History Main / ActualPacifist

17th Apr '16 2:33:31 PM SoapheadChurch
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* Mohandas Gandhi has this reputation, [[SubvertedTrope but the reality is much more complicated.]] While he stopped the first Indo-Pakistan war by going on hunger-strike and successfully helped to end British imperialism in India non-violently, his non-violence was more of a tactic than an ethos. In the case of Britain, it was more that he was never capable of acquiring the weapons necessary for the revolution through force that he initially wanted, so a peaceful one was the next-best thing for him. Philosophically, he leaned towards the MartialPacifist, and considered violence preferable to passive acceptance.[[note]][[Gandhi's philosophy of non-violent civil disobedience is frequently mistranslated as "passive resistance," but is more accurately rendered "militant non-violence."]][[/note]]. His ''ahimsa'' demanded that its followers actively work to counteract violence, and espoused the use of force in the immediate defense of others. He is, however, on record stating that he firmly believed [[SuicidalPacifism the Allies should have surrendered to the Germans rather than allow WWII to happen and that the Jews should have committed suicide instead of "allowing themselves" to be taken prisoner.]] However, this may have been because he, like many others, overestimated Hitler's humanity, and assumed that WWII was another senseless conflict between world powers like WWI.

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* Mohandas Gandhi UsefulNotes/MohandasGandhi has this reputation, [[SubvertedTrope but the reality is much more complicated.]] While he stopped the first Indo-Pakistan war by going on hunger-strike and successfully helped to end British imperialism in India non-violently, his non-violence was more of a tactic than an ethos. In the case of Britain, it was more that he was never capable of acquiring the weapons necessary for the revolution through force that he initially wanted, so a peaceful one was the next-best thing for him. Philosophically, he leaned towards the MartialPacifist, and considered violence preferable to passive acceptance.[[note]][[Gandhi's [[note]]Gandhi's philosophy of non-violent civil disobedience is frequently mistranslated as "passive resistance," but is more accurately rendered "militant non-violence."]][[/note]]."[[/note]]. His ''ahimsa'' demanded that its followers actively work to counteract violence, and espoused the use of force in the immediate defense of others. He is, however, on record stating that he firmly believed [[SuicidalPacifism the Allies should have surrendered to the Germans rather than allow WWII to happen and that the Jews should have committed suicide instead of "allowing themselves" to be taken prisoner.]] However, this may have been because he, like many others, overestimated Hitler's humanity, and assumed that WWII was another senseless conflict between world powers like WWI.
9th Apr '16 5:10:13 PM eroock
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* In ''Film/AngelAndTheBadman'' (1947) Quirt Evans (JohnWayne) falls in love with Quaker Prudence Worth (Gail Russel) and foreswears his violent ways and quest to avenge the murder of his adoptive father. He almost backslides, but in the final confrontation with the man responsible, Laredo Stevens, Prudence convinces Quirt to lay down his gun. [[spoiler: Stevens then attempts to shoot Evans, who would have been killed if not for the timely intervention of the sheriff (Harry Carey, Sr.).]] Some critics say that here Prudence Worth succeeded where her coreligionist Amy Kane (Creator/GraceKelly) would fail in ''HighNoon''. The pacifist theme this Western is a bit unexpected given John Wayne's popular image, but he not only played the lead, but also produced it.

to:

* In ''Film/AngelAndTheBadman'' (1947) Quirt Evans (JohnWayne) falls in love with Quaker Prudence Worth (Gail Russel) and foreswears his violent ways and quest to avenge the murder of his adoptive father. He almost backslides, but in the final confrontation with the man responsible, Laredo Stevens, Prudence convinces Quirt to lay down his gun. [[spoiler: Stevens then attempts to shoot Evans, who would have been killed if not for the timely intervention of the sheriff (Harry Carey, Sr.).]] Some critics say that here Prudence Worth succeeded where her coreligionist Amy Kane (Creator/GraceKelly) would fail in ''HighNoon''.''Film/HighNoon''. The pacifist theme this Western is a bit unexpected given John Wayne's popular image, but he not only played the lead, but also produced it.



