History WMG / Dragonball

Just as there are no mistakes in martial arts, there are no mistakes in martial arts anime/cartoons apparently. If Vegito/Gogeta were to appear in BOG then it would be just another "turn the tables around curbstomp retaliation" like the battle against Buu or even the ending in non-canon movie "Fusion Reborn" or the appearance of [=SSJ4=] Gogeta in the non-canon franchise gt. Even though it would of been really satisfying seeing another appearance from Vegito or even the first canon appearance of Gogeta beat the shit out of a villian that thinks their invincible such as beerus, that would of defeated the point of the film hence its name "battle of GODS". If Goku and Vegeta did fuse(then of course beat the shit out of Beerus and Whis) that would take up all of the creative room that was meant to introduce the new saiyan transformation(ssjgod). It's clear that Akira regrets ending the series after the Majin Buu saga and that's why there's Gt, a couple of [=DBZ=] movies after the Buu saga, and let's not forget the shitload of [=DBZ=] video games including that online [=DBZ=] games. So he decides to make a movie about the series even going as far as introducing a new saiyan transformation into it, he's pretty much trying to pull the series out of retirement (not cancellation), and to add to that there is a new [=DBZ=] movie coming out in 2015. While some fans are in denial in the face that Vegito is stronger than Beerus here's this. Vegito beat Buu(han) and Super was more or less equal to [=SSJ3=] Goku plus he had Goten, Trunks, Piccolo and Ultimate Gohan who was way stronger than Vegeta (Before BOG in which he got that rage boost against Beerus) seeing as he completely dominated super Buu before he started assimilating people so if you're going to be all mathematical about this shit, Buuhan after absorbing all of those people should of kicked Vegito's ass not the other way around. The reason being because Vegito got a power boost from the earrings also an additional power boost because Goku and Vegeta were rivals as stated by Elder Kai. So Vegito is going to have a hell of a lot more power than just Goku and Vegeta otherwise he wouldn't of been able to defeat Majin Buu but completely dominate him as well. For those fans who are still feeling "skeptical" about the subject Beerus can't defeat [=SSJ1=] Vegito/Gogeta, let's just be generous and say Beerus can defeat [=SSJ1=] Vegito/Gogeta, but is it possible for beerus to defeat [=SSJ2=] or even [[ThereIsNoKillLikeOverkill [=SSJ3=] Vegito Gogeta]]? Point proven.

In the BOG movie when we see Goku "training" on King Kai's planet he is completely slacking off instead of doing any sort of productive training whether it would of been his usual conditioning training or just simple warm ups. It's clear that after the defeat of Majin Buu Goku thought that there was nothing beyond him and as we see in BOG when he was so called training on KK's planet he wasn't taking his training seriously anymore. The reason Goku pushed himself earlier in the series is because there were foes(that he was aware of) that were stronger than him and this was his primary motivation to train hard so he could defeat any villain threatening the Earth or just about any part of the universe for that matter. For example the reason why he did that 100X gravity training was not only to surpass Vegeta but also defeat this "formidable opponent who dwarfed Vegeta" in terms of power and so on. Before Raditz came and threatened the Earth Goku was seen taking it easy and just living a normal life, but after Raditz gave him a harsh reality check that there are a realm of strong opponents out there Goku started training to his hearts content to become the strongest he could be. After the defeat of the universes greatest terror(at the time) which being Majin Buu and Goku unlocking [=SSJ3=] Goku once again thought there was no villian in the universe stronger than him. Unlike Vegeta who is seen keeping up his vigorous training regimen. If Beerus wouldn't of showed up Vegeta would of eventually surpassed the Goku who was apparently slacking off. Just as Goku and Vegeta surpassed Gohan after the Cell Saga.

*** ''Manga/{{Toriko}}'', ''Manga/RosarioToVampire'', ''Manga/{{Hellsing}}'', ''Manga/FairyTail'', and ''Manga/NuraRiseOfTheYokaiClan''

What have the Saiyans not had that the [=DBZ=] Saiyans and Half-Saiyans had in droves? Human associates. Huan associates that taught them (and other alien characters) to repress emotion until it bursts out of their ears like steam, have violent outbursts at any expression of their species' traditional pastimes (and then switch completely to ''encourage'' this in a younger sibling), let illogical sequences of thought and action slide as long as they sound okay, [[MoralEventHorizon shoot dogs for fun and]] [[BerserkButton lack of profit]], and (though this is usually the tipping point after years of buildup of the [[HumansAreBastards Human Bastardry]]) [[WorldOfCardboardSpeech watch their weak human friends die like flies]]. Saiyans just kill things for food, release of aggression, money and at least sometimes honor, which humans do all the time ''plus'' those other things. The only beings in the series that are worse than the average human mercenary (on a wider scale) are the {{Card Carrying Villain}}s that originate from Earth or [[AlwaysChaoticEvil other dimensions]] anyway.\\

And it's one where Goku arrived for the battle with Vegeta after Piccolo sacrificed himself for Gohan, but before he died from Nappa's attack. Thus, Goku was able to use a senzu bean to save Piccolo, and together, Goku, Piccolo, Krillin, and Gohan were enough to force Vegeta to retreat. This leads to ''Anime/DragonBallZTheWorldsStrongest'', where Gohan remembers Piccolo sacrificing himself even though Piccolo is still alive. At the beginning of that movie, Gohan and Oolong were looking for the dragon balls to revive their friends, but the villain got them first. ''Anime/DragonBallZTheTreeOfMight'' takes place after everyone was revived, and ''Anime/LordSlug'' takes place after that.

* Earth does have an unnaturally large moon relative to other planets. Raditz even comments on this in ''Anime/DragonBallKai''. Perhaps the large size emits enough "flux waves" to increase Saiyan power even if their tails are missing. This is assuming the moon was wished back after Piccolo blew it up.

[[WMG: Reacoom is the announcer in ''Anime/DragonBallKai''.]]

Both are played by Creator/JojiYanami, besides King Kai ''is'' a God of sorts. Why wouldn't he be able to narrate the story? (This kinda falls apart in the dub where Creator/SeanSchemmel is King Kai, Brice Armstrong narrates Manga/DragonBall, Creator/KyleHebert narrates Anime/DragonBallZ, Andy Chandler narrates Anime/DragonBallGT and Doc Morgan narrates Anime/DragonBallKai.)

The sixth ''Daizenshuu'' describes ''Tree of Might'' as taking place in a period of time after Goku's arrival on Namek, but before his fight with Frieza, a scenario that is impossible to accomodate in either the original timeline and in the future timeline of Trunks. But in the WhatIf story "Beautiful Treachery" from ''VideoGame/DragonballZBudokaiTenkaichi'' 2, Goku travels to Namek and leaves without having his decisive battle with Frieza or becoming a Super Saiyan[[note]]Krillin wishes him back to Earth after tricking Zarbon out of the second and third Porunga wishes.[[/note]]. Vegeta is killed by Zarbon and Dodoria, which explains his absence in ''Tree of Might''. And Piccolo is revived but does not fuse with Nail, explaining why he is stronger than Saiyan Saga Piccolo in ''Tree of Might'' but still not as strong as the Piccolo who fought Frieza.

*** ''Manga/OutlawStar'', ''{{Manga/Gunnm}}'', ''Manga/FistOfTheNorthStar'', ''Manga/HikaruNoGo''. (Imagins Goku and Vegeta playing go as super saiyans.)

[folder:Jossed]]

[[WMG: Ironically, the Saiyans' Zenkai ability is a defense mechanism, not an offensive feature.]]
That's how it's so inconsistent. When Vegeta first demonstrated his Zenkai ability, he went from 18k to 24k; higher than Goku's kaioken 3x boost , when he got beaten to near-death one more time by Zarbon, he went from having the tar beaten out of him to kicking his ass. After he instructed Krillin to nearly kill him, he was indeed stronger than form 3 Frieza but was no match for his final form.

While training in 100x gravity, he kept putting himself in near-death, but on Namek he was only as strong as [[TheDragon Ginyu]], who was more than 4 times weaker than first form Frieza. Goku was so worried about fighting Frieza before he healed, and then conveniently became as strong as initial final form Frieza.

During their fight, Perfect Cell was no match for a Super Saiyan 2 Gohan; after blowing himself up in a desperate attempt to defeat him, his power increased so drastically that he can stalemate with a Super Saiyan 2-powered Kamehameha.

By these speculations, a saiyan's ability to get stronger from recovering a near-death state is because, just in case they encounter a similar or same threat, they would have enough power to deal with that problem.

* IF what you were saying were true. Then it would mean Zenkai protects a specefic method of being injured similar to how an antibiotic protects against a certain illness. Zenkai improves the saiyans overall health.

* If this is true it would possibly be an example of FridgeBrilliance. After the Cell saga Goku trained in otherworld (and if anime filler is considered) fought with opponents like Pikkon etc. while Vegeta trained on his own. Goku was able to reach higher levels of power because he had an opponent and Vegeta didn't. Goku wanted Buu to come back to life so he could have a challenge AND continue to grow.

* Jossed: If the Zenkai really was a defense mechanism, then when Gohan was nearly killed by Frieza in his second form, then his power should have shot up to over a million. And we never see Vegeta getting hurt by Frieza in his third form; in fact, he completely ignores him in favor of Piccolo and Gohan.

