History Main / StatGrinding

* The ''VideoGame/{{Mabinogi}}'' skill system is drenched with this. Every single skill level comes with a list of successes, failures, particular results and specific applications that must be met to level the skill up, ''plus'' requiring a bunch of [[CharacterPoints AP]]. It works well for the most part, but you can run into difficulty when it comes to higher-level craft skills that require a certain amount of successes ''and'' failures to level. If you level the craft skill too high too quickly, then it becomes harder to accumulate the necessary quota of failures than the quota of successes.

* The ''VideoGame/{{Mabinogi}}'' skill system is drenched with this. Every single skill level comes with a list of successes, failures, particular results and specific applications that must be met to level the skill up, ''plus'' requiring a bunch of [[CharacterPoints AP]]. It works well for the most part, but you can run into difficulty when it comes to higher-level craft skills that require a certain amount of successes ''and'' failures to level. If you level your craft skill too high too quickly, then it becomes harder to accumulate the necessary quota of failures than the quota of successes.

* The ''VideoGame/{{Mabinogi}}'' skill system is drenched with this. Every single skill level comes with a list of successes, failures, particular results and specific applications that must be met to level the skill up, ''plus'' requiring a bunch of [[CharacterPoints AP]].

*** ''SaGa2'' (aka ''Final Fantasy Legend 2'') also did this, but humans could gain stats the same way Mutants did too. Monsters evolved the same way with the fixed-stat-values (and the inability to use weapons). But there was another class that leveled up a different way...robots. Robots would simply have their stats increased by equipment that is given to them, with the theory that it's added on as an upgrade.

** ''MakaiToshiSaGa'' (aka ''FinalFantasyLegend'') primarily did this with mutants. Humans could use items to speed the process, and monsters simply evolved into stronger monsters with fixed stat values (a hidden "rank" stat on monsters and enemies allowed for some real shenanigans, such as evolving a monster to one of monsters outside of the last boss's room... before ever entering the tower).

* The ''[[MabinogiFantasyLife Mabinogi]]'' skill system is drenched with this. Every single skill level comes with a list of successes, failures, particular results and specific applications that must be met to level the skill up, ''plus'' requiring a bunch of [[CharacterPoints AP]].

* {{Quest 64}} used this in a way that ignored [[RandomNumberGod typical level up systems]]. Of course, it still required work, but it was better than relying on a bad level up.

* ''[[SaGa Final Fantasy Legend]]'' only did this with mutants. Humans needed items, and monsters simply evolved into stronger monsters with fixed stat values.
** ''[[SaGa2 Final Fantasy Legend 2]]'' also did this, but humans could gain stats the same way Mutants did too. Monsters evolved the same way with the fixed-stat-values (and the inability to use weapons). But there was another class that leveled up a different way...robots. Robots would simply have their stats increased by equipment that is given to them, with the theory that it's added on as an upgrade.
*** There are also some potential Catch 22 situations, and when dealing with parties of robots and monsters mixed with humans and mutants, monsters and robots may be ordered to defend or do something useless so humans and mutants could be able to take the appropriate action to gain stats.

* ''{{SaGa}}'' used this ''a lot'', although some games had different methods to give some diversity..

* ''FinalFantasyLegend'' only did this with mutants. Humans needed items, and monsters simply evolved into stronger monsters with fixed stat values.
** ''Final Fantasy Legend 2'' also did this, but humans could gain stats the same way Mutants did too. Monsters evolved the same way with the fixed-stat-values (and the inability to use weapons). But there was another class that leveled up a different way...robots. Robots would simply have their stats increased by equipment that is given to them, with the theory that it's added on as an upgrade.

*** To elaborate: While the game engine of Morrowind didn't allow for more than one dose of a particular potion to be effective at the same time, crafted potions worked slightly differently. The same potion made twive, with the same ingredients, didn't count as the same potion mechanically so long as it granted even slightly different bonuses. Since Alchemy was Intelligence-based, it was simply a matter of producing an Intelligence-boosting potion, drinking it, gaining the buff and repeating until you eventually produced potions with effect values in the millions and durations of in-game decades. As the whole process is exponential, this actually happened fairly quickly.

** Addendum: ''FinalFantasyII'' also had another method to keep you from maxing all your characters stats out so even the manly-fighter Gus wouldn't wind up also being a formidable magic user; whenever you worked on some stats, others would actually go down. This was removed in the remakes, meaning one could just make ridiculously powerful and nearly identical characters with enough time.

* ''{{SaGa}}'' used this ''a lot'', although some games had different methods to give some diversity..
** ''FinalFantasyLegend'' only did this with mutants. Humans needed items, and monsters simply evolved into stronger monsters with fixed stat values.
** ''Final Fantasy Legend 2'' also did this, but humans could gain stats the same way Mutants did too. Monsters evolved the same way with the fixed-stat-values (and the inability to use weapons). But there was another class that leveled up a different way...robots. Robots would simply have their stats increased by equipment that is given to them, with the theory that it's added on as an upgrade.
*** There are also some potential Catch 22 situations, and when dealing with parties of robots and monsters mixed with humans and mutants, monsters and robots may be ordered to defend or do something useless so humans and mutants could be able to take the appropriate action to gain stats.

