History Main / EasyLogistics

15th Aug '16 2:46:55 AM Aasivar
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* This is normally averted in ''Manga/AttackOnTitan'', which is the primary reason retaking Wall Maria would take decades: Getting a couple dozen scouts to the breach would be easy enough, but getting the construction materials necessary to repair the breach requires supply lines that the titans would constantly harry. This is also one of the reasons that [[spoiler:Erin]] is so important. If he can figure out how to patch the hole using [[spoiler:his titan-shifting ability, like how the Walls were built in the first place]], they could retake Wall Maria in ''days''.

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* This is normally averted in ''Manga/AttackOnTitan'', which is the primary reason retaking Wall Maria would take decades: Getting a couple dozen scouts to the breach would be easy enough, but getting the construction materials necessary to repair the breach requires supply lines that the titans would constantly harry. This is also one of the reasons that [[spoiler:Erin]] [[spoiler:Eren]] is so important. If he can figure out how to patch the hole using [[spoiler:his titan-shifting ability, like how the Walls were built in the first place]], they could retake Wall Maria in ''days''.
11th Aug '16 5:38:53 AM Morgenthaler
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* This trope is also averted in other Creator/ParadoxInteractive games. In all of them, maintaining military forces costs money, and in ''VideoGame/VictoriaAnEmpireUnderTheSun'' military units also consume certain types of world resource (for example, an infantry division might require not only pay but also ammunition and weapons). Furthermore, while the system is understandably (and [[JustifiedTrope justifiably]]) less complex than the one in HeartsOfIron, units still need to be in your territory or adjacent to it to reinforce, and will suffer attrition (modified by terrain factors such as winter conditions or how fertile the province is) if they cannot form a continuous supply line. This leads to many interesting approaches to deal with larger invading armies, as it is possible to create some of those terrain factors yourself.

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* This trope is also averted in other Creator/ParadoxInteractive games. In all of them, maintaining military forces costs money, and in ''VideoGame/VictoriaAnEmpireUnderTheSun'' military units also consume certain types of world resource (for example, an infantry division might require not only pay but also ammunition and weapons). Furthermore, while the system is understandably (and [[JustifiedTrope justifiably]]) less complex than the one in HeartsOfIron, VideoGame/HeartsOfIron, units still need to be in your territory or adjacent to it to reinforce, and will suffer attrition (modified by terrain factors such as winter conditions or how fertile the province is) if they cannot form a continuous supply line. This leads to many interesting approaches to deal with larger invading armies, as it is possible to create some of those terrain factors yourself.
9th Aug '16 10:09:44 AM Doug86
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* General Halder (Chief of the General Staff) ensured that the Wehrmacht's planning for ''[[UsefulNotes/WorldWarII Unternehmen Barbarossa'']] played this trope straight. Having been informed that the petrol-reserve would only allow full-scale operations/warfare to a depth of 300km and for two months, [[ShapedLikeItself his team declared (at his prompting) that the war would be won in two months after they advanced to a depth of 300km]]. But they went on to assume that:

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* General Halder (Chief of the General Staff) ensured that the Wehrmacht's planning for ''[[UsefulNotes/WorldWarII Unternehmen Barbarossa'']] Barbarossa]]'' played this trope straight. Having been informed that the petrol-reserve would only allow full-scale operations/warfare to a depth of 300km and for two months, [[ShapedLikeItself his team declared (at his prompting) that the war would be won in two months after they advanced to a depth of 300km]]. But they went on to assume that:



* Pretty much played straight for America during WorldWarII by virtue of the US ''immense'' industrial potential (it took ''every single one of the other big players combined'' to surpass it, and it wasn't by much): they could produce all the supplies their forces and those of their allies needed and then some, ''and'' the ships to carry them on the combat theatre and the trucks to bring them to the troops, and, to make things even easier on logistics, they reduced the types of material produced as much as possible. It went to to the point that in the latter half of 1944 they had to ''slow down production'' because ''the war was ending too fast to use all the things they were producing''.

to:

