History Main / VillainForgotToLevelGrind

31st Jan '18 11:40:39 AM Ferot_Dreadnaught
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* When Ryoga finally manages to find his way back to Tokyo in ''Manga/RanmaOneHalf'', he immediately challenges Ranma again. Who has spent the whole time having to fight several extremely strong opponents, most prominently Cologne. So the challenge turns into a CurbStompBattle. Ryoga turns out to be GenreSavvy enough to just ask Cologne to help him. And since Ryoga wants to marry Akane and Cologne wants to prevent Ranma from marrying Akane so he can marry Shampoo instead, she's quite willing to help rather literally help him [[LevelGrind grind]].

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* When Ryoga finally manages to find his way back to Tokyo in ''Manga/RanmaOneHalf'', he immediately challenges Ranma again. Who has spent the whole time having to fight several extremely strong opponents, most prominently Cologne. So the challenge turns into a CurbStompBattle. Ryoga turns out to be GenreSavvy enough to instead just ask asks Cologne to help him. And since Ryoga wants to marry Akane and Cologne wants to prevent Ranma from marrying Akane so he can marry Shampoo instead, she's quite willing to help rather literally help him [[LevelGrind grind]].



* Played with in the ComicBook/{{WITCH}} comic: At first Cedric is a massive threat due the same reasons as in the cartoon ''and'' being extremely cunning, then the Guardians, being more powerful to begin with, achieve the experience to take on him, but by the times of the final battle of the first arc [[BigBad Phobos]] turned him into a creature capable of taking on all of them and ''winning'', and they barely defeat him due the Crown of Light having been enchanted to absorb the energy of whoever wears it (including Cedric's, when Will puts it on his head). He's later imprisoned in the Tower of Mists, where he ''can't'' get better... But when he's broken out in the fourth arc he's an ''even bigger'' threat than before, as [[GenreSavvy he knows he's now outmatched in a direct battle]] and relies exclusively on his wits, and he happens to be one of the smartest characters in the series. To the point that in the fifth arc, when he's released on probation, [[ActionGirl Orube]] is ''terrified'' when she stumbles into him (and he's now powerless), something that proves {{Justified}} when, improvising [[spoiler:he casually tricks Matt into being imprisoned in the Book of Elements in spite of Matt having been warned exactly of who he was, with the Guardians unable to make him pay because he's necessary to get Matt out]].

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* Played with in the ComicBook/{{WITCH}} comic: At first Cedric is a massive threat due the same reasons as in the cartoon ''and'' being extremely cunning, then the Guardians, being more powerful to begin with, achieve the experience to take on him, but by the times of the final battle of the first arc [[BigBad Phobos]] turned him into a creature capable of taking on all of them and ''winning'', and they barely defeat him due the Crown of Light having been enchanted to absorb the energy of whoever wears it (including Cedric's, when Will puts it on his head). He's later imprisoned in the Tower of Mists, where he ''can't'' get better... But when he's broken out in the fourth arc he's an ''even bigger'' threat than before, as [[GenreSavvy he knows he's now outmatched in a direct battle]] battle and relies exclusively on his wits, and he happens to be one of the smartest characters in the series. To the point that in the fifth arc, when he's released on probation, [[ActionGirl Orube]] is ''terrified'' when she stumbles into him (and he's now powerless), something that proves {{Justified}} when, improvising [[spoiler:he casually tricks Matt into being imprisoned in the Book of Elements in spite of Matt having been warned exactly of who he was, with the Guardians unable to make him pay because he's necessary to get Matt out]].
31st Jan '18 11:29:22 AM TheSinful
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[[folder:Fan Fiction]]
* Played with in ''[[https://www.fanfiction.net/s/12696961/1/Stallion-of-the-Line Stallion of the Line]]''. Smoker can't beat Luffy when they first meet but his powers are unusual enough that Luffy has to work for his victory if he doesn't want to use haki. However, despite Luffy warning him to, Smoker doesn't pick up any new tricks and uses the same tactics in subsequent encounters, causing Luffy to defeat him with ease each time. Contrast Hina who changes her tactics since not only do her normal ones not work, but Luffy's already seen them and would have counters prepared. Luffy at one point asks if he can have Hina chasing him instead since she keeps things interesting.
[[/folder]]
26th Jan '18 6:36:13 AM ChronoLegion
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* ''Series/TheFlash2014'' provides an interesting variant, where it's not that a villain forgot to level grind as much as that he just hasn't leveled grind ''yet''. In season 1, [[EvilCounterpart the Reverse Flash]] was stronger, faster and a better fighter than Barry, repeatedly defeated him, and required help from multiple allies to be taken down. Season 2 episode ''[[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin The Reverse Flash Returns]]'' has him come back... except he turns out to be a time-travelling earlier version of him who [[HaveWeMetYet is meeting the Flash in person for the first time]], going against a more experienced Barry. As a result, when they do fight, [[CurbStompBattle Barry takes him down relatively easily]].

