History Main / ReliablyUnreliableGuns

12th Jan '16 2:28:28 PM MrDeath
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** In the first book, this applies during the final confrontation. Harry disrupts the villainous warlock's huge spell, sending an overload of magical energy all over the place. The warlock's accomplices open fire with an Uzi that quickly jams, and Harry notes they're probably lucky it didn't explode. When they resume fire, it's with a revolver.
12th Jan '16 2:26:29 PM MrDeath
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The "tae bo" thing was him telling the clerk what to tell the cops — that she beat them up.
* Played with in the ''Film/MarvelOneShot'' short film ''A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to Thor's Hammer.'' Agent Coulson, in a convenience store during a robbery, lets the crooks know that he has a gun. When they want him to toss it over, he remarks he'd rather not and risk it going off, so he asks if it would be ok to slide it to them. As the guys agree, [[spoiler:he takes them out using a bag of flour and moves he learned on "Tae-bo" tapes. All this in the time it takes to fill-up his car at the pumps.]]
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* Played with in the ''Film/MarvelOneShot'' short film ''A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to Thor's Hammer.'' Agent Coulson, in a convenience store during a robbery, lets the crooks know that he has a gun. When they want him to toss it over, he remarks he'd rather not and risk it going off, so he asks if it would be ok to slide it to them. As the guys agree, [[spoiler:he takes them out using a bag of flour and moves he learned on "Tae-bo" tapes.flour. All this in the time it takes to fill-up his car at the pumps.]]
10th Jan '16 1:37:46 PM maxwellsilver
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* Standard doctrine is to always, always treat the gun as loaded and to handle with incredible care to avoid this trope, no matter how reliable your gun is, just to avert the whole 'gun going off for no damn reason' side of this trope. Then, treat the weapon as if it ''will'' go off for no damn reason anyway and make sure it's always pointed away from anyone or anything you don't want holed. Gun safety rules are big on "belt and suspenders" thinking; nobody wants to be responsible for the tiniest accident that ends up killing another person, after all. ** It's important to note that accidental discharges (mechanical failure) are different from negligent discharges (operator carelessness). Accidental discharges are very rare and can be minimized near to the point of elimination with good maintenance and stringent obedience of [[UsefulNotes/GunSafety gun safety rules]], but regardless of what so-called "experts" say, when ''all'' these rules are observed and followed, negligent discharges '''will not happen''', nor will injuries and/or deaths from accidental ones; that's why the rules are there in the first place. * In real life, almost all weapon reliability issues stem from either magazines or ammunition. Using factory-loaded ammunition, military magazines, and regularly cleaning and lubricating the weapon will typically make malfunctions quite scarce. * Colonel William Fairbairn, armed combat instructor for U.S. and British special forces during World War II, was an advocate of the semi-automatic pistol, but placed no faith in safeties. In his books on the subject, he recommends carrying the pistol with an empty chamber, and training to rack the slide as part of the draw action. Time permitting, he also advises cutting off the trigger guard and disabling the safeties, which makes the gun faster to use by making it Shur-Fine for anyone who doesn't follow Fairbairn's system. In modern times, racking-while-drawing is known as the "Israeli draw", because leading up to the 1948 war, the incipient IDF's arsenal was made up of so many different weapons of varying designs and reliabilities that this was the only safe way to train soldiers who might have to use an unfamiliar weapon. ** It should be noted that with most 1911-style pistols, with which a variant of this is a somewhat popular method of carrying[[note]]that is, chamber a bullet and then lower the hammer, as it's single-action[[/note]], chambering a single specific cartridge multiple times can seat the bullet further into the casing than it should, which can cause dangerous pressure failures if that round is actually fired without reseating the bullet.
3rd Jan '16 4:46:03 AM maxwellsilver
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** Also of note, some older military surplus weapons [[BreakOutTheMuseumPiece (milsurps)]] may be filled with cosmoline, which is used to preserve firearms for storage. In order to remove cosmoline, disassemble the gun and give it a bath in mineral spirits -- acetone and WD-40 work too.

** The Remington Model 700 rifle has a reputation for having a highly questionable safety mechanism, which is infamous for either causing the gun to randomly fire, or for not doing anything to keep the gun from firing. The trigger mechanism used on the rifle from its original design to about 2007 also had gained a bit of a reputation for causing the weapon to discharge on its own, though Remington has dismissed these claims, instead blaming negligent users for not properly maintaining their weapons and [[IJustShotMarvinInTheFace pointing them directly at other people]] for extreme lengths of time, even pointing out that some of the claimants admitted to police that they "may have accidentally" pulled the trigger themselves; military rifles based on the Model 700's action, in use by people who have received proper training on how to handle the weapon, continue to use the original trigger mechanism[[note]]though this isn't in itself a point for reliability; militaries, especially that of the US, will typically stay with a weapon that has a known issue but otherwise still works as intended simply because any more reliable replacement would cost more[[/note]], and it is also still available for custom orders, which most definitely would ''not'' be the case if there were dangerous reliability issues inherent in its design.
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** The Remington Model 700 rifle has a reputation for having a highly questionable safety mechanism, which is infamous for either causing the gun to randomly fire, or for not doing anything to keep the gun from firing. The trigger mechanism used on the rifle from its original design to about 2007 also had gained a bit of a reputation for causing the weapon to discharge on its own, though Remington has dismissed these claims, instead blaming negligent users for not properly maintaining their weapons and [[IJustShotMarvinInTheFace pointing them directly at other people]] people for extreme lengths of time, even pointing out that some of the claimants admitted to police that they "may have accidentally" pulled the trigger themselves; military rifles based on the Model 700's action, in use by people who have received proper training on how to handle the weapon, continue to use the original trigger mechanism[[note]]though this isn't in itself a point for reliability; militaries, especially that of the US, will typically stay with a weapon that has a known issue but otherwise still works as intended simply because any more reliable replacement would cost more[[/note]], mechanism, and it is also still available for custom orders, which most definitely would ''not'' be the case if there were dangerous reliability issues inherent in its design.

