Follow TV Tropes

Following

History GameBreaker / SuperSmashBros

Go To

OR

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** It doesn't help that Pyra/Mythra themselves are also incredibly good even without this due to Mythra possessing some of the best ground and air speed in the game, being top 5 run speed, the fastest initial dash, 11th best air speed and being a fast-faller, which gives her even more ways to punish the opponent after a Foresight. Mythra's frame data is some of the best in the game, and Pyra has huge hitboxes that cover a lot of space, making it hard for some characters to get in. Mythra also low-profiles or "pancakes" when using some of her aerials or grounded attacks or in her general dash animation, making it very hard to hit her similarly to Joker and Pikachu. Mythra's up air is her best move and one of the best aerials in the game. It autocancels very early on, 3 frames after the hitboxes end which makes it virtually impossible to punish if done by a short-hop fastfall, is her safest move on shield, has high base knockback causing it to kill surprisingly early (unlike most of Mythra's moves outside of her smash attacks and Lightning Buster) and is perfect at putting opponents in juggle scenarios due to its frame data and Mythra's fast movement options. Due to Mythra's fast air speed, their recovery is generally acceptable, unlike low tiers such as Dr Mario, Ganondorf, Incineroar and Little Mac. [[ComplacentGamingSyndrome Their easy to pick up and play nature and popularity have given them a lot of mains, co-mains, secondaries and players who use them as a pocket character]] including [=MkLeo=], [=Sparg0=], Cosmos, [=VoiD=], Cloudy, Shuton, Ned, Tsu, Kome, Jagaimo, [=Mew2King=], Komorikiri, Space and DM due to their fantastic matchup spread, making them excellent at counterpicking. This has given them a lot of comparisons to Cloud in ''Smash 4'', (see at the Smash for 3DS and Wii U section). Generally, players consider them a top 10-top 5 character, with some such as Tweek, Cloudy and Cosmos believing the character is top 3 alongside Joker and Pikachu.

to:

** It doesn't help that Pyra/Mythra themselves are also incredibly good even without this due to Mythra possessing some of the best ground and air speed in the game, being top 5 run speed, the fastest initial dash, 11th best air speed and being a fast-faller, which gives her even more ways to punish the opponent after a Foresight. Mythra's frame data is some of the best in the game, and Pyra has huge hitboxes that cover a lot of space, making it hard for some characters to get in. Mythra also low-profiles or "pancakes" when using some of her aerials or grounded attacks or in her general dash animation, making it very hard to hit her similarly to Joker and Pikachu. Mythra's up air is her best move and one of the best aerials in the game. It autocancels very early on, 3 frames after the hitboxes end which makes it virtually impossible to punish if done by a short-hop fastfall, is her safest move on shield, has high base knockback causing it to kill surprisingly early (unlike most of Mythra's moves outside of her smash attacks and Lightning Buster) and is perfect at putting opponents in juggle scenarios due to its frame data and Mythra's fast movement options. Due to Mythra's fast air speed, their recovery is generally acceptable, unlike low tiers such as Dr Mario, Ganondorf, Incineroar and Little Mac. [[ComplacentGamingSyndrome Their easy to pick up and play nature and popularity have given them a lot of mains, co-mains, secondaries and players who use them as a pocket character]] including [=MkLeo=], [=Sparg0=], Cosmos, [=VoiD=], Cloudy, Shuton, Ned, Tsu, Kome, Jagaimo, [=Mew2King=], Komorikiri, Space and DM due to their fantastic matchup spread, making them excellent at counterpicking. This has given them a lot of comparisons to Cloud in ''Smash 4'', (see at the Smash for 3DS and Wii U section). Generally, players consider them a top 10-top 5 character, with some such as [=MkLeo=}, Tweek, Cloudy and Cosmos believing the character is top 3 alongside Joker and Pikachu.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Mythra's Foresight may potentially be the most broken ability in Smash Ultimate, being compared to Smash 4 Witch Time. When an enemy is about to hit Mythra as she spot-dodges, rolls or air dodges, Foresight activates and makes her take half the damage, but unlike Bats-Within, it also slows the opponent down, causing Mythra to get a potential kill or put the opponent in disadvantage state. Its punish window is longer than a parry, and it also is effective against projectiles from about half-way across the stage allowing Mythra a way to counter zoners by punishing them. What's even worse is that it also works against multi-hits, such as Pikachu's back air, Palutena's nair and even fast jabs or multi-hit out of shield options, which changes how each characters play effectively, as a lot of characters best moves are multi-hits. Moves that have high end lag such as smash attacks are so punishable that you can switch to Pyra and kill them super early with forward smash. It also works on any recovery with a hitbox, allowing Mythra to get an easier punish while they're recovering to the ledge at high percents from a down tilt into a forward smash. The ability also comes out frame 2, allowing her to get out of juggle scenarios very fast if you time the airdodge right, being even faster than Flip Jump's invincibility which aids Mythra's disadvantage state. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh7ZN3h98bI GIMR explains more about how good this ability is]].

