History Main / SkillGateCharacters

10th Feb '18 3:07:56 PM MBG159
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*** Franchise/{{Kirby}} is considered practically unusable in high-level play, but his gimmicky, fun moveset appeals to and is generally easy to break down for new players.

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*** Franchise/{{Kirby}} is considered practically unusable in high-level play, but his gimmicky, fun moveset appeals to and is generally easy to break down for new players. In particular, inhaling an opponent and then spitting them out under the stage before floating to safety is a pretty classic newbie strategy - but for more advanced players, it's predictable as all get out, and being able to maneuver back onto the stage after something like that is pretty much the first thing you learn to do.
5th Feb '18 8:12:59 PM Sylian
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** Torbjorn: New Torb players can at least rely on his level 2 turret to harass the enemy team (which can now be constructed more quickly due to his faster hammer swing as of the Sombra patch) and throw armor packs on the floor due to him being able to passively generate scrap (added in the same patch). However, new players are often fixated on keeping the turret up at all costs (allowing an enemy team to pick off Torb easily), do not know maps well enough to position the turret to get the maximum effect, rarely ever fight with Torbjorn himself and use Molten Core only to save themselves or the turret. A veteran Torb will know where to place the turret and when to repair/redeploy it, will master Torb's rivet gun to increase his damage output and will know when to activate Molten Core to wipe or repel an entire enemy team.

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** Torbjorn: Torbjörn: New Torb Torbjörn players can at least rely on his level 2 turret to harass the enemy team (which can now be constructed more quickly due to his faster hammer swing as of the Sombra patch) and throw armor packs on the floor due to him being able to passively generate scrap (added in the same patch). However, new players are often fixated on keeping the turret up at all costs (allowing an enemy team to pick off Torb Torbjörn easily), do not know maps well enough to position the turret to get the maximum effect, rarely ever fight with Torbjorn Torbjörn himself and use Molten Core only to save themselves or the turret. A veteran Torb Torbjörn will know where to place the turret and when to repair/redeploy it, will master Torb's Torbjörn's rivet gun to increase his damage output and will know when to activate Molten Core to wipe or repel an entire enemy team.
5th Feb '18 4:57:35 PM onionmaster
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** Rock is this in Soul Edge , for example with his final weapon you can easily KO the opponent in two or three hits, but his speed is the lowest of all characters so faster players can easily attack before he finishes his move. This is the primary reason why his style was reworked from Soul Calibur onwards.
** The final boss Soul Edge (in Soul Edge / Blade) has a lot of powerful moves particularly his torpedo attack, which the CPU will frequently spam. However, he cannot execute this move when the player is crouching, and moves do more damage to him than to Cervantes - so it is quite easy to KO him provided you attack from a crouching. This flaw with crouching is generally common in the game, though not to quite this degree. It was phased out from Soul Calibur onwards.
31st Jan '18 7:52:51 AM Cryoclaste
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* The GearsOfWar series has the [[ShortRangeShotgun Gnasher Shotgun]] - and Gears of War 3 adds the [[UpToEleven Sawed-off]] variety. With the [[FragileSpeedster kinds of movement skill that are vital]] in Gears multiplayer, the only thing mitigating the point-and-shoot ease of shotguns is the fact that [[MirrorMatch everyone else has them, too]]. But when you move up to tournament levels of play, teamwork and co-ordination with [[BoringButPractical assault rifle fire]] and power weapon procurement will utterly [[CurbStompBattle destroy any teams]] that rely on wallbouncing into shotgun range to score kills.

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* The GearsOfWar ''VideoGame/GearsOfWar'' series has the [[ShortRangeShotgun Gnasher Shotgun]] - and Gears ''Gears of War 3 3'' adds the [[UpToEleven Sawed-off]] variety. With the [[FragileSpeedster kinds of movement skill that are vital]] in Gears ''Gears'' multiplayer, the only thing mitigating the point-and-shoot ease of shotguns is the fact that [[MirrorMatch everyone else has them, too]]. But when you move up to tournament levels of play, teamwork and co-ordination with [[BoringButPractical assault rifle fire]] and power weapon procurement will utterly [[CurbStompBattle destroy any teams]] that rely on wallbouncing into shotgun range to score kills.
29th Jan '18 8:25:33 AM MBG
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** The Engineer gets to be this way. On pub servers, a single Engineer camped on a Sentry gun with a Dispenser can be an obstacle insurmountable to the whole team because the sentry's aim is perfect and they tend to fight it one at a time. However, players can improve their effective damage by learning to aim better while the sentry's power is static, and players also learn how to either kill the Engineer or destroy the sentry fast enough that it can't be repaired in time. You'll be lucky if your fully upgraded sentry stops the enemy for more than a few seconds in a higher level of play.