* Pretty much played straight for America during WorldWarII UsefulNotes/WorldWarII by virtue of the US ''immense'' industrial potential (it took ''every single one of the other big players combined'' to surpass it, and it wasn't by much): they could produce all the supplies their forces and those of their allies needed and then some, ''and'' the ships to carry them on the combat theatre and the trucks to bring them to the troops, and, to make things even easier on logistics, they reduced the types of material produced as much as possible. It went to to the point that in the latter half of 1944 they had to ''slow down production'' because ''the war was ending too fast to use all the things they were producing''.
2nd Aug '16 3:48:25 AM Morgenthaler
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* Played with in the ''VideoGame/MechCommander'' series of the ''{{TabletopGame/BattleTech}}'', at least in the second game. While mechs can go on for miles without losing juice (since they're powered by [[AllThereInTheManual contained]], but [[GoingCritical volatile]] nuclear fusion reactors), their weapons are subject to ammo depletion and {{overheating}}. Replenishment of ammo and health requires the deployment of a Repair Truck. Suffice to say, the Repair Truck defies the repair unit stereotype hard. To repair and reload a mech, the mech in question must be immobilized and shut down first. And unlike [[BottomlessMagazines Bottomless Spare Parts]] repairers, each Repair Truck only carries a limited [[IncrediblyLamePun truck]]load of spare parts and ammo (called ''repair resources''), meaning that once the Repair Truck runs out of resources left to spend, you're not getting that Truck back. But what makes it Easy Logistics: the Repair Truck seemingly has [[UniversalAmmunition only one kind of repair resource]] -- whether it's a damaged limb that needs to be fixed or a gun that needs to be reloaded, it's all taken cared of by the same resource pool.

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* Played with in the ''VideoGame/MechCommander'' series of the ''{{TabletopGame/BattleTech}}'', at least in the second game. While mechs can go on for miles without losing juice (since they're powered by [[AllThereInTheManual contained]], but [[GoingCritical volatile]] nuclear fusion reactors), their weapons are subject to ammo depletion and {{overheating}}. Replenishment of ammo and health requires the deployment of a Repair Truck. Suffice to say, the Repair Truck defies the repair unit stereotype hard. To repair and reload a mech, the mech in question must be immobilized and shut down first. And unlike [[BottomlessMagazines Bottomless Spare Parts]] repairers, each Repair Truck only carries a limited [[IncrediblyLamePun truck]]load truckload of spare parts and ammo (called ''repair resources''), meaning that once the Repair Truck runs out of resources left to spend, you're not getting that Truck back. But what makes it Easy Logistics: the Repair Truck seemingly has [[UniversalAmmunition only one kind of repair resource]] -- whether it's a damaged limb that needs to be fixed or a gun that needs to be reloaded, it's all taken cared of by the same resource pool.
2nd Aug '16 3:48:09 AM Morgenthaler
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* In ''EnemyNations'', this is played straight for fighting units (which never run out of ammo or fuel), but averted for the game's CommandAndConquerEconomy. Individual trucks have to actually carry resources from mines to refineries, from refineries to factories, and even to construction sites for new buildings, in order for anything to get done. These trucks run automatically (and have mostly-decent AI), but can also be controlled directly by the player. If a truck gets destroyed en route, you lose everything it was carrying, and your refineries and factories will sit idle until supply is re-established. A good network of roads, and the protection of all elements in the supply chain, are important to victory.

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* In ''EnemyNations'', ''VideoGame/EnemyNations'', this is played straight for fighting units (which never run out of ammo or fuel), but averted for the game's CommandAndConquerEconomy. Individual trucks have to actually carry resources from mines to refineries, from refineries to factories, and even to construction sites for new buildings, in order for anything to get done. These trucks run automatically (and have mostly-decent AI), but can also be controlled directly by the player. If a truck gets destroyed en route, you lose everything it was carrying, and your refineries and factories will sit idle until supply is re-established. A good network of roads, and the protection of all elements in the supply chain, are important to victory.