* In ''HighNoon'' (1952), the marshall (Gary Cooper) has just retired and married a pacifist Quaker (Grace Kelly) -- which is sort of a problem 'cause a gang of indignant baddies has just come back to town and they want revenge. [[spoiler: This makes for extra drama when his Quaker bride, after protesting his heroics and leaving him because of his choice to stay and fight, comes back just in time and kills a man to save her man]].
* Terrence Mann in ''FieldOfDreams''. When he's reminded so by Ray, he stops short of "beat[ing Ray] with a crowbar until you go away" and drops the crowbar.

to:

* In ''HighNoon'' ''Film/HighNoon'' (1952), the marshall (Gary Cooper) has just retired and married a pacifist Quaker (Grace Kelly) -- which is sort of a problem 'cause a gang of indignant baddies has just come back to town and they want revenge. [[spoiler: This makes for extra drama when his Quaker bride, after protesting his heroics and leaving him because of his choice to stay and fight, comes back just in time and kills a man to save her man]].
* Terrence Mann in ''FieldOfDreams''.''Film/FieldOfDreams''. When he's reminded so by Ray, he stops short of "beat[ing Ray] with a crowbar until you go away" and drops the crowbar.
27th Mar '16 12:09:43 PM SoapheadChurch
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* Mohandas Gandhi has this reputation, [[SubvertedTrope but the reality is much more complicated.]] While he stopped the first Indo-Pakistan war by going on hunger-strike and successfully helped to end British imperialism in India non-violently, his non-violence was more of a tactic than an ethos. In the case of Britain, it was more that he was never capable of acquiring the weapons necessary for the revolution through force that he initially wanted, so a peaceful one was the next-best thing for him. Philosophically, he leaned towards the MartialPacifist, and considered violence preferable to passive acceptance.[[note]][[Gandhi's philosophy of non-violent civil disobedience is frequently mistranslated as "passive resistance," but is more accurately rendered "militant non-violence."]][[/note]]. His ''ahimsa'' demanded that its followers actively work to counteract violence, and espoused the use of force in the immediate defense of others. He is, however, on record stating that he firmly believed [[SuicidalPacifism the Allies should have surrendered to the Germans rather than allow WWII to happen and that the Jews should have committed suicide instead of "allowing themselves" to be taken prisoner.]]

to:

* Mohandas Gandhi has this reputation, [[SubvertedTrope but the reality is much more complicated.]] While he stopped the first Indo-Pakistan war by going on hunger-strike and successfully helped to end British imperialism in India non-violently, his non-violence was more of a tactic than an ethos. In the case of Britain, it was more that he was never capable of acquiring the weapons necessary for the revolution through force that he initially wanted, so a peaceful one was the next-best thing for him. Philosophically, he leaned towards the MartialPacifist, and considered violence preferable to passive acceptance.[[note]][[Gandhi's philosophy of non-violent civil disobedience is frequently mistranslated as "passive resistance," but is more accurately rendered "militant non-violence."]][[/note]]. His ''ahimsa'' demanded that its followers actively work to counteract violence, and espoused the use of force in the immediate defense of others. He is, however, on record stating that he firmly believed [[SuicidalPacifism the Allies should have surrendered to the Germans rather than allow WWII to happen and that the Jews should have committed suicide instead of "allowing themselves" to be taken prisoner.]]]] However, this may have been because he, like many others, overestimated Hitler's humanity, and assumed that WWII was another senseless conflict between world powers like WWI.
27th Mar '16 12:06:45 PM SoapheadChurch
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* Mohandas Gandhi has this reputation, [[SubvertedTrope but the reality is much more complicated.]] While he stopped the first Indo-Pakistan war by going on hunger-strike and successfully helped to end British imperialism in India non-violently, his non-violence was more of a tactic than an ethos. In the case of Britain, it was more that he was never capable of acquiring the weapons necessary for the revolution through force that he initially wanted, so a peaceful one was the next-best thing for him. Philosophically, he leaned towards the MartialPacifist, and considered violence preferable to passive acceptance. His ''ahimsa'' demanded that its followers actively work to counteract violence, and espoused the use of force in the immediate defense of others. He is, however, on record stating that he firmly believed [[SuicidalPacifism the Allies should have surrendered to the Germans rather than allow WWII to happen and that the Jews should have committed suicide instead of "allowing themselves" to be taken prisoner.]]