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** The Engineer gets to be this way. On pub servers, a single Engineer camped on a Sentry gun with a Dispenser can be an obstacle insurmountable to the whole team because the sentry's aim is perfect and they tend to fight it one at a time. However, players can improve their effective damage by learning to aim better while the sentry's power is static, and players also learn how to either kill the Engineer or destroy the sentry fast enough that it can't be repaired in time. You'll be lucky if your fully upgraded sentry stops the enemy for more than a few seconds in a higher level of play. That said, the Engineer himself remains useful, though his role switches from an immovable object to a support role.
** Though the Medic himself is considered useful in any level of play, a specific case of this is the Quick-Fix medigun. It has a significantly buffed heal and charge rate over the standard medigun, at the cost of an Ubercharge that provides further-enhanced healing rather than invincibility, and lessened overheal. In casual play, you're likely to be the only Medic on your team, so you'll probably be focusing on keeping everyone on their feet rather than buffing up specific players, meaning that the overheal isn't a big deal, and your survivability is pretty low, so a frequent but weak Uber is a better option than a powerful one that you'll die before you can ever pull off. In a coordinated team, though, there'll probably be at least two medics and the team itself is probably better at staying alive rather than charging to their deaths, so the workload is a lot lower and they can afford to pocket, and they can rely on their team or their own skills to protect themselves, meaning the game-changing Ubercharge becomes quite feasible. This makes the stock Medigun preferable.
21st Jan '18 4:59:25 PM nombretomado
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** The pre-packaged decks WizardsOfTheCoast sells are generally skill gates in themselves: Competitive against each other, but will get crushed against tournament-level decks. But they are useful in teaching newer players how to modify their decks to win more (first tip: Buy two of the same pre-packaged decks and smoosh 'em together.)

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** The pre-packaged decks WizardsOfTheCoast Creator/WizardsOfTheCoast sells are generally skill gates in themselves: Competitive against each other, but will get crushed against tournament-level decks. But they are useful in teaching newer players how to modify their decks to win more (first tip: Buy two of the same pre-packaged decks and smoosh 'em together.)
6th Jan '18 4:00:15 AM darkknight109
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** Most beginner decks focus on a handful (sometimes just one or two) big, scary creatures that frequently have sky-high casting costs - while these could, in theory, be game-winners if they ever got on the table, speed is everything in ''Magic'' and more skilled players will frequently build their decks around weaker, but faster-to-cast cards that will ensure the game is over long before they have to worry about that Progenitus or Emrakul. While it is possible to build a deck around strong, high-cost creatures, it's generally regarded as one of the more difficult ways to win a high-level game as creatures are one of the most easy threats to defend against.