* A less famous, but no less awful example of light machine gun design was the Italian [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breda_30 Breda 30]] which saw service in World War 2. Its [[http://www.forgottenweapons.com/light-machine-guns/breda-model-30/ numerous design faults]] teamed up to make it an ''extremely'' unreliable weapon, especially in the desert conditions of North Africa. The gun attempted to use a blowback system of operation to reduce complexity, but using simple blowback for a high pressure rifle round required the rounds to be '''oiled''' to prevent them from being ripped apart during extraction. This didn't always work, leaving the front part of spent casings hopelessly jammed in the chamber, plus the oil attracted dirt into the working areas of the weapon, causing another type of jam. Furthermore the gun used the same bad idea as the Chauchat with an open magazine that invited even ''more'' dirt into the operating mechanism. ''[[FromBadtoWorse Furthermore]]'' the closed bolt design reduced air circulation and also put rounds in the chamber at risk of cooking off which could injure or ''kill'' the gunner. Oh, and the magazine was non-detachable, making use of special 20 round strips to reload it which had the effect of drastically slowing the rate of fire. So even when the gun actually managed to fire one would wind up spending most of their time reloading it.
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* A less famous, but no less awful example of light machine gun design was the Italian [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breda_30 Breda 30]] which saw service in World War 2. Its [[http://www.forgottenweapons.com/light-machine-guns/breda-model-30/ numerous design faults]] teamed up to make it an ''extremely'' unreliable weapon, especially in the desert conditions of North Africa. The gun attempted to use a blowback system of operation to reduce complexity, but using simple blowback for a high pressure rifle round required the rounds to be '''oiled''' to prevent them from being ripped apart during extraction. This didn't always work, leaving the front part of spent casings hopelessly jammed in the chamber, plus the oil attracted dirt into the working areas of the weapon, causing another type of jam. Furthermore the gun used the same bad idea as the Chauchat with an open magazine that invited even ''more'' dirt into the operating mechanism. ''[[FromBadtoWorse Furthermore]]'' ''Furthermore'' the closed bolt design reduced air circulation and also put rounds in the chamber at risk of cooking off which could injure or ''kill'' the gunner. Oh, and the magazine was non-detachable, making use of special 20 round strips to reload it which had the effect of drastically slowing the rate of fire. So even when the gun actually managed to fire one would wind up spending most of their time reloading it.
1st Jan '16 9:21:48 PM maxwellsilver
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Cleaned up as per this thread.
** Also of note, some older military surplus weapons [[BreakOutTheMuseumPiece (milsurps)]] may be filled with cosmoline, which is used to preserve firearms for storage. In order to remove cosmoline, disassemble the gun and give it a bath in paint thinner (also called mineral spirits - acetone and WD-40 work too.) * RealLife example: The infamous North Hollywood Shootout. Two bank robbers did a job armed to the teeth with modified AKM rifles and full kevlar suits to protect them. One of them was cornered into a one on one with an officer when his assault rifle jammed due to a stovepiped cartridge. Ordinarily, this would have taken only a moment to fix, but the robber had earlier been shot in the wrist, rendering him incapable of clearing the jam[[note]]not that he couldn't have used his wrist or arm to do it, or held the rifle up with that arm to use his good hand for the job; it's likely he was too preoccupied with the whole "oh fuck I've been shot" bit to consider that[[/note]]. After his attempt to clear the jam failed, he threw the assault rifle to the side and pulled out a 9mm pistol he had as a sidearm to continue shooting; when [[BlastingItOutOfTheirHands he took another round to his good hand]], he picked the pistol back up, placed it to his chin, and shot himself.
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** Also of note, some older military surplus weapons [[BreakOutTheMuseumPiece (milsurps)]] may be filled with cosmoline, which is used to preserve firearms for storage. In order to remove cosmoline, disassemble the gun and give it a bath in paint thinner (also called mineral spirits - -- acetone and WD-40 work too.) too. * Colonel William Fairbairn, armed combat instructor for U.S. and British special forces during World War II, was an advocate of the semi-automatic pistol, but placed no faith in safeties. In his books on the subject, he recommends carrying the pistol with an empty chamber, and training to rack the slide as part of the draw action. Time permitting, he also advises cutting off the trigger guard and disabling the safeties, which makes the gun faster to use by making it Shur-Fine for anyone who doesn't follow Fairbairn's system. In modern times, racking-while-drawing is known as the "Israeli draw", because leading up to the 1948 war, the incipient IDF's arsenal was made up of so many different weapons of varying designs and reliabilities that this was the only safe way to train soldiers who might have to use an unfamiliar weapon. ** It should be noted that with most 1911-style pistols, with which a variant of this is a somewhat popular method of carrying[[note]]that is, chamber a bullet and then lower the hammer, as it's single-action[[/note]], chambering a single specific cartridge multiple times can seat the bullet further into the casing than it should, which can cause dangerous pressure failures if that round is actually fired without reseating the bullet. * RealLife example: The infamous North Hollywood Shootout. Two bank robbers did a job armed to the teeth with modified AKM rifles and full kevlar suits to protect them. One of them was cornered into a one on one with an officer when his assault rifle jammed due to a stovepiped cartridge. Ordinarily, this would have taken only a moment to fix, but the robber had earlier been shot in the wrist, rendering him incapable of clearing the jam[[note]]not jam [[note]]not that he couldn't have used his wrist or arm to do it, or held the rifle up with that arm to use his good hand for the job; it's likely he was too preoccupied with the whole "oh fuck I've been shot" bit to consider that[[/note]]. After his attempt to clear the jam failed, he threw the assault rifle to the side and pulled out a 9mm pistol he had as a sidearm to continue shooting; when [[BlastingItOutOfTheirHands he took another round to his good hand]], he picked the pistol back up, placed it to his chin, and shot himself.

* The Chauchat "Machine rifle" was the first squad automatic weapon and the most widely-produced automatic weapon in UsefulNotes/WorldWarI. It introduced a number of features seen on modern long guns, including a pistol grip, an in-line stock, a fire rate selector, and stamped steel components to simplify production. As with many pioneering designs the weapon also had several design faults, including a relatively complicated feed path necessitated by the heavily tapered case of the standard French 8mm Lebel cartridge (an issue that would plague all French efforts at automatic weapons until the modern straight-cased 7.5x54mm was introduced in 1929), and the use of long recoil operation. There were also production issues stemming from the traditional arms manufacturers being fully utilized to make traditional arms, therefore Chauchat production was given to less experienced and non-firearms-related firms that resulted in quality control and other manufacturing problems, including poorly aligned sights, which were so common that it was nearly impossible to exchange parts between any two Chauchats. The major issue that was responsible for 75% of all stoppages were the open sided magazines which would inevitably become clogged with dirt and debris. Overheating was the second leading cause of problems with thermal expansion jamming the gun. Despite its generally lackluster performance it was still the only/best option available and saw extensive service by the French and 8 other nations during the war and beyond. The Chauchat only earned its RockBottom reputation when the Americans entered the war and were issued Chauchats that were [[FromBadToWorse hastily designed]] to take the significantly more powerful .30-06 cartridge. The gun had trouble extracting the long, straight cases and was hardly up to the stresses of the powerful round. To make matters ''even worse'', somebody managed to screw up the conversion between English (US) and metric (French) units, so the magazine and chamber for the .30-06 version were the ''wrong size'' (this error wasn't even realized at the time; it wasn't until private testing decades later that it was discovered, hence the error never having been corrected). It was so poor that it was used only as a training weapon, and virtually all of them were destroyed after the war. US troops were then issued 8mm Lebel-chambered Chauchats, which were considered better than no light machine gun at all (but only marginally so[[note]]One of the saddest things about this is that, by the time America entered the war, they had access to the vastly-better Lewis gun and Browning Automatic Rifle - the USMC even had Lewis guns on hand when they were deployed - but [[ExecutiveMeddling were forced into using the Chauchat anyway]]. The Lewis gun was overlooked [[InterserviceRivalry simply because the AEF's chief of ordnance didn't like Colonel Lewis]], while the BAR wasn't issued due to fear that it would fall into enemy hands.[[/note]]).
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* The Chauchat "Machine rifle" was the first squad automatic weapon and the most widely-produced automatic weapon in UsefulNotes/WorldWarI. It introduced a number of features seen on modern long guns, including a pistol grip, an in-line stock, a fire rate selector, and stamped steel components to simplify production. As with many pioneering designs the weapon also had several design faults, including a relatively complicated feed path necessitated by the heavily tapered case of the standard French 8mm Lebel cartridge (an issue that would plague all French efforts at automatic weapons until the modern straight-cased 7.5x54mm was introduced in 1929), and the use of long recoil operation. There were also production issues stemming from the traditional arms manufacturers being fully utilized to make traditional arms, therefore Chauchat production was given to less experienced and non-firearms-related firms that resulted in quality control and other manufacturing problems, including poorly aligned sights, which were so common that it was nearly impossible to exchange parts between any two Chauchats. The major issue that was responsible for 75% of all stoppages were the open sided magazines which would inevitably become clogged with dirt and debris. Overheating was the second leading cause of problems with thermal expansion jamming the gun. Despite its generally lackluster performance it was still the only/best option available and saw extensive service by the French and 8 other nations during the war and beyond. The Chauchat only earned its RockBottom reputation when the Americans entered the war and were issued Chauchats that were [[FromBadToWorse hastily designed]] to take the significantly more powerful .30-06 cartridge. The gun had trouble extracting the long, straight cases and was hardly up to the stresses of the powerful round. To make matters ''even worse'', somebody managed to screw up the conversion between English (US) and metric (French) units, so the magazine and chamber for the .30-06 version were the ''wrong size'' (this error wasn't even realized at the time; it wasn't until private testing decades later that it was discovered, hence the error never having been corrected). It was so poor that it was used only as a training weapon, and virtually all of them were destroyed after the war. US troops were then issued 8mm Lebel-chambered Chauchats, which were considered better than no light machine gun at all (but only marginally so[[note]]One of the saddest things about this is that, by the time America entered the war, they had access to the vastly-better Lewis gun and Browning Automatic Rifle - the USMC even had Lewis guns on hand when they were deployed - but [[ExecutiveMeddling were forced into using the Chauchat anyway]].anyway. The Lewis gun was overlooked [[InterserviceRivalry simply because the AEF's chief of ordnance didn't like Colonel Lewis]], while the BAR wasn't issued due to fear that it would fall into enemy hands.[[/note]]).

** Post-war analysis showed that around half the Chauchats used in combat were dropped as useless by their operator before they could fire off an entire magazine; it wasn't uncommon for American auto-rifle squadrons equipped with them to give up on that and switch to far more usable bolt-action M1903 Springfields instead. It jammed often and easily due to the above mentioned reasons, and the only way to unjam it was complete dis and reassembly -- less than recommended in the heat of battle in no-man's-land. One may as well have charged into that trench with nothing but a knife[[note]]which some trench raiders basically did - a [[ShovelStrike sharpened entrenching tool]] and a pistol beat the Chauchat in that situation[[/note]], because it would likely outperform the Chauchat when it turned into an overly-elaborate and cumbersome metal club.
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** Post-war analysis showed that around half the Chauchats used in combat were dropped as useless by their operator before they could fire off an entire magazine; it wasn't uncommon for American auto-rifle squadrons equipped with them to give up on that and switch to far more usable bolt-action M1903 Springfields instead. It jammed often and easily due to the above mentioned reasons, and the only way to unjam it was complete dis and reassembly -- less than recommended in the heat of battle in no-man's-land. One may as well have charged into that trench with nothing but a knife[[note]]which some trench raiders basically did - a [[ShovelStrike sharpened entrenching tool]] and a pistol beat the Chauchat in that situation[[/note]], because it would likely outperform the Chauchat when it turned into an overly-elaborate and cumbersome metal club.