to:

* Mythra's Foresight may potentially be the most broken ability in Smash Ultimate, being compared to Smash 4 Witch Time. When an enemy is about to hit Mythra as she spot-dodges, rolls or air dodges, Foresight activates and makes her take half the damage, but unlike Bats-Within, it also slows the opponent down, causing Mythra to get a potential kill or put the opponent in disadvantage state. Its punish window is longer than a parry, and it also is effective against projectiles from about half-way across the stage allowing Mythra a way to counter zoners by punishing them. What's even worse is that it also works against multi-hits, such as Pikachu's back air, Palutena's nair and even fast jabs or multi-hit out of shield options, which changes how each characters play effectively, as a lot of characters best moves are multi-hits. Moves that have high end lag such as smash attacks are so punishable that you can switch to Pyra and kill them super early with forward smash. It also works on any recovery with a hitbox, allowing Mythra to get an easier punish while they're recovering to the ledge at high percents from a down tilt into a forward smash. The ability also comes out frame 2, 2 and is active for 7 frames, allowing her to get out of juggle scenarios very fast if you time the airdodge right, being even faster than Flip Jump's invincibility which aids Mythra's disadvantage state. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh7ZN3h98bI GIMR explains more about how good this ability is]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Diddy Kong was often viewed as this in the first few months of the game's release. Already considered a high-tier character in ''Brawl'', he hits rather hard and fast, is surprisingly heavy despite his size, moves quickly, has an array of great combo options out of many of his moves, a bevy of useful projectile options, a solid ground game and good recovery to boot. In the first few months after release, however, all of the above was exacerbated to the point where he sat comfortably atop many tier lists, to say nothing of his infamously overpowered Up Aerial and the [[FanNickname 'hoo-hah']] combo, both of which were thankfully nerfed in two balance patches (among other moves) later down the line. And yet, despite all of the changes the dev team has made, Diddy is still widely considered a high-tier character and a notable competitive threat; his low learning curve certainly doesn't help matters.

to:

* Diddy Kong was often viewed as this in the first few months of the game's release. Already considered a high-tier character in ''Brawl'', he hits rather hard and fast, is surprisingly heavy despite his size, moves quickly, has an array of great combo options out of many of his moves, a bevy of useful projectile options, a solid ground game and good recovery to boot. In the first few months after release, however, all of the above was exacerbated to the point where he sat comfortably atop many tier lists, to say nothing of his infamously overpowered Up Aerial and the [[FanNickname 'hoo-hah']] combo, both of which were thankfully nerfed in two balance patches (among other moves) later down the line. And yet, despite all of the changes the dev team has made, Diddy is still widely considered a high-tier top tier character and a notable competitive threat; his low learning curve certainly doesn't help matters.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Mythra's Foresight may potentially be the most broken ability in Smash Ultimate, being compared to Smash 4 Witch Time. When an enemy is about to hit Mythra as she spot-dodges, rolls or air dodges, Foresight activates and makes her take half the damage, but unlike Bats-Within, it also slows the opponent down, causing Mythra to get a potential kill or put the opponent in disadvantage state. Its punish window is longer than a parry, and it also is effective against projectiles from about half-way across the stage allowing Mythra a way to counter zoners by punishing them. What's even worse is that it also works against multi-hits, such as Pikachu's back air, Palutena's nair and even fast jabs or multi-hit out of shield options, which changes how each characters play effectively, as a lot of characters best moves are multi-hits. Moves that have high end lag such as smash attacks are so punishable that you can switch to Pyra and kill them super early with forward smash. It also works on any recovery with a hitbox, allowing Mythra to get an easier punish while they're recovering to the ledge at high percents from a down tilt into a forward smash. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh7ZN3h98bI GIMR explains more about how good this ability is]].

to:

* Mythra's Foresight may potentially be the most broken ability in Smash Ultimate, being compared to Smash 4 Witch Time. When an enemy is about to hit Mythra as she spot-dodges, rolls or air dodges, Foresight activates and makes her take half the damage, but unlike Bats-Within, it also slows the opponent down, causing Mythra to get a potential kill or put the opponent in disadvantage state. Its punish window is longer than a parry, and it also is effective against projectiles from about half-way across the stage allowing Mythra a way to counter zoners by punishing them. What's even worse is that it also works against multi-hits, such as Pikachu's back air, Palutena's nair and even fast jabs or multi-hit out of shield options, which changes how each characters play effectively, as a lot of characters best moves are multi-hits. Moves that have high end lag such as smash attacks are so punishable that you can switch to Pyra and kill them super early with forward smash. It also works on any recovery with a hitbox, allowing Mythra to get an easier punish while they're recovering to the ledge at high percents from a down tilt into a forward smash. The ability also comes out frame 2, allowing her to get out of juggle scenarios very fast if you time the airdodge right, being even faster than Flip Jump's invincibility which aids Mythra's disadvantage state. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh7ZN3h98bI GIMR explains more about how good this ability is]].
** It doesn't help that Pyra/Mythra themselves are also incredibly good even without this due to Mythra possessing some of the best ground and air speed in the game, being top 5 run speed, the fastest initial dash, 11th best air speed and being a fast-faller, which gives her even more ways to punish the opponent after a Foresight. Mythra's frame data is some of the best in the game, and Pyra has huge hitboxes that cover a lot of space, making it hard for some characters to get in. Mythra also low-profiles or "pancakes" when using some of her aerials or grounded attacks or in her general dash animation, making it very hard to hit her similarly to Joker and Pikachu. Mythra's up air is her best move and one of the best aerials in the game. It autocancels very early on, 3 frames after the hitboxes end which makes it virtually impossible to punish if done by a short-hop fastfall, is her safest move on shield, has high base knockback causing it to kill surprisingly early (unlike most of Mythra's moves outside of her smash attacks and Lightning Buster) and is perfect at putting opponents in juggle scenarios due to its frame data and Mythra's fast movement options. Due to Mythra's fast air speed, their recovery is generally acceptable, unlike low tiers such as Dr Mario, Ganondorf, Incineroar and Little Mac. [[ComplacentGamingSyndrome Their easy to pick up and play nature and popularity have given them a lot of mains, co-mains, secondaries and players who use them as a pocket character]] including [=MkLeo=], [=Sparg0=], Cosmos, [=VoiD=], Cloudy, Shuton, Ned, Tsu, Kome, Jagaimo, [=Mew2King=], Komorikiri, Space and DM due to their fantastic matchup spread, making them excellent at counterpicking. This has given them a lot of comparisons to Cloud in ''Smash 4'', (see at the Smash for 3DS and Wii U section). Generally, players consider them a top 10-top 5 character, with some such as Tweek, Cloudy and Cosmos believing the character is top 3 alongside Joker and Pikachu.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* In the competitive scene, Cloud is often viewed as the best doubles character in the game, being more overbearingly dominant then [[https://intheloop837.wordpress.com/2018/04/09/data-cloud-in-doubles-an-analysis/ Brawl Meta Knight in singles]]. With a partner, Cloud can abuse Limit charges more frequently while his partner keeps their opponents busy, leading into him getting Limit buffs and higher-damage moves way more often, and some of Cloud's moves such as his neutral and back-airs are perfect for sending opponents towards Cloud's teammate for a follow-up. Cloud's partner can also guarantee a Finishing Touch — a normally high-risk move that deals low damage but K.O.s as early as 30% — out of ''almost any throw,'' eliminating the risk factor almost entirely. This becomes even more ridiculous with a team of two Clouds, as the knockback growth on their throws and aerials can lead to situations such as [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzhnCRLuc9o a string of neutral-airs topped off with a Finishing Touch or other Limit Special.]] In addition, Cloud's biggest weakness is gone which is his poor recovery, as a teammate could go offstage to save him by hitting him onto the stage as Team Attack is on.

to:

* In the competitive scene, Cloud is often viewed as the best doubles character in the game, being more overbearingly dominant then than [[https://intheloop837.wordpress.com/2018/04/09/data-cloud-in-doubles-an-analysis/ Brawl Meta Knight in singles]]. With a partner, Cloud can abuse Limit charges more frequently while his partner keeps their opponents busy, leading into him getting Limit buffs and higher-damage moves way more often, and some of Cloud's moves such as his neutral and back-airs are perfect for sending opponents towards Cloud's teammate for a follow-up. Cloud's partner can also guarantee a Finishing Touch — a normally high-risk move that deals low damage but K.O.s as early as 30% — out of ''almost any throw,'' eliminating the risk factor almost entirely. This becomes even more ridiculous with a team of two Clouds, as the knockback growth on their throws and aerials can lead to situations such as [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzhnCRLuc9o a string of neutral-airs topped off with a Finishing Touch or other Limit Special.]] In addition, Cloud's biggest weakness is gone which is his poor recovery, as a teammate could go offstage to save him by hitting him onto the stage as Team Attack is on.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* In the competitive scene, Cloud is often viewed as one of the best doubles characters in the game. With a partner, Cloud can abuse Limit charges more frequently while his partner keeps their opponents busy, leading into him getting Limit buffs and higher-damage moves way more often, and some of Cloud's moves such as his neutral and back-airs are perfect for sending opponents towards Cloud's teammate for a follow-up. Cloud's partner can also guarantee a Finishing Touch — a normally high-risk move that deals low damage but K.O.s as early as 30% — out of ''almost any throw,'' eliminating the risk factor almost entirely. This becomes even more ridiculous with a team of two Clouds, as the knockback growth on their throws and aerials can lead to situations such as [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzhnCRLuc9o a string of neutral-airs topped off with a Finishing Touch or other Limit Special.]]