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* ''Series/TheFlash2014'' provides an interesting variant, where it's not that a villain forgot to level grind as much as that he just hasn't leveled grind ''yet''. In season 1, [[EvilCounterpart the Reverse Flash]] was stronger, faster and a better fighter than Barry, repeatedly defeated him, and required help from multiple allies to be taken down. Season 2 episode ''[[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin The Reverse Flash Returns]]'' has him come back... except he turns out to be a time-travelling earlier version of him who [[HaveWeMetYet is meeting the Flash in person for the first time]], going against a more experienced Barry. As a result, when they do fight, [[CurbStompBattle Barry takes him down relatively easily]]. When Barry encounters the Reverse Flash again in ''Series/CrisisOnEarthX'', Thawne once again provides a challenge for Barry, although Barry does defeat him in the end.
26th Jan '18 6:33:14 AM ChronoLegion
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** In the case of the Borg, it's not so much that the villain ''forgot'' to level grind as that the villain is ''incapable'' of level-grinding in the conventional manner. ''Voyager'' establishes that the Borg are completely incapable of invention or innovation. The only way they can grow is through assimilation...and most of the technology in the Delta Quadrant that was worth assimilating already had been. The rest was in the hands of those smart and/or powerful enough to avoid assimilation. Essentially, the villain had already hit his level {{cap}}, while the heroes haven't and thus can keep on grinding.

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** In the case of the Borg, it's not so much that the villain ''forgot'' to level grind as that the villain is ''incapable'' of level-grinding in the conventional manner. ''Voyager'' establishes that the Borg are completely incapable of invention or innovation. The only way they can grow is through assimilation...and most of the technology in the Delta Quadrant that was worth assimilating already had been. The rest was in the hands of those smart and/or powerful enough to avoid assimilation. Essentially, the villain had already hit his level {{cap}}, while the heroes haven't and thus can keep on grinding. This is the main reason the Borg have trouble with Species 8472 (STO calls them the Undine), whose extremely aggressive immune system prohibits assimilation, which also applies to their extremely capable OrganicTechnology.
26th Jan '18 6:30:14 AM ChronoLegion
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* Averted in ''Series/StargateSG1''. At first, when humans get Ancient technology, they can curb stomp the Go'auld. Fast forward a few years, and their new ships can ignore the human beam weapons and destroy them.

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* Averted in ''Series/StargateSG1''. At first, when humans get Ancient technology, they can curb stomp the Go'auld. Fast forward a few years, and their new ships can ignore the human beam weapons and destroy them. This is also shown in ''Series/StargateUniverse'', where the [[TheSyndicate Lucian Alliance]] is able to engage Earth's most advanced ship, the ''George Hammond'' (equipped with those same plasma beams), with 3 upgraded Ha'taks, and the ''Hammond'' receives substantial damage in the fight. WordOfGod is that the Lucian Alliance (largely composed of humans) has every incentive to upgrade their tech, unlike the Goa'uld, who spent millennia sitting on their asses.
2nd Jan '18 7:53:36 PM Linda58
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* Done across movies, for a single move. In ''[[Film/TheHobbitTheDesolationOfSmaug The Desolation of Smaug]]'', Bolg caught Legolas's sword by pinning it between his arm and body, and then pulled Legolas in close and pummeled him. He repeated the move against Legolas, this wielding his knives, in ''[[Film/TheHobbitTheBattleOfTheFiveArmies The Battle of the Five Armies]]'', only for Legolas to grab unto Bolg's arm, leap up onto his shoulders, [[spoiler:and stab him through the head.]]

