History Main / MagicVersusScience

21st Jan '18 7:09:31 PM baschapp
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** Interestingly, this universes magic is, at times, more scientific than the local "scientific" esper powers. The program that creates espers can be best summed up as "plug kids into the machine and hope for the best", and produces [[SuperpowerLottery unpredictable power-sets]] and [[SuperWeight levels]]. Magic can be used by anyone but espers at a level based on study and practice(with a few exceptions) and the knowledge of spells can be used to invent entirely new ones, or alter per-existing ones.
10th Jan '18 7:33:42 AM Temporary14
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** On the flipside, there are many loopholes to the way in which Randi, and other identified skeptics, could or would use to invalidate any psychic or supernatural performance, even if it was genuine. Make no mistake, Randi and many skeptics have done great things to expose an industry of con artists, but if you put an honest-to-God psychic (if such a thing were ever to exist) and that psychic demonstrated true psychic ability even under Randi's testing terms, he is not going to be impressed. Why? Because it's his JOB to not be impressed. A serious skeptic is not going to agree that X-thing exists for the same reason you won't get a professional Christian minister to agree that God doesn't exist. All Randi would need to do is find any series of mechanical failures and posit that the so-called "psychic" is simply just an incredible stage magician while someone on the crew was paid to help them out. Proof has to extinguish doubt, but human beings can find ways to doubt anything (for examples, see the Anti-Vaxx and Flat Earth Society movements) and just not being able to figure it out won't cut it (which is referred to as the "God of the gaps" argument).

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** On the flipside, there are many loopholes to the way in which Randi, and other identified skeptics, could or would use to invalidate any psychic or supernatural performance, even if it was genuine. Make no mistake, Randi and many skeptics have done great things to expose an industry of con artists, but if you put an honest-to-God psychic (if such a thing were ever to exist) and that psychic demonstrated true psychic ability even under Randi's testing terms, he is not going to be impressed. Why? Because it's his JOB to not be impressed. A serious skeptic is not going to agree that X-thing exists for the same reason you won't get a professional Christian minister to agree that God doesn't exist. All Randi would need to do is find any series of mechanical failures and posit that the so-called "psychic" is simply just an incredible stage magician while someone on the crew was paid to help them out. Proof has to extinguish doubt, but human beings can find ways to doubt anything (for examples, see the Anti-Vaxx and Flat Earth Society movements) anything, and just not being able to figure it out won't cut it (which is referred to as the "God of the gaps" argument).
17th Nov '17 8:02:31 PM RandomnessUnlimited
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* An ''WesternAnimation/AdventureTime'' episode centers around this. Scientist [[EverythingsBetterWithPrincesses princess]] Bonnibel Bubblegum has to cure a cold for one of her citizens. Luckily, she has the antidote and just has to give it to him (the show takes place in TheFuture); unfortunutely, the citizen only takes "magic". Princess Bubblegum thinks the idea of magic is ridiculous (mainly because of its association with AWizardDidIt logic). When she makes fun of it, [[DoesThisRemindYouOfAnything the citizen says she's not being respectful of his beliefs]]. Her disdain for magic is the basis for the episode. It should be noted her attitude is similar to [[WesternAnimation/TheVentureBrothers Doctor Venture's]], in that she doesn't think Magic has any supernatural connotation and goes so far as to call out the scientific principles being used by the wizards.

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* An ''WesternAnimation/AdventureTime'' episode centers around this. Scientist [[EverythingsBetterWithPrincesses princess]] Bonnibel Bubblegum has to cure a cold for one of her citizens. Luckily, she has the antidote and just has to give it to him (the show takes place in TheFuture); unfortunutely, unfortunately, the citizen only takes "magic". Princess Bubblegum thinks the idea of magic is ridiculous (mainly because of its association with AWizardDidIt logic). When she makes fun of it, [[DoesThisRemindYouOfAnything the citizen says she's not being respectful of his beliefs]]. Her disdain for magic is the basis for the episode. It should be noted her attitude is similar to [[WesternAnimation/TheVentureBrothers Doctor Venture's]], in that she doesn't think Magic has any supernatural connotation and goes so far as to call out the scientific principles being used by the wizards.


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* ''WesternAnimation/{{Kaeloo}}'': Mr. Cat does not believe in magic and always tries to look at things from a scientific point of view. This being a show which has a lot of SurrealHumor, he's proven wrong more often than not.
26th Oct '17 4:34:35 PM TitoMosquito
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** It's mentioned in the expanded universe that magic ''did'' once exist in the current universe and was even practiced in Gallifrey. Rassilon, however, despised magic, and with the Time Lords' ascension, magic was quashed beneath science. There was in fact a race of magic users who began approaching time travel before they went to war with the Time Lords and lost, getting them RetGoned. Had the won, they would've replaced the Time Lords as the dominant race with magic being the common phenomenon. So in general, magic vs science actually occurred and magic lost.