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* ''TabletopGame/Warhammer40000'' has several:
** A standard beginner tactic is to load up an army with lots of powerful, elite, high-cost units. While this strategy occasionally works at a tournament level ("Nidzilla" armies were built around taking a small number of incredibly scary monsters and using them to shred the opponent, and were an extremely potent list for a few years), more frequently this will result in a tiny army that simply doesn't have enough guns/close combat attacks to deal with a numerically superior force.
** Vanilla terminators were this for years. On the surface, they look like a fantastic unit - better guns than their tactical squad brethren, two S8 attacks in close combat that ignore armour saves, and a 2+/5++ armour save made them seem like a JackOfAllTrades unit that could do well anywhere on the board. Unfortunately, they cost a bomb (at 40 points per model, they were nearly 3x as expensive as a basic tactical marine, and a fully upgraded squad cost an eye-popping 500 points) and while their armour was great, they had the same T4/W1 defence as any other marine, so they were not nearly as invulnerable as they appeared on first blush. Add into this a lack of a dedicated transport (unless you spent ANOTHER 250+ points on a Land Raider variant) and you had a super-expensive unit that had trouble making its point costs back before an opponent could justifiably direct a significant amount of firepower at them. While Terminators were not impossible to use, their uses are significantly more limited than most beginners understood.
** Likewise, the Space Marine Dreadnought was basically a Terminator on steroids. Packing a Dreadnought close combat weapon (three S10 attacks in close combat that struck at initiative and ignored armour saves) and a (usually twin-linked) heavy weapon, the Dreadnought looked like a threat at range or in close. Unfortunately, their rate of fire was actually fairly unimpressive and they were horribly vulnerable to being tarpitted (three S10 attacks means that, statistically, you're probably only killing two enemies a turn - not particularly impressive if the enemy is tying you up with a unit where models are 6 points apiece). Like the Terminators they did have their uses, but few tournament-level Space Marine lists bothered with them as the points were generally more effectively spent elsewhere.
4th Jan '18 8:51:36 PM MurlocAggroB
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** As the game continues to add more heroes, a couple straight examples of this trope have popped up.
*** Despite being a Support, Kharazim is actually a really good introduction to Melee Assassins. Kills typically require three ingredients: an enemy out of position (either by allied crowd control or misplay), someone to whittle down most of that enemy's HP, and someone to finish off the last bit, confirming the kill. Melee Assassins are designed to provide the last part, featuring gap closers and good damage but lacking self-sustain and/or escape options. Kharazim can confirm kills and keep himself alive if you overextend, making him a forgiving hero to make mistakes on. By the time you get impatient with his [[CompetitiveBalance restricted damage output]], you'll already have a good sense of when his replacement Melee Assassin should or should not go in, something you may not learn if you just plunge straight in on, say, The Butcher.
*** Jaina is a great introduction to burst Mages. All of her skills apply Frostbite, which increases her ability damage on the target and slows their movement. This gives the player a lot of versatility in choosing how they open an engagement, and allows for powerful but open-ended ability sequencing. The slow also creates more leeway to hit abilities. By the time players have Jaina mastered, they'll be ready for safer, longer-ranged, more technical mages like Li-Ming or Kel'Thuzad.
*** The Butcher is a serious bully in low leagues, who uses his all-in dive and burst to rip apart poorly positioned players. Each kill he makes nets him Fresh Meat, which boosts his attack damage. Once the player learns better positioning however, it becomes easy to kite The Butcher and kill ''him'' instead, as he lacks any form of disengaging whatsoever. In the highest leagues, The Butcher is only taken by skilled players in very specific situations where they can capitalize with their team to farm meat and snowball.
2nd Jan '18 2:13:50 PM MBG159
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** Sentinel has (prior to being nerfed somewhat in a patch) ridiculously high health, great air speed to play keep-away, simple inputs, good damage, and multiple attacks that cover the whole screen. A new player can get pretty far by simply flying to the other side of the screen and spamming his projectiles. However, he's also quite predictable, he's a gigantic target, he's not too great in melee, and his attacks come out slowly. More experienced players, especially ones with small or rushdown characters, can easily close the gap and proceed to rip him apart.
10th Dec '17 5:38:19 AM Grudgeal
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** [[StoneWall Rampart]] lacks a dash move outside of his ultimate, instead using a giant portable wall that sets up a NoSell barrier in a single cardinal direction that protects both him and anyone behind him. He also ties for the highest HP in the game and his melee damage and YouWillNotEscapeMe move are both very potent for a frontliner, which makes him very very hard to kill and capable of defeating almost any other character in a 1v1 melee battle (this also gives him the lowest deaths-per-game rate in the game, at any level of play). Again, like Nix, he suffers from the fact that an experienced team can simply play around him, targeting his softer team-mates instead, and without a dash he can't close the gap or chase enemies like every other frontliner can and almost never sees high-level or tournament play as a result. He is also hard-countered by several characters who are popular in tournaments (most notably Blackburn, but also Phaedra and Gremolitions, inc.).

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** [[StoneWall Rampart]] lacks a dash move outside of his ultimate, instead using a giant portable wall that sets up a NoSell barrier in a single cardinal direction that protects both him and anyone behind him. He also ties for the highest HP in the game and his melee damage and YouWillNotEscapeMe YouWillNotEvadeMe move are both very potent for a frontliner, which makes him very very hard to kill and capable of defeating almost any other character in a 1v1 melee battle (this also gives him the lowest deaths-per-game rate in the game, at any level of play). Again, like Nix, he suffers from the fact that an experienced team can simply play around him, targeting his softer team-mates instead, and without a dash he can't close the gap or chase enemies like every other frontliner can and almost never sees high-level or tournament play as a result. He is also hard-countered by several characters who are popular in tournaments (most notably Blackburn, but also Phaedra and Gremolitions, inc.).
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