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History Headscratchers / ThePrincessBride

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*** Seconded. If you think that this movie has suspicuously many wacky one-scene characters and sidequests, try ''Film/MontyPythonAndTheHolyGrail''.

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*** Seconded. If you think that this movie has suspicuously suspiciously many wacky one-scene characters and sidequests, try ''Film/MontyPythonAndTheHolyGrail''.
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** Yes, but why would Vizzini have just made up that it was from Australia? It was Westley's iocane and there was every chance he knew where it was from. If he had said 'It's from America!' then Westley would have corrected him and he'd have appeared stupid. If Vizzini had not said anything about the origins, he would not have appeared stupid and randomly guessing had a very high probability of guessing wrong and then looking stupid. Vizzini may have read about iocane powder andn so when it was identified he knew where it originated from at least.

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** Yes, but why would Vizzini have just made up that it was from Australia? It was Westley's iocane and there was every chance he knew where it was from. If he had said 'It's from America!' then Westley would have corrected him and he'd have appeared stupid. If Vizzini had not said anything about the origins, he would not have appeared stupid and randomly guessing had a very high probability of guessing wrong and then looking stupid. Vizzini may have read about iocane powder andn and so when it was identified he knew where it originated from at least.
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** OR, being the hopeless romantic that he is, he did it out of love and then heartbreak. Initially, if the Dread Pirate Roberts was threatening him with death daily, what use would it be to tell his love he was alive if he might die any day? Why give her false hope? By the time he was not threatened anymore and handed the title, he may have received the news of Buttercup's engagement (in the book, she spent three years at princess lessons, so it's possible) and convinced himself that, since she was going to marry someone else, she clearly was not waiting for him anymore, so it was no use to communicate with her and he might as well let her be happy with Prince Humperdink. He only went after her when she was kidnapped because, obviously, being kidnapped is not how you spend a happy life and he didn't want her prisoner o dead.

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** OR, being the hopeless romantic that he is, he did it out of love and then heartbreak. Initially, if the Dread Pirate Roberts was threatening him with death daily, what use would it be to tell his love he was alive if he might die any day? Why give her false hope? By the time he was not threatened anymore and handed the title, he may have received the news of Buttercup's engagement (in the book, she spent three years at princess lessons, so it's possible) and convinced himself that, since she was going to marry someone else, she clearly was not waiting for him anymore, so it was no use to communicate with her and he might as well let her be happy with Prince Humperdink. He only went after her when she was kidnapped because, obviously, being kidnapped is not how you spend a happy life and he didn't want her prisoner o or dead.

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** Your standard JRPGs and ''The Princess Bride'' share influences from similar sources, such as fairy tales and fantasy fiction, where such kind of exotic and unusual quests, characters and settings are commonplace.

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** Your standard JRPGs [=JRPGs=] and ''The Princess Bride'' share influences from similar sources, such as fairy tales and fantasy fiction, where such kind of exotic and unusual quests, characters and settings are commonplace. commonplace.
*** Seconded. If you think that this movie has suspicuously many wacky one-scene characters and sidequests, try ''Film/MontyPythonAndTheHolyGrail''.
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*** But the point is, from ''Westley's'' point of view it appears to be a 50/50 chance, since he's put the decision of which goblet to drink in Vizzini's hands. And Vizzini should have been suspicious that the MIB would willingly give control of the game to him when death is on the line. Vizzini, for all his purported cleverness, doesn't think outside the box.
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** In addition to other points, Inigo and the Man in Black spend a few moments chatting hospitably before they fight and come to develop a respect for each other. Perhaps Inigo is, at least initially, holding back a little out of regard for a newfound friend.
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*** Clarifying the DeliberateValuesDissonance, historically, there’s a difference between what used to be called an assassin (someone who kills in cold blood, not just someone who targets famous people) and someone who kills someone else in a fight, even a fight the killer started. This troper recalls two stories by Creator/GKChesterton in which someone killed someone else, a family member no less, with the protagonist reacting in horror — until it was explained that it was in a duel, which made it okay.
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** It's a {{Ruritania}}.
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[[/folder]]