* ''FinalFantasyX''[='=]s Sphere Grid. Leveling up does not raise stats; it just grants you moves on the Sphere Grid. To boost your stats, you use spheres to activate spaces on the grid that boost your characters' stats and grant them new abilities.
** ''FinalFantasyXIII''[='=]s Crystarium way of levelling is very similar to ''FinalFantasyX''[='=]s Sphere Grid levelling (except the "grid" was based on the character, not universal, and the ability/stat unlocks just required enough points), so it also counts.

[[AC:MMORPGs]]

** ''FinalFantasyXIII''[='=]s Crystarium way of levelling is very similar to ''FinalFantasyX''[='=]s Sphere Grid levelling, so it also counts.

* The ''FireEmblem'' games use this for weapon proficiency gains, in that by attacking with a certain weapon/magic (or healing with staves) enough times will allow the character to use the next relevant level of arms.

* The ''[[MabinogiFantasyLife Mabinogi]]'' skill system is drenched with this. Every single skill level comes with a list of successes, failures, particular results and specific applications that must be met to level the skill up, ''plus'' a bunch of [[CharacterPoints AP]].

** So, it makes ''{{Disgaea}}'' have THREE level grindings IN ONE. You go into item world and kill stuff there. You get exp for LevelGrinding, you get skills for StatGrinding and you are making the item you are in into an InfinityPlusOneSword.

This is based off of real life workouts. If you want to boost your overall strength, you practice lifting more and more weight, but if you want to boost endurance, then you practice bigger reps. One of the pros of Stat based grinding is that you can customize characters a little more this way, and it can give that feel of immersion to it. (Such as say, [[ElderScrolls Morrowind.]])

This is not without its drawbacks, however. As mentioned before, this could actually take ''longer'' than simple LevelGrinding because you might find a PeninsulaOfPowerLeveling in a Level-based-grinding game. Stat-Based-Grinding doesn't really work that well with a PeninsulaOfPowerLeveling. Another drawback involving gameplay would be a potential Catch22. You need to build your defense and health/stamina by getting hit, right? Well that will not help you if you keep dying. You need accuracy to hit enemies, but without accuracy, you can't hit the enemies. Finally, it is not only dependent on what the player does in battle but what the enemies do. In a party-based game, a player would find themselves putting someone out right in front of an enemy in hopes they decide to attack the character, that way the character will gain much-needed defense and HP. And if they don't, the player could wind up with characters who are extremely powerful but have little more HP than they actually started with, creating a true Glass Cannon.

** Quite frustrating in ''{{Morrowind}}'' was that you only made progress to leveling a skill on a ''successful'' use. Unless you want to spend half an hour swinging and missing a broadsword at a worm at your feet, nearly every non-Primary/Secondary skill on your character sheet required a small fortune in training before it would successfully go off once. I feel I should mention CrackIsCheaper, because skooma ''actually is''.

* ''PhantomBrave'' combines both LevelGrinding and Stat Grinding for both your characters and the items they can weild.

* One of the first games to do this was FinalFantasyII. Many things are still done today, but one of the things people made fun of in FinalFantasyII was that the most efficient way to power up your characters wasn't to kill enemies. It was to order your characters to ''smack themselves across the head with their weapons''. Seriously. The way it was set up, you were helping yourself ''more'' when targeting yourselves and attacking than you were beating up the enemies as you were intended. It was also the most surefire way to level up the Cure magic. Even in the remakes, this remains one of the best ways to gain experience and empower your characters.
** Magic was also a different story entirely, and was almost as big of a Catch22 as evasion stats. You had to cast spells and after a specific time, they'd level up. This unfortunately meant that while magic can be powerful after all, it's just too tedious to level up since your characters can become just as powerful after a few rounds of masochism than they would fighting a million battles with magic. It also didn't help that you could still inflict dinky damage with the most powerful spell in the game's world because your intellect stat was still low.
*** The NES version was considered a little easier for magic-fans because there was actually a [[GoodBadBug benevolent glitch]] that enabled you to simply select and deselect the spell over and over again and it eventually levels up.
*** The remake made it so that magic levels faster than weapons. (Though still not as easy to powerlevel as exploiting a glitch.) The BonusDungeon is much less tedious if you go at it with a party of mages.
** Addenum: ''FinalFantasyII'' also had another method to keep you from maxing all your characters stats out so even the manly-fighter Gus wouldn't wind up also being a formidable magic user; whenever you worked on some stats, others would actually go down. This was removed in the remakes, meaning one could just make ridiculously powerful and nearly identical characters with enough time.
* Used in ''ElderScrolls''. Also helps when it's a solo game and your character is pretty much a Game Breaker by the end anyhow. Many skills are leveled up this way.
** Quite frustrating in ''{{Morrowind}}'' was that you only made progress to leveling a skill on a ''successful'' use. Unless you want to spend half an hour swinging and missing a broadsword at a worm at your feet, nearly every non-Primary/Secondary skill on your character sheet required a small fortune in training before it would successfully go off once. I feel I should mention CrackIsCheaper, because skooma ''actually is''.
*** Also consider grinding spellcasting as a non-spellcaster. Your basic fireball has a laughable chance of success, costs a good chunk of your mana bar (whether it works or not), and the bar doesn't recharge until you rest. Maybe it was a good thing the alchemy was [[GoodBadBugs obscenely buggy and exploitable]].
*** To elaborate: While the game engine of Morrowind didn't allow for more than one dose of a particular potion to be effective at the same time, crafted potions worked slightly differently. The same potion made twive, with the same ingredients, didn't count as the same potion mechanically so long as it granted even slightly different bonuses. Since Alchemy was Intelligence-based, it was simply a matter of producing an Intelligence-boosting potion, drinking it, gaining the buff and repeating until you eventually produced potions with effect values in the millions and durations of in-game decades. As the whole process is exponential, this actually happened fairly quickly.
** ''{{Oblivion}}'' made this ''far'' less painful, as failed attempts at crafting counted toward skilling up, accuracy rolls in combat were removed altogether, and your mana bar recharged passively.
*** However, the skill points and attributes in ''Oblivion'' are handled in such a way that efficient grinding requires a lot of micromanagement.