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* Done across movies, for a single move. In ''[[Film/TheHobbitTheDesolationOfSmaug The Desolation of Smaug]]'', Bolg caught Legolas's sword by pinning it between his arm and body, and then pulled Legolas in close and pummeled him. He repeated the move against Legolas, this time wielding his knives, in ''[[Film/TheHobbitTheBattleOfTheFiveArmies The Battle of the Five Armies]]'', only for Legolas to grab unto Bolg's arm, leap up onto his shoulders, [[spoiler:and stab him through the head.]]
9th Dec '17 1:41:24 PM Godzillawolf
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* ''StarWarsRebels'': Darth Maul never really improved his combat skills over the years. Obi-wan Kenobi went through the grinder of the Clone Wars in addition to his normal training, but gained maturity and wisdom in the 30 years since their first encounter while Maul has descended into insanity. [[spoiler: Then Maul he spends days wandering in the desert, exhausting himself. Their climactic duel is three moves: Obi-wan blocks him twice and kills him with a single stroke]].

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* ''StarWarsRebels'': Darth Maul never really improved his combat skills over the years. Obi-wan Kenobi went through the grinder of the Clone Wars in addition to his normal training, but gained maturity and wisdom in the 30 years since their first encounter while Maul has descended into insanity. [[spoiler: Then Maul he spends days wandering in the desert, exhausting himself. Their climactic duel is three moves: Obi-wan blocks him twice and kills him with a single stroke]].stroke. The last move he tries is also the move he used to kill Qui-Gon, which Obi-wan effortlessly defeats. Also justified, as Obi-wan has sense become one of the most experienced expert of the single most defensive lightsaber style]].
9th Nov '17 1:59:54 AM Makir
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* ''Manga/JoJosBizarreAdventure'' Diavolo is arguably the only main villain in the series to progress as far as he has without the need for the sudden last-minute PowerUp, signature of Araki himself. [[TimeMaster King Crimson]] was just as powerful and had all the same abilities at the climax of the final battle as when it was first introduced. Not that it matters, since his [[LightningBruiser Rank A Strength and incredible speed]], along with his ability [[TheOmniscient to view the future]] and erase it, make him one of the most powerful villains in the series.
** Considering his motivation is actually getting that PowerUp MacGuffin for King Crimson it's easy to say that if he got it he would have become so powerful absolutely nobody would have been able to defeat him.
24th Oct '17 5:05:47 PM Linda58
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** In ''Digimon Frontier'', the Royal Knights got hit by this hard. When they first fight [=EmperorGreymon=] and [=MagnaGarurumon=], they beat them in a CurbStompBattle. Subsequent battles can best be described as the kids losing less badly. In "To Make the World Go Away", they are evenly matched against the Royal Knights and [[BigBad Lucemon]] needs to intervene to defeat them. In the very next episode, they curb-stomp the Royal Knights. Each fight made [=EmperorGreymon=] and [=MagnaGarurumon=] more skilled, but the Royal Knights didn't learn anything new.

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** In ''Digimon Frontier'', the Royal Knights got hit by this hard. When they first fight [=EmperorGreymon=] and [=MagnaGarurumon=], they beat them in a CurbStompBattle. Subsequent battles can best be described as the kids losing less and less badly. In "To Make the World Go Away", they are evenly matched against the Royal Knights and [[BigBad Lucemon]] needs to intervene to defeat them. In the very next episode, they curb-stomp the Royal Knights. Each fight made [=EmperorGreymon=] and [=MagnaGarurumon=] more skilled, but the Royal Knights didn't learn anything new.


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* Done across movies, for a single move. In ''[[Film/TheHobbitTheDesolationOfSmaug The Desolation of Smaug]]'', Bolg caught Legolas's sword by pinning it between his arm and body, and then pulled Legolas in close and pummeled him. He repeated the move against Legolas, this wielding his knives, in ''[[Film/TheHobbitTheBattleOfTheFiveArmies The Battle of the Five Armies]]'', only for Legolas to grab unto Bolg's arm, leap up onto his shoulders, [[spoiler:and stab him through the head.]]
17th Oct '17 4:30:32 AM Couran
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* Really, this is a fact of life for anyone who has a serious desire to improve themselves. Working a 50 hour week while raising children may sound like an impossible task when you're 18, only for you to gain enough time management skills to make it a breeze by the time you're 30.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Main.VillainForgotToLevelGrind