to:

* Mohandas Gandhi has this reputation, [[SubvertedTrope but the reality is much more complicated.]] While he stopped the first Indo-Pakistan war by going on hunger-strike and successfully helped to end British imperialism in India non-violently, his non-violence was more of a tactic than an ethos. In the case of Britain, it was more that he was never capable of acquiring the weapons necessary for the revolution through force that he initially wanted, so a peaceful one was the next-best thing for him. Philosophically, he leaned towards the MartialPacifist, and considered violence preferable to passive acceptance.[[note]][[Gandhi's philosophy of non-violent civil disobedience is frequently mistranslated as "passive resistance," but is more accurately rendered "militant non-violence."]][[/note]]. His ''ahimsa'' demanded that its followers actively work to counteract violence, and espoused the use of force in the immediate defense of others. He is, however, on record stating that he firmly believed [[SuicidalPacifism the Allies should have surrendered to the Germans rather than allow WWII to happen and that the Jews should have committed suicide instead of "allowing themselves" to be taken prisoner.]]
27th Mar '16 9:55:09 AM SoapheadChurch
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* Taoism was all about living in harmony with everything and respecting the right of others to live the way they choose. For the more violent branch. It even has [[ToWinWithoutFighting the tactic for a pacifist]] to win a war.

to:

* Taoism was all about living in harmony with everything and respecting the right of others to live the way they choose. For the more violent branch. It branch, it even has [[ToWinWithoutFighting the tactic for a pacifist]] to win a war.
27th Mar '16 9:43:51 AM SoapheadChurch
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* Mohandas Gandhi: [[CrowningMomentOfAwesome stopped the first Indo-Pakistan war]] by going on hunger-strike. And that's just the tip of the iceberg. Philosophically, however, he leaned towards the MartialPacifist, and considered violence preferable to passive acceptance. His ''ahimsa'' demanded that its followers actively work to counteract violence, and espoused the use of force in the immediate defense of others.
** He is, however, on record stating that he firmly believed [[SuicidalPacifism the Allies should have surrendered to the Germans rather than allow WWII to happen and that the Jews should have committed suicide instead of "allowing themselves" to be taken prisoner.]]
** In Gandhi's case, it was more that he was never capable of acquiring the weapons necessary for the revolution through force that he initially wanted, so a peaceful one was the next-best thing for him. Similar to St. Moses, Gandhi was a former BadAss - at one point he'd actually served in the British Army (in South Africa) and won a medal for his service.
*** Gandhi served as a medic and never carried a weapon.
* Martin Luther King, Jr, who took inspiration from Gandhi, also preached a message of non-violence, though he did believe that sometimes it was necessary.

to:

* Mohandas Gandhi: [[CrowningMomentOfAwesome Gandhi has this reputation, [[SubvertedTrope but the reality is much more complicated.]] While he stopped the first Indo-Pakistan war]] war by going on hunger-strike. And that's just hunger-strike and successfully helped to end British imperialism in India non-violently, his non-violence was more of a tactic than an ethos. In the tip case of Britain, it was more that he was never capable of acquiring the iceberg. weapons necessary for the revolution through force that he initially wanted, so a peaceful one was the next-best thing for him. Philosophically, however, he leaned towards the MartialPacifist, and considered violence preferable to passive acceptance. His ''ahimsa'' demanded that its followers actively work to counteract violence, and espoused the use of force in the immediate defense of others.
**
others. He is, however, on record stating that he firmly believed [[SuicidalPacifism the Allies should have surrendered to the Germans rather than allow WWII to happen and that the Jews should have committed suicide instead of "allowing themselves" to be taken prisoner.]]
** In Gandhi's case, it was more that he was never capable of acquiring the weapons necessary for the revolution through force that he initially wanted, so a peaceful one was the next-best thing for him. Similar to St. Moses, Gandhi was a former BadAss - at one point he'd actually served in the British Army (in South Africa) and won a medal for his service.
*** Gandhi served as a medic and never carried a weapon.
* Martin Luther King, Jr, who took inspiration from Gandhi, also preached a message of non-violence, though non-violence. Like Gandhi, however, he did believe that sometimes it violence was necessary.