[[folder: Is this Earth or a fantasy world?]]
*The main two countries in the story’s narrative are the fictional countries of Florin and Guilder. Now, these may just be fictionalized versions of Italy and Germany, as many have already theorized, but fictional countries all the same. But Vizzini is from Sicily, a very real country on Earth. So… Does the story take place on a fictional fantasy world or does it take place on Earth?
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*** Technically yes, but again -- the grandfather's just framing it that way to make it sound a bit special for his grandson. That doesn't make it ''actually'' a family tradition that's rigidly set in stone, the way this headscratcher is presuming (though it could certainly become one over time). The fact that this grandfather had this story read to him as a child and consequently decided to read it to his own son doesn't mean it's become a fixed-in-stone family rite-of-passage that a father ''must'' pass this story down to his son, and that a failure to do so is indicative only of a major family upheaval that means the father is either dead or absent. It simply means that the grandfather liked this story as a child, liked reading it to his son, and thought his grandson might like it as well. There are any number of possible reasons why the father never read it to him that don't hinge on him either being dead or absent. Maybe the father didn't really like it but didn't want to upset the grandfather. Maybe the boy's mother always read him a bedtime story instead of his father. Maybe the father always meant to but kept forgetting to get the book, and the grandfather finally decided it was a good opportunity to bring it around. Maybe the father ''asked'' the grandfather to read it to the boy because he thought the grandfather would tell it better. Heck, maybe this family simply didn't really do bedtime stories up to this point. There are any number of possible explanations.

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*** Technically yes, but again -- the grandfather's likely just framing it that way to make it sound a bit special for his grandson. That doesn't make it ''actually'' a family tradition that's rigidly set in stone, the way this headscratcher is presuming (though it could certainly become one over time). The fact that this grandfather had this story read to him as a child and consequently decided to read it to his own son doesn't mean it's become a fixed-in-stone family rite-of-passage that a father ''must'' pass this story down to his son, and that a failure to do so is indicative only of a major family upheaval that means the father is either dead or absent. It simply means that the grandfather liked this story as a child, liked reading it to his son, and thought his grandson might like it as well. There are any number of possible reasons why the father never read it to him that don't hinge on him either being dead or absent. Maybe the father didn't really like it but didn't want to upset the grandfather. Maybe the boy's mother always read him a bedtime story instead of his father. Maybe the father always meant to but kept forgetting to get the book, and the grandfather finally decided it was a good opportunity to bring it around. Maybe the father had forgotten this particular story (do you remember every story your parents read to you as a child?). Maybe the father ''asked'' the grandfather to read it to the boy because he thought the grandfather would tell it better. Heck, maybe this family simply didn't really do bedtime stories up to this point. There are any number of possible explanations.
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** Westley MAY be regaining his strength, but only gradually over time. Westly PROBABLY crawled through the corridors to get to the honeymoon suite (how EXACTLY he knew, don't ask me), and laid on the bed so he can rest until Buttercup arrives. When Westley does confront Humperdink, he DELIBERATELY gave him the [[ToThePain "To The Pain" speech]] to not only stall Humperdink while still regaining strength, but also to tell him that there are [[AFateWorseThanDeath fates that are much worse than death]]. So Westley (literally) stood up to Humperdink, sword he was carrying pointing right at him, making Humperdink quite intimidated. Barely able to stand for about less than a minute, Westley demands Buttercup to tie him up to a chair, so when they leave, Humperdink will realize Westley's right, he'll be left in anguish and misery for the rest his life. By the time the gang left the kingdom, Westley will have his strength restored, probably with some [[DamnYouMuscleMemory side effects]].
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** As a for instance: The book is set after America, but before Europe, but after France, but before Paris, but after blue jeans. . .
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** It's still light when they leave the wall. "Buttercup is marry Humperdink in little less a half an hour." Half an hour is plenty of time for the sun to set, depending on time of year and latitude. Also, the wedding may be scheduled to start in half an hour, but the ceremony itself could take an hour ''or more''. And they have to go get the wheelbarrow and the few other things (the candle to light Fezik on fire) they need for the plan to work. That would easily eat up the time before sunset, and they still start their run on the gate almost exactly as the wedding starts. If Humperdink hadn't insisted to "Skip to the end," they may very well have crashed the wedding itself and carried Buttercup off from there.
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*** Not true. If memory serves, the book specifically calls out that Domingo has zero interest in making gilded and bejeweled swords for foppish nobles who just want a pretty belt ornament they have no intention of drawing in anger. His friend, the master blacksmith with the artisan reputation, handles that crap. This friend has the reputation as the master swordsmith, but when he gets a commission for an exceptional weapon he knows to be beyond his skills, then he gives it to Domingo. Rugen somehow learned that Domingo was the [[ManBehindTheMan truly gifted swordsmith]] and approached him directly, not bothering to go through the friend with the reputation. Domingo took the job because of the difficulty and the opportunity to create a truly unique masterpiece. Neither Domingo nor Rugen were interested in the sword ''looking pretty'', it being a blade that would function at the highest end of swordsmanship for a man with six fingers on his dueling hand was the important part.
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** Just for clarification: Inigo had already decided to team up with the Man in Black, reasoning that if the Man in Black outfenced Inigo and outfought Fezik, then he must have outsmarted Vizzini, "and a man who can do that can plan my castle onslaught any day." The scream just let them track down where the Man in Black was. The reasoning that "the Man in Black was after Princess Buttercup, who's set to marry Prince Humperdinck today, as we hear the Sound of Ultimate Suffering, must mean the Man in Black loves Princess Buttercup and is Suffering because she's going to marry another man in a few hours" is about as sound as "because he bested our best swordfighter with steel and our best fistfighter with strength he must have outsmarted our smartest, and thus can pull a plan to let three guys successfully storm an entire castle out of his ass."
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**The Miracle Pill ''is'' magic. The music when Inigo gets his HeroicSecondWind is the same as when he kissed the pill before giving it to Westley.
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*** Technically yes, but again -- the grandfather's just framing it that way to make it sound a bit special for his grandson. That doesn't make it ''actually'' a family tradition that's rigidly set in stone, the way this headscratcher is presuming (though it could certainly become one over time). The fact that this grandfather had this story read to him as a child and consequently decided to read it to his own son doesn't mean it's become a fixed-in-stone family rite-of-passage that a father ''must'' pass this story down to his son, and that a failure to do so is indicative only of a major family upheaval that means the father is either dead or absent. It simply means that the grandfather liked this story as a child, liked reading it to his son, and thought his grandson might like it as well. There are any number of possible reasons why the father never read it to him that don't hinge on him either being dead or absent. Maybe the father didn't really like it but didn't want to upset the grandfather. Maybe the boy's mother always read him a bedtime story instead of his father. Maybe the father always meant to but kept forgetting to get the book, and the grandfather finally decided it was a good opportunity to bring it around. Maybe the father ''asked'' the grandfather to read it to the boy because he thought the grandfather would tell it better. Heck, maybe this family simply didn't really do bedtime stories up to this point. There are any number of possible explanations.
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*** Not to be ''too'' pedantic, but from the boy's perspective, it is '''literally''' "my father, and his father, and his father before him".
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*** Indeed, Andre the Giant was ''supposed'' to hit the door three or four times like book!Fezzik did, and you can actually see Mandy Patinkin's surprise when Andre instead breaks the prop with only one hit.
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* Westley didn't cheat. The quote was, "Where is the poison? The battle of wits has begun. It ends when you decide and we both drink, and find out who is right and who is dead." There was a correct answer: Vizzini could have chosen to drink from the ''[[TakeAThirdOption bottle]]''. But Vizzini failed the battle of wits, chose wrong, and died. Had he chosen right, both would have lived, and the battle would have continued.

