History Main / VillainForgotToLevelGrind

19th Mar '17 5:00:58 PM MyFinalEdits
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* ''VideoGame/DevilMayCry 3'' has a more plot-oriented example. Vergil goes from handing Dante his ass during their first encounter, to fighting him to a stand-still in their second, and finally losing to him in their third. However, it's not so much that Vergil forgot to level grind, since he actually gets progressively stronger just like Dante, gaining new weapons (Beowulf, Force Edge) and attacks, but Dante's just gaining much faster than he is.
** History repeats itself (chronologically speaking) in the original game. Nelo Angelo proves himself Dante's superior in their first battle, but Dante wins their second before slaying him in their third. Thematically appropriate, as Nelo is Vergil's reanimated corpse.

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* ''VideoGame/DevilMayCry 3'' has a more plot-oriented example. Vergil goes from handing Dante his ass during their first encounter, to fighting him to a stand-still in their second, and finally losing to him in their third. However, it's not so much that Vergil forgot to level grind, since he actually gets progressively stronger just like Dante, gaining new weapons (Beowulf, Force Edge) and attacks, but Dante's just gaining much faster than he is.
**
is. History repeats itself (chronologically speaking) itself, chronologically speaking, in the original game. game: Nelo Angelo proves himself Dante's superior in their first battle, but Dante wins their second before slaying him in their third. Thematically appropriate, as Nelo is Vergil's reanimated corpse.



** In ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaI'', a completely unaltered version of the level one boss returns guarding level seven. With the best sword in the game -- which is obtainable by that point -- it can be killed [[OneHitKill in one hit]].

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** In ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaI'', a completely unaltered version of the level one Level 1 boss (Aquamentus) returns guarding level seven.Level 7. With the best sword in the game -- which is obtainable by that point -- it can be killed [[OneHitKill in one hit]].



* The Solarian League Navy in the ''Literature/HonorHarrington'' series has spent literally centuries as the biggest, baddest navy out there. Able to push around any "neobarbs" who got uppity with no problem. In their arrogance over that fact, they never developed much in the way of new technology themselves (so as not to change their own balance of power) and disregarded anything Manticore and Haven came up with as inherently inferior, despite the two star nations' recent LensmanArmsRace. In later books, they're learning the hard way just ''how'' far behind the curve they are now as every battle they've fought with Manticore has been a CurbStompBattle in Manticore's favor despite being vastly outnumbered every time.
** It goes beyond simply just the technology, which the heroes admit the Solarians could catch up on fairly quickly because the League is a very large technologically advanced civilization. What they ''can't'' catch up as quickly on is that that members of the Manticore-Haven alliance have spent decades at war and as a result Darwinian selection has largely separated the wheat from the chaff among their senior officers and military, leaving a collection of highly competent, experienced commanders leading efficient, veteran military forces. The SLN, meanwhile, has most of their senior commanders appointed strictly due to their seniority and/or political connections or personal ability at sucking up instead of actual talent while their crews are largely inexperienced in war. The end result is not only a navy that's horrifically outgunned, but one led by people too stupid or ignorant to realize how outgunned they are.

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* The Solarian League Navy in the ''Literature/HonorHarrington'' series has spent literally centuries as the biggest, baddest navy out there. Able to push around any "neobarbs" who got uppity with no problem. In their arrogance over that fact, they never developed much in the way of new technology themselves (so as not to change their own balance of power) and disregarded anything Manticore and Haven came up with as inherently inferior, despite the two star nations' recent LensmanArmsRace. In later books, they're learning the hard way just ''how'' far behind the curve they are now as every battle they've fought with Manticore has been a CurbStompBattle in Manticore's favor despite being vastly outnumbered every time.
** It goes beyond simply just the technology, which the heroes admit the Solarians could catch up on fairly quickly because the League is a very large technologically advanced civilization.
time. What they ''can't'' catch up as quickly on is that that members of the Manticore-Haven alliance have spent decades at war and as a result Darwinian selection has largely separated the wheat from the chaff among their senior officers and military, leaving a collection of highly competent, experienced commanders leading efficient, veteran military forces. The SLN, meanwhile, has most of their senior commanders appointed strictly due to their seniority and/or political connections or personal ability at sucking up instead of actual talent while their crews are largely inexperienced in war. The end result is not only a navy that's horrifically outgunned, but one led by people too stupid or ignorant to realize how outgunned they are.



* Possible in the case of exams that can be taken more than once. If you didn't study the first time, you may not get even half the percentage needed for a passing score. Study enough after that, and the knowledge you learned may come as second nature and may definitely lead to a curb stomp, given the questions remain the same.
** When you're studying, some subjects can look really hard, especially math, when you move to the next grades, those subjects will seem a piece of cake for you, even if you forgot them and are looking back to remember.