[[WMG: Cell would have accepted defeat if Goku became a Super Saiyan 2]]
Cell expected Goku to be the strongest of the Z fighters, he even offered him the opportunity to get a senzu bean so the fight could continue. Had Goku accepted Cell's offer he eventually would have received power boost to reach Super Saiyan 2 (granted he didn't die first). Because Cell predicted Goku was the biggest threat he probably wouldn't have gotten as angry as he did with Gohan (who was a [[LargeHam "CHILD!!!!"]]) if he surpassed him.

** Jossed, it's not in Cell's genetic nature (ex. Vegeta and Frieza's Pride) to be so understanding, if anything he'd be more mad.

[[WMG: Fasha is ''NOT'' Goku's mother, but is the mother of Raditz.]]
Just throwing it out there. If anything (since Saiyans age much differently than humans) she looks like she's about Bardock's age. She's got black hair, which could have been cut short to aid in battle - or passed on by her as a recessive trait even though she exhibited the dominant short hair.
* Partially Confirmed WordOfGod says Goku's mom was name was Gine.

[[WMG: Frieza never transformed past his base state for fear of Ginyu stealing his body]]
Ginyu was always seeking a stronger host and Frieza was always around, but Ginyu knows the Changeling race well, having worked for King Cold for years and years. The reason Ginyu never took Frieza's body is because he was waiting for him to transform into his most powerful state first. Frieza knew this, so he stayed in his "base" form.
** Jossed by simple logic: If Frieza was so concerned about Ginyu taking over his body, he would have killed him before he became a threat, plain and simple.

[[WMG: Vegeta's growth was stunted due to insufficient rations.]]
Raditz and Nappa were fully grown when Planet Vegeta was destroyed, but Vegeta was still a child at the time. Frieza felt he was still valuable as a soldier, but he was afraid of what Vegeta could be capable of when he grew up, so he made sure that Vegeta was never well fed. That's why Vegeta is so much shorter than the other saiyans and half-saiyans.
* Jossed. Raditz was confirmed to be the about the same age as Vegeta in both official guides and in [=DB=] Minus. Plus, Bardock wasn't elderly when Planet Vegeta was destroyed, so Raditz couldn't have been fully grown at the time. Plus, Vegeta's height is inconsistently draw in the series (to the point were he's often depicted as only slightly shorter than Goku, especially in Super).

[[WMG: Raditz and Goku have different fathers]]
Sayians don't mate for life, and polygamy is the norm. Raditz and Goku are brothers in the Saiyan sense, as they have the same mother. If you bring movies into it, Turles can be Goku's patriarchal bro.
* Jossed. Dragonball Zero confirmed that Goku and Raditz share the same mother and father, and Bardock and Raditz acknowledge each other as father and son in the video games.

[[WMG: The reason why Future Trunks never mentions the events of the Buu saga...]]
...is because in his timeline, it simply didn't happen. Either the Androids killed Babidi before he could awaken Buu, or more likely, the Z warriors of that timeline simply couldn't provide enough energy to awaken Buu, especially after the Androids wiped most of them out. It's unlikely that the Androids would have survived if Buu were awakened, and even if by chance Buu and the Androids chose to coexist, the Androids would ''not'' be Trunks' biggest concern when he went back to warn Goku about the bad future.
** Or alternatively, the enormous ki being put out by Cell and Gohan was felt throughout the universe, and that's what attracted Babidi to Earth, so it has yet to happen in Future Trunks's timeline, which means he's quite literally screwed as he has yet to face Dabura and Babidi, much less Buu.
** Jossed, it does happen in the video game Dragon Ball Z: Shin Budokai - Another Road.

[[WMG:Bulma buried herself under technology to make up for not having her dream boyfriend]]
[[spoiler: Jossed by JacoTheGalacticPatrolman. She buried herself in technology long before puberty, even proving herself to be a better engineer than her father while she was still a child.]]

[[WMG: Vegito/Gogeta not appearing in Battle of the Gods was no coincidence.]]
Just as there are no mistakes in martial arts, there are no mistakes in martial arts anime/cartoons apparently. If Vegito/Gogeta were to appear in BOG then it would be just another "turn the tables around curbstomp retaliation" like the battle against Buu or even the ending in non-canon movie "Fusion Reborn" or the appearance of [=SSJ4=] Gogeta in the non-canon franchise gt. Even though it would of been really satisfying seeing another appearance from Vegito or even the first canon appearance of Gogeta beat the shit out of a villian that thinks their invincible such as beerus, that would of defeated the point of the film hence its name "battle of GODS". If Goku and Vegeta did fuse(then of course beat the shit out of Beerus and Whis) that would take up all of the creative room that was meant to introduce the new saiyan transformation(ssjgod). It's clear that Akira regrets ending the series after the Majin Buu saga and that's why there's Gt, a couple of [=DBZ=] movies after the Buu saga, and let's not forget the shitload of [=DBZ=] video games including that online [=DBZ=] games. So he decides to make a movie about the series even going as far as introducing a new saiyan transformation into it, he's pretty much trying to pull the series out of retirement (not cancellation), and to add to that there is a new [=DBZ=] movie coming out in 2015. While some fans are in denial in the face that Vegito is stronger than Beerus here's this. Vegito beat Buu(han) and Super was more or less equal to [=SSJ3=] Goku plus he had Goten, Trunks, Piccolo and Ultimate Gohan who was way stronger than Vegeta (Before BOG in which he got that rage boost against Beerus) seeing as he completely dominated super Buu before he started assimilating people so if you're going to be all mathematical about this shit, Buuhan after absorbing all of those people should of kicked Vegito's ass not the other way around. The reason being because Vegito got a power boost from the earrings also an additional power boost because Goku and Vegeta were rivals as stated by Elder Kai. So Vegito is going to have a hell of a lot more power than just Goku and Vegeta otherwise he wouldn't of been able to defeat Majin Buu but completely dominate him as well. For those fans who are still feeling "skeptical" about the subject Beerus can't defeat [=SSJ1=] Vegito/Gogeta, let's just be generous and say Beerus can defeat [=SSJ1=] Vegito/Gogeta, but is it possible for beerus to defeat [=SSJ2=] or even [[ThereIsNoKillLikeOverkill [=SSJ3=] Vegito Gogeta]]? Point proven.
** Brutally jossed, especially with regards to pre-god fusions being stronger than Whis.

** Also at least one of the human warriors will find a 'God' form of their own.
** Toriyama said that Supreme Kais are born from a tree, though...

** The problem with this theory is that they never surpassed Gohan. Mystic Gohan was more powerful than [=SSJ3=] Goku and that is pretty much undisputed. Mystic Gohan is heavily implied not to be an increase in power it's instead a matter of Gohan fighting at 100%. Basically Vegeta was wrong about why Gohan was 'weaker' than when he faced Cell. He'd lost his killer instinct which honestly that kid does everyday.

[[WMG: Akira Toriyama will live just long enough to be invited to the White House to meee the President.]]

Considering the Super Saiyan God transformation only dyed Goku's hair red, and [[spoiler: in the newest movie, Saiyan's who master the Super Saiyan God power can use their base Super Saiyan form on top of it, but instead of gold hair, their [[YouGottaHaveBlueHair hair becomes blue]]]], it seems that may be where the transformations may be heading. As such, characters having multicolor rainbow hair will be the new joke with {{Super Form}}s instead of characters turning into walking balls of hair.

When we first meet Cooler, he's in his "third transformed state", which we all took to mean his original, basic form, comparable to Frieza's fourth (and original) form. When comparing [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/cooler1.png Cooler's "normal" form]] to [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/6a1c3bbd1fa4dbd406150e869c890ef0.png Frieza's fourth form]], the two even look somewhat similar. But! Frieza's fourth form looks much ''more'' similar to [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/frost_final_form.png Frost's true form]], and Frieza's [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/c8f409eba62492abd7715d7c8267e68_1.png first]], [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/ffcb7f2dceb5159a8bbca08d362d4533.png second]], and [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/0599a23b2bd4050233236675064729cc.png third]] forms ''very'' closely parallel [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/first_form_frost.png Frost's first form]], [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/king_cold.png King Cold's only known form]], and [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/frost_tercera_forma_artwork.png Frost's "assault" form]], while the form that Cooler's "base" form most closely parallels is... Frieza's [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/golden_frieza__2_by_nekoar.png Golden form]]. Note in particular the head shape, the brow ridge, and the bio-armor around the chest and shoulders.

[[WMG: The Hyperbolic Time Chamber[=/=]RoSaT is supposed to represent a black hole]]
Just think about it. A black hole's gravity is so great, that not even light can escape from it. The RoSaT has a 10x greater gravity than Earth, and everything looks white because it is pulling down light. Time dilation, or time going slower or faster than usual, is also believed to happen in black holes. There are also odder, but plausible scientific theories saying that black holes act as wormholes, so the entrance to the Hyperbolic Time Chamber could be a wormhole to an alternate dimension, which the RoSaT is stated to be.

