's not just a DeadpanSnarker who's actually very good friends with the other girls (but quite exasperated at having to be their baby sitter), she actively does ''not'' want to be in the group. She can't be a hire, because if she hated her job that much she'd quit and find a better sphere-hunting group, so she has to be there involuntarily.

That leaves two options: blackmail or debt. (Or, debt ''because'' of blackmail, or vice versa.) She owes something huge, most likely to Brother, and part of the stipulation in paying off the debt is "play bodyguard to two people you can't stand".

Yuna knows this, so she tries to play peacemaker to keep Payne from deciding "screw this, I'm just going to murder everybody on this [bleeping] ship and becoming a fugitive". Rikku has no idea, and she thinks it's hilarious to try to get a laugh at old sourpuss Payne.

[[WMG: The game contains one big TakeThat at purists who object to there being a sequel.]]
This troper was seriously considering adding this entry, but [[RuleOfCautiousEditingJudgment there would probably be some who don’t agree, and vehemently]]. Here goes:

TakeThat - Near the beginning, Yuna and co. arrive at Zanarkand, to find that it’s become a tourist trap. Yuna is disappointed, and Rikku is disgusted. After all, FinalFantasyX—er, Zanarkand was an immaculate story—er, site with a contained history and they should have just left it alone and not let new things happen there, right? Too late, we—er, Cid went there!

[[WMG: Yuna is acting as a real person in her circumstances would.]]
Psychologically, everything makes sense. The poor girl's been repressing both normal emotions ''and'' grief since she was eight years old, and she even admits that her whole happy-go-lucky sphere hunter persona is just another mask. Example: When her father died, everyone was too busy PARTYING to remember that their savior had an unusual thing called a "daughter"--to the point where it took Yuna herself a while to realize that she had no parents, and led to ''one of three times in her life'' that she cried. Then when Tidus dies, she deals with yet another loved one's death by sphere-hunting... and solving religious conflicts. For [[ChronicHeroSyndrome TWO AND A HALF YEARS.]]

It's only natural that Yuna finally starts cracking under it all and affecting drastic changes in her personality, because [[BreakTheCutie she's had her parents, her beliefs, and her boyfriend savagely ripped away from her]]--most people would have at least a close friend to turn to, but even Lulu and Wakka are too focused on their new baby to spend much time with her. Or maybe she doesn't spend time with them on purpose (due to fixing everyone else's problems), so they have no idea in the first place how she's feeling.

And the lifetime of repression and being groomed to ritual suicide? That means Yuna has ''no idea how to effectively cope with her pain.'' People are only complaining that she's acting like an idiot because they don't realize how severely she's been traumatized by having half the people she loves die untimely deaths. I can't imagine how she managed to last two and a half years.
** Perhaps related to what you're saying: Yuna's been under massive amounts of restrictions since she was little, following in her father's footsteps every step of her life, and has never really had anyone in her life who didn't remind her that people were counting on her to do so. While folks like Lulu, Wakka, and Kimahri all care for her dearly, they are still part of the whole Summoner shtick and thus she doesn't want to disappoint. Tidus was really the first person in Yuna's life where she could forget about the Summoner title, and just be Yuna. He didn't have anything to do with Yevon, and his part as a Guardian was simply to fight and protect Yuna, nothing more. When he faded away, Yuna lost not only her main purpose in life (Defeat Sin), but she lost the one person in her life who never saw her as anything but Yuna. Two years later, Yuna's kind of drifting around with nothing to give her roots. Then Rikku shows up with this sphere and an offer for something new. Naturally, this appeals to Yuna since she's been only relatively happy so far, and this new spherehunting thing could give her a purpose again. So High Summoner Yuna is left behind, and Sphere Hunter Yuna, with a new outfit, new haircut, and new attitude takes her place, allowing Yuna to be entirely different from the old Yuna. She's now making choices for herself, deciding her future, instead of letting tradition make them for her. FinalFantasyX2 was basically her time to recover and be her own person for once. She wasn't forced into fighting Shuyin, that was her own choice, (mainly because she has a rather impressive case of ChronicHeroSyndrome, but I digress.) She's making idiot choices simply because she ''can'', and that's probably more exciting to her than fighting even the biggest of fiends.
*** Extremely good point. Also, to add to my original one: Maybe people [[RealityIsUnrealistic are too used to Heroic BSODs and Bewaring The Nice Ones]] to realize that she's behaving like an actual PERSON. Not everyone "snaps" in the sense that they [[HeroicBSOD go blank]] or on a RoaringRampageOfRevenge--in fact, only a small percentage of real people do. It's because most of us are decent people who can't get past our aversion to wanton murder/torture, even if the targets are the ones who killed or hurt our own loved ones: We know that almost ''everyone'' has someone who cares about them. (Also, there'd be a lot less people to go AxCrazy on if everyone who snapped under tragedy bombed cities or went on killing sprees.) The fact that it takes several years for soldiers to even ''temporarily'' ignore the knowledge that their enemy is another person proves the point. Since Yuna will only consider hurting someone if it means helping/protecting someone else, she can't go on a rampage or lie around in an unfeeling heap; she cares too much about others for those to be viable courses of action. So that leaves her with the idea of taking the WORST solutions to things--which, as you said, is something she was never able to do before because she was busy being held on a pedestal as the [[TheBible Sacrificial Lamb Of]] [[strike: God]] [[TheBible Yevon]].
** Not to nitpick, but Rikku saw her as "just Yuna" as much as Tidus did. The main difference Tidus/Yuna and Rikku-Yuna was the lack of romance in the latter.
*** In that case, it does explain why Yuna decides to leave everything from her old life behind and join Rikku and the Gullwings.
[[WMG: A wizard cursed her with a hair growing curse inbetween the games.]]
* How else could she get that hair that's a good six feet long when braided in just two years?
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<<|WildMassGuessing|>>

*** Someone else already shed some more light on the disagreements, but Yuna was already shown to be able to deal with loss in FinalFantasyX, she's used to loss, in fact that was what her final speech in FinalFantasyX. You forget that Yuna is an orphan whose mother was killed by an attack from Sin, and whose father and his colleagues died holding back. You forgot that the initial introduction to Besaid in X, the villagers revealed that Besaid is frequently attacked by Sin, as was the rest of the world and because of that life expectancy in Spira is unpredictable. By X-2 however Yuna as well as the rest of Spira was tired of losing things, and you can't blame them.