*** [[ImNotADoctorButIPlayOneOnTV Non-television firearms experts]] have [[http://www.forgottenweapons.com/the-worst-gun-ever/ conducted analyses]] and found that the Chauchat's poor reputation is largely undeserved, aside from the .30-06 conversion and poor open-sided magazine design. It is, however, well-documented that the Chauchats manufactured by Gladiator, a bicycle company with no prior firearms experience, tended to have manufacturing errors (including the aforementioned misaligned sights) that were not present on those made by SIDARME. Unfortunately, SIDARME accounted for less than 10% of the production, meaning that most Chauchat gunners had to either learn to manually compensate for the typically misaligned Gladiator sights, or if they were mechanically inclined enough implement their own field repairs to correct them.
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*** [[ImNotADoctorButIPlayOneOnTV Non-television firearms experts]] experts have [[http://www.forgottenweapons.com/the-worst-gun-ever/ conducted analyses]] and found that the Chauchat's poor reputation is largely undeserved, aside from the .30-06 conversion and poor open-sided magazine design. It is, however, well-documented that the Chauchats manufactured by Gladiator, a bicycle company with no prior firearms experience, tended to have manufacturing errors (including the aforementioned misaligned sights) that were not present on those made by SIDARME. Unfortunately, SIDARME accounted for less than 10% of the production, meaning that most Chauchat gunners had to either learn to manually compensate for the typically misaligned Gladiator sights, or if they were mechanically inclined enough implement their own field repairs to correct them.

*** Also {{Subverted}} by the [[http://www.forgottenweapons.com/medium-machine-guns/perino/ Perino Modello 1908 machine gun]], a contemporary of the Fiat-Revelli prototype that was reliable as the famous Vickers machine gun (kept in service until 1968 because it was just that good) and having a variant of the clip mechanism ''superior to the ammo belt'' (the clips were in an open box that obtained similar results to the belt, but a soldier would be able to place new clips on its top to keep continuous fire while the belt would have to be changed but was faster to change once empty, and the spent cases would be replaced in the clip and ejected with it, avoiding to get the spent clips underfoot or hitting troops and allowing an easier recover of the clips for reloading. On the other hand, it was heavier), with the only issue, excessive weight, being solved by the inventor himself. So, why the hell was it not mass-produced beyond the initial 150 weapons commission and adopted? [[ScrewTheRulesIMakeThem Because engineer Revelli (inventor of the other machine gun) was on the commission to decide if production of the Perino would continue,]] [[ScrewTheRulesIHaveConnections and the opinion of the rest of the commission was swayed by the Fiat company's political power]]. * The Enfield L85 (better known as the [=SA80=]) was basically Britain's way of telling the United States that when it came to the design of infantry weapons, "anything you can screw up, we can screw up bigger"; the design itself was fairly sound, albeit rather maintenance-intensive and complicated to disassemble, but had to be built to extremely fine tolerances. Unfortunately, the initial in-service version was the last project undertaken by the Royal Small Arms Factory, whose workers had recently learned they were all going to be laid off. [[TheyJustDidntCare The reader can doubtless imagine the effect this had on their workmanship.]] A report listed 50 issues inherent to the system, including spontaneous malfunctions, firing pin breakage, safety breakages, and magazines spontaneously dropping. This is what happens when a country forces through a new assault rifle just for the hell of it. Heckler & Koch managed to (mostly) salvage the design in the upgrade to the A2 standard, though the light support weapon variation is still not seeing much use at all except as a rarely-used DMR (its initial role is instead being fulfilled by the [=L110A1=]).
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*** Also {{Subverted}} by the [[http://www.forgottenweapons.com/medium-machine-guns/perino/ Perino Modello 1908 machine gun]], a contemporary of the Fiat-Revelli prototype that was reliable as the famous Vickers machine gun (kept in service until 1968 because it was just that good) and having a variant of the clip mechanism ''superior superior to the ammo belt'' belt (the clips were in an open box that obtained similar results to the belt, but a soldier would be able to place new clips on its top to keep continuous fire while the belt would have to be changed but was faster to change once empty, and the spent cases would be replaced in the clip and ejected with it, avoiding to get the spent clips underfoot or hitting troops and allowing an easier recover of the clips for reloading. On the other hand, it was heavier), with the only issue, excessive weight, being solved by the inventor himself. So, why the hell was it not mass-produced beyond the initial 150 weapons commission and adopted? [[ScrewTheRulesIMakeThem Because engineer Revelli (inventor of the other machine gun) was on the commission to decide if production of the Perino would continue,]] [[ScrewTheRulesIHaveConnections and the opinion of the rest of the commission was swayed by the Fiat company's political power]]. power. * The Enfield L85 (better known as the [=SA80=]) was basically Britain's way of telling the United States that when it came to the design of infantry weapons, "anything you can screw up, we can screw up bigger"; the design itself was fairly sound, albeit rather maintenance-intensive and complicated to disassemble, but had to be built to extremely fine tolerances. Unfortunately, the initial in-service version was the last project undertaken by the Royal Small Arms Factory, whose workers had recently learned they were all going to be laid off. [[TheyJustDidntCare The reader can doubtless imagine the effect this had on their workmanship.]] workmanship. A report listed 50 issues inherent to the system, including spontaneous malfunctions, firing pin breakage, safety breakages, and magazines spontaneously dropping. This is what happens when a country forces through a new assault rifle just for the hell of it. Heckler & Koch managed to (mostly) salvage the design in the upgrade to the A2 standard, though the light support weapon variation is still not seeing much use at all except as a rarely-used DMR (its initial role is instead being fulfilled by the [=L110A1=]).

** Most sources mention the biggest issue with the Sten wasn't the mechanism, but rather the magazines (which were the same magazines used by the [=MP40=], used by Britain's ''principal enemy'' at the time). Indeed, the [=MP40=]'s magazines were prone to spring failure when fully-loaded with 32 rounds, though most soldiers got around that by only loading 28 or 30 instead. Another problem is that the Sten fed from the side, rather than from beneath like the [=MP40=] (and by extension, like the magazines were actually designed for).
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** Most sources mention the biggest issue with the Sten wasn't the mechanism, but rather the magazines (which were the same magazines used by the [=MP40=], used by Britain's ''principal enemy'' at the time).[=MP40=]). Indeed, the [=MP40=]'s magazines were prone to spring failure when fully-loaded with 32 rounds, though most soldiers got around that by only loading 28 or 30 instead. Another problem is that the Sten fed from the side, rather than from beneath like the [=MP40=] (and by extension, like the magazines were actually designed for).

** The Lanchester SMG was a British copy of the German [=MP28=] SMG (an evolution of the WW1 [=MP18=]), that was introduced during the aformentioned desperate rearmament period following Dunkirk. While it was a robust and well made weapon, it did have an unfortunate tendency to fire off bursts whenever the butt was given a hard knock while it was cocked and loaded. This was due to the way the blowback action was designed (open bolt with large mainspring holding the bolt under tension), not due to manufacturing errors.
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** The Lanchester SMG was a British copy of the German [=MP28=] SMG (an evolution of the WW1 [=MP18=]), that was introduced during the aformentioned aforementioned desperate rearmament period following Dunkirk. While it was a robust and well made weapon, it did have an unfortunate tendency to fire off bursts whenever the butt was given a hard knock while it was cocked and loaded. This was due to the way the blowback action was designed (open bolt with large mainspring holding the bolt under tension), not due to manufacturing errors.