Why, then, would Cooler describe this as his "third transformed state"? Well, first, why would he describe it like that at all if it was the form that required absolutely zero transformations? But more than that, I think the answer is found in Frost. Remember that Toriyama once described Cold and Frieza as mutants of their race, explaining both their borderline–incalculable strength and the fact that they were evil. Frost is much nicer than Frieza ([[DependingOnTheWriter at least in the manga]]), perhaps establishing that he is not a mutant and his strength comes from training rather than [[TheAce being born with it]]. Frost, notably, does not possess an equivalent to Frieza's second form, and his equivalent to Frieza's third form is called his "Assault Form". I think that most members of Frieza's race only have the squat, first form, which [[PowerLimiter severely limits their natural power]]; the [[XenomorphRipoff third form]], which [[WeakButSkilled helps them channel their ki more efficiently]]; the fourth/natural form, which [[UnskilledButStrong removes any limits on their power at all]]; and an equivalent to Frieza's Golden Form, which is the only transformation they have that actually ''increases'' their ki. I think that Frieza's second form was a form invented by his father, King Cold, as a kind of half–way pressure valve release for his power — Cold didn't want to release all of his power, but needed more power than the minuscule first form would allow him. I think, therefore, that Cooler in his "third transformed state" because it's not his natural state, but rather his equivalent to Friza's Golden Form. Remember that Frieza knew he could achieve his Golden Form before he began training to achieve it, and that he specifically described it as him having chosen to make it gold, implying that other members of his race might have a similar form that is not monochrome. I think that's what Cooler's "base" form is: he's mastered the equivalent of Frieza's Golden form in an effort to try to match Frieza and King Cold's monstrous strength (the theory being that Cooler isn't a mutant, and so is not nearly as naturally strong, which also explains his CardCarryingVillain tendencies which don't tend to vibe with his [[BenevolentBoss actual]] [[FatherToHisMen actions]]).

Why, then, would Cooler describe this as his "third transformed state"? Well, first, why would he describe it like that at all if it was the form that required absolutely zero transformations? But more than that, I think the answer is found in Frost's "assault" form. I think that that form was built by Frieza (and Frost) specifically to channel more of their enormous natural power offensively while still allowing them a greater degree of control, and that it is not a form normal members of Frieza's race possess. Members such as Chilled and King Cold are only shown with the squat, first form, and the more monstrous second form, while presumably possessing an original form mirroring Frieza's fourth form as well and an actual Power Up form equivalent to Frieza's Golden form as well. Remember that Frieza knew he could achieve his Golden Form before he began training to achieve it, and that he specifically described it as him having chosen to make it gold, implying that other members of his race might have a similar form that is not monochrome. I think that's what Cooler's "base" form is: he's mastered the equivalent of Frieza's Golden form in an effort to try to match Frieza and King Cold's monstrous strength (remember that Toriyama describes Cold and Frieza as being so strong [and evil] because they're mutants — the theory here is that Cooler isn't, and so is not nearly as naturally strong, which also explains his CardCarryingVillain tendencies which don't tend to vibe with his [[BenevolentBoss actual]] [[FatherToHisMen actions]]). Hence, it's his third transformed state, and the only transformation designed specifically to ''increase'' his power.

The evidence ranges from one hundred percent cannon to taking a bit of stretching to get to but lets start wtih the fact that everything we know about Saiyan culture comes from an UnreliableNarator , Vegeta. He was a child when he was taken and raised by Frieza so how well Vegeta's actual grasp on his own society is questionable at best. It's not like his father was planning on giving up his son or his planet getting blown up and thus instilled him with tons of history. There are however specifics that are very odd.

He's a paranoid psychopath and tyrant. Like many in his position, the Emperor of the Galaxy wanted to make sure no-one would have the guts to try and overthrow him, or subvert him to even the slightest degree. Also, as a high-functioning coward and [[TheBully bully]] he's afraid of those with VillainousValour who wouldn't be cowed. As for the lack of proper training? He's afraid they might get more gutsy; being abnormally powerful mutants they aren't too much of a concern. Given how none of the non-Saiyan Freeza Force thought of turning traitor, to the point of considering reviving him, [[JerkassHasAPoint it worked]]. Still, there are exceptions. With Captain Ginyu and the rest of the Ginyu Force except maybe Jeice, [they're mercenaries and thus loyalty isn't an issue when you're one if not ''the'' wealthiest people in the universe(plus even if its not a VillainousFriendship he and Ginyu are on good terms). The Saiyans meanwhile sparked a rare interest in Frieza; fascination in their power, subconsciously letting them becoming stronger than he'd usually let the get. That, and [[InLoveWithYourSlaughter he loves their violence and bloodlust]], [[MoralMyopia even if he considers them beast for it]]. Even if he thought otherwise bravery is etched into the Saiyans' DNA and would be inconvenient for the lazy Frieza to crush. [[GoneHorriblyRight This backfired]] and he decided it was a bad move. The only reasons he never tried to crush the courage out Vegeta is because he knew that was impossible, and [[TheCorrupter he wanted the Prince of Saiyans to be like him]]. It's unfortunate for Sorbet that he never thought of bolstering the courage of the remaining ranks and gave them proper training, or else there'd never be a need to bring back the worst evil Universe 7 has ever known.

Why, then, would Cooler describe this as his "third transformed state"? Well, first, why would he describe it like that at all if it was the form that required absolutely zero transformations? But more than that, I think the answer is found in Frost's "assault" form. I think that that form was built by Frieza (and Frost) specifically to channel more of their enormous natural power offensively while still allowing them a greater degree of control, and that it is not a form normal members of Frieza's race possess. Members such as Chilled and King Cold are only shown with the squat, first form, and the more monstrous second form, while presumably possessing an original form mirroring Frieza's fourth form as well and an actual Power Up form equivalent to Frieza's Golden form as well. Remember that Frieza knew he could achieve his Golden Form before he began training to achieve it, and that he specifically described it as him having chosen to make it gold, implying that other members of his race might have a similar form that is not monochrome. I think that's what Cooler's "base" form is: he's mastered the equivalent of Frieza's Golden form in an effort to try to match Frieza and King Cold's monstrous strength (remember that Toriyama describes Cold and Frieza as being so strong because they're mutants — the theory here is that Cooler isn't, and so is not nearly as naturally strong). Hence, it's his third transformed state, and the only transformation designed specifically to ''increase'' his power.

FridgeHorror sets in when you realize that this means Frieza might have as many as two more forms he could unlock, both of which come with '''''dramatic''''' power increases... if he knew everything that his brother had achieved.

* This is simply false. Gohan became a Super Saiyan through training, he went SS2 when he saw 16 destroyed. Vegeta became a SS roughly through sheer will and Gotten and Trunks just developed the power by competing with each other. Neither had known any loss. Also Comics can say whatever they want but we don't see a lot of Uchias and the ones we do see seem to flaunt that "rule". Madara gains the Sharingan by losing his best friend, not to death or anything just because and Sasuke gains his not from the death of his entire family but rather in the middle of a fight with Orochimaru.

** No, you are dead wrong. There are many definitions of canon across all other works of fiction. DBZ, for some odd reason, has inspired many manga worshipers who prefer that so much over the anime that they insist on calling that canon. It's plain delegitimizing the anime, claiming that it is not real or that it is not as important as the manga is. The anime is just set in a different continuity, that's all, but it is ''still'' canon. Canon does NOT describe original work alone, that's just one part of it, and you seem to be selectively tweaking the word to support your argument. In DBZ's case, since Toriyama worked on the movies ''and'' the filler scenes ''and'' the new movie, they are canon, period, although the movies, like the anime, are set in a third, separate continuity, with the exception of ''Dead Zone''. That's also the whole reason DBGT ''isn't'' canon, because Toriyama ''did not work on it''.

[[WMG: Saiyans and Humans had a common ancestor or better they are actually the same species that simply evolved a little differently because of different planetary and survival conditions. DBZ genetics obey Lamarck]]

* DBZ genetics seem to suggest that LamarckWasRight. Perhaps after a few generations of very powerful human fighters having their own offspring, those humans' own Super genes will be activated enough to become dominant and we could see the first Super Human transformation, which would be the icing on the cake.

* DBZ follows mendelian genetics, with one exception. Powerful fighter have powerful children. this is because each cell has its own ki, including haploid cells. So when really powerful Goku and really powerful Chichi have sex, it produces really powerful Gohan, because he got a big helping of ki to start off with. Also, the humans in DBO are descended from saiyans. Humans have no super gene, tail gene, or zenkai gene of their own. Hybrids inherit those only from their saiyan parent, which is why hybrids get smaller zenkais.

* Goku relies on his Super Saiyan forms a lot more because ''he's usually pitted against the BigBad''. Threatening his own safety fighting in his base form when he could power up early on would be the DBZ equivalent of NeverBringAKnifeToAGunFight. The only times we see him consciously avoid leveling up is when he has a specific intent - i.e. not defeating Buu so the surviving fighters on Earth could learn to shoulder the burden of Earth's protection. Besides, this theory would only really stand if Goku never trained in his base form, which is a bit of a LogicBomb since earlier arcs showed us that attainment of higher power levels could only be done through the strengthening of the previous form, allowing the fighter to reach the breach of its potential before ascending. Hence, [=SSJ2=] comes after a body becomes properly trained to [=SSJ1=], which in turn would imply that the base form must be consistently strengthened, as well. Given the power he exemplifies in the Buu arc, it's obvious he doesn't take very well to the idea of "resting in peace."