to:

* In the competitive scene, Cloud is often viewed as one of the best doubles characters character in the game.game, being more overbearingly dominant then [[https://intheloop837.wordpress.com/2018/04/09/data-cloud-in-doubles-an-analysis/ Brawl Meta Knight in singles]]. With a partner, Cloud can abuse Limit charges more frequently while his partner keeps their opponents busy, leading into him getting Limit buffs and higher-damage moves way more often, and some of Cloud's moves such as his neutral and back-airs are perfect for sending opponents towards Cloud's teammate for a follow-up. Cloud's partner can also guarantee a Finishing Touch — a normally high-risk move that deals low damage but K.O.s as early as 30% — out of ''almost any throw,'' eliminating the risk factor almost entirely. This becomes even more ridiculous with a team of two Clouds, as the knockback growth on their throws and aerials can lead to situations such as [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzhnCRLuc9o a string of neutral-airs topped off with a Finishing Touch or other Limit Special.]]
]] In addition, Cloud's biggest weakness is gone which is his poor recovery, as a teammate could go offstage to save him by hitting him onto the stage as Team Attack is on.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Cloud is one of the biggest example of this in the game, being considered top 2 just below Bayonetta. He has incredibly huge ranged disjointed hitboxes through his Up Air, Neutral Air, Forward Air and Forward Tilt and can combo or kill quite easily with them and has a very low learning curve as a swordsmen with no tipper mechanic. His up air is also lagless due to its autocancel window (which is bugged and autocancels exactly when the hitboxes end), can kill and has a lot of active frames, allowing it to easily punish air dodges and juggle very easily, while his down air has virtually no landing lag due to its autocancel window, allowing him to safely get back on stage. He also has Limit Break which gives him reliable kill moves such as Finishing Touch and Cross Slash, as well as boosting Climhazzard's typically very bad recovery, making him less of a GlassCannon. He's also the second heaviest swordfighter, below Ike. ButWaitTheresMore, as Cloud has some of the best mobility in the game both on the ground and in the air, with Limit Break increasing that even further, which in turn improves his combo game. Limit Break also lasts forever until you use it, or you die, and his special moves are more powerful than they are in ''Ultimate''.

to:

* Cloud is one of the biggest example of this in the game, being considered top 2 just below Bayonetta. He has incredibly huge ranged disjointed hitboxes through his Up Air, Neutral Air, Forward Air and Forward Tilt and can combo or kill quite easily with them and has a very low learning curve as a swordsmen with no tipper mechanic. His up air is also lagless due to its autocancel window (which is bugged and autocancels exactly when the hitboxes end), can kill and has a lot of active frames, allowing it to easily punish air dodges and juggle very easily, while his down air has virtually no landing lag due to its autocancel window, allowing him to safely get back on stage. He also has Limit Break which gives him reliable kill moves such as Finishing Touch and Cross Slash, as well as boosting Climhazzard's typically very bad recovery, making him less of a GlassCannon. He's also the second heaviest swordfighter, below Ike. ButWaitTheresMore, as Cloud has some of the best mobility in the game both on the ground and in the air, with Limit Break increasing that even further, which in turn improves his combo game. Limit Break also lasts forever until you use it, or you die, and his special moves are more powerful than they are in ''Ultimate''.
''Ultimate''. Due to his extreme ease of use and popularity, [[ComplacentGamingSyndrome he was one of the most common characters ever]], being picked up as either a main or secondary by multiple top players including [=MkLeo=], Tweek, Nairo, Mr. R, Komoriki, Ned, [=Mew2King=], Masashi, [=MattyG=] and [=ZeRo=], the best player in the world before he left the scene. He was also incredibly popular to use by mid and high level players too, making him rather popular in locals.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Alongside Diddy Kong and Bayonetta, Cloud is the biggest example of this in the game. He has incredibly huge ranged disjointed hitboxes through his Up Air, Neutral Air, Forward Air and Forward Tilt and can combo or kill quite easily with them and has a very low learning curve as a swordsmen with no tipper mechanic. His up air is also lagless due to its autocancel window (which is bugged and autocancels exactly when the hitboxes end), can kill and has a lot of active frames, allowing it to easily punish air dodges and juggle very easily, while his down air has virtually no landing lag due to its autocancel window, allowing him to safely get back on stage. He also has Limit Break which gives him reliable kill moves such as Finishing Touch and Cross Slash, as well as boosting Climhazzard's typically very bad recovery, making him less of a GlassCannon. He's also the second heaviest swordfighter, below Ike. ButWaitTheresMore, as Cloud has some of the best mobility in the game both on the ground and in the air, with Limit Break increasing that even further, which in turn improves his combo game. Limit Break also lasts forever until you use it, or you die, and his special moves are more powerful than they are in ''Ultimate''.