** Contrary to the above, the Japanese actually did produce a quality machine gun. The Type 96 and the later updated 99 LMG (based off the Czechoslovakian ZB vz 26, an influential LMG at the time that inspired the excellent Bren LMG as well) was a notoriously feared weapon on the battlefield, particularly for its accuracy. A skilled operator could lay down a deadly field of fire from a concealed position (especially on Iwo Jima where a number of them made short work of a fire team or two). A special 2.5X telescopic site was sometimes attached to create essentially an ''automatic sniper rifle''. Unfortunately for the Japanese, they were never fielded in a substantial enough quantity to make a difference in a battle, and because both weapons required vastly different cartridges to operate[[note]]Imperial Japan utilized ''four'' different 7.7mm cartridges, none of which could interchange with each other. That's in addition to still using the older 6.5mm rifle/light machine gun round.[[/note]], made logistics a nightmare. Additionally, even the Type 96 had its own problems with frequent jamming from fired cases getting stuck in the chamber; attempts to rectify this via oiling the rounds, similar to some of the Italian machine guns referred to above, simply worsened the problem by attracting sand and dirt into the chamber, leading to the removal of that feature for the Type 99. * UsefulNotes/{{The Vietnam|War}}-era original M16 assault rifle was infamous for jamming at inopportune times, to the point that soldiers grabbed AK-47s off dead Vietcong when they got the chance, even when ordered not to. There is a litany of reasons known for the problems, primarily bad design decisions, most notably using a direct impingement gas system, not chroming the chamber or bore, having very narrow clearances (clearances = space between parts -- tolerances = acceptable size and weight variations for parts), having an excessively complicated bolt design, using a spring-loaded extractor, and lacking any way of clearing malfunctions other than by disassembly of the rifle (there's a story quoted on Wiki/{{Wikipedia}} of a Marine Corps platoon armed with the initial model that lost 53 of their 72 men in one firefight; when they went back to check the dead, almost every single one of them had their rifles disassembled from trying to fix a jam). Not only these, but also some intentional sabotage by the Army Ordnance Board, who wanted to go back to the M14 (itself not a bad design, but being heavy enough for someone to struggle just to carry it, but not enough to dampen the recoil of a battle rifle round being fired in full-auto, [[MasterOfNone it was not suited to replace the entire WWII-era arsenal as the military had hoped]]), a lack of cleaning kits, and errant claims that the gun "cleaned itself" (it didn't - in fact, due to the aforementioned direct impingement system, the gun more or less made itself far, far messier by ejecting debris ''into'' the chamber). The cleaning kit issues were fixed relatively quickly, and the improved [=M16A1=] was introduced in 1967. While the worst of the reliability problems were mostly over with, with the exceptions of the chamber and bore now being chromed, and there being a way to clear the weapon without complete dissassembly, many of the fundamental design flaws still persist to this day. [[http://madogre.com/?p=174 These are the words of a U.S. infantryman on why the M16, and by extension, all AR-family weapons are fundamentally deeply flawed.]] ** The M4, which is the modern carbine based off of the M16, is actually even less reliable than its big brother, especially when accessories are added. Reliability issues still persist with the entire AR family. They are mostly encountered in military settings, given the harsh demands that war places upon them. They can generally endure rather nasty "torture tests", but accumulated strain and abuse will cause failures at some point, even with fairly mild usage. *** The original M4's burst-fire trigger mechanism has an issue where the trigger pull in semi-auto can vary depending on the ''exact'' positioning of the selector lever, thus decreasing accuracy due to throwing off the shooter's expectation for the trigger pull. The full-auto mechanism from the [=M4A1=] does not have this issue, and as such, the US Army has begun converting all M4's to [=M4A1=]'s as of 2014. ** The extremely-similar [=HK416=] has a tendency to be unreliable in cold weather (such as the charging handle becoming stuck), thanks to the addition of a gas piston to a design that was not meant to have any solid parts within its gas system, which creates a new slew of problems. Ironically, the reason for the gas piston system was to make the gun ''less'' prone to jamming in dust-prone environments, especially deserts. ** The Barrett M468, meanwhile, had the opposite problem - it continued to use the M16's direct-impingement system, but only managed to exacerbate the problems associated with it due to its heavier chambering for the 6.8mm SPC cartridge. The later [=REC7=] is both piston-driven instead, so as to make using 6.8mm bullets with it actually viable, and also convertible to 5.56mm.
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** Contrary to the above, the Japanese actually did produce a quality machine gun. The Type 96 and the later updated 99 LMG (based off the Czechoslovakian ZB vz 26, an influential LMG at the time that inspired the excellent Bren LMG as well) was a notoriously feared weapon on the battlefield, particularly for its accuracy. A skilled operator could lay down a deadly field of fire from a concealed position (especially on Iwo Jima where a number of them made short work of a fire team or two). A special 2.5X telescopic site sight was sometimes attached to create essentially an ''automatic sniper rifle''. Unfortunately for the Japanese, they were never fielded in a substantial enough quantity to make a difference in a battle, and because both weapons required vastly different cartridges to operate[[note]]Imperial Japan utilized ''four'' different 7.7mm cartridges, none of which could interchange with each other. That's in addition to still using the older 6.5mm rifle/light machine gun round.[[/note]], made logistics a nightmare. Additionally, even the Type 96 had its own problems with frequent jamming from fired cases getting stuck in the chamber; attempts to rectify this via oiling the rounds, similar to some of the Italian machine guns referred to above, simply worsened the problem by attracting sand and dirt into the chamber, leading to the removal of that feature for the Type 99. * UsefulNotes/{{The Vietnam|War}}-era original M16 assault rifle was infamous for jamming at inopportune times, to the point that soldiers grabbed AK-47s off dead Vietcong when they got the chance, even when ordered not to. There is a litany of reasons known for the problems, primarily bad design decisions, most notably using a direct impingement gas system, not chroming the chamber or bore, having very narrow clearances (clearances = space between parts -- tolerances = acceptable size and weight variations for parts), having an excessively complicated bolt design, using a spring-loaded extractor, and lacking any way of clearing malfunctions other than by disassembly of the rifle (there's a story quoted on Wiki/{{Wikipedia}} of a Marine Corps platoon armed with the initial model that lost 53 of their 72 men in one firefight; when they went back to check the dead, almost every single one of them had their rifles disassembled from trying to fix a jam). Not only these, but also some intentional sabotage by the Army Ordnance Board, who wanted to go back to the M14 (itself not a bad design, but being heavy enough for someone to struggle just to carry it, but not enough to dampen the recoil of a battle rifle round being fired in full-auto, [[MasterOfNone it was not suited to replace the entire WWII-era arsenal as the military had hoped]]), a lack of cleaning kits, and errant claims that the gun "cleaned itself" (it didn't - in fact, due to the aforementioned direct impingement system, the gun more or less made itself far, far messier by ejecting debris ''into'' the chamber). The cleaning kit issues were fixed relatively quickly, and the improved [=M16A1=] was introduced in 1967. While the worst of the reliability problems were mostly over with, with the exceptions of the chamber and bore now being chromed, and there being a way to clear the weapon without complete dissassembly, many of the fundamental design flaws still persist to this day. [[http://madogre.com/?p=174 These are the words of a U.S. infantryman on why the M16, and by extension, all AR-family weapons are fundamentally deeply flawed.]] ** The M4, which is the modern carbine based off of the M16, is actually even less reliable than its big brother, especially when accessories are added. Reliability issues still persist with the entire AR family. They are mostly encountered in military settings, given the harsh demands that war places upon them. They can generally endure rather nasty "torture tests", but accumulated strain and abuse will cause failures at some point, even with fairly mild usage. *** The original M4's burst-fire trigger mechanism has an issue where the trigger pull in semi-auto can vary depending on the ''exact'' positioning of the selector lever, thus decreasing accuracy due to throwing off the shooter's expectation for the trigger pull. The full-auto mechanism from the [=M4A1=] does not have this issue, and as such, the US Army has begun converting all M4's to [=M4A1=]'s as of 2014. ** The extremely-similar [=HK416=] has a tendency to be unreliable in cold weather (such as the charging handle becoming stuck), thanks to the addition of a gas piston to a design that was not meant to have any solid parts within its gas system, which creates a new slew of problems. Ironically, the reason for the gas piston system was to make the gun ''less'' prone to jamming in dust-prone environments, especially deserts. ** The Barrett M468, meanwhile, had the opposite problem - it continued to use the M16's direct-impingement system, but only managed to exacerbate the problems associated with it due to its heavier chambering for the 6.8mm SPC cartridge. The later [=REC7=] is both piston-driven instead, so as to make using 6.8mm bullets with it actually viable, and also convertible to 5.56mm.99.