Several fanfics, in fact, the vast majority of all Krillin angst fics, focus on the topic of Krillin being horribly abused by his father. Often, his mother has died naturally, or more frequently, been KILLED BY HIS FATHER. This actually makes a considerable amount of sense; in DBZ Kai, as he prepares to fight Frieza, he says "It's times like these that I really wish I had a mother to call." However, this doesn't have to mean she was killed, but keep in mind that Krillin is only in his 20's when he says that, so she wouldn't be dead from old age. Most fanfics on this topic involve Krillin running away to the Orinji temple and then to The Kame house.

* I don't think so. When Goku was turned back into a kid in GT, He got his tail back, and he was still able to go SSJ, [=SSJ3=], AND [=SSJ4=]. Also the [=SSJ4=] transformations have tails.

* Well, other than the filler and DBGT, there's no indication that Saiyans came from another planet or stole their tech. I personally prefer to think that some Saiyan scientists looked at the night sky and dreamed about punching the stars in their mouths. Not to mention the possibility of finally having a city that wasn't blown up by some overpowered brat having a temper tantrum.

** But remember that the only available time for Goten's conception was during the several days before the Cell Games (see above), during which Goku was in permanent, but also "normal" SSJ, without radiating any violent energy. So Goten pretty much HAD to have been conceived while Goku was in a semi-permanent SSJ state.

* This ties in with the WMG of the tail-SSJ connection above. We know Goku hadn't gone SSJ prior to Gohan's conception, but had by the time of Goten's. Vegeta had the capability to go SSJ when Trunks was conceived. We also know we never see a SSJ with a tail. Perhaps the removal of a Saiyan's tail begins a BIOLOGICAL process that results in the ability to go SSJ. This change could be passed on to offspring. Goku had lost his tail a good while ago when Gohan had been born, but had yet to complete the process. Thus, Gohan has an easier time going SSJ than Goku or Vegeta because he started somewhere in the middle of the process and the tail prevented it from progressing. By the time Goten was conceived, Goku had completed the SSJ process and passed his new genetic sequence more fully onto Goten. The reason Vegeta was able to go SSJ so comparatively soon (compared to Goku) after losing his tail was because he was in more near-death experiences. Its canon that Saiyans get a chunk stronger after almost dying, possibly pushing them along the SSJ process, but further, he was HEALED alot more. Indicating a higher rate of cell division. Goku regaining his tail in ''GT'' (a slow time consuming process) started a new biological process that allowed for a [=SSJ4=] state. Baby replicated this process within Vegeta after seeing it in Goku.
** Nice explanation but mostly likely NOT. The whole SSJ transformation was already a legend among Saiyan culture. Vegeta briefly pictures a gold SSJ Oozaru rampaging per the legends he was told and no Saiyans prior to Goku (who was not on his native planet) ever let their tails be removed. So there is reasons to believe that SSJ could be achieved by Saiyans with tails intact but it was so rare that it became something of myth and legend.

* The official map of the DB world shows that it, first off much smaller then our current world. And second, and most importantly, that it is a COMPLETELY different shape than ours. A much more likely theory than the "700 years since we just restarted the calendar" is "it's been 700 years since we used all those bombs to blow the world into a different shape".

* Why a lot of squick if GT is canon? If you mean Pan, her first appearance was at the end of DBZ, not in GT.

When Devilman used the devilmite beam on goku, he was a child, & his heart was pure. But, who's to say that the effects of the beam didn't wear off immediately afterwards? The devilmite beam might have been permanent, & Goku's purity didn't last forever. During his battle with Frieza, Goku became enraged (which caused him to become a super saiyan) after he found out that Frieza killed his best friend & his entire species. The devilmite then took effect, but the beams grew slowly, because Devilman wasn't manipulating them. Eventually (about a year after he went SSJ) the beams grew large enough for Goku to start feeling them. The beams then shredded Goku's heart, & he died before they could destroy anything else.

** Two problems. The first is that power levels for better or worse seem to make a lot more difference in who wins a fight than inteligence or talent. So once the Ginyu force and Frieza were wiped out Zarbon likely could have taken command with little trouble. Possibly less trouble than the Captain Ginyu since all the flashbacks suggest that Zarbon and Dodoria are the next in command regardless of their power levels. The second being that Frieza couldn't be everywhere at once and since it's implied that the Saiyans are well above the rank and file (and lets be honest Raditz wasn't all that powerful by any scale used in DBZ) the elimination of Frieza, King Cold, the Ginyu Force, Zarbon and Dodoria and Cui all at once is an enormous vacuum.

** Must be filler. After the Frieza arc the DBZ team had no further access to spaceships, and the only ones who ever space-travelled after that were Goku and Dende.

* And his hybrid son (or daughter, whatever) will appear in the next DBZ movie as an important plot point. If they made Vegeta's long lost permashota brother in this recent movie, why not Nappa's kid?

It takes a different trigger to do so. Men are transformed by rage (Goten might be the exception, as Vegeta probably irritated Trunks enough to SSJ him on purpose), but Pan (if GT is to be taken in consideration) doesn't seem to transform into one, even when absurdly enraged. Perhaps, their trigger is an emotion that transforms women into monsters, like rage does with men. [[WomanScorned Scorn]], [[{{Yandere}} deception]], and [[StepfordSmiler absolute despair]] are good options to take in consideration.

** It was overwhelming rage + a pure heart (Vegeta claimed he used pure evil) + sufficient amounts of power. Unless you're over a level of power that Vegeta never approached until late into the Frieza saga, you just can't transform into SSJ.

* Some FridgeLogic, though I'm not sure if it counts in the DBZ universe: Blood. Remember, Pan is only a quarter saiyan.

* Women probably can become Super Saiyans but you need to have at least as much Saiyan blood as human blood to go Super Saiyan. That's why Pan never went SSJ, she's only 1/4 Saiyan.

Meanwhile, Pan is running around the universe, beating the crap out of villains that most DBZ characters would have a hard time with... and is even out-performing her grandfather at times. About the only way to explain this is that she somehow 'stole' the powerup from her father when she was concieved.

* It's never stated in canon that Gohan can never go SSJ again. Although he went Mystic instead of SSJ when asked to, it doesn't say anywhere that SSJ has been overwritten or erased for good.

** But what clearly ''was'' done to SSJ is it was rendered ''pointless'', due to Gohan having a better (ie. "less taxing") way of accessing his power. This is apparently no longer the case in ''GT'', whereas Pan, as said before, is running around doing things on par with a basic level SSJ.
** It could just be that only ''Gohan'' can use his Mystic power. Now, who was in control of Gohan's body during the Baby arc? Certainly not Gohan. Furthermore, it's possible that being under Baby's control basically "broke" the Mystic power-up, either turning it off for good or getting it permanently stuck on a x49 or lower setting; both cases would force him to go back to SSJ transformations. Another possibility is that Baby [[LaserGuidedAmnesia erased everyone's memory of the Mystic form when he couldn't use it]], although this brings up a question of why Goku never mentioned it, since he wasn't controlled by Baby at any point.

* All the kami water did is give him a power boost. The reason why Kakarot was able to easily surpass Vegeta is because he had more battle smarts. Even though Vegeta trained more and violently then Kakarot, Goku trained smarter and more efficiently than him. A good example of this is when Vegeta was on Namek getting his face pounded in and Goku was training in 100x gravity, who do you think suffered more Goku or Vegeta, I believe that one's so easy it doesn't need to be answered because we all know the answer, but answer this to your self who came out stronger. Goku's training was no walk in the park either but he did it at a steady pace or at least steady for him since we all know how energetic Goku is. Oh yeah do you remember when Kakarot came out of the hyperbolic time chamber stronger than Vegeta (because he mastered the Full Power SSJ instead of the Ascended SSJ form) because he recieved better training than him and it was because he trained (worked on his strength and speed) instead of torturing himself.

Trunks traveled through dimensions, not time, which is why he was able to come back for return visits and still avoided screwing up his own timeline. There were three versions of Cell because of this, but this ''changes nothing'' and helps further explain why DBZ "time travel" is so screwed up anyhow.[[note]]And before you complain, different timelines can move at different speeds - and different events can happen in different ways. Like how Goku suffered from the heart virus far ''later'' than Future Trunks' version of Goku.[[/note]]

Nowadays many viewers wondered why did Creator/AkiraToriyama became such a Master in DemotedToExtra when it came to just about any DBZ character whom was from DB. (Well, except for Goku, even though Akira seemed to have tried to do that. Namely on how later on in the series Goku has been accused of trying a little too hard to get the younger fighters to take over his role.) Its no secret that Gohan was suppose to have taken over the role of "Earth's Hero" and Main Character from his Father. (In which plenty of fans have wished that the show ended on the Cell Saga so Akira might have actually got his wish.) While DBZ did have its fair share of new characters, Goku never did lose his role as Earth's main protector. And despite on how they have been hit with the "DemotedToExtra" trope (some a lot more than others) it was still pretty much the adventures of Goku and his friends.

