History Literature / Dune

16th Aug '17 8:34:48 PM hollowboy
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* MacGuffin: The spice is largely a MacGuffin, since the majority of what makes it valuable and highly contested (the geriatric properties) are not supported in 'verse. The Fremen don't have long lifespans, and no character of the original trilogy is described as being unusually old, or even references someone who is. The only demonstrated (mind altering) properties of the spice are useful only for a very limited group.

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* MacGuffin: The spice is largely a MacGuffin, since the majority of what makes it valuable and highly contested (the geriatric properties) are not supported in 'verse. The Fremen don't have long lifespans, and no character of the original trilogy is described as being unusually old, or even references someone who is. The only demonstrated (mind altering) demonstrated, mind altering, properties of the spice are useful only for to a very limited group.
16th Aug '17 8:29:46 PM hollowboy
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** A general rule on Arrakis, as a ploy for being able to fight someone regardless of whether he's foolhardy enough to carry a working personal shield generator or not. Unlike lasguns, kinetic firearms fire projectiles that can always penetrate a personal shield without fear of causing a miniature nuclear explosion. This makes them ideal for fighting shielded and unshielded infantry alike. It is explicitly mentioned numerous times that Fremen [[GenreSavvy prefer to use]] [[FlechetteStorm spring-loaded dartguns]], [[AutomaticCrossbows crossbow-like guns]], or [[KineticWeaponsAreJustBetter just plain old gunpowder firearms]].

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** A general rule on Arrakis, as a ploy for being able to fight someone regardless of whether he's foolhardy enough to carry a working personal shield generator or not. Unlike lasguns, kinetic firearms fire projectiles that can always penetrate strike a personal shield without fear of causing a miniature nuclear explosion. This makes them ideal for fighting shielded and unshielded infantry alike. It is explicitly mentioned numerous times that Fremen [[GenreSavvy prefer to use]] [[FlechetteStorm spring-loaded dartguns]], [[AutomaticCrossbows crossbow-like guns]], or [[KineticWeaponsAreJustBetter just plain old gunpowder firearms]].
16th Aug '17 8:18:54 PM hollowboy
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* DrawSwordDrawBlood: The Fremen consider re-sheathing a crysknife without drawing blood to be a very grave offense.

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* DrawSwordDrawBlood: The Fremen consider re-sheathing a crysknife without drawing blood to be a very grave offense. Very unevenly applied: by the end of the original trilogy, there have been multiple scenes where a crysknife is unsheathed and not blooded, with no comment made. This is possibly done to demonstrate the rapid corruption of Fremen culture.
16th Aug '17 8:03:42 PM hollowboy
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* MacGuffin: The spice is largely a MacGuffin, since the majority of what makes it valuable and highly contested (the geriatric properties) are not supported in 'verse. The Fremen don't have long lifespans, and no character of the original trilogy is described as being unusually old, or even references someone who is. The only demonstrated (mind altering) properties of the spice are useful only for a very limited group.
16th Aug '17 7:53:54 PM hollowboy
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** If we count non-firearm weapons as well, bladed melee weapons count in general in the 'verse. Though thrusting even a simple dagger through a personal shield takes practice, it is an effective enough fighting method. It allows the essentially medieval melee weapons of the setting to stay relevant in infantry warfare. Then again, on planets like Arrakis, where personal shields are too risky ([[BerserkButton because they drive sandworms crazy]]), tactics change accordingly -- with [[SwordAndGun melee weapons and firearms being used in roughly equal measure]].

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** If we count non-firearm weapons as well, bladed melee weapons count in general in the 'verse. Though thrusting even a simple dagger through a personal shield takes practice, it is an effective enough fighting method.method (since nobody, in 'verse, combines a personal shield with conventional body armour capable of halting a dagger). It allows the essentially medieval melee weapons of the setting to stay relevant in infantry warfare. Then again, on planets like Arrakis, where personal shields are too risky ([[BerserkButton because they drive sandworms crazy]]), tactics change accordingly -- with [[SwordAndGun melee weapons and firearms being used in roughly equal measure]].
16th Aug '17 7:49:43 PM hollowboy
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** Baron Harkonnen calls this out specifically during the assault on Arrakis, where he boasts of resurrecting artillery to counteract the shields the Atreides troops were expected to use.

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** Baron Harkonnen calls this out specifically during the assault on Arrakis, where he boasts of resurrecting artillery to counteract the shields the Atreides troops were expected to use.use, [[spoiler:which is possibly a partial aversion, since the artillery is only useful in a very conditional way: he uses it to attack the caves in which the troops sheltered, rather than attacking the shielded troops directly]]
** Oddly, nobody calls this out by resurrecting bullzozers, or any other (completely mundane) method to counteract shields and thereby overcome the era's extreme tactical stasis.
9th Aug '17 6:45:49 AM jormis29
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* From the early 1970's on, several disastrous attempts were made to produce a theatrical film. Cult Argentinian director Creator/AlejandroJodorowsky (known for incredibly bizarre, unsettling films such as ''Film/ElTopo'' and ''Film/TheHolyMountain'') forced his way onto the project after having never read the book, and decided to ignore the book almost completely in favor of his own vision. Convinced that he could "rape Frank Herbert with love", he resolved to make '''a movie based on his dream,''' with a few random, minor ideas from the book itself thrown in to connect it in ''some'' way to the book (that's not hyperbole, that was his stated agenda). [[WhatCouldHaveBeen Inevitably, it was too insane and weirdly ambitious (and far over budget) to ever get off the ground.]] The 2014 documentary ''Alejandro Jodorowsky's Dune'' is a look into what Jodorowsky envisioned.