* In the Old West, experienced horsemen would only load five rounds into their single-action revolvers and have the hammer resting on the empty chamber. That was because while tightening the cinch on their horse's saddle, they would hook the stirrup over the saddle horn. If the stirrup came loose it could fall back into place and strike the pistol's hammer, causing it to discharge if there was a loaded round in the chamber. This defect in single-action revolvers was not completely corrected until the Ruger New Model Blackhawk revolver came on the market in 1973. Despite the fact that it was certainly known ''how'' to correct this flaw much earlier, since double-action revolvers had since the 1890s included a transfer bar, nobody had bothered to implement it in the single-action designs. Even today, many modern reproductions of the Old West revolvers exclude the transfer bar in order to be completely faithful to the original designs. ** There's a story that during his early days, Wyatt Earp once nearly shot himself by mishandling a single action revolver. Back then, handguns definitely were reliably unreliable. ** "Load one, skip one, load four" was a common mantra of the Old West when it came to loading your gun, for just that reason. ** Another story has Billy the Kid use this to get the drop on a bounty hunter. Billy, his identity unknown to the bounty hunter, was [[GoKartingWithBowser playing cards with the guy]]. He asked to see the guy's gun and offered his own just to show he wasn't going to try and rob him. Carefully setting the cylinder back one space, he gives it back. After a few minutes he told him who he was. They both drew and fired, with the bounty hunter firing on the empty chamber. ** In the days of cap-and-ball revolvers, Remington implemented a way to safely carry their New Model Army with all 6 chambers loaded by milling groves ''between'' the chambers that the firing pin could be rested on, and thus the hammer being forced down wouldn't land it on one of the percussion caps. Nobody, not even Remington, did this on the later cartridge-firing single-action revolvers, for whatever reason. * Colonel William Fairbairn, armed combat instructor for U.S. and British special forces during World War II, was an advocate of the semi-automatic pistol, but placed no faith in safeties. In his books on the subject, he recommends carrying the pistol with an empty chamber, and training to rack the slide as part of the draw action. Time permitting, he also advises cutting off the trigger guard and disabling the safeties, which makes the gun faster to use by making it Shur-Fine for anyone who doesn't follow Fairbairn's system. ** In modern times, racking-while-drawing is known as the "Israeli draw", because leading up to the 1948 war, the incipient [[IsraelisWithInfraredMissiles IDF's]] arsenal was made up of so many different weapons of varying designs and reliabilities that this was the only safe way to train soldiers who might have to use an unfamiliar weapon. ** It should be noted that with most 1911-style pistols, with which a variant of this is a somewhat popular method of carrying[[note]]that is, chamber a bullet and then lower the hammer, as it's single-action[[/note]], chambering a single specific cartridge multiple times can seat the bullet further into the casing than it should, which can cause dangerous pressure failures if that round is actually fired without reseating the bullet.