But in Akira Toriyama's defense its an interesting idea to try to come up with a "Next Generation" a bit more gradually. Cause often enough when a franchise tries to use that idea we get a bunch of new characters that come out of nowhere, in which we might not even be certain if we are in the same continuity anymore. (But its generally due to the story having a time skip when that happens though how much of a time skip can often vary.) The story would often like to claim that these characters would have any connection to any previously established character, even though the story never actually mentioned their existence until now. Akira tried to avert this by getting Gohan to one day take over his father's role gradually. But sadly DBZ is probably quite the example on how that kind of idea can go wrong. So in other words Akira might have succeeded in truly getting Gohan to truly take over his father's position as Earth's Main Defender if he did it right from the start.

* In support of this is the fact that while Goku in DB was a legitimate KidHero who saved the world many times over, adult Goku in DBZ was actually not much of a big hero (and even in some ways a subversion of the hero concept). Consider: he didn't save the world from Raditz alone (enter Piccolo), he didn't save the world from Vegeta and Nappa alone (enter Vegeta's own {{Bad Boss}}ness, Gohan, Krillin, and Yajirobe), he didn't save Namek from Freeza (no one did), he actually endangered Earth by provoking Freeza, and he didn't protect Earth from Freeza afterwards (Mirai Trunks did), he didn't save the world from the Androids (turned out it didn't need to be done, or maybe ''Krillin'' did by showing enough compassion to No.18 to prevent them from going evil), he didn't save the world from Cell (unless guiding Gohan to it counts), he had a chance to save the world from Fat Buu and didn't do it (Mr. Satan did by befriending Buu), his plan to save the world from Super Buu by teaching fusion to Goten and Trunks failed miserably (failed to take into account that the kids weren't emotionally mature enough to pull it off), and his contribution to stopping Kid Buu was as part of a team effort (along with Mr. Satan, Vegeta, and ''the entire population of the earth'').

There's only been one saiyan recorded in the last 3000 years that wasn't in close contact with humans for years before his transformation, and that's Broly, who had a SlaveCrown and a parent who made the normal Saiyan TrainingFromHell look like [[{{Bowdlerization}} Training From HFIL]]. Goku was raised by humans, and even needed his best friend being killed in cold blood before his eyes to snap and go Super Saiyan rage in his mid-twenties. The [[AuthorityEqualsAsskicking incredibly powerful Prince]] Vegeta was raised by the punk kid who enslaved and later destroyed his entire planet (and I ''mean'' "his", being Prince of All Saiyans), then got surpassed by some punk serf-class guy who lived most of his life on a backwards planet with almost nobody above [[PowerLevels level 5]], and spent a few years using mystical and technological training weights to push his rage at, probably, Goku being more powerful. This was when he was at ''least'' over thirty (unless I drastically overestimated his age), but he had exposure to humans for a much shorter time than Goku. Gohan, a half-human and raised (mostly) by humans, has emotion-based power boost, turned Super Saiyan when he was eleven and [[UnstoppableRage Super Saiyan 2]] when he was 12. Trunks and Goten were SS-capable by the age of ten, and while Goten had (almost definitely, I don't remember the timeline) been conceived after Goku was SS-capable, Trunks required TrainingFromHell anyway- Goten just needed a human family. That included [[{{Tsundere}} Chichi]] (as did Gohan, until he was five).\\
What have the Saiyans not had that the DBZ Saiyans and Half-Saiyans had in droves? Human associates. Huan associates that taught them (and other alien characters) to repress emotion until it bursts out of their ears like steam, have violent outbursts at any expression of their species' traditional pastimes (and then switch completely to ''encourage'' this in a younger sibling), let illogical sequences of thought and action slide as long as they sound okay, [[MoralEventHorizon shoot dogs for fun and]] [[BerserkButton lack of profit]], and (though this is usually the tipping point after years of buildup of the [[HumansAreBastards Human Bastardry]]) [[WorldOfCardboardSpeech watch their weak human friends die like flies]]. Saiyans just kill things for food, release of aggression, money and at least sometimes honor, which humans do all the time ''plus'' those other things. The only beings in the series that are worse than the average human mercenary (on a wider scale) are the {{Card Carrying Villain}}s that originate from Earth or [[AlwaysChaoticEvil other dimensions]] anyway.\\
Therefore, [[HumansAreBastards DBZ humans are the most evil,]] [[StrawVulcan loony]] [[HumansAreBastards species in existence]] (at least on average, since some humans are only evil ''or'' loony), and ''bring out the worst'' in even ''Saiyans''.

After Frieza killed off all the saiyans but four (or maybe nine or ten, if you count the movies), it became incredibly easy to go to higher levels of power, passing Super Saiyan and going to Legendary Super Saiyan (when you reach SSJ the hard way first) or [=SSJ2=]+.

Raditz had hair with a length that rivaled goku in [=SSJ3=], so my theory is that Raditz was able to transform into an SS at a very younge age, due to being constantly beaten to near death due to his weakness. after his 105th or so loss, he became sdo enraged that he became a super sayan. He kept this hidden so that he could train more and allow himself to be beaten in order to become even more powerful, but eventually he reached the point where a normal sayin couldnt do any damage to him. He knew that Vegeta or Nappa could damage him, as well as Frieza, but they would have killed him, and he would have not been able to come back since he didnt know about the dragon balls. So he went to earth to have Goku, whom he knew would be strong enough but not kill him, to beat him senseless, but he didnt expecct Gohan and Piccolo.

* Presumably in Future Trunks' timeline Goku used Instant Transmission to teleport back to earth, turned SSJ, and squished Freeza and his father. Now if we add the supposition that Goku's heart virus is alien in origin and he contracted it while in space, perhaps in Yarblat, and consider that turning SSJ seems to accelerate the onset of the disease, then going SSJ to fight Freeza that second time would be the trigger that activated the heart virus, leading to Goku's death. This explains why Goku didn't get the heart disease until much later in the main timeline.

In DBZ, souls definitely exist. Nail told Piccolo that if they merge, he won't put his personality into him. Therefore, I think it makes sense that Nail's soul was seperated from his body, and went to King Yemma to be processed. (Obviously, he'd go to heaven) Nail's body, and the power it possesses, went to Piccolo. Others may have thought of this before I did, but I don't see it mentioned here and there has been some discussion to what happened to him when the merge happened.

* Call me crazy, but maybe Kishimoto saw how all the fighters could learn techniques ridiculously fast and track super speed (although in DBZ they sense it when it's too fast to see), and decided to base the Sharingan on that. It wouldn't be the first thing he based on DBZ, after all.

She has to know that any of them can wipe the floor with her. Yes, go Big Head Yell, throw objects, fume and rage--cool. They obey her because they love her; They fear her temper because of that love, it makes them upset to see her upset. She has them by the heartstrings, but in no other way. Her way of handling or mishandling them goes back to the final tournament of the original DB. She shows up, wants to surprise the boy she loves, figures to give him a good fight at worst, which is fair. Goku was always strong, but he wasn't making super-geometric leaps when they were kids. But she shows up, and not only does he not recognize her, he brushes aside her combat challenge, one she has prepared for likely for years, under the tutelage of a great fighter, her own father. From the start she realizes even the hint of physical control of any sort is out for her men, and must therefore keep herself tsundere to handle it all.

* This theory is very obsolete and more importantly absurd. Once someone has achieved the SSJ form it becomes encoded in their genetics. That's why Goten was born a hell of a lot stronger than gohan, because Goku was a Super Saiyan at the time. I don't think Goten off all people has a warrior spirit.

For starter when she changes or better yet transforms she turns into a blonde, considering the fact that the super saiyan transformation [[SuperpoweredEvilSide naturally taints one's heart with evil]] Launch's blonde transformation turns her into a JerkAss, both blonde transformations increase one's strength and finally both blonde transformations have the capability of being "tamed". Example being Goku and Gohan achieving the Full-power super saiyan form completely negating the negative side effects of the SSJ transformation including the attitude problem and Launch being able to put a leash on her own self when in her blonde state.

* You have a good point, I have some evidence to back up said claims, He dresses very similarly to how Buu does, it is outright stated that he is immortal, which is rare in the DBZ universe, also he is supposed to be a Genie or something, wheras Buu by WordOfGod is stated to be inspired by a Djinn, which in modern culture has translated to "evil Genie" type spirits, there is also the fact that Mr. Popo has seemingly no trouble fighting people who, generally, should be way above his skill level, and is usually cited as being stronger than he looks, along with the fact that he never takes off that damn turban, bet there is a head tentacle under there.

* Jossed. Raditz was confirmed to be the about the same age as Vegeta in both official guides and in DB Minus. Plus, Bardock wasn't elderly when Planet Vegeta was destroyed, so Raditz couldn't have been fully grown at the time. Plus, Vegeta's height is inconsistently draw in the series (to the point were he's often depicted as only slightly shorter than Goku, especially in Super).