* Christianity was originally innovative because, regardless of the reason violence is committed, it's thought of as an inherently bad thing for which one must atone. This was a radical concept a couple of millennia ago.
** Some sects of Christianity, typically ascetic ones such as the Quakers (Religious Society of Friends), are absolute pacifists, at least in their rhetoric.
* Taoism was all about living in harmony with everything and respecting the right of others to live the way they choose. The two most important Taoists (Lao Tzu, Chuang Tzu) were a libertarian and an anarchist, respectively.
** For the more violent branch. It even has [[ToWinWithoutFighting the tactic for a pacifist]] to win a war.

to:

* Christianity was originally innovative because, regardless of the reason violence is committed, it's thought of as an inherently bad thing for which one must atone. This was a radical concept a couple of millennia ago.
**
ago. Some sects of Christianity, typically ascetic ones such as the Quakers (Religious Society of Friends), are absolute pacifists, at least in their rhetoric.
ideology.
* Taoism was all about living in harmony with everything and respecting the right of others to live the way they choose. The two most important Taoists (Lao Tzu, Chuang Tzu) were a libertarian and an anarchist, respectively.
**
For the more violent branch. It even has [[ToWinWithoutFighting the tactic for a pacifist]] to win a war.
16th Mar '16 9:35:43 PM PaulA
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* In Tim Powers' ''Expiration Date'', Sullivan is forced to become this when the hands of Harry Houdini's ghost become permanently bonded to his own hands. The ghostly hands refuse to wield weapons or even play violent video games.

to:

* In Tim Powers' ''Expiration Date'', ''Literature/ExpirationDate'', Sullivan is forced to become this when the hands of Harry Houdini's ghost become permanently bonded to his own hands. The ghostly hands refuse to wield weapons or even play violent video games.
6th Mar '16 9:33:05 PM Eagal
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* Martin Luther King, Jr, who took inspiration from Gandhi.
** Then again, he is known to have owned a lot of firearms in order to defend his family with.

to:

* Martin Luther King, Jr, who took inspiration from Gandhi.
** Then again,
Gandhi, also preached a message of non-violence, though he is known to have owned a lot of firearms in order to defend his family with.did believe that sometimes it was necessary.
20th Feb '16 12:50:39 AM WanderingBrowser
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When they appear in more cynical works, Actual Pacifists may be used to bring up the FamilyUnfriendlyAesop that "sometimes, you ''need'' violence''.



* Doctor Leslie Thompkins in ''Franchise/{{Batman}}''.

to:

* Doctor Leslie Thompkins in ''Franchise/{{Batman}}''.''Franchise/{{Batman}}'' is a notorious example of this. She runs a clinic for the poor and desperate in Gotham and refuses to have anything to do with violence. She is a reluctant ally of Batman, but openly chides and scorns him for his willingness to actually hurt people like the Joker or various mooks in order to stop them from committing crimes.



* ''ComicBook/GIJoe'' has the medic, Lineline, who although he does have some training in non-combative martial arts like Judo for strict purposes of self-defense, is determined to never intentionally harm another person. Doc Greer is also an actual pacifist, [[spoiler: who gets killed trying to protect his injured colleagues in the field.]]
** Lifeline even gets mad at other people for using him to help them be violent, like when Roadblock told him to talk to a Cobra agent. While he was talking, Roadblock snuck behind the agent and knocked him out.
--> '''Lifeline''': Hey! You used me for violence!
** In an issue of ''G.I. Joe: Special Missions'', Lifeline is among a group of Joes ambushed by river pirates during a skirmish with the [[TheRival Oktober Guard]], and is forced into a duel to the death with [[TheBigGuy Horrorshow]]; winner gets to leave with the black box from a Cobra Firebat that the Joes had captured. Lifeline uses aikido to redirect Horrorshow's attacks and he wins the fight, but refuses to kill Horrorshow, instead asking for the lives of both teams and letting the pirates keep the black box. The pirate leader decides to throw away the box and let them all go, having been impressed that Lifeline had the courage of his convictions.