to:

* Alongside Diddy Kong and Bayonetta, Cloud is one of the biggest example of this in the game.game, being considered top 2 just below Bayonetta. He has incredibly huge ranged disjointed hitboxes through his Up Air, Neutral Air, Forward Air and Forward Tilt and can combo or kill quite easily with them and has a very low learning curve as a swordsmen with no tipper mechanic. His up air is also lagless due to its autocancel window (which is bugged and autocancels exactly when the hitboxes end), can kill and has a lot of active frames, allowing it to easily punish air dodges and juggle very easily, while his down air has virtually no landing lag due to its autocancel window, allowing him to safely get back on stage. He also has Limit Break which gives him reliable kill moves such as Finishing Touch and Cross Slash, as well as boosting Climhazzard's typically very bad recovery, making him less of a GlassCannon. He's also the second heaviest swordfighter, below Ike. ButWaitTheresMore, as Cloud has some of the best mobility in the game both on the ground and in the air, with Limit Break increasing that even further, which in turn improves his combo game. Limit Break also lasts forever until you use it, or you die, and his special moves are more powerful than they are in ''Ultimate''.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Alongside Diddy Kong and Bayonetta, Cloud is the biggest example of this in the game. He has incredibly good disjointed hitboxes through his Up Air, Neutral Air, and Forward Air and can combo quite easily with them and has a very low learning curve as a swordsmen with no tipper mechanic. He also has Limit Break which gives him reliable kill moves such as Finishing Touch and Cross Slash, as well as boosting Climhazzard's typically very bad recovery. ButWaitTheresMore, as Cloud has some of the best aerial mobility in the game and is relatively fast overall, with Limit Break increasing that even further. The big thing that makes him better in ''Smash 4'' than ''Smash Ultimate'' is that Limit Break can be held for an unlimited amount of time until you use it or die.

to:

* Alongside Diddy Kong and Bayonetta, Cloud is the biggest example of this in the game. He has incredibly good huge ranged disjointed hitboxes through his Up Air, Neutral Air, and Forward Air and Forward Tilt and can combo or kill quite easily with them and has a very low learning curve as a swordsmen with no tipper mechanic. His up air is also lagless due to its autocancel window (which is bugged and autocancels exactly when the hitboxes end), can kill and has a lot of active frames, allowing it to easily punish air dodges and juggle very easily, while his down air has virtually no landing lag due to its autocancel window, allowing him to safely get back on stage. He also has Limit Break which gives him reliable kill moves such as Finishing Touch and Cross Slash, as well as boosting Climhazzard's typically very bad recovery. recovery, making him less of a GlassCannon. He's also the second heaviest swordfighter, below Ike. ButWaitTheresMore, as Cloud has some of the best aerial mobility in the game both on the ground and is relatively fast overall, in the air, with Limit Break increasing that even further. The big thing that makes him better further, which in ''Smash 4'' than ''Smash Ultimate'' is that turn improves his combo game. Limit Break can be held for an unlimited amount of time also lasts forever until you use it it, or die.
you die, and his special moves are more powerful than they are in ''Ultimate''.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Mythra's Foresight may potentially be the most broken ability in Smash Ultimate, being compared to Smash 4 Witch Time. When an enemy is about to hit Mythra as she spot-dodges, rolls or air dodges, Foresight activates and makes her take half the damage, but unlike Bats-Within, it also slows the opponent down, causing Mythra to get a potential kill or put the opponent in disadvantage state. Its punish window is longer than a parry, and it also is effective against projectiles from about half-way across the stage allowing Mythra a way to counter zoners by punishing them. What's even worse is that it also works against multi-hits, such as Pikachu's back air, Palutena's nair and even fast jabs or multi-hit out of shield options, which changes how each characters play effectively, as a lot of characters best moves are multi-hits. Moves that have high start up lag such as smash attacks are so punishable that you can switch to Pyra and kill them super early with forward smash. It also works on any recovery with a hitbox, allowing Mythra to get an easier punish while they're recovering to the ledge at high percents from a down tilt into a forward smash. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh7ZN3h98bI GIMR explains more about how good this ability is]].