That's why the bigger they are the more harder they are to dodge. In the DBZ universe or in any world anyway size doesn't matter, speed and strength does, am I right? Just like a big enemy is at a disadvantage rather then a small strong enemy. A bullet can move so fast that it can't even be seen yet the fighters on this show dodge them and catch them like nothing, yet they can't dodge a big enough kamehameha or any other super big energy blast. Raditz can catch a bullet at point blank range but yet he couldn't dodge a kamehameha wave from far way, does that even add up. Saiyans can move at blinding speeds and can dodge approaching projectiles or melee attacks with a minimum of effort, energy blast might be strong but they don't move that fast so why can't a saiyans dodge that. Kid buu getting hit with the spirit bomb doesn't count because he didn't even try to dodge it, also it was very far away and it wasn't approaching him that fast, he had no problem dodging majin buu's chocolate beam so I think he can dodge a slower attack. Bardock as high as his power level is should be able to move at super speed, however he couldn't dodge Dodoria's mouth attack, maybe he felt like a deer caught in the headlights or he was being sucked in by the large anti-matter beam that was intent on killing him.

* Well, SSJG Goku was very far above Ultimate Gohan and was not equal to Beerus. Beerus was never using more then 70% of his power.

He said he ate a lot of food there that's how he probably got it, well that's a theory what I'm about to say isn't. In Future Trunks's timeline Goku fought and defeated King Cold and Frieza and more than likely he assumed the SSJ form. In the timeline we all know Trunks fought Frieza and his father, and Goku stayed a super saiyan for less then a minute. Which one do you think is harder that or killing the strongest warrior in the universe and his son, it doesn't matter if your strong enough to beat the both of them your still going to have to put some muscle in it.Goku using his super saiyan form to destroy the two took up a lot of super saiyan energy, to the point where'd it increased the virus meter for the heart virus he all ready had. Everyone even Vegeta said "The super saiyan transformation will only make your heart virus worst" so that proves he got it before he'd even come to Earth. I don't know where some fans got the absurd "Goku got his heart virus on Earth somehow" theory, that should be a WMG. Trunks saved goku the effort of having to use his Super saiyan transformation in the current timeline and speeding up the development of his heart virus. That's what Piccolo meant when he said "that boy just visiting changed the future".

It provides power greater than money in the DBZ universe and you are inclined to worship the entity that gave it to you.

It's already been established in the very early Buu saga that a super saiyan can produce an offspring that posseses the inate ability to transform into a super saiyan as well without any special training, eg. said offspring being [[HetereosexualLifePartners Trunks and Goten]]. With that being said in order for Broly to be so powerful and assume the SSJ transformation [[LargeHam at such a young age]] just like Goten and Trunks he would of needed someone in his family tree to be able to become a SSJ. It's safe to say that it definitely isn't Paragus, so who could be. Bardock of course. If the "Bardock is the legendary SSJ" WMG and the "Episode of Bardock Special" are canon that is. In the DBZ canon it's said that the lengendary super saiyan destroyed themself because they couldn't control all of that enormous power of theirs and self-destructed oblitherating their home planet in the process. In the "Bardock father of Goku" movie it's been established that Bardock did not master the great ape transformation(losing all self awareness in that state), also him being a super saiyan and all also meaning he would be a SSJ great ape and he couldn't control his overwhelming energy leading to it eventually consuming his whole body in a fiery explosion. Some time before his untimely REAL death he had another child and that child had the SSJ genes in their genes. After some generations later Paragus was born but the bloodlined had thinned out so badly that he didn't possess super saiyan abilities but he still had them in his gene pool, his son Broly inherited all of the SSJ traits in Paragus's gene pool thus explains the second coming of the legendary SSJ.

Whis offered the job of God of Destruction to Goku after Beerus died, implying that it was more of a title than anything, and was open to anyone who was strong enough (in other words, you didn't have to be born as a god to obtain the position). Furthermore, talking anthropomorphic animals, including cats, are native to Earth in the DBverse. Beerus was just a mortal cat-person who became strong enough to become the God of Destruction. This is also the real reason why Beerus decided not to destroy the Earth.

It seems (in canon) that there is contradictory information as to whether the Saiyans were a separate species that developed naturally on Planet Plant alongside the Tuffles, or invaders/refugees who came to the planet from space. I'd like to propose a third option - that a group of Tuffles developed the Saiyans, Dr. Gero-style, to be the perfect killing machines. Since the Tuffles were good with technology but physically weak, and living in the Crapsack Universe that is DBZ's playground of villains and genocidal maniacs, they needed people with muscle if they were ever going to expand their infrastructure to other planets, or even just guarantee the safety of their own little corner of the universe. So a group of mad scientists got together and designed the Saiyans. When it seemed like the project was a success, the new group were introduced to the public as 'aliens' who were being allowed to colonize the planet in exchange for their loyalty and military services. Of course, it wasn't long before it became apparent that the whole thing had GoneHorriblyRight, the Saiyans turned on their makers, and the rest is history.

Despite eps and arcs set in the afterlife, we never again see Granpa Gohan after the end of DB/Pre-Timeskip. While he could easily avoid reincarnation, Granpa asked to be born again as DBZ Gohan, to again be part of his grandson's life--and on a perverted level, be, err--fed by Goku's wife.

[[WMG: DBGT is canon despite {{WordOfGod}} however Akira Toriyama is decanonilizing it so he can bring back DBZ explaining the "Battle of Gods".]]
As many DBZ fans dislike Anime/DragonBallGT it perfectly fits in the Dragonball timeline. The reason why GT is becoming obsolete is so DBZ can be revived and brought into a new direction.

[[WMG: The reason why there is no direct power up from SS3]]
Yes I know, the GT-exclusive Transformation is called "Super Saiyan 4" but it is not a direct power up from SS3, since you can't just reach it via powering up. It requires a tail and transforming into a great ape. It's also completely different from the usual gold-colored Super Saiyan forms. Now if you look at the new forms, Super Saiyan God and Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan (or Super Saiyan Blue) you will also notice that they are not direct 'next tier' upgrades to the SS3 form but rather a new base form and a god-empowered SS1. And the reason for that is simple. While a SS4 (or 5, or 6 or even 7) that is a direct upgrade from SS3 could exist, the simple fact is that SS3 suffered from an immense amount of energy drain. Thus any further upgrade down this line would exponentionally increase in the amount of ki it consume, to the point it would become unsustainable for more than, say, a minute or two. Directly powering up the base Super Saiyan form is a dead end because of that.

So my thought is this, the hair sticks up straight during SSJ to maximize surface area, while the hair doesn't change pigmentation in and of itself, but has it's own independent (yellow) aura of energy (Ki) bleed. All this is to prevent the overflow of Ki from destroying a Saiyans body for the duration of the transformation. This also explains the variation in hair colour depending on how much power is being used, and Why SSJ 3 grows more hair (and why it's so wasteful, it literally wastes a significant portion of the users Ki).

This doesn't explain the SSJ 4, however, nor the Oozaru, although the latter could be explained as the result of an entirely unrelated transformation that is also built into the Saiyans.

Just as there are no mistakes in martial arts, there are no mistakes in martial arts anime/cartoons apparently. If Vegito/Gogeta were to appear in BOG then it would be just another "turn the tables around curbstomp retaliation" like the battle against Buu or even the ending in non-canon movie "Fusion Reborn" or the appearance of [=SSJ4=] Gogeta in the non-canon franchise gt. Even though it would of been really satisfying seeing another appearance from Vegito or even the first canon appearance of Gogeta beat the shit out of a villian that thinks their invincible such as beerus, that would of defeated the point of the film hence its name "battle of GODS". If Goku and Vegeta did fuse(then of course beat the shit out of Beerus and Whis) that would take up all of the creative room that was meant to introduce the new saiyan transformation(ssjgod). It's clear that Akira regrets ending the series after the Majin Buu saga and that's why there's Gt, a couple of DBZmovies after the Buu saga, and let's not forget the shitload of dbz video games including that online DBZ games. So he decides to make a movie about the series even going as far as introducing a new saiyan transformation into it, he's pretty much trying to pull the series out of retirement (not cancellation), and to add to that there is a new DBZ movie coming out in 2015. While some fans are in denial in the face that Vegito is stronger than Beerus here's this. Vegito beat Buu(han) and Super was more or less equal to [=SSJ3=] Goku plus he had Goten, Trunks, Piccolo and Ultimate Gohan who was way stronger than Vegeta (Before BOG in which he got that rage boost against Beerus) seeing as he completely dominated super Buu before he started assimilating people so if you're going to be all mathematical about this shit, Buuhan after absorbing all of those people should of kicked Vegito's ass not the other way around. The reason being because Vegito got a power boost from the earrings also an additional power boost because Goku and Vegeta were rivals as stated by Elder Kai. So Vegito is going to have a hell of a lot more power than just Goku and Vegeta otherwise he wouldn't of been able to defeat Majin Buu but completely dominate him as well. For those fans who are still feeling "skeptical" about the subject Beerus can't defeat ssj1 Vegito/Gogeta, let's just be generous and say Beerus can defeat [=SSJ1=] Vegito/Gogeta, but is it possible for beerus to defeat [=SSJ2=] or even [[ThereIsNoKillLikeOverkill [=SSJ3=] Vegito Gogeta]]? Point proven.