*** There was an Italian bolt-action rifle manufactured during both World Wars with a similar design flaw.

** It can also happen if you get wimpy rounds that don't move the Desert Eagle's heavy slide back enough. Unlike with .44 and .357 Magnum revolvers, the Desert Eagle when chambered for one of those rounds ''can't'' be used effectively with .44 or .38 Special, unless the springs are swapped out to account for the much weaker rounds. Otherwise you'll have to rack the slide manually for every shot, which obviously defeats the purpose of a semi-automatic. ** The .44 and .357 Magnum variants fire revolver rounds. Semi-automatic weapons, whether recoil or gas operated, have a ''much'' narrower pressure curve in which the weapon can be safely operated, as opposed to the time-honored "if it fits in the holes, shoot it" method of determining safe revolver rounds. ** Early in the Desert Eagle's life, it wasn't widely understood as being closer to an M16 in action than a normal automatic pistol or revolver. The direct gas system taps gas from behind the bullet using a port drilled into the barrel. Most revolver rounds are all lead, without a gliding metal jacket like all automatic pistol or rifle rounds. The soft lead would get shorn off and clog the gas port, causing a failure to cycle and being a complete pain in the ass to clean out. When using jacketed rounds, as recommended by the manufacturer, the gun works just fine. * The M50 and M55 Reising were submachine guns issued to the Marines during UsefulNotes/WorldWarII as a replacement for Thompsons, which were in short supply (especially for the Marine Corps, which as always had to wait until Army and Navy orders were filled before getting any) and too bulky and heavy for constant jungle patrols. The Reising was accurate and reliable in trials; unfortunately, the trials were designed for a civilian law enforcement weapon, not a military one. While a cop would have no trouble with his gun (since he'd only be using it in his own city, and would be keeping it in storage most of the time), the complex internals of the gun would easily foul and jam in the sand, mud, and salt water of the Pacific campaign. The design of the magazine meant that it could also easily be slightly damaged and make the magazine useless. The folding stock of the M55 would often not stay in place while the gun was being fired. It would even jam just from too-humid air, which rusted the firing pin. As if this wasn't enough, the weapon was cocked by pulling back a tab attached to the bolt....at the bottom of the handguard. In other words, a rapidly reciprocating piece of metal right by your delicate fingers. The cocking piece was ''inside'' the handguard (which had a groove cut into it for that purpose), meaning that your fingers were probably safe...unless you accidentally slipped them into the groove instead of around the side. But this provided the most common of the Reising's many opportunities to jam; if the groove filled with mud, the cocking lever would be blocked from moving. To make things worse, the Reising (amazingly for a weapon of mid-20th century vintage) had parts that didn't properly interchange from one gun to the next, and replacement parts needed to be hand-fitted. The only reason the Marines used them at all was they were available ''immediately'' rather than the "maybe in a few months" status of new Thompsons. Not surprisingly, Marines would take almost anything else and dump their guns as soon as possible. Lt. Col. Merritt Edson commanded his battalion to dump all of their Reisings in a river so they could draw better guns. One NCO reportedly "decommissioned" his gun by smashing the stock over the head of a rather unruly prisoner in the brig. After the Marines' dismal experience with it in the Pacific, the remaining Reisings were either foisted off on Canada and Russia, or assigned to duty they were more suitable for: issue to stateside police, factory guards and Coast Guard patrols. * The FAMAS F1 was designed a few years after France withdrew from NATO[[note]]Sort of. France withdrew from NATO's military command structure after the US and UK basically laughed at their demand to be given equal authority of NATO operations. But they remained a NATO member. Given that NATO is an exclusively military alliance, what that distinction actually meant is somewhat complicated.[[/note]], in turn allowing France to design a new infantry weapon without being forced to comply to NATO standards (though it was preferable given the UsefulNotes/ColdWar context). The result was one of the most mind-bogglingly weird and boneheaded assault rifles designs of the twentieth century, not helped by a laundry list of poor decisions. The downsides stem from the fact the FAMAS F1 has a higher barrel twist rate than either version of the AR-15/M16 family rifle (i.e. it's optimized for ''neither'' the original American M193 cartridge nor the NATO-standard SS109), optimized for the locally-produced steel-cased 5.56mm "F1" cartridges; as time passed and production of the rifle and ammunition ceased, the French military was left sitting on their reserves. As operations in Afghanistan and Chad showed, when a standard FAMAS F1 was fed with American-issued 5.56 NATO ammunition, the effective range would drop to an abysmal average of 50 meters (about 165 ft; a modern 9x19mm ''pistol'' can equal this, for context), effectively making the rifle useless. Because France was not anymore able to produce this proprietary ammunition locally, they had to contract a manufacturer in the Emirates, however ammo purchased from them turned out to be of low quality and poor manufacture; coupled with an awkward, proprietary 25-round magazine instead of STANAG-compliant magazines (some [[SarcasmMode genius]] thought it would be a great idea to go with cheap magazines designed to be thrown away after being emptied once...and then later [[WhatAnIdiot some other genius decided it would be a great idea to save money by reusing the non-reusable magazines]]), this effectively killed the F1 as an effective, modern-day infantry rifle. Nearly all of those problems were fixed with the more modern variants, such as the FAMAS G2, which has a STANAG magwell and a barrel with the same twist rate as an M16/AR, allowing it to shoot 5.56 NATO proper. However, the G2 was never purchased in high numbers by the French military (only the Navy has officially adopted it), citing an ever-shrinking budget, and an administration unwilling to replace the some 300,000 F1s equipping the armories; there's talk of the French military giving up on the design entirely and adopting an Australian version of the Steyr AUG in the future. * As the quote goes, "You ain't a SEAL until you've eaten Italian steel." The early production run of the Beretta 92F pistols for the US Government had an issue where the slide would fly off the frame during shooting, causing injury to at least one SEAL. While several different reasons were claimed (high round counts, overpressure ammunition), it was eventually discovered that a component that was supposed to be replaced after 25,000 rounds was failing around the five thousand mark. Free replacement parts were sent out and Beretta, in the upgrade to the 92FS, redesigned the hammer to prevent the slide from flying rearward in the event that the locking block fails. The 92FS has gone on to be a fairly satisfactory military and police sidearm, but [[ReformedButRejected the Navy SEALS still switched to the SIG P226]], and the other branches that didn't resist switching to it in the first place keep trying to replace it with a 1911-based sidearm every couple of years; in official American military surveys about troop experience and opinion regarding weapons, the M9 rated the lowest, with a significant majority of users distrusting it.
to:
** It can also happen if you get wimpy rounds that don't move the Desert Eagle's heavy slide back enough. Unlike with .44 and .357 Magnum revolvers, the Desert Eagle when chambered for one of those rounds ''can't'' be used effectively with .44 or .38 Special, unless the springs are swapped out to account for the much weaker lower-pressure rounds. Otherwise you'll have to rack the slide manually for every shot, which obviously defeats the purpose of a semi-automatic. ** The .44 and .357 Magnum variants fire revolver rounds. Semi-automatic weapons, whether recoil or gas operated, have a ''much'' narrower pressure curve in which the weapon can be safely operated, as opposed to the time-honored "if it fits in the holes, shoot it" method of determining safe revolver rounds. ** Early in the Desert Eagle's life, it wasn't widely understood as being closer to an M16 in action than a normal automatic pistol or revolver. The direct gas system taps gas from behind the bullet using a port drilled into the barrel. Most revolver rounds are all lead, without a gliding metal jacket like all automatic pistol or rifle rounds.copper jacket. The soft lead would get shorn off and clog the gas port, causing a failure to cycle and being a complete pain in the ass to clean out. When using jacketed rounds, as recommended by the manufacturer, the gun works just fine. * The M50 and M55 Reising were submachine guns issued to the Marines during UsefulNotes/WorldWarII as a replacement substitute for Thompsons, which were in short supply (especially for the Marine Corps, which as always had to wait until Army and Navy orders were filled before getting any) anything) and too bulky and heavy for constant jungle patrols. The Reising was accurate and reliable in trials; unfortunately, the trials were designed for a civilian law enforcement weapon, not a military one. While a cop would have no trouble with his gun (since he'd only be using it in his own city, and would be keeping it in storage most of the time), the complex internals of the gun would easily foul and jam in the sand, mud, and salt water of the Pacific campaign. The design of the magazine meant that it could also easily be slightly damaged and make the magazine useless. The folding stock of the M55 would often not stay in place while the gun was being fired. It would even jam just from too-humid air, which rusted the firing pin. As if this wasn't enough, the weapon was cocked by pulling back a tab attached to the bolt....at the bottom of the handguard. In other words, a rapidly reciprocating piece of metal right by your delicate fingers. The cocking piece was ''inside'' the handguard (which had a groove cut into it for that purpose), meaning that your fingers were probably safe...unless you accidentally slipped them into the groove instead of around the side. But this provided the most common of the Reising's many opportunities to jam; if the groove filled with mud, the cocking lever would be blocked from moving. To make things worse, the Reising (amazingly for a weapon of mid-20th century vintage) had parts that didn't properly interchange from one gun to the next, and replacement parts needed to be hand-fitted. The only reason the Marines used them at all was they were available ''immediately'' rather than the "maybe in a few months" status of new Thompsons. Not surprisingly, Marines would take almost anything else and dump their guns as soon as possible. Lt. Col. Merritt Edson commanded his battalion to dump all of their Reisings in a river so they could draw better guns. One NCO reportedly "decommissioned" his gun by smashing the stock over the head of a rather unruly prisoner in the brig. After the Marines' dismal experience with it in the Pacific, the remaining Reisings were either foisted off on Canada and Russia, or assigned to duty they were more suitable for: issue to stateside police, factory guards and Coast Guard patrols. * The FAMAS F1 was designed a few years after France withdrew from NATO[[note]]Sort of. France withdrew from NATO's military command structure after the US and UK basically laughed at their demand to be given equal authority of NATO operations. But they remained a NATO member. Given that NATO is an exclusively military alliance, what that distinction actually meant is somewhat complicated.[[/note]], in turn allowing France to design a new infantry weapon without being forced to comply to NATO standards (though it was preferable given the UsefulNotes/ColdWar context). The result was one of the most mind-bogglingly weird and boneheaded assault rifles designs of the twentieth century, not helped by a laundry list of poor decisions. The downsides stem from the fact the FAMAS F1 has a higher barrel twist rate than either version of the AR-15/M16 family rifle (i.e. it's optimized for ''neither'' the original American M193 cartridge nor the NATO-standard SS109), optimized for the locally-produced steel-cased 5.56mm "F1" cartridges; as time passed and production of the rifle and ammunition ceased, the French military was left sitting on their reserves. As operations in Afghanistan and Chad showed, when a standard FAMAS F1 was fed with American-issued 5.56 NATO ammunition, the effective range would drop to an abysmal average of 50 meters (about 165 ft; a modern 9x19mm ''pistol'' can equal this, for context), effectively making the rifle useless. Because France was not anymore able to produce this proprietary ammunition locally, they had to contract a manufacturer in the Emirates, however ammo purchased from them turned out to be of low quality and poor manufacture; coupled with an awkward, proprietary 25-round magazine instead of STANAG-compliant magazines (some [[SarcasmMode genius]] genius thought it would be a great idea to go with cheap magazines designed to be thrown away after being emptied once...and then later [[WhatAnIdiot some other genius decided it would be a great idea to save money by reusing the non-reusable magazines]]), magazines), this effectively killed the F1 as an effective, modern-day infantry rifle. Nearly all of those problems were fixed with the more modern variants, such as the FAMAS G2, which has a STANAG magwell and a barrel with the same twist rate as an M16/AR, allowing it to shoot 5.56 NATO proper. However, the G2 was never purchased in high numbers by the French military (only the Navy has officially adopted it), citing an ever-shrinking budget, and an administration unwilling to replace the some 300,000 F1s equipping the armories; there's talk of the French military giving up on the design entirely and adopting an Australian version of the Steyr AUG in the future. * As the quote goes, "You ain't a SEAL until you've eaten Italian steel." The early production run of the Beretta 92F pistols for the US Government had an issue where the slide would fly off the frame during shooting, causing injury to at least one SEAL. While several different reasons were claimed (high round counts, overpressure ammunition), it was eventually discovered that a component that was supposed to be replaced after 25,000 rounds was failing around the five thousand mark. Free replacement parts were sent out and Beretta, in the upgrade to the 92FS, redesigned the hammer frame with a pin to prevent the slide from flying rearward in the event that the locking block fails. The 92FS has gone on to be a fairly satisfactory military and police sidearm, but [[ReformedButRejected the Navy SEALS still switched to the SIG P226]], P226, and the other branches that didn't resist switching to it in the first place keep trying to replace it with a 1911-based sidearm every couple of years; in official American military surveys about troop experience and opinion regarding weapons, the M9 rated the lowest, with a significant majority of users distrusting it.

** Most of these issues got worse with wear, so the gun tended to perform passably if recently refit, but degrade ''horribly'' over time; this was especially an issue for the [=M60E3=], which attempted to reduce the weight of the weapon, but succeeded at the cost of making it ''even less'' reliable. It's commonly said that an M60 would literally beat itself to death. So much so that even the ''receivers'' got labelled as replaceable parts[[note]]for context, a broken receiver on ''any other Army-issue weapon'' resulted in other working parts attached to it being stripped to replace the parts on other guns[[/note]] - only the trunnion was considered to be long lasting. Modern variants like the [=M60E4/E6=] and Mk. 43 have finally fixed the M60's issues for beating themselves to death, but save for the [=SEALs=] and the Coast Guard, [[ReformedButRejected almost every branch of the US military has abandoned it]], either deciding reliability at the cost of [[{{BFG}} no mobility]] is a fair trade and switching to the M240, or looking towards the newer Mk. 48 (a 7.62mm version of the M249 that still manages to be lighter ''and'' more reliable than modern M60 variants). * The MG 42 and its post-war progeny, as mentioned above, was primarily an excellent design, but there was one poor variant - the US military briefly experimented with MG 42's converted to their .30-06 cartridge following the war. In the same manner as one of the above-mentioned Chauchat's many issues, the design team failed to account for the .30-06 cartridge being six millimeters longer than the original 7.92mm cartridge when converting them, thus failing to increase the length of the receiver for the new cartridge and making weapons that were completely incapable of properly cycling after a single shot.
to:
** Most of these issues got worse with wear, so the gun tended to perform passably if recently refit, but degrade ''horribly'' over time; this was especially an issue for the [=M60E3=], which attempted to reduce the weight of the weapon, but succeeded at the cost of making it ''even less'' reliable. It's commonly said that an M60 would literally beat itself to death. So much so that even the ''receivers'' got labelled as replaceable parts[[note]]for context, a broken receiver on ''any other Army-issue weapon'' resulted in other working parts attached to it being stripped to replace the parts on other guns[[/note]] - only the trunnion was considered to be long lasting. Modern variants like the [=M60E4/E6=] and Mk. 43 have finally fixed the M60's issues for beating themselves to death, but save for the [=SEALs=] and the Coast Guard, [[ReformedButRejected almost every branch of the US military has abandoned it]], it, either switching to the M240 or deciding reliability at the cost of [[{{BFG}} no mobility]] mobility is a fair trade and switching to the M240, trade, or looking towards the newer Mk. 48 (a 7.62mm version of the M249 that still manages to be lighter ''and'' more reliable than modern M60 variants). * The MG 42 and its post-war progeny, as mentioned above, was primarily an excellent design, but there was one poor variant - the US military briefly experimented with MG 42's [=42s=] converted to their .to .30-06 cartridge Springfield following the war. In the same manner as one of the above-mentioned Chauchat's many issues, the design team failed to account for the .for .30-06 cartridge being six millimeters longer than the original 7.92mm cartridge when converting them, thus failing to increase the length of the receiver for the new cartridge and making weapons that were completely incapable of properly cycling after a single shot.