* Played with in the ''MechCommander'' series of the ''{{TabletopGame/BattleTech}}'', at least in the second game. While mechs can go on for miles without losing juice (since they're powered by [[AllThereInTheManual contained]], but [[GoingCritical volatile]] nuclear fusion reactors), their weapons are subject to ammo depletion and {{overheating}}. Replenishment of ammo and health requires the deployment of a Repair Truck. Suffice to say, the Repair Truck defies the repair unit stereotype hard. To repair and reload a mech, the mech in question must be immobilized and shut down first. And unlike [[BottomlessMagazines Bottomless Spare Parts]] repairers, each Repair Truck only carries a limited [[IncrediblyLamePun truck]]load of spare parts and ammo (called ''repair resources''), meaning that once the Repair Truck runs out of resources left to spend, you're not getting that Truck back. But what makes it Easy Logistics: the Repair Truck seemingly has [[UniversalAmmunition only one kind of repair resource]] -- whether it's a damaged limb that needs to be fixed or a gun that needs to be reloaded, it's all taken cared of by the same resource pool.

to:

* Played with in the ''MechCommander'' ''VideoGame/MechCommander'' series of the ''{{TabletopGame/BattleTech}}'', at least in the second game. While mechs can go on for miles without losing juice (since they're powered by [[AllThereInTheManual contained]], but [[GoingCritical volatile]] nuclear fusion reactors), their weapons are subject to ammo depletion and {{overheating}}. Replenishment of ammo and health requires the deployment of a Repair Truck. Suffice to say, the Repair Truck defies the repair unit stereotype hard. To repair and reload a mech, the mech in question must be immobilized and shut down first. And unlike [[BottomlessMagazines Bottomless Spare Parts]] repairers, each Repair Truck only carries a limited [[IncrediblyLamePun truck]]load of spare parts and ammo (called ''repair resources''), meaning that once the Repair Truck runs out of resources left to spend, you're not getting that Truck back. But what makes it Easy Logistics: the Repair Truck seemingly has [[UniversalAmmunition only one kind of repair resource]] -- whether it's a damaged limb that needs to be fixed or a gun that needs to be reloaded, it's all taken cared of by the same resource pool.
31st Jul '16 3:57:19 PM UmbrellasWereAwesome
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* {{Subverted}} or {{Averted}} at multiple points in the ‘‘Anime/{{Macross}}’’ franchise:
** Any Zentraedi fleet has many planetoid-sized [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin Factory Satellites]] to keep it supplied, so they should play it straight. The problem is, [[{{Precursors}} the Protoculture]], [[GenreSavvy fearing their slave soldiers would one day rebel]], willingly weakened the Zentraedi by denying them the technical know-how necessary to maintain and repair their ships or reverse-engineer existing design. As the Zentraedi rebelled and wiped out Protoculture 500,000 years ago, modern Zentraedi ships get in progressively worse conditions as they’re used, don’t have access to [[NuclearWeaponsTaboo reaction weapons]] because all the Factory Satellites producing them were wiped out and they’ve long ran out of their supplies, and at least the fleet appearing in ‘‘Anime/SuperDimensionFortressMacross’’ depends on a limited supply for the Glaug officer pod due their Satellite for that one getting destroyed too. The NUN Spacy stealing all the surviving Factory Satellites of the fleet appearing in the original series after destroying it and NUN colony fleets stealing any Factory Satellite they stumble upon doesn’t improve things.
** Averted in ‘‘Anime/MacrossDelta’’: [[PrivateMilitaryContractor Chaos]] cannot launch an immediate counteroffensive after Windermere [[spoiler:conquers the whole Brisingr Cluster]] because they’ve used up almost all their munitions in the last battle and, with their employers, [[spoiler:the worlds of the Brisingr Cluster, having been overran]] and thus being unable to pay, cannot buy more nor the spare parts to repair th refugee ship: being mercenaries and not government military, Chaos doesn’t have direct access to the Factory Satellites but has to buy all their weapons and munitions. This gets solved when a mining consortium with interests in the Brisingr Cluster hire them to [[spoiler:reconquer it]], but even then they have to wait until the supplies show up.

to:

* {{Subverted}} or {{Averted}} at multiple points in the ‘‘Anime/{{Macross}}’’ ''Anime/{{Macross}}'' franchise:
** Any Zentraedi fleet has many planetoid-sized [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin Factory Satellites]] to keep it supplied, so they should play it straight. The problem is, [[{{Precursors}} the Protoculture]], [[GenreSavvy fearing their slave soldiers would one day rebel]], willingly weakened the Zentraedi by denying them the technical know-how necessary to maintain and repair their ships or reverse-engineer existing design. designs. As the Zentraedi rebelled and wiped out the Protoculture 500,000 years ago, modern Zentraedi ships get in degrade into progressively worse conditions as they’re used, and don’t have access to [[NuclearWeaponsTaboo reaction weapons]] because all the Factory Satellites producing them were wiped out and they’ve long ran run out of their supplies, and preexisting supplies. Additionally, at least the fleet appearing in ‘‘Anime/SuperDimensionFortressMacross’’ depends on ''Anime/SuperDimensionFortressMacross'' is shown to have only a limited supply for the of Glaug officer pod pods due to their Satellite for that one getting destroyed too. The NUN New UN Spacy stealing all the surviving Factory Satellites of the fleet appearing in the original series after destroying it and NUN colony fleets stealing any Factory Satellite they stumble upon doesn’t improve things.
(including those of the Zentraedi fleet they defeated in the original series) isn't helping the situation of independent Zentraedi fleets either, though those who have allied with humanity have benefited from the latter's technical know-how.
** Averted in ‘‘Anime/MacrossDelta’’: ''Anime/MacrossDelta'': [[PrivateMilitaryContractor Chaos]] cannot launch an immediate counteroffensive after Windermere [[spoiler:conquers the whole Brisingr Cluster]] because they’ve they've used up almost all their munitions in the last battle and, with their employers, [[spoiler:the employers[[spoiler:, the worlds of the Brisingr Cluster, having been overran]] overrun and thus thus]] being unable to pay, cannot buy more nor any more, much less afford the spare parts to repair th their refugee ship: being mercenaries and not government military, Chaos doesn’t have direct access to the New UN's Factory Satellites but has to buy all their weapons and munitions. This gets solved when a mining consortium with interests in the Brisingr Cluster hire them to [[spoiler:reconquer [[spoiler:retake it]], but even then they have to wait until the supplies show up.
31st Jul '16 7:31:21 AM EDP
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* Averted in ''Anime/MacrossDelta'': after [[spoiler:Windermere successfully conquer the Brisingr Cluster]], [[PrivateMilitaryContractor Chaos]] cannot launch a counteroffensive because they expended most of their munitions in the previous battle and, with their employers [[spoiler: overran by Windermere]], don't have the money to buy more ''or'' the spare parts for the damaged Island ship with civilian refugees until a mining consortium with interests in the cluster doesn't hire them.

to:

* {{Subverted}} or {{Averted}} at multiple points in the ‘‘Anime/{{Macross}}’’ franchise:
** Any Zentraedi fleet has many planetoid-sized [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin Factory Satellites]] to keep it supplied, so they should play it straight. The problem is, [[{{Precursors}} the Protoculture]], [[GenreSavvy fearing their slave soldiers would one day rebel]], willingly weakened the Zentraedi by denying them the technical know-how necessary to maintain and repair their ships or reverse-engineer existing design. As the Zentraedi rebelled and wiped out Protoculture 500,000 years ago, modern Zentraedi ships get in progressively worse conditions as they’re used, don’t have access to [[NuclearWeaponsTaboo reaction weapons]] because all the Factory Satellites producing them were wiped out and they’ve long ran out of their supplies, and at least the fleet appearing in ‘‘Anime/SuperDimensionFortressMacross’’ depends on a limited supply for the Glaug officer pod due their Satellite for that one getting destroyed too. The NUN Spacy stealing all the surviving Factory Satellites of the fleet appearing in the original series after destroying it and NUN colony fleets stealing any Factory Satellite they stumble upon doesn’t improve things.
**
Averted in ''Anime/MacrossDelta'': after [[spoiler:Windermere successfully conquer the Brisingr Cluster]], ‘‘Anime/MacrossDelta’’: [[PrivateMilitaryContractor Chaos]] cannot launch a an immediate counteroffensive after Windermere [[spoiler:conquers the whole Brisingr Cluster]] because they expended most of they’ve used up almost all their munitions in the previous last battle and, with their employers [[spoiler: overran by Windermere]], don't have employers, [[spoiler:the worlds of the money Brisingr Cluster, having been overran]] and thus being unable to pay, cannot buy more ''or'' nor the spare parts for to repair th refugee ship: being mercenaries and not government military, Chaos doesn’t have direct access to the damaged Island ship with civilian refugees until Factory Satellites but has to buy all their weapons and munitions. This gets solved when a mining consortium with interests in the cluster doesn't Brisingr Cluster hire them.
them to [[spoiler:reconquer it]], but even then they have to wait until the supplies show up.
31st Jul '16 6:50:35 AM EDP
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to:

* Averted in ''Anime/MacrossDelta'': after [[spoiler:Windermere successfully conquer the Brisingr Cluster]], [[PrivateMilitaryContractor Chaos]] cannot launch a counteroffensive because they expended most of their munitions in the previous battle and, with their employers [[spoiler: overran by Windermere]], don't have the money to buy more ''or'' the spare parts for the damaged Island ship with civilian refugees until a mining consortium with interests in the cluster doesn't hire them.
31st Jul '16 6:42:18 AM EDP
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to:

* Pretty much played straight for America during WorldWarII by virtue of the US ''immense'' industrial potential (it took ''every single one of the other big players combined'' to surpass it, and it wasn't by much): they could produce all the supplies their forces and those of their allies needed and then some, ''and'' the ships to carry them on the combat theatre and the trucks to bring them to the troops, and, to make things even easier on logistics, they reduced the types of material produced as much as possible. It went to to the point that in the latter half of 1944 they had to ''slow down production'' because ''the war was ending too fast to use all the things they were producing''.
24th Jul '16 5:44:27 PM nombretomado
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* ''CompanyOfHeroes'' uses a territory control resource model like ''VideoGame/DawnOfWar'', from the same studio. In its case, if a territory section doesn't have a continuous chain of captured sections linking it back to headquarters, it doesn't add any resources to the pool until the lines are connected. The supply of ammo and fuel to individual units on the field is rolled into the resource model: fuel and munitions are generic, and using special abilities or getting individual upgrades like hand grenades and sub-machine guns respectively use up munitions while buying advanced units and global upgrades use up fuel (and what you get permanently with both resources does not cause more upkeep on the resource to maintain, though having units causes an upkeep reducing your income on the separate manpower resource). Units must be next to a reinforcement area in order to replace their missing squad members (such as your headquarters or a forward barracks), but a single halftrack on a distant corner of the map can provide a reinforcement area to replenish numerous devastated squads repeatedly just so long as you have the manpower resource to do so (the actual vehicles tend to hold up to ten passengers at best, on that note). In the case of paratroops, they are allowed to reinforce anywhere, with the replacements dropped one at a time from wave after wave of apparently-underloaded cargo planes.

to:

* ''CompanyOfHeroes'' ''VideoGame/CompanyOfHeroes'' uses a territory control resource model like ''VideoGame/DawnOfWar'', from the same studio. In its case, if a territory section doesn't have a continuous chain of captured sections linking it back to headquarters, it doesn't add any resources to the pool until the lines are connected. The supply of ammo and fuel to individual units on the field is rolled into the resource model: fuel and munitions are generic, and using special abilities or getting individual upgrades like hand grenades and sub-machine guns respectively use up munitions while buying advanced units and global upgrades use up fuel (and what you get permanently with both resources does not cause more upkeep on the resource to maintain, though having units causes an upkeep reducing your income on the separate manpower resource). Units must be next to a reinforcement area in order to replace their missing squad members (such as your headquarters or a forward barracks), but a single halftrack on a distant corner of the map can provide a reinforcement area to replenish numerous devastated squads repeatedly just so long as you have the manpower resource to do so (the actual vehicles tend to hold up to ten passengers at best, on that note). In the case of paratroops, they are allowed to reinforce anywhere, with the replacements dropped one at a time from wave after wave of apparently-underloaded cargo planes.
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