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* From the early 1970's on, several disastrous attempts were made to produce a theatrical film. Cult Argentinian director Creator/AlejandroJodorowsky (known for incredibly bizarre, unsettling films such as ''Film/ElTopo'' and ''Film/TheHolyMountain'') forced his way onto the project after having never read the book, and decided to ignore the book almost completely in favor of his own vision. Convinced that he could "rape Frank Herbert with love", he resolved to make '''a movie based on his dream,''' with a few random, minor ideas from the book itself thrown in to connect it in ''some'' way to the book (that's not hyperbole, that was his stated agenda). [[WhatCouldHaveBeen Inevitably, it was too insane and weirdly ambitious (and far over budget) to ever get off the ground.]] The 2014 documentary ''Alejandro Jodorowsky's Dune'' ''Film/JodorowskysDune'' is a look into what Jodorowsky envisioned.
6th Aug '17 11:03:58 PM hollowboy
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12th Jul '17 5:35:06 PM Pred3000
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* From the early 1970's on, several disastrous attempts were made to produce a theatrical film. Cult Argentinian director Creator/AlejandroJodorowsky (known for incredibly bizarre, unsettling films such as ''Film/ElTopo'' and ''Film/TheHolyMountain'') forced his way onto the project after having never read the book, and decided to ignore the book almost completely in favor of his own vision. Convinced that he could "rape Frank Herbert with love", he resolved to make '''a movie based on his dream,''' with a few random, minor ideas from the book itself thrown in to connect it in ''some'' way to the book (that's not hyperbole, that was his stated agenda). [[WhatCouldHaveBeen Inevitably, it was too insane and weirdly ambitious (and far over budget) to ever get off the ground.]] The 2014 documentary ''Alejandro Jodorowsky's Dune'' is a look into what Jodorowsky envisioned, but thankfully, never was.

* Once Jodorowsky's "vision" fell apart, the producers turned to a young, upstart new director who had been considered for ''[[StarWars Return of the Jedi]],'' mostly on the strength of his classic [[Film/{{Eraserhead}} first film]] and a critically and commercially successful [[Film/TheElephantMan biopic]] which made him a popular commodity in the industry. The man's name: Creator/DavidLynch, who took the project and made it his own bizzare opus, but to a far more faithful extent than Jodorowsky would have. Due to his alien style and the sheer scale of the book, the already-complex narrative became nearly incomprehensible to some viewers; many theaters handed out [[AllThereInTheManual printed plot summaries]] to patrons. The 1984 Lynch version of ''Film/{{Dune}}'' is the most memorable (and notorious) for its Freudian imagery, [[SceneryPorn elaborate set design]] (containing some holdovers from the Jodorowsky version, including Giger's designs), and AllStarCast. Subsequent recut and extended versions have inspired [[BrokenBase varying]] degrees of critical [[LoveItOrHateIt reappraisal]]. Its box office revenues were lower than movie's substantial budget however, and has become both a CultClassic, and an example of how ''not'' to make a blockbuster.

to:

* From the early 1970's on, several disastrous attempts were made to produce a theatrical film. Cult Argentinian director Creator/AlejandroJodorowsky (known for incredibly bizarre, unsettling films such as ''Film/ElTopo'' and ''Film/TheHolyMountain'') forced his way onto the project after having never read the book, and decided to ignore the book almost completely in favor of his own vision. Convinced that he could "rape Frank Herbert with love", he resolved to make '''a movie based on his dream,''' with a few random, minor ideas from the book itself thrown in to connect it in ''some'' way to the book (that's not hyperbole, that was his stated agenda). [[WhatCouldHaveBeen Inevitably, it was too insane and weirdly ambitious (and far over budget) to ever get off the ground.]] The 2014 documentary ''Alejandro Jodorowsky's Dune'' is a look into what Jodorowsky envisioned, but thankfully, never was.

envisioned.

* Once Jodorowsky's "vision" vision fell apart, the producers turned to a young, upstart new director who had been considered for ''[[StarWars Return of the Jedi]],'' mostly on the strength of his classic [[Film/{{Eraserhead}} first film]] and a critically and commercially successful [[Film/TheElephantMan biopic]] which made him a popular commodity in the industry. The man's name: Creator/DavidLynch, who took the project and made it his own bizzare opus, but to a far more faithful extent than Jodorowsky would have. Due to his alien style and the sheer scale of the book, the already-complex narrative became nearly incomprehensible to some viewers; many theaters handed out [[AllThereInTheManual printed plot summaries]] to patrons. The 1984 Lynch version of ''Film/{{Dune}}'' is the most memorable (and notorious) for its Freudian imagery, [[SceneryPorn elaborate set design]] (containing some holdovers from the Jodorowsky version, including Giger's designs), and AllStarCast. Subsequent recut and extended versions have inspired [[BrokenBase varying]] degrees of critical [[LoveItOrHateIt reappraisal]]. Its box office revenues were lower than movie's substantial budget however, and has become both a CultClassic, and an example of how ''not'' to make a blockbuster.
21st Apr '17 7:05:44 PM direguy
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* KillAllHumans: Ominus programmed the Thinking Machines into this mode.
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