** 10mm Auto has basically become an [[RareGuns almost-never-used cartridge]] thanks in part to reliability issues with the weapons initially designed for it. The Smith & Wesson 1076 is largely tied to the cartridge's fall - initially developed for and issued to the FBI, some agents (particularly those who were less-experienced shooters or had smaller hands) complained that they had trouble controlling the recoil of the cartridge. The FBI fixed this by forcing every agent to use down-loaded ammunition, which made the recoil easier to control, but also resulted in frequent stovepipe jams and double-feeding rounds. These issues were eventually fixed by changing out the recoil springs to account for the weaker version of the round, but it was too late to save the cartridge or the pistol; the FBI cancelled their 10,000-pistol contract at only 2,400 deliveries and switched to the 9mm SIG P228, just two years after first adopting the 1076. Then they switched again to the Glock 22 in .40 S&W...which is a shortened version of 10mm Auto designed to be ballistically identical to the down-loaded FBI rounds. * Even the memetically tough AK series of rifles can suffer from this, generally due to wildly differing build quality. You see, whilst the ones coming out of foundries in the former USSR or the more advanced Eastern Bloc nations will generally be of a high-standard, because Mikhail Kalashnikov never patented it - he couldn't - hundreds have been produced in underground factories or back-street metal shops. The soundness of the design can only do so much for abysmal build quality. * The FN MAG, whilst highly regarded as a general purpose machine gun, sometimes suffers from "runaway gun" during which the weapon continues to fire after the trigger is released. Users are trained to twist the belt to stop the rounds from feeding. ** "Runaway gun" is in fact similar to a problem that has plagued both machine guns and, more recently, attempts to create weapons which fire caseless ammunition since their inception, known as "cook-off". This is where the action of the gun is so hot that rounds will keep firing even without the bullets' primers being struck. ** Some earlier versions of the FN Minimi can accept STANAG magazines in place of the usual ammo belt. Military users typically only do this when they are totally out of belted ammo, however, as the weapon's [[MoreDakka extremely high rate of fire]] is too fast for a STANAG magazine's spring to properly feed rounds into it. Later versions remove the STANAG magwell entirely to cut down on weight. * Firearms fitted with blank fire adaptors for the purpose of exercises are a lot less reliable than non-adapted firearms firing live rounds, as much more carbon builds up in the weapon due to the barrel being essentially blocked off to allow the gas expelled from the blanks to operate the action properly as opposed to being expelled from the barrel. * Any firearm that lacks a manual safety catch, like revolvers or most Glock semi-automatics, require even stricter than usual adherence to proper trigger discipline. ** "Safe-action" handguns get the moniker from the fact that it is very difficult for them to fire by accident while in retention. The only safety catch to stop them from firing is the trigger. *** Most manufacturers compensate for this by giving the gun a heavy trigger pull (as high as eight pounds in some models). Unfortunately the trigger spring has a tendency to weaken with regular use, making it far easier to accidentally discharge.
to:
** 10mm Auto has basically become an [[RareGuns almost-never-used cartridge]] thanks in part to reliability issues with the weapons initially designed for it. The Smith & Wesson 1076 is largely tied to the cartridge's fall - initially developed for and issued to the FBI, some agents (particularly those who were less-experienced shooters or had smaller hands) complained that they had trouble controlling the recoil of the cartridge. The FBI fixed this by forcing every agent to use down-loaded ammunition, which made the recoil easier to control, but also resulted in frequent stovepipe jams and double-feeding rounds. These issues were eventually fixed by changing out the recoil springs to account for the weaker version of the round, but it was too late to save the cartridge or the pistol; the FBI cancelled their 10,000-pistol contract at only 2,400 deliveries and switched to the 9mm SIG P228, just two years after first adopting the 1076. Then they switched again to the Glock 22 in .40 S&W...which is a shortened version of 10mm Auto designed to be ballistically identical to the down-loaded FBI rounds. * Even the memetically tough AK series of rifles can suffer from this, generally due to wildly differing build quality. You see, whilst the ones coming out of foundries in the former USSR or the more advanced Eastern Bloc nations will generally be of a high-standard, because Mikhail Kalashnikov never patented it - he couldn't - (he couldn't) hundreds have been produced in underground factories or back-street backstreet metal shops. The soundness of the design can only do so much for abysmal build quality. * The FN MAG, whilst highly regarded as a general purpose machine gun, sometimes suffers from "runaway gun" during which the weapon continues to fire after the trigger is released. Users are trained to twist the belt to stop the rounds from feeding. ** "Runaway gun" is in fact similar to a problem that has plagued both machine guns and, more recently, attempts to create weapons which fire caseless ammunition since their inception, known as "cook-off". This is where the action of the gun is so hot that rounds will keep firing even without the bullets' primers being struck. ** Some earlier versions of the FN Minimi can accept STANAG magazines in place of the usual ammo belt. Military users typically only do this when they are totally out of belted ammo, however, as the weapon's [[MoreDakka extremely high rate of fire]] is too fast for a STANAG magazine's spring to properly feed rounds into it. Later versions remove the STANAG magwell entirely to cut down on weight. * Firearms fitted with blank fire adaptors for the purpose of exercises are a lot less reliable than non-adapted firearms firing live rounds, as much more carbon builds up in the weapon due to the barrel being essentially blocked off to allow the gas expelled from the blanks to operate the action properly as opposed to being expelled from the barrel. * Any firearm that lacks a manual safety catch, like revolvers or most Glock semi-automatics, require even stricter than usual adherence to proper trigger discipline. ** "Safe-action" handguns get the moniker from the fact that it is very difficult for them to fire by accident while in retention. The only safety catch to stop them from firing is the trigger. *** Most manufacturers compensate for this by giving the gun a heavy trigger pull (as high as eight pounds in some models). Unfortunately the trigger spring has a tendency to weaken with regular use, making it far easier to accidentally discharge.quality.

* The mechanism on the bolt of a bolt-action rifle that yanks the spent bullet casing out of the barrel will slowly wear out with age. With an old enough gun, it will be nearly incapable of pulling the casing out, forcing the user to repeatedly bang on the gun to loosen up the casing and then slam the bolt back and forth in order to try and get the bolt to catch the casing. In some extreme cases, the user will have to get a screw driver or a knife and try to wedge it into the paper-thin area between the front of the receiver and the rim of the casing.

* Part of the reason why many guns are of closed-bolt design, where the bolt in the "ready to fire" position is forward, as opposed to the open-bolt design, where the bolt is held back, is because the chance for an accidental discharge at best or a runaway gun at worst is much higher. What's stopping the gun from firing in an open bolt design is a sear the trigger pulls out of the way, as opposed to a hammer dropping on the firing pin. Another reason is that the ''entire'' weight of the bolt throwing itself forward before every shot, which can compromise accuracy depending on how heavy the bolt is.

* Some youth rifles have a tendency to go off if the butt takes too hard a knock. [[http://www.mirror.co.uk/tv/tv-news/i-regret-purchasing-gun-mother-3943099 A documentary]] on Channel 4 told the story of a 9 year old boy who fell victim to this fault when he slipped while crossing a creek, accidentally shooting himself in the head. The boy's father demonstrated this by loading the weapon and slamming the butt onto a plank of wood, setting it off. The manufacturer and forensics had found no faults with the weapon. Disturbingly, this is a rifle ''designed for use by children''.