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* Possible in the case of exams that can be taken more than once. If you didn't study the first time, you may not get even half the percentage needed for a passing score. Study enough after that, and the knowledge you learned may come as second nature and may definitely lead to a curb stomp, given the questions remain the same.
**
same. When you're studying, some subjects can look really hard, especially math, when you move to the next grades, those subjects will seem a piece of cake for you, even if you forgot them and are looking back to remember.
19th Mar '17 12:31:51 PM KeithM
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Added DiffLines:

** It goes beyond simply just the technology, which the heroes admit the Solarians could catch up on fairly quickly because the League is a very large technologically advanced civilization. What they ''can't'' catch up as quickly on is that that members of the Manticore-Haven alliance have spent decades at war and as a result Darwinian selection has largely separated the wheat from the chaff among their senior officers and military, leaving a collection of highly competent, experienced commanders leading efficient, veteran military forces. The SLN, meanwhile, has most of their senior commanders appointed strictly due to their seniority and/or political connections or personal ability at sucking up instead of actual talent while their crews are largely inexperienced in war. The end result is not only a navy that's horrifically outgunned, but one led by people too stupid or ignorant to realize how outgunned they are.
19th Mar '17 11:54:42 AM KeithM
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* [[StarWarsRebels Darth Maul]] never really improved his combat skills over the years, while Obi-wan Kenobi not only went through the grinder of the Clone Wars where he was constantly in combat and improving his skills in addition to his normal training, but gained maturity and wisdom in the 30 years since their first encounter while Maul has descended into insanity. As a result, their climactic duel consists of three moves: Obi-wan blocking him twice and then killing him with a single stroke.

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* [[StarWarsRebels Darth Maul]] never really improved his combat skills over the years, while Obi-wan Kenobi not only went through the grinder of the Clone Wars where he was constantly in combat and improving his skills in addition to his normal training, but gained maturity and wisdom in the 30 years since their first encounter while Maul has descended into insanity. [[spoiler: As a result, their climactic duel consists of three moves: Obi-wan blocking him twice and then killing him with a single stroke.stroke]].
19th Mar '17 11:53:37 AM KeithM
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Added DiffLines:

* [[StarWarsRebels Darth Maul]] never really improved his combat skills over the years, while Obi-wan Kenobi not only went through the grinder of the Clone Wars where he was constantly in combat and improving his skills in addition to his normal training, but gained maturity and wisdom in the 30 years since their first encounter while Maul has descended into insanity. As a result, their climactic duel consists of three moves: Obi-wan blocking him twice and then killing him with a single stroke.
25th Feb '17 11:43:18 AM sgamer82
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* The Solarian League Navy in the ''Literature/HonorHarrington'' series has spent literally centuries as the biggest, baddest navy out there. Able to push around any "neobarbs" who got uppity with no problem. In their arrogance over that fact, they never developed much in the way of new technology themselves (so as not to change their own balance of power) and disregarded anything Manticore and Haven came up with as inherently inferior, despite the two star nations' recent LensmanArmsRace. They're learning the hard way just ''how'' far behind the curve they are now as every battle they've fought with Manticore has been a CurbStompBattle in Manticore's favor despite being vastly outnumbered every time.

to:

* The Solarian League Navy in the ''Literature/HonorHarrington'' series has spent literally centuries as the biggest, baddest navy out there. Able to push around any "neobarbs" who got uppity with no problem. In their arrogance over that fact, they never developed much in the way of new technology themselves (so as not to change their own balance of power) and disregarded anything Manticore and Haven came up with as inherently inferior, despite the two star nations' recent LensmanArmsRace. They're In later books, they're learning the hard way just ''how'' far behind the curve they are now as every battle they've fought with Manticore has been a CurbStompBattle in Manticore's favor despite being vastly outnumbered every time.
20th Feb '17 12:25:58 PM SnowyNix
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See Also: SortingAlgorithmOfVillainThreat. Compare StrongAsTheyNeedToBe for an aversion, when the heroes are artificially weakened below the villain. Contrast VillainDecay, where a villain becomes less threatening for potentially less well-defined reasons, and LoweredMonsterDifficulty. Might overlap with DegradedBoss, whether on purpose or not.

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See Also: SortingAlgorithmOfVillainThreat. Compare StrongAsTheyNeedToBe for an aversion, when the heroes are artificially weakened below the villain. Also compare TheWorfEffect. Contrast VillainDecay, where a villain becomes less threatening for potentially less well-defined reasons, and LoweredMonsterDifficulty. Might overlap with DegradedBoss, whether on purpose or not.
13th Dec '16 2:37:49 PM MyFinalEdits
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* Played with in the ComicBook/{{WITCH}} comic: At first Cedric is a massive threat due the same reasons as in the cartoon ''and'' being extremely cunning, then the Guardians, being more powerful to begin with, achieve the experience to take on him, but by the times of the final battle of the first arc [[BigBad Phobos]] turned him into a creature capable of taking on all of them and ''winning'', and they barely defeat him due the Crown of Light having been enchanted to absorb the energy of whoever wears it (including Cedric's, when Will puts it on his head). He's later imprisoned in the Tower of Mists, where he ''can't'' get better... But when he's broken out in the fourth arc he's an ''even bigger'' threat than before, as [[GenreSavvy he knows he's now outmatched in a direct battle]] and relies exclusively on his wits, and he happens to be one of the smartest characters in the series. To the point that in the fifth arc, when he's released on probation, [[ActionGirl Orube]] is ''terrified'' when she stumbles into him (and he's now powerless), something that proves {{Justified}} when, improvising [[spoiler:he casually tricks Matt into being imprisoned in the Book of Elements in spite of Matt having been warned exactly of who he was, with the Guardians unable to make him pay because he's necessary to get Matt out]].