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* ** Westley didn't cheat. The quote was, "Where is the poison? The battle of wits has begun. It ends when you decide and we both drink, and find out who is right and who is dead." There was a correct answer: Vizzini could have chosen to drink from the ''[[TakeAThirdOption bottle]]''. But Vizzini failed the battle of wits, chose wrong, and died. Had he chosen right, both would have lived, and the battle would have continued.
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* Westley wasn't drinking. The quote was, "Where is the poison? The battle of wits has begun. It ends when you decide and we both drink, and find out who is right and who is dead." There was a correct answer: Vizzini could have chosen to drink from the ''[[TakeAThirdOption bottle]]''. But Vizzini failed the battle of wits, chose wrong, and died. Had he chosen right, both would have lived, and the battle would have continued.

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* Westley wasn't drinking.didn't cheat. The quote was, "Where is the poison? The battle of wits has begun. It ends when you decide and we both drink, and find out who is right and who is dead." There was a correct answer: Vizzini could have chosen to drink from the ''[[TakeAThirdOption bottle]]''. But Vizzini failed the battle of wits, chose wrong, and died. Had he chosen right, both would have lived, and the battle would have continued.
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** Watch the scene again. Vizzini waits for the MIB to sip first, then drinks happily. Vizzini thinks the MIB thinks he's drinking from the unpoisoned chalice, so Vizzini thinks he's drinking from the unpoisoned chalice. I supposed Vizzini would have refused to drink if the MIB had hesitated