* ''{{SaGa}}'' used this ''a lot'', although some games had different methods to give some diversity..
** ''FinalFantasyLegend'' only did this with mutants. Humans needed items, and monsters simply evolved into stronger monsters with fixed stat values.
** ''Final Fantasy Legend 2'' also did this, but humans could gain stats the same way Mutants did too. Monsters evolved the same way with the fixed-stat-values (and the inability to use weapons). But there was another class that leveled up a different way...robots. Robots would simply have their stats increased by equipment that is given to them, with the theory that it's added on as an upgrade.
*** There are also some potential Catch 22 situations, and when dealing with parties of robots and monsters mixed with humans and mutants, monsters and robots may be ordered to defend or do something useless so humans and mutants could be able to take the appropriate action to gain stats.

* Partially done in ''{{Disgaea}}'', which has regular level-ups, but also has a system by which spells become more powerful/cover more range the more you use them, and you become more proficient with a given weapon the more you use that.
** So, it makes ''{{Disgaea}}'' have THREE level grindings IN ONE. You go into item world and kill stuff there. You get exp for LevelGrinding, you get skills for StatGrinding and you are making the item you are in into an InfinityPlusOneSword.
* Special Abilities use this system in ''SoulNomadAndTheWorldEaters''.
* The first ''Digimon World'' had no levels. You raise your Digimon's stats by having them train at the gym, by feeding them chips, or by having them win battles. (Unfortunately it was a grind for levels.)
** The fact that your Digimon partner has a limited lifespan before needing to be recycled from scratch as a Baby level doesn't help, either.

* ''RuneFactory'' has this. Farming, taming, melee, magic, cooking, weapon crafting, clothes making...there's a stat for everything.
* ''WorldOfDarkness'' has a variation of this, where you choose which stats to boost to use your experience.
* In ''TheWorldEndsWithYou'', your stats do not increase except by eating food. Leveling up only affects your health. Pins also develop this way.
* ''PhantomBrave'' combines both LevelGrinding and Stat Grinding for both your characters and the items they can weild.

* WorldOfWarcraft uses the variety for trade skills and weapon levels. Weapon levels don't really take that long to level up (Since usually they will level up with characters) but if you have a much lower skill with a particular type of weapon it'll not only deal less damage but will hit much less than a weapon you're good at. (Despite how powerful it is.) Trade skills meanwhile can take a little while to level but there exist power-leveling guides for the gathering ones.

* Chaosium's Basic Role Playing system did this first with RuneQuest, and later in CallOfCthulhu, Elric!/Stormbringer, Superworld and others. It took a successful roll to become eligible for a chance at improvement, and then between sessions (one week) the roll was made to increase the skill. There was also the possibility of taking formal training for skills and characteristics, but in Superworld (a generic superhero RPG), a critical success, special success, or fumble with a characteristic allowed to improve the characteristic as well.

<<|VideoGameTropes|>>

* ''RFOnline'' has this as its entire basis. You still gain levels, yes, but these are mainly used to limit the maximum level of every stat, spell and HP available. Want to use those high level spells? Then you'll have to not only increase your Force level, but your [[WhiteMagic White]]/[[BlackMagic Dark]] Force level too. Its so prevalent that its not uncommon to see a player being mobbed by 30 monsters just to level his Shield stat.

* ''{{Pokemon}}'' has the [[ClassAndLevelSystem Species and Level System]], randomly-determined stats, and this in effect all at once. The first of these determines the bulk of your stats, while this trope is invoked in EV - the Pokemon gain points based not on the kind of damage they inflict or take, but what kind of Pokemon they knock out as well as augmentor items currently being held. Changes to EV only register at level-up, but you can build them for the Pokemon's lifetime - though it's kind of useless once you hit Lv100, and there's a total EV cap to boot.