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** It's mentioned in the expanded universe that magic ''did'' once exist in the current universe and was even practiced in Gallifrey. Rassilon, however, despised magic, and with the Time Lords' ascension, magic was quashed beneath science. There was in fact a race of magic users who began approaching time travel before they went to war with the Time Lords and lost, getting them RetGoned.{{Ret Gone}}d. Had the won, they would've replaced the Time Lords as the dominant race with magic being the common phenomenon. So in general, magic vs science actually occurred and magic lost.
18th Oct '17 12:19:42 AM Dvandemon
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* When Hank Pym goes up against magic in Mighty Avengers he actually makes some headway on defeating it with science. He manages to entrap Loki, both a master of magic and PhysicalGod, with scientific innovation and nullify an EldritchAbomination possessing Quicksilver casting spells at SuperSpeed by scrambling his brain's speech center.
13th Oct '17 4:15:52 PM DVB
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* A ComicBook/DoctorStrange parody in ''Webcomic/PvP'' claimed magic and science were opposing forces. Scratch Fury [[http://www.pvponline.com/comic/2012/10/17/to-coin-a-phrase disagreed]].

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* A ComicBook/DoctorStrange parody in ''Webcomic/PvP'' claimed magic and science were opposing forces. Scratch Fury [[http://www.pvponline.com/comic/2012/10/17/to-coin-a-phrase disagreed]]. [[http://pvponline.com/comic/paying-by-ear Scratch was then proven wrong.]]
13th Oct '17 2:10:18 PM Abodos
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* In ''VideoGame/MetroidPrime 3: Corruption'' the natives of Bryyo had an entire war over this. The war caused 96% of the planet to become uninhabitable and the survivors became barbarians.

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* In ''VideoGame/MetroidPrime 3: Corruption'' ''VideoGame/MetroidPrime3Corruption'' the natives of Bryyo had an entire war over this. The war caused 96% of the planet to become uninhabitable and the survivors became barbarians.
23rd Sep '17 8:37:04 PM Kamiguy123
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* This is the premise of the setting of ''LightNovel/ACertainMagicalIndex'' and its SpinOff ''Manga/ACertainScientificRailgun'', with a secret EnforcedColdWar going on between the two factions. Magic is secret and controlled by religion while science is public. PsychicPowers are classified as scientific even though they share the category "supernatural" with magic in this setting and tend to break all known laws of physics, due to being widely accepted and studied (most espers know exactly what laws their power breaks and how to make the most of that). The really odd thing is that when it comes right down to it, the only difference between the two sides is methods. Espers ''are'' magicians--that's not a snarky reference to MagicByAnyOtherName, they are literally highly specialized magic users who are unable to use any other form of magic. The science side as a whole makes a lot more sense when you remember that modern espers were invented by an evil wizard.

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* This is the premise of the setting of ''LightNovel/ACertainMagicalIndex'' and its SpinOff ''Manga/ACertainScientificRailgun'', with a secret EnforcedColdWar going on between the two factions. Magic is secret and controlled by religion while science is public. PsychicPowers are classified as scientific even though they share the category "supernatural" with magic in this setting and tend to break all known laws of physics, due to being widely accepted and studied (most espers know exactly what laws their power breaks and how to make the most of that). The really odd thing is that when it comes right down to it, the only difference between the two sides is methods. Espers ''are'' magicians--that's not a snarky reference to MagicByAnyOtherName, they are literally highly specialized magic users who are unable to use any other form of magic. The science side as a whole makes a lot more sense when you remember that modern espers were invented by an ''[[UsefulNotes/AleisterCrowley evil wizard.]]''
18th Sep '17 10:10:02 AM TheKaizerreich
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*** The weird relationship can also be explained simply because of a lack of frame and perspective ''other'' than religion at the time. Many scientists honoured nowadays for their accomplishments, such as Newton, were flat-earthers simply because ''nothing else was available'', and many of them were motivated to figure out how the real world works because they wanted to ''prove'' God, not refute, even though the refutation eventually won out simply because the ancient texts don't offer a correct world view, but as they were taught from birth influenced the researchers negatively with false preconceptions. Brahe fell into this trap and proposed a weird geocentric-esque model despite his otherwise correct ideas and observations. He might have changed his mind had he not died before the invention of the telescope so he could have measured stellar parallax, for example.
8th Sep '17 12:41:50 PM SeptimusHeap
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* In the [[WebVideo/ImAMarvelAndImADC Randomverse]], Franchise/{{Batman}} puts this trope to use in the second season of After Hours. He deduces that something magical is blocking Franchise/{{Spider-Man}}'s memories of [[Comicbook/OneMoreDay his marriage]] and tells Joker to have [[RidiculouslyHumanRobots Lance]] read his mind. Lance explodes from his systems overloading, as, according to Batman, "Science and magic usually don't mix."

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* In the [[WebVideo/ImAMarvelAndImADC Randomverse]], Franchise/{{Batman}} puts this trope to use in the second season of After Hours. He deduces that something magical is blocking Franchise/{{Spider-Man}}'s Franchise/SpiderMan's memories of [[Comicbook/OneMoreDay his marriage]] and tells Joker to have [[RidiculouslyHumanRobots Lance]] read his mind. Lance explodes from his systems overloading, as, according to Batman, "Science and magic usually don't mix."
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