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** Watch the scene again. Vizzini waits for the MIB to sip first, then drinks happily. Vizzini thinks the MIB thinks he's drinking from the unpoisoned chalice, so Vizzini thinks he's drinking from the unpoisoned chalice. I supposed Vizzini would have refused to drink if the MIB had hesitated
hesitated.
* Westley wasn't drinking. The quote was, "Where is the poison? The battle of wits has begun. It ends when you decide and we both drink, and find out who is right and who is dead." There was a correct answer: Vizzini could have chosen to drink from the ''[[TakeAThirdOption bottle]]''. But Vizzini failed the battle of wits, chose wrong, and died. Had he chosen right, both would have lived, and the battle would have continued.
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* As above, I always assumed that the repeated use of the word was the problem. Vizzini's first use of the word, while an example of him using five-dollar words because of his great (or imagined) intelligence, is not technically incorrect. Given the passae of time, it is in fact inconceivable that the Man in Black could have been an official search party. Buttercup would have had to fail to return on time, been missing long enough to arouse suspicion, had her trail searched to eliminate the possibility of an accident, and ''then'' a search party would have had to follow the trio's precise course as opposed to any other possible path of escape, all while they only needed to set sail in one direction and keep going. For someone from the castle to have done all of that and then caught up to them while they were only sailing across a channel...is indeed inconceivable. BUT, once it is clear that Westley is, in fact, following them, the entire paradigm of believability shifts in his favor. He's already established a new baseline, so his further exploits should have been downgraded to "impressive", or even "astonishing", but certainly no longer literally incapable of even being conceived of.
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** Plus, Rugen had lots of both money and power, he may very well be able to have paid several blacksmiths and weapon-crafters to make him functional swords/knives/axes/whatever to fit his six fingers. However, Domingo Montoya was a true artist of the trade, so the sword he created would not only be functional but also pretty.
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** OR, being the hopeless romantic that he is, he did it out of love and then heartbreak. Initially, if the Dread Pirate Roberts was threatening him with death daily, what use would it be to tell his love he was alive if he might die any day? Why give her false hope? By the time he was not threatened anymore and handed the title, he may have received the news of Buttercup's engagement (in the book, she spent three years at princess lessons, so it's possible) and convinced himself that, since she was going to marry someone else, she clearly was not waiting for him anymore, so it was no use to communicate with her and he might as well let her be happy with Prince Humperdink. He only went after her when she was kidnapped because, obviously, being kidnapped is not how you spend a happy life and he didn't want her prisoner o dead.
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** Alternatively, he may not have known she knew of the attack. As mentioned above, news were slow. It is entirely possible that he assumed Buttercup thought he was still making his fortune somewhere, and so he continued his life as the pirate's valet. It is possible he didn't find out about the whole marriage ordeal until he arrived to Florin.
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**Also, in the book it's mentioned that Buttercup's parents were constantly quarreling and bickering with one another yet still seemed to genuinely love one another. To the extent that when her father died, the general consensus of her mother's death not long after was "the lack of competition" in their arguing. So it's possible to her that this all is just the kind of banter that a loving couple actually has.
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** Always thought it was supposed to be him trying to comfort her because, to him, it didn't matter if she was legally married to another or not. He's a pirate, a wanted man who's broken plenty of laws, and is by all legal counts dead (or at least "Wesley" has been considered dead for five years). Doubt he cares much if some small country they're never planning on returning to considers the woman he's planning on spending the rest of his life is technically married to another. He only says that about it not counting because Buttercup seems worried, and because, in his mind, as long as she doesn't want/agree to the marriage, than it doesn't count.
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** It's possible to be both, as all they said was that Buttercup had been trained for three years to a princess. Humperdink probably took Buttercup two years after she received word of Wesley's murder. She then spent the next three years in training.
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** This is all explained by examining the differences between the novel and the film. The conceit of the novel is that the author is abridging a political treatise his father (who is originally from Florin) read to him when the author was young. Like the grandfather of the film, the father skipped boring parts and just read "the good stuff," and the author regularly interrupts the story to let the reader know which parts he's editing or cutting completely. The film dropped the abridgment conceit and and replaced the authorial interjections with scenes between the boy and his grandfather. The grandfather was likely aged up because the original telling would have been in the late 30's/early 40's, when Goldman was a child. The modern day portions of the film take place in 1987, over a generation later. A 40 something in 1973 can have an immigrant father without issue, but they decided to make it a grandfather to a boy in the 80's.

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** This is all explained by examining the differences between the novel and the film. The conceit of the novel is that the author (now an adult) is abridging a political treatise his father (who is originally from Florin) read to him when the author was young. Like the grandfather of the film, the father skipped boring parts and just read "the good stuff," and the author regularly interrupts the story to let the reader know which parts he's editing or cutting completely. The film dropped the abridgment conceit and and replaced the authorial interjections with scenes between the boy and his grandfather. The grandfather was likely aged up because the original telling would have been in the late 30's/early 40's, when Goldman was a child. The modern day portions of the film take place in 1987, over a generation later. A 40 something in 1973 can have an immigrant father without issue, but they decided to make it a grandfather to a boy in the 80's.

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