to:

* Mythra's Foresight may potentially be the most broken ability in Smash Ultimate, being compared to Smash 4 Witch Time. When an enemy is about to hit Mythra as she spot-dodges, rolls or air dodges, Foresight activates and makes her take half the damage, but unlike Bats-Within, it also slows the opponent down, causing Mythra to get a potential kill or put the opponent in disadvantage state. Its punish window is longer than a parry, and it also is effective against projectiles from about half-way across the stage allowing Mythra a way to counter zoners by punishing them. What's even worse is that it also works against multi-hits, such as Pikachu's back air, Palutena's nair and even fast jabs or multi-hit out of shield options, which changes how each characters play effectively, as a lot of characters best moves are multi-hits. Moves that have high start up end lag such as smash attacks are so punishable that you can switch to Pyra and kill them super early with forward smash. It also works on any recovery with a hitbox, allowing Mythra to get an easier punish while they're recovering to the ledge at high percents from a down tilt into a forward smash. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh7ZN3h98bI GIMR explains more about how good this ability is]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:


* [[SarcasmMode Surprise]], still [[RunningGag Meta Knight]]. All of his prior mentioned advantages are still amazing attributes for this mode, where he can OHKO the alloys with ease and avoid getting hit better than anyone else. Additionally the most effective method for survival on 15 Minute Brawl and Cruel Brawl is planking, which Meta Knight can notoriously abuse to levels far more game breaking than any other character, so he can survive the former mode and rack up [=KOs=] in the latter mode far better than anyone else.

to:

* [[SarcasmMode Surprise]], still [[RunningGag Meta Knight]]. Knight once again: All of his prior mentioned advantages are still amazing attributes for this mode, where he can OHKO the alloys with ease and avoid getting hit better than anyone else. Additionally the most effective method for survival on 15 Minute Brawl and Cruel Brawl is planking, which Meta Knight can notoriously abuse to levels far more game breaking than any other character, so he can survive the former mode and rack up [=KOs=] in the latter mode far better than anyone else.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* [[SarcasmMode Surprise]], still [[RunningGag Meta Knight]]. All of his prior mentioned advantages are still amazing attributes for this mode, where he can OHKO the alloys with ease and avoid getting hit better than anyone else. Additionally the most effective method for survival on 15 Minute Brawl and Cruel Brawl is planking, which Meta Knight can notoriously abuse to levels far more game breaking than any other character, so he can survive the former mode and rack up [=KOs=] in the latter mode far better than anyone else.

Changed: 507

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
"World of Light specific" generally works against spirits outside of that mode too, but the category was still being used distinctly from the "Spirits" one, so I renamed it (and added to the DK entry and added a Chrom entry from Game Champs' experience)


[[AC: World of Light specific]]

to:

[[AC: World of Light specific]]Strategies against spirits]]



* Donkey Kong is another solid choice, as his ground slap can stun lock and reduce even Legend-class Spirits to a near cake-walk as the AI is rarely smart enough to attack from range or drop on you directly. Combine it with a spirit that lets you start as a giant and you're golden. Even disregarding the Ground Slap, Donkey Kong hits like a truck with his Smash attacks, which paired with the aforementioned Giant spirits means handing out near instant [=KOs=] like candy. [[DiscOneNuke He can also be found very early in World of Light so long as the player doesn't take the east path at the beginning, and is more than likely the first heavyweight character that the player will find.]]

to:

* Donkey Kong is another solid choice, as his ground slap can stun lock and reduce even Legend-class Spirits to a near cake-walk as the AI is rarely smart enough to attack from range or drop on you directly. Combine it with a spirit that lets you start as a giant and you're golden. Even disregarding the Ground Slap, Donkey Kong hits like a truck with his Smash attacks, which paired with the aforementioned Giant spirits means handing out near instant [=KOs=] like candy. Moreover, many opposing spirits are ineffective at recovering when [=DK=] uses Spinning Kong on the ground at the edge of the stage. [[DiscOneNuke He can also be found very early in World of Light so long as the player doesn't take the east path at the beginning, and is more than likely the first heavyweight character that the player will find.]]




to:

* Chrom. When facing a single opponent, you can knock them off-stage, and with some luck, spike them with the Soaring Slash (Up Special), knocking them out before Chrom. In stamina battles with no walk-offs to abuse, this is one of the best tickets to cheesing the fight, especially useful if the opponent has a large advantage in power level.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Using certain combinations of Spirit effects that stack or otherwise synergize with each other can lead to excellent results. For example, though [[BribingYourWayToVictory you'll need the Pyra/Mythra DLC in order to get the latter]], the Spirits of [[VideoGame/XenobladeChronicles2 Master Driver Rex and Pneuma]] go like bread on butter with each other; [[GameplayAndStoryIntegration go figure, as they are a Driver and Blade pair]]. Master Driver Rex has high stats overall (as mentioned above), and has the Critical Health Stats effect, which grants a CriticalStatusBuff. Pneuma has the Critical Healing and Metal effect, which is similar, but provides a heal and turns you into Metal instead. The combination of both effects is the perfect safety net when dealing with tough fights in case Rex's raw stats don't cut it, as once the effects kick in (both at the same time), you'll suddenly become stronger, faster, ''and'' have NighInvulnerability on top of that. Add one last single slot Support Spirit as necessary, whether it be something like another Critical Health Stats provider for more stat stacking, a [[WeaponOfXSlaying Killer effect]] for dealing with specific fights, or something straightforwardly useful like Victini with its Hyper Smash Attacks, and you can make even foes like [[ThatOneLevel Giga Mac]] into total chumps.

to:

* Using certain combinations of Spirit effects that stack or otherwise synergize with each other can lead to excellent results. For example, though [[BribingYourWayToVictory you'll need the Pyra/Mythra DLC in order to get the latter]], the Spirits of [[VideoGame/XenobladeChronicles2 Master Driver Rex and Pneuma]] go like bread on butter with each other; [[GameplayAndStoryIntegration go figure, as they are a Driver and Blade pair]]. Master Driver Rex has high stats overall (as mentioned above), and has the Critical Health Stats effect, which grants a CriticalStatusBuff. Pneuma has the Critical Healing and Metal effect, which is similar, but provides a heal and turns you into Metal instead. The combination of both effects is the perfect safety net when dealing with tough fights in case Rex's raw stats don't cut it, as once the effects kick in (both at the same time), you'll suddenly become stronger, faster, ''and'' have NighInvulnerability on top of that. Add one last single slot Support Spirit as necessary, whether it be something like another Critical Health Stats provider for more stat stacking, a [[WeaponOfXSlaying Killer effect]] for dealing with specific fights, or something straightforwardly useful like Victini with its Hyper Smash Attacks, and you can make even foes like [[ThatOneLevel Giga Mac]] into look like total chumps.

Added: 432

Changed: 1342

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** [[VideoGame/XenobladeChronicles2 Master Driver Rex]] is a well rounded Shield Spirit that has three support slots and the Critical Health Stats effect. He can be obtained by Enhancing the basic Rex Spirit, and you don't actually need the Pyra/Mythra DLC to obtain him, though said DLC comes with a Spirit Board that has him available to snag at any time, on top of making the battle itself easier by throwing away the Lava Floor.




to:

* Using certain combinations of Spirit effects that stack or otherwise synergize with each other can lead to excellent results. For example, though [[BribingYourWayToVictory you'll need the Pyra/Mythra DLC in order to get the latter]], the Spirits of [[VideoGame/XenobladeChronicles2 Master Driver Rex and Pneuma]] go like bread on butter with each other; [[GameplayAndStoryIntegration go figure, as they are a Driver and Blade pair]]. Master Driver Rex has high stats overall (as mentioned above), and has the Critical Health Stats effect, which grants a CriticalStatusBuff. Pneuma has the Critical Healing and Metal effect, which is similar, but provides a heal and turns you into Metal instead. The combination of both effects is the perfect safety net when dealing with tough fights in case Rex's raw stats don't cut it, as once the effects kick in (both at the same time), you'll suddenly become stronger, faster, ''and'' have NighInvulnerability on top of that. Add one last single slot Support Spirit as necessary, whether it be something like another Critical Health Stats provider for more stat stacking, a [[WeaponOfXSlaying Killer effect]] for dealing with specific fights, or something straightforwardly useful like Victini with its Hyper Smash Attacks, and you can make even foes like [[ThatOneLevel Giga Mac]] into total chumps.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None



to:

[[/folder]]

Changed: 4094

Removed: 705

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Did someone put DK's Brawl final smash here as a joke? Also what's hyper-Lucas fanboyism going on here, he isn't anything special in the single-player modes


* Play DK's Final Smash correctly, and you will earn a guaranteed KO on a stationary stage.

to:

* Play DK's Final Smash correctly, and you will earn a guaranteed KO on a stationary stage.