Beerus is shown to be a super arrogant prick [[UpToEleven even in villian standards]] and he did say that there are universes with warriors stronger than him, but him being the smug bastard he is he wouldn't go into detail of how the other Gods of Destruction are stronger than him. Remember when Dragonball ended and then DBZ began, Raditz showed up and he seemed nearly invincible just like BEERUS and WHIS in the movie, but then it turned out that Raditz was literally microscopic in terms of power compared the other villians later in the series. Beerus being as malevolent and power hungry as he is clearly rules over his sector with an iron fist and feels no remorse for his misdeeds just like other villians the series and if he could he would take over other universes and rule over them just as he does the seventh universe, but he doesn't because those gods of the respective universe would make him sorry even if he tried so Beerus just stays in his own section in the universe and pretty much bullies everyone in it. Making sure to avoid other universes in fears of getting into a confrontation with someone stronger than him.

It was more like another branch of super saiyan just like assj and the regular ssj1 branch. It doesn't look like the regular ssj and of course doesn't work like or is achieved in the same manor as the regular ssj transformation because it's not related to normal super saiyan transformation. Goku just dubbed it super saiyan 4 because of the simple fact that he thought that it was.

* Akira Toriyama has confirmed that [[http://www.kdramastars.com/articles/22976/20140524/dragon-ball-z-manga-continuation.htm?nxid=62 mastering the base Super Saiyan form is more efficient than using further transformations like Super Saiyan 2 or Super Saiyan 3]]. Also, if this were true, Gotenks wouldn't have been able to skip [=SS2=] altogether and go straight from SS to [=SS3=] without at least mastering his base SS state. Although, given how unaggressive SS Goten and SS Kid Trunks seemed compared to other Super Saiyans, it's possible that they may already have been Full-Power Super Saiyans.

* We're told that Saiyans were an evil and blood thirsty race but the few examples we're given don't really support that claim at all. Given how power levels function in DBZ Raditz can claim all he wants that he was picking up his brother because he would make the coming battle easier but that's bullshit. Any battle Vegeta couldn't win by himself Raditz and Goku wouldn't even effect, nor would Raditz. He traveled for two years to get his baby brother and Vegeta let him go because there were only four Saiyans left. Bardock and King Vegeta clearly love their sons and their entire race. For all the talk about Vegeta being cold to the rest of the Z warriors by the time the Buu Saga rolls around it's clear he's spending more time with the group than Tien, Yamcha, Piccolo or Chousou. He also bonds with Future Trunks very quickly. All things considered they don't seem to be a whole lot worse than humans. They are a lot stronger than us on average but there's no reason to think the Red Ribbon Army wouldn't have been every bit as bad as the Saiyans if they had access to the raw power.

It was mentioned that there are in fact 12 universes, and Beerus is the god of destruction for the DBZ universe(Universe 7). Perhaps Whis is the equivalent of Beerus on a large scale-he controls acts of destruction throughout all universes, training and electing a representative for each of the 12 universes. Whether or not Whis [[AlwaysABiggerFish answers to the God of Destruction for an even higher megaverse]] is unknown.

I think it's more that Super Saiyan becomes more like a second "base" form, and the various enhanced versions are just raw power increases. In the Cell saga, not only were two enhanced [=SS1=] forms introduced (Ascended Super Saiyan & Ultra Super Saiyan), but Goku & Gohan trained to the point where they could maintain their base Super Saiyan forms with virtually no ki drain (Full-Power Super Saiyan form). The two ascended forms show that the base SS form can increase its power output without having to actually transform. Not only is the FPSS form mastery over the SS state (to the point where they lose all of the inherent restlessness and aggression, and gain the ability to control their power level as easily as in their base states), similar to how extensive aerobic training lowers your heart & respiratory rate while you're at rest, but according to Vegeta, when he was sensing FPSS Goku & Gohan, they felt the same as if they were in their base form; their aura also calms considerably when in the FPSS form, compared to a standard SS aura. (In the anime, mastering the SS form and gaining the FPSS state also allows a Saiyan to use Super Saiyan power without actually transforming out of their base form, suggesting a much deeper bond between the two forms than one just being a transformation of the other.) Furthermore, Goku absorbed some of the Super Saiyan God state into his base and SS forms, letting him stand roughly on par with Beerus without being a god himself anymore (and possibly internalised the ability to transform into an SSG, as well), which suggests that it can be enhanced. (And if you want to stretch things a bit, the movie implies that SSG is a base state transformation instead of a Super Saiyan transformation, seeing how it more or less just gives the Saiyan a red tint, without the bio-electrical discharges or face/hair changes associated with SS transformations, has a much calmer aura (no jagged edges at all), and doesn't explicitly require energy from Super Saiyans (while the others transformed, Pan likely didn't have access to any SS transformations, not being born yet); if this is true, the SS state absorbing some of the SSG form's power implies that SS is treated as a base state (at least for [=FPSSes=]). [Furthermore, the SS form causes a MUCH more drastic change in power level than any other form (SS is 50x base state, [=SS2=] is 2x SS, and [=SS3=] is 4x [=SS2=]), possibly suggesting that the other forms aren't full-fledged transformations on their own, and merely based on the amount of ki fed to them.]

Further support for this would be how natural transformation is for Trunks & Goten, and how they barely have any of the standard SS aggression until they go [=SS3=] Gotenks. This actually links into another interesting theory; since tails are recessive traits for half-Saiyans, and the only half-Saiyan we've seen with a tail (Gohan) required ''much'' more effort to achieve his Super Saiyan form (and how his tail stopped growing back once he finally ''did'' get it), it suggests that tails actively interfere with the process. Seeing how tails cause Saiyans to transform into Great Apes, this may suggest that the Great Ape form is a corrupted SS state (as evidenced in one of Vegeta's flashbacks in the Frieza saga). There's a definite link between the two types of transformation; when Future Trunks goes Ultra Super Saiyan, Krillin thought he was turning into a Great Ape, implying that USS has a very similar energy signature to GA; similarly, in the anime, Goku's first onscreen [=SS3=] transformation includes imagery of a GA, hinting at a connection between the two. (''GT'' supports this, in that Super Saiyan 4 is basically a Golden Great Ape in a human body, and majorly increases the Saiyan's aggression, although that show's not exactly canonical.) I'd guess that the tail acts as a conduit or amplifier for emotions (both positive and negative), keeping a transformed Saiyan from concentrating enough to maintain an SS state, or even realising there is one. It's already been proven to actually interfere in the transformation process; note how tailed Saiyans require visual stimulus in the form of a full moon to transform[[note]]I don't remember Blutz Waves being mentioned before ''GT'', and this seems like a more logical reason for the transformation, seeing how it doesn't actually happen until they ''look'' at the moon/Earth/Power Ball, and it would be instantaneous if it solely depended on energy waves from the object in question.[[/note]], while a Saiyan without a tail is able to transform under their own power. Goten and Trunks, not having tails, were able to transform before they were even 10, and as stated, are much less aggressive in their transformed states. While Goten was conceived after Goku acquired his SS transformation (and thus Goku's ability to transform may have had a hand in Goten's ease of transforming), Trunks was conceived before Vegeta left for his SS training. Therefore, even if it plays a role, the parent Saiyan's access to the SS form doesn't determine how easily their half-Saiyan child can transform. (I'm not sure how Future Trunks' difficulty in initially achieving SS ties into this. Perhaps in that timeline, he was born with a tail?) So, basically, if they had a tail (regardless of whether they still have it), their [[RageBreakingPoint rage has to hit a breaking point]], and push past what the tail can handle, before gaining the ability to transform into an SS instead of a GA. [If we use ''GT'' to support this, then a Saiyan whose tail is forced to grow back after achieving an SS form retains the ability to use SS forms, and it seems to amplify both their energy and ability to handle energy while transformed (Saiyans with tails are stronger than average Saiyans, assuming neither has access to any SS transformations; Kid Goku can only retain [=SS3=] for a few seconds until regrowing his tail, thanks to his deaged body's lessened ability to handle the energy, but can keep it much longer after the tail comes back), which can theoretically be extended to amplifying other things, as well. Perhaps this energy amplification is the entire reason that the tail corrupts SS states: SS states have both inherent power and inherent aggression, so an amplified SS state would likely have amplified aggression as well, very possibly more than a Saiyan could consciously handle while retaining a humanoid form. If so, then a tailed Saiyan would only be able to transform into an SS if they had already mastered the Super Saiyan form, and thus it didn't have its inherent aggression and unrest. Otherwise, the heightened emotions would corrupt the transformation, preventing them from using it naturally, and regressing them to a more bestial state when they artificially stimulate it.]

Of course, all we have is speculation until they give an official reason, and these aren't incompatible theories. The whole "Great Ape is a corrupted Super Saiyan form" thing would easily tie them together, as does the SS state's flame-like hair (corresponding to an SSG's flame aura).