** Likewise, Moist von Lipwig is a con man and oftentimes MagnificentBastard who is nonetheless much more comfortable with being threatened by violence than the other way 'round. He never physically attacks anyone, and becomes extremely nervous when put into the position to freely do so.
*** He is so against violence that he's profoundly disturbed when his parole officer, the logical golem Mr. Pump, calculates his white-collar crimes have indirectly killed 2.338 people.

to:

** Likewise, Moist von Lipwig is a con man and oftentimes MagnificentBastard who is nonetheless much more comfortable with being threatened by violence than the other way 'round. He never physically attacks anyone, and becomes extremely nervous when put into the position to freely do so.
***
so. He is so against violence that he's profoundly disturbed when his parole officer, the logical golem Mr. Pump, calculates his white-collar crimes have indirectly killed 2.338 people.



* Cream The Rabbit does not physically engage in combat in ''VideoGame/SonicBattle''; all of her moves are done via her partner/pet Cheese. This pacifism comes to a particular head in her story mode: ''Neither'' Cream nor Cheese will fight their captors, [[ItsUpToYou leaving all of the combat duties]] to Emerl.

to:

* Cream The Rabbit does not physically engage in combat in ''VideoGame/SonicBattle''; all of her moves are done via her partner/pet Cheese. This pacifism comes to a particular head in her story mode: ''Neither'' Cream nor Cheese will fight their captors, [[ItsUpToYou leaving all of the combat duties]] to Emerl.Emerl, at least for the first few rounds, before she realises she's just endangering her friends and reluctantly steps up to def end her friends.



* It is possible to play an actual pacifist in both Fallout 1 and Fallout 2 by maxing out all of your social traits. You can even talk the final boss to death.

to:

* It is possible to play an actual pacifist in both Fallout 1 and Fallout 2 the first two games of ''Franchise/{{Fallout}}'' by maxing out all of your social traits. You can even talk the final boss to death.



%% * ''WebComic/{{Precocious}}'': Max, overtly. Yvette, possibly as well, though she is so timid it's hard to know what's in her head. Ursula almost certainly will be.

to:

%% * ''WebComic/{{Precocious}}'': Max, overtly. Yvette, possibly as well, though she is so timid it's hard to know what's in her head. Ursula almost certainly will be.



* Lifeline from ''GIJoe'' refused to employ violence. On one occasion, he wouldn't even touch a rifle, even though it was being held out for him to grab and pull him out of a trap.
** Which is a nod to the comic continuity, in which Doc Greer was an actual pacifist, [[spoiler: who was killed trying to protect his injured colleagues in the field.]]
** Lifeline even gets mad at other people for using him to help them be violent, like when Roadblock told him to talk to a cobra agent. While he was talking, Roadblock snuck behind the agent and knocked him out.
--> '''Lifeline''': Hey! You used me for violence!
** In an issue of ''G.I. Joe: Special Missions'', Lifeline is among a group of Joes ambushed by river pirates during a skirmish with the [[TheRival Oktober Guard]], and is forced into a duel to the death with [[TheBigGuy Horrorshow]]; winner gets to leave with the black box from a Cobra Firebat that the Joes had captured. Lifeline uses aikido to redirect Horrorshow's attacks and he wins the fight, but refuses to kill Horrorshow, instead asking for the lives of both teams and letting the pirates keep the black box. The pirate leader decides to throw away the box and let them all go, having been impressed that Lifeline had the courage of his convictions.

to:

* Lifeline from ''GIJoe'' ''WesternAnimation/GIJoeARealAmericanHero'' refused to employ violence. On one occasion, he wouldn't even touch a rifle, even though it was being held out for him to grab and pull him out of a trap.
** Which
trap. This is a nod to based on his counterpart from the comic continuity, in which Doc Greer was comics - see above. Exactly what an actual pacifist, [[spoiler: who was killed trying to protect his injured colleagues in ActualPacifist is doing as part of a ''front-line Anti-Terrorist Combat Force'' is never really explained, but it's implied he basically is only part of the field.]]
** Lifeline even gets mad at other people for using him
Joes to always be there to help them be violent, like out when Roadblock told him Cobra attacks.
** His father, a priest, is an even stricter pacifist. Thanks
to talk to a cobra agent. While he was talking, Roadblock snuck behind the agent and knocked him out.
--> '''Lifeline''': Hey! You used me for violence!
** In an issue of ''G.
Lifeline's joining G.I. Joe: Special Missions'', Lifeline is among a group of Joes ambushed by river pirates during a skirmish with the [[TheRival Oktober Guard]], and is forced into a duel Joe, he considers his son to the death with [[TheBigGuy Horrorshow]]; winner gets to leave with the black box from be ''a violent thug no better than a Cobra Firebat that the Joes had captured. Lifeline uses aikido to redirect Horrorshow's attacks and he wins the fight, but refuses to kill Horrorshow, instead asking for the lives of both teams and letting the pirates keep the black box. The pirate leader decides to throw away the box and let them all go, having been impressed that Lifeline had the courage of his convictions.agent''.
14th Feb '16 11:45:47 AM intastiel
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* ''TabletopGame/DungeonsAndDragons'' has the "Vow of Non-Violence" And "Vow of Peace", the first makes you into a TechnicalPacifist, the latter into an * actual* one.
** Eldath, a goddess from the ''ForgottenRealms'' Campaign setting also forbids her clerics from violence.
** Not to forget the Prestige Class also from the ''Book of Exalted Deeds'', the Apostle of Peace, which requires characters to take both the vows above as well as the Vow of Poverty (foregoing material wealth and possessions save for plain clothing, a day's worth of food, and a simple weapon). The class gives you abilities such as turning undead (who are exempt from the Vow of Peace as non-living), the power to instantly pacify anger with a touch, and the power to tell fiends to go back to hell (and have them listen). The class also includes a spell list comprised of non-offensive spells that might help you wage peace. It is noted that Player Character Apostles of Peace would be difficult, but not impossible given the right kind of party, since not only are they not allowed to employ violence, their companions aren't either. Players tend to balk at allowing someone into a group [[StupidGood whose moral code affects the rest of the party's behavior]]. Otherwise, they make good spiritual advisor [=NPCs=].
*** Also, the Vow of Peace allows for non-lethal damage to be dished out to living enemies, which moves the feat out of the area of this trope depending on how [[GoodIsNotNice willing a particular character is to use this loophole]].

to:

* ''TabletopGame/DungeonsAndDragons'' has In ''TabletopGame/DungeonsAndDragons'':
** The goddess Eldath from
the ''TabletopGame/ForgottenRealms'' setting forbids her clerics from violence.
** The
"Vow of Non-Violence" And "Vow of Peace", the first makes you into a TechnicalPacifist, the latter into an * actual* one.
** Eldath, a goddess from the ''ForgottenRealms'' Campaign setting also forbids her clerics from violence.
** Not
Peace" are intended to forget the Prestige Class also from the ''Book of Exalted Deeds'', lead towards this, as exemplified by the Apostle of Peace, which requires characters to take both the vows above as well as the Vow of Poverty (foregoing Peace PrestigeClass: they forsake violence and material wealth and possessions save in exchange for plain clothing, a day's worth of food, and a simple weapon). The class gives you healing abilities such as turning undead (who are exempt from the Vow of Peace as non-living), the power to instantly pacify anger with a touch, and the power to tell fiends to go back to hell (and have them listen). The class also includes a spell list comprised of non-offensive spells that might help you wage peace. It is noted that Player Character Apostles of Peace would be difficult, but not impossible given the right kind of party, since not only are they not allowed to employ violence, their companions aren't either. Players tend to balk at allowing someone defensive powers. However, those lofty holy vows don't prohibit ''non''lethal damage, so [[TechnicalPacifist beating people into a group [[StupidGood whose moral code affects the rest of the party's behavior]]. Otherwise, they make good spiritual advisor [=NPCs=].
*** Also, the Vow of Peace allows for non-lethal damage to be dished out to living enemies, which moves the feat out of the area of this trope depending on how [[GoodIsNotNice willing a particular character
unconsciousness]] is to use this loophole]].fair game.
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