* The [[CoolGuns/{{Handguns}} Tokarev TT-30 and TT-33]] were some of the very few Soviet handguns designed to use an American-style magazine release button at the base of the trigger guard, as opposed to a release lever mounted at the heel of the grip as is more popular in European designs. This resulted in a tendency for the weapons to drop their magazines on their own when drawn or fired, particularly when the mag was damaged in some way, so for the post-war Makarov they went right back to the heel-mounted lever.

* The Czech-made [[CoolGuns/MachinePistols Skorpion]] is a rather distinctive little machine pistol and is by all accounts perfectly serviceable. It's fine for what it is--a one-handed bundle of MoreDakka. Enter Armitage International, a South Carolina gun manufacturing company that decided that the original's 20 rounds of .32 ACP just wasn't enough--no, they needed to copy the design wholesale and scale it up to take 9mm instead (never mind that the original Skorpion's manufacturer, Česká zbrojovka, already did that). The end result is the Armitage International Scarab Skorpion, a titan of a machine pistol that takes modified MAC-10 magazines, meaning that it edges into being a small SMG. Where the Skorpion's toolings and functions work just fine, the Scarab is a mess. It loads poorly, feeds even worse, and manages to have almost every kind of problem one can imagine thanks to its rather primitive construction. To say that the damned thing can't even go one magazine without having multiple issues is not an understatement. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KunQNYDsNEs Just watch]] as Ian [=McCollum=], a RareGuns commentator, struggles to maintain his goodwill as the gun continues to give him grief.
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* The Czech-made [[CoolGuns/MachinePistols Skorpion]] Skorpion is a rather distinctive little machine pistol CoolGuns/{{machine pistol|s}} and is by all accounts perfectly serviceable. It's fine for what it is--a one-handed bundle of MoreDakka.serviceable. Enter Armitage International, a South Carolina gun manufacturing company that decided that the original's 20 rounds of .32 ACP just wasn't enough--no, they needed to copy the design wholesale and scale it up to take 9mm instead (never mind that the original Skorpion's manufacturer, Česká zbrojovka, already did that). The end result is the Armitage International Scarab Skorpion, a titan of a machine pistol that takes modified MAC-10 magazines, meaning that it edges into being a small SMG. Where the Skorpion's toolings and functions work just fine, the Scarab is a mess. It loads poorly, feeds even worse, and manages to have almost every kind of problem one can imagine thanks to its rather primitive construction. To say that the damned thing can't even go one magazine without having multiple issues is not an understatement. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KunQNYDsNEs Just watch]] as Ian [=McCollum=], a RareGuns commentator, struggles to maintain his goodwill as the gun continues to give him grief.
29th Dec '15 12:13:42 AM thatother1dude
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No potholes in headlining quotes.
-> ''"Be careful. The safety's off, so [[ChekhovsGun it could go off]] for, like, no reason."''
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-> ''"Be careful. The safety's off, so [[ChekhovsGun it could go off]] off for, like, no reason."''
8th Dec '15 7:50:13 PM Jeduthun
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Added DiffLines:
If the person is ''really'' TooDumbToLive, they may [[JugglingLoadedGuns look into the barrel to see why it isn't working]].[[note]]If you have to be told why [[AndThatsTerrible this is a bad idea]], you should never touch a gun.[[/note]]
3rd Dec '15 9:23:35 AM eroock
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* Parodied on ''WesternAnimation/TheSimpsons'': to ease Marge's worries about his new gun, Homer turns on the safety, causing it to discharge into a photo of Marge. Then he notices that he actually turned the safety ''off'', turns it on, and causes ''another'' misfire. After a stunned second, he decides to gently set the gun on the table...and a couple of seconds later it goes off anyhow, ricocheting off several surfaces before striking a nearby knife which embeds itself in the picture, right between Marge's eyes. As Lisa says, "No offense Mom, but that '''was''' pretty cool."
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* Parodied on ''WesternAnimation/TheSimpsons'': to ease Marge's worries about his new gun, [[https://youtu.be/3oXFjhj76-I?t=36 Homer turns on the safety, safety]], causing it to discharge into a photo of Marge. Then he notices that he actually turned the safety ''off'', turns it on, and causes ''another'' misfire. After a stunned second, he decides to gently set the gun on the table...and a couple of seconds later it goes off anyhow, ricocheting off several surfaces before striking a nearby knife which embeds itself in the picture, right between Marge's eyes. As Lisa says, "No offense Mom, but that '''was''' pretty cool."
1st Dec '15 8:39:03 AM babyhenchy1
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* In ''Series/{{Daredevil}}'' a hitman is about to shoot a mobster when we flash back a few hours to when one of Fisk's mooks gives the hitman an untraceable gun to use for the hit. The mook guarantees that the gun will not jam. We then return to the present and sure enough the gun jams and the hitman is forced to beat his target to death. A previous episode established that the gun was part of a larger batch of illegal guns smuggled into the city and the mook removed it directly from the storage crate. The gun was probably some low quality knock-off that was not stored and maintained properly after it left the factory. The hitman only had himself to blame for not personally test firing it before the hit.
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* In ''Series/{{Daredevil}}'' ''Series/{{Daredevil 2015}}'' a hitman is about to shoot a mobster when we flash back a few hours to when one of Fisk's mooks gives the hitman an untraceable gun to use for the hit. The mook guarantees that the gun will not jam. We then return to the present and sure enough the gun jams and the hitman is forced to beat his target to death. A previous episode established that the gun was part of a larger batch of illegal guns smuggled into the city and the mook removed it directly from the storage crate. The gun was probably some low quality knock-off that was not stored and maintained properly after it left the factory. The hitman only had himself to blame for not personally test firing it before the hit.
13th Nov '15 11:55:34 AM Kadorhal
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** The Franchi SPAS-12 originally featured a lever-type safety which, as it aged, would eventually cause the weapon to fire if it was toggled while the weapon was loaded, as well as fail to prevent the gun from firing with it on. A recall order was issued to replace these with a different, more reliable safety, though most of the SPAS-12's in existence still have the original safety -- and even the most recently-produced examples were produced way back in 2000.
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** The Franchi SPAS-12 originally featured a lever-type safety which, as it aged, would eventually cause the weapon to fire if it was toggled while the weapon was loaded, as well as fail to prevent the gun from firing with it on. A recall order was issued to replace these with a different, more reliable safety, though most of the SPAS-12's in existence still have the original safety -- and even the most recently-produced examples were produced way back in 2000. Also, as a rather minor note given the above, the SPAS-12 also requires the safety off to load shells into it.

* The Enfield L85 (better known as the [=SA80=]) was basically Britain's way of telling the United States that when it came to the design of infantry weapons, "anything you can screw up, we can screw up bigger"; the design itself was fairly sound, albeit rather maintenance-intensive and complicated to disassemble, but had to be built to extremely fine tolerances. Unfortunately, the initial in-service version was the last project undertaken by the Royal Small Arms Factory, whose workers had recently learned they were all going to be laid off. [[TheyJustDidntCare The reader can doubtless imagine the effect this had on their workmanship.]] Problems included: spontaneous malfunctions, firing pin breakage, safety breakages, magazines spontaneously dropping, and these are only a few out of the 50 listed in the report. This is what happens when a country forces through a new assault rifle just for the hell of it. Heckler & Koch managed to (mostly) salvage the design in the upgrade to the A2 standard, though the light support weapon variation is still not seeing much use at all except as a rarely-used DMR (its initial role is instead being fulfilled by the [=L110A1=]).
to:
* The Enfield L85 (better known as the [=SA80=]) was basically Britain's way of telling the United States that when it came to the design of infantry weapons, "anything you can screw up, we can screw up bigger"; the design itself was fairly sound, albeit rather maintenance-intensive and complicated to disassemble, but had to be built to extremely fine tolerances. Unfortunately, the initial in-service version was the last project undertaken by the Royal Small Arms Factory, whose workers had recently learned they were all going to be laid off. [[TheyJustDidntCare The reader can doubtless imagine the effect this had on their workmanship.]] Problems included: A report listed 50 issues inherent to the system, including spontaneous malfunctions, firing pin breakage, safety breakages, and magazines spontaneously dropping, and these are only a few out of the 50 listed in the report.dropping. This is what happens when a country forces through a new assault rifle just for the hell of it. Heckler & Koch managed to (mostly) salvage the design in the upgrade to the A2 standard, though the light support weapon variation is still not seeing much use at all except as a rarely-used DMR (its initial role is instead being fulfilled by the [=L110A1=]).
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