** Played with in [[ComicBook/{{WITCH}} the original comic]]: at first he's a massive threat due the same reasons as in the cartoon ''and'' being extremely cunning, then the Guardians, being more powerful to begin with, achieve the experience to take on him, but by the times of the final battle of the first arc [[BigBad Phobos]] turned him into a creature capable of taking on all of them and ''winning'', and they barely defeat him due the Crown of Light having been enchanted to absorb the energy of whoever wears it (including Cedric's, when Will puts it on his head). He's later imprisoned in the Tower of Mists, where he ''can't'' get better... But when he's broken out in the fourth arc he's an ''even bigger'' threat than before, as [[GenreSavvy he knows he's now outmatched in a direct battle]] and relies exclusively on his wits, and he happens to be one of the smartest characters in the series. To the point that in the fifth arc, when he's released on probation, [[ActionGirl Orube]] is ''terrified'' when she stumbles into him (and he's now powerless), something that proves {{Justified}} when, improvising [[spoiler:he casually tricks Matt into being imprisoned in the Book of Elements in spite of Matt having been warned exactly of who he was, with the Guardians unable to make him pay because he's necessary to get Matt out]].
13th Dec '16 12:27:18 PM EDP
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Added DiffLines:

** Played with in [[ComicBook/{{WITCH}} the original comic]]: at first he's a massive threat due the same reasons as in the cartoon ''and'' being extremely cunning, then the Guardians, being more powerful to begin with, achieve the experience to take on him, but by the times of the final battle of the first arc [[BigBad Phobos]] turned him into a creature capable of taking on all of them and ''winning'', and they barely defeat him due the Crown of Light having been enchanted to absorb the energy of whoever wears it (including Cedric's, when Will puts it on his head). He's later imprisoned in the Tower of Mists, where he ''can't'' get better... But when he's broken out in the fourth arc he's an ''even bigger'' threat than before, as [[GenreSavvy he knows he's now outmatched in a direct battle]] and relies exclusively on his wits, and he happens to be one of the smartest characters in the series. To the point that in the fifth arc, when he's released on probation, [[ActionGirl Orube]] is ''terrified'' when she stumbles into him (and he's now powerless), something that proves {{Justified}} when, improvising [[spoiler:he casually tricks Matt into being imprisoned in the Book of Elements in spite of Matt having been warned exactly of who he was, with the Guardians unable to make him pay because he's necessary to get Matt out]].
9th Dec '16 2:06:27 AM TheJovian
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* The [[BigBad Dread]] [[NamesToRunAwayFromFast Lords]] of ''[[VideoGame/GalacticCivilizations Galactic Civilizations II]]'' have incredibly powerful warships from the beginning that will eat anything an early-to-mid game player can throw at them for breakfast. As the game progresses however not only do their warship designs fail to improve to counter your own, but they also rarely group them into fleets to give them a strength in numbers. Eventually, if you can survive their attacks long enough to research superior weaponry and logistics to field not only powerful warships but also group them in bigger fleets than they do, you can gang up on their mostly solitary vessels and destroy themwith only light casualties, causing them to degrade from an InvincibleVillain to a MiniBoss.

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* The [[BigBad Dread]] [[NamesToRunAwayFromFast [[NamesToRunAwayFrom Lords]] of ''[[VideoGame/GalacticCivilizations Galactic Civilizations II]]'' have incredibly powerful warships from the very beginning of the game that will eat anything an early-to-mid game player can throw at them for breakfast. As the game progresses however not only do their warship designs fail to improve to counter your own, but they also rarely group them into fleets to give them a strength in numbers. Eventually, if you can survive their attacks long enough to research superior weaponry and logistics to field not only powerful warships but also group them in bigger fleets than they do, you can gang up on their mostly solitary vessels and destroy themwith them with only light casualties, causing them to degrade from an InvincibleVillain to a MiniBoss.
9th Dec '16 2:04:19 AM TheJovian
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Added DiffLines:

* The [[BigBad Dread]] [[NamesToRunAwayFromFast Lords]] of ''[[VideoGame/GalacticCivilizations Galactic Civilizations II]]'' have incredibly powerful warships from the beginning that will eat anything an early-to-mid game player can throw at them for breakfast. As the game progresses however not only do their warship designs fail to improve to counter your own, but they also rarely group them into fleets to give them a strength in numbers. Eventually, if you can survive their attacks long enough to research superior weaponry and logistics to field not only powerful warships but also group them in bigger fleets than they do, you can gang up on their mostly solitary vessels and destroy themwith only light casualties, causing them to degrade from an InvincibleVillain to a MiniBoss.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Main.VillainForgotToLevelGrind