...Something else I realised while typing this up: Super Saiyan 2 and 3 probably aren't even additional transformations to begin with! Remember the two ascended forms, Ascended Super Saiyan and Ultra Super Saiyan? They use energy to increase the SS's strength, and merely beef up the base SS state's muscles. Similarly, [=SS2=] and [=SS3=] are just powered-up variations on the basic SS form, focusing more on increasing the [[OneStatToRuleThemAll energy output]] instead of [[DumpStat physical bulk]] ([=SS3=] especially, which majorly increases ''ki'' utilisation, at the cost of insane ''ki'' consumption). This may suggest that both Ascended/Ultra and [=SS2=]/[=SS3=] transformations are variants on the same technique, expending ''ki'' to magnify aspects of the base SS state. If this is true, then it stands to reason that any further 'transformations' would just drain their reserves too fast to be useful, and that training [=SS2=] and [=SS3=] states either wouldn't be useful, or would only be useful up until they master them. This would also explain why both Ultra Super Saiyan and Super Saiyan 3 are associated with the Great Ape form, in that they're both variants of the same thing (pumping oneself up to the point where it immensely increases their abilities, but also has immense drawbacks). [This also suggests that Saiyans use their hair as either ''ki'' repositories or ''ki'' magnifiers, instead of it just being made of dead skin cells, which ties into pure Saiyans' hair only changing if they transform.]

Ok there have been a crap ton of debates of whether this godly ki makes you immune to normal ki and this Vegito couldn't hurt Beerus even if he went [=SSJ3=] so it's about time end it. Before I state out the obvious answer let me just put out everything that all DBZ fans so know because the obvious really isn't so obvious to those who just don't want(emphasis on want) to see the truth). Just to be generous to you Beerus fans I am not going to include the Kaios including King Kai and say that they fit in the God category considering the fact that they were able to sense Beerus's awakening and only those with "Godly" ki can sense others with it and the fact that Cell a normal ki user was able to kill him. During the Buu saga right around the time Elder Kai got released from the Z-sword, Elder Kai stated directly that the guy who sealed him up in there(Beerus) was not as strong as Majin Buu which is funny because of this "normal ki can't hurt godly ki" nonsense. If that were true why did elder kai(a KAIOSHIN by the way) state that Beerus was not as strong as majin buu during the time he sealed him up in the Z-sword? Another instance is when Vegeta was pummeling Beerus. Beerus said that normal ki has NO affect what so ever on Godly ki, however when Vegeta overcame his fear of Beerus and also got mad he not only surpassed Goku(who was at [=SSJ3=]) but was able to harm Beerus, even though he didn't do any major damage to him or leave any ugly marks on him he was still able to cause him pain hence him whincing and even spitting up a small amount of blood. Now let's not get distracted by Vegeta's amazing feat of strength and get right back to the subject shall we? Beerus said that normal ki can't do nothing to a god ki user and later on in the movie this little so called "fact" is proven obsolete. Yes Beerus was holding back a great amount of power when Vegeta was beating him up but that's besides the point. Vegeta was still able to hurt him without the use of godly ki. Now if Beerus said that normal ki has little, ALMOST no effect on a godly ki user or something similar to that now that would be a whole different story, but judging by Vegeta's little fit Beerus was wrong. Now if what beerus said was true then the battle between enraged Vegeta and a heavily surpressed Beerus should of went something like Hercule versus Majin buu or something because hey a normal Ki user would have NO effect on a godly ki user. The reason why Beerus was able to kick everyone's arse was for the simple fact that he was that much stronger than him. Vegito(base) or hell even Buuhan could did everything Beerus did. Now what I will say is that a single Godly ki is more powerful than a singular unit of normal ki and this is how. Akira Toriyama stated that Golden Frieza has a power level of 100 quintillion; notice how he didn't mention godly ki Akira just gave a number just like any other power level, and after Goku lost his God form and he was fighting Beerus with regular ki Beerus said that "he absorbed that transformation into his body that's why his power level didn't DECREASE DRASTICALLY"(watch the movie), not Oh you still have some of your God ki. Think of God Ki as the American dollar and normal Ki as Pesos. America's richer than Mexico right not because it uses a different form of currency but because it's currency is worth more right(1 dollar equals 7 pesos or something like that), or when the Z-team was in Babidi's spaceship and there power level was measured in Kili's instead of the scouters unit of power measurement. So think of God ki as premium fuel and normal Ki as regular. Another instance is when Goku was fighting Beerus and he was annoyed because he said he was fighing with his FRIENDS POWER NOT HIS, he didn't say anything about Godly ki. When Goku went SSjgod he pretty much did the same thing Buuhan did but the only differences are that Goku had Vegeta and an unborn fetus if that counts for anything, and that Goku had his energy converted into a different unit of power instead of just having a ton of normal ki hence why Krillin couldn't sense him. So saying SSj God Goku is stronger than Vegito is like saying Buuhan is stronger than Vegito and we all remember Vegito destroying him.

"Resurrection F" has Golden Frieza, proving Saiyans aren't the only race to have massively stronger forms. Despite being hybrids, Gohan, Trunks and Goten aren't diluted because of their human DNA-in fact, they're arguably even stronger than normal Saiyans!(Gohan's hidden power, Trunks and Goten able to go Super Saiyan at such a young age). This all suggests that, despite [[CantCatchUp being outclassed by the Saiyans]], Earthlings can be just as strong as them. So why aren't they? Simple-it's harder. Thanks to racial traits like Zenkai, it's a lot easier and/or faster for Saiyans to get powerful than it is human beings. There's also the fact that the Saiyans are a warrior race, giving them more motivation and reason to improve. Thanks to the Saiyans landing on Earth, humanity can learn how to better train themselves, and one day catch up. We may even have a super form like Golden Frieza and SSJ, it's just that we haven't figured out how to unlock it.

The absolute earliest thing we know for sure about Saiyan history is the presence of the original SSJ 1000 years ago, who was ultimately overwhelmed by his power. [[EarthShatteringKaboom We've seen what non-Super Saiyans can do]], so whatever rampage the original SSJ went on must have been horribly damaging to the Saiyans at the time. As a result, the planet they lived on was devastated. The original Saiyan home world was a wasteland DeathWorld because of this, forcing them to adopt a "survival of the fittest" code to survive. Some Saiyans who didn't fit this code/were descended from those who hadn't embraced this warrior culture still existed(for example, whoever may have been the original Super Saiyan God), but by the time of the Saiyan-Tuffle War the only remnant of whatever original ideas for peace they had remained only in Goku's mother Gine. Only with the death and/or redemption of all home-grown Saiyans could the "dog-eat-dog world" culture of the Saiyans die out. The Tuffles may have even been part of the same society over a millennium ago, representing what the Saiyans were.

[[WMG: Dr. Slump is a more benign [[Main/TheFairFolk fey realm]] split off from the main DB earth.]]
It occasions interacts with DB earth, but a [[Main/WeirdnessCensor weirdness censor]] is in place to prevent anyone from noticing it.

Toriyama has gone on record saying he regrets the introduction of power levels to DBZ, and it's pretty easy to see why. They were introduced to showcase Gohan's massive hidden potential and then sort of got away from him. But they still work so long as one takes into account this simple notion: Power Levels represent a person's raw Power, but not their Skill at using it. In support of this, let's look at Frieza. By the man's own admission, he had never trained a day in his life, had no idea how to actually fight, and couldn't even control his power without resorting to power-limiting transformations. He made the claim that his second form had a power level of over 1 million, but this didn't stop a PL 300,000 Goku from being able to go toe-to-toe with a final form Frieza at 25%, despite the fact that logically Frieza's final form ought to, even at 25%, still be stronger than his second form, otherwise why the Hell would you use transformations to begin with? Even with Goku using the Kaioken to keep up, he couldn't possibly have been able to do such a thing unless there was a considerable difference in Skill. The reason Frieza was such a humongous threat was ''because'' his raw power was so overwhelming that even the Z Warriors' vastly superior Skills couldn't bridge the gap. He was just too fast, too strong, too tough. He was the Hulk to their Captain America, or the Superman to their Batman. When faced with overwhelming, earth-shaking power no amount of skill can prevail.

The early DBZ fights also support this notion; Nappa had at least twice as much raw power compared to the Z Warriors, but Krillin and Piccolo were still able to hold him at bay for a considerable length of time because Nappa was a mediocre fighter at best and Krillin and Piccolo have literally entered martial arts tournaments. Goku had issues matching Vegeta when he finally arrived because Vegeta is actually a good fighter and so the difference in Skill was minimal. The late DBZ fights also support this notion; recall that after Majin Buu was first summoned, Gohan said that he thought that he could take him, indicating that he thought Buu's Power wasn't that much different from his own. Unfortunately for Gohan, Buu doesn't feel pain, regenerates like mad, and doesn't tire. Kid Buu, despite being the weakest form in terms of raw Power, still managed to beat down Goku and Vegeta because of these reasons plus the fact that he was so damned unpredictable.

During their training in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber, Gohan was staying into SSJ a lot by himself and having trouble dialing his ki blasts down enough for the little things such as roasting some meat. As he helped him refine his control, Goku noted that Gohan was slowly becoming better as a SSJ in general... And, being a fighting and training genius, Goku realized what it would lead to.

* Freeza's race has no official name, and we have no idea what Metamorans actually look like. In DBS's Resurrection 'F' arc, it's confirmed that Freeza definitely knows what fusion is (well in the dub anyway). Granted, Freeza's lived a pretty long time and has probably seen a ton of techniques; plus he's had soldiers working under him of numerous races, and some of them could have used fusion. But Freeza doesn't seem like the type to interact directly with his soldiers too often, and he probably wouldn't be on the battlefield with them if he could help it.