* If you're okay with using Stickers, Lucas becomes one of the most effective characters in the ''Subspace Emissary''. He's already great to use in the adventure mode, but the "PK" stickers turn him into a monster; ''all but three'' of his moves[[note]]the side smash, down tilt, and up aerial, all of which can be safely ignored in SSE anyway[[/note]] are boosted by these stickers. Slap a big one on and watch as this [[BadassAdorable adorable PSI kid decimates everything in his path]].
* Many grounded mooks who do not use projectiles will be unable to handle Donkey Kong's Hand Slap, which makes it very easy to beat a horde of them. Airborne enemies can easily be taken care of with Donkey Kong's powerful aerials.
* Unsurprisingly, Meta Knight snaps the Subspace Emissary just as hard as the main game. On top of all his advantages in the main game, his divine recovery makes platforming and avoiding boss attacks a breeze, his neutral-air chops through the health bars of large enemies in seconds, and almost all of his attacks use his sword, meaning sword-boosting stickers make him even sillier.

to:

* If you're okay with using Stickers, Lucas becomes one of the most effective characters in the ''Subspace Emissary''. He's already great to use in the adventure mode, but the "PK" stickers turn him into a monster; ''all but three'' of his moves[[note]]the side smash, down tilt, and up aerial, all of which can be safely ignored in SSE anyway[[/note]] are boosted by these stickers. Slap a big one on and watch as this [[BadassAdorable adorable PSI kid decimates everything in his path]].
* Many grounded mooks who do not use projectiles will be unable to handle Donkey Kong's Hand Slap, which makes it very easy to beat a horde of them. Airborne enemies can easily be taken care of with Donkey Kong's powerful aerials.
* Unsurprisingly, Meta Knight snaps the Subspace Emissary just as hard as the main game. On top of all his advantages in the main game, his divine recovery makes platforming and avoiding boss attacks a breeze, his neutral-air chops through the health bars of large enemies in seconds, and almost all of his attacks use his sword, meaning sword-boosting stickers make him even sillier.
sillier. Additionally, Meta Knight's only weakness, his light weight, can be easily patched up through launch resistance boosting stickers, whereas other characters will have weaknesses that can't be improved by stickers.



* [[VideoGame/{{MOTHER 3}} Lucas]], who is considered the overall best character for this mainly because of his PSI Magnet that can absorb certain attacks (such as Master Hand's finger bullets and Duon's pink lasers), which is invaluble during a BossRush, his powerful attacks such as his PK Thunder and up smash, and the fact that his triple jump hits for massive damage and ''goes through the opponent'', which also makes a great evasion tactic. The reason why he seems more prized than Ness is that his said PSI Magnet can both damage upon releasing it and heal even more than Ness' can. Despite Lucas holding his Magnet in front of himself, his version still covers his whole body even if something tries to shoot him from behind, as he can turn around to absorb rear projectile shots.
* Charizard is second on this list because its Rock Smash cuts through the bosses' health bars like a hot knife through butter. Combined with the fact the Pokemon Trainer's down special move switches the Pokémon out, and it also makes a good evasion tactic against a lot of the bosses' attacks, including [[ThatOneAttack Tabuu's Off Waves]].
* [[Franchise/DonkeyKong Donkey Kong]] is third here, mainly because of how powerful he is, his great reach, and his very heavy weight, making it difficult for him to be KO'd. His combination of Hand Slap, up smash, side smash, up aerial, and back aerial tears the bosses up in record time.
* Marth is fourth on the list for the fact that he's fast, has a good amount of power and reach, and the most important reason of all, '''his counter attack!''' This allows you to dodge and attack the bosses for a nice amount of damage after they try to hit you with a physical attack, which makes most of the bosses a trivial aspect.
* Ness gets an honorable mention for having the same healing move (the PSI Magnet) as Lucas, as well as some highly spammable damage-dealing moves (PK Fire comes to mind). However, it should be noted that Lucas has overall superior mobility, and Ness' PSI Magnet heals less than Lucas' and doesn't deal damage.

to:

* [[VideoGame/{{MOTHER 3}} Lucas]], who is considered the overall best character for this mainly because of Again Meta Knight, as thanks to his PSI Magnet double-hitting and very fast neutral aerial that can absorb certain attacks (such as Master Hand's finger bullets deals 19% and Duon's pink lasers), which is invaluble during a BossRush, his powerful attacks such as his PK Thunder and up smash, and the fact down smash that his triple jump deals 27% when both hits for massive damage connect, he has some of the highest DPS against bosses, while his safe offense, small hurtbox, several jumps, and ''goes through the opponent'', which mobility-boosting invincible special moves also makes a great evasion tactic. The reason why he seems more prized than Ness is that his said PSI Magnet can both damage upon releasing it and heal even more than Ness' can. Despite Lucas holding his Magnet in front of himself, his version still covers his whole body even if something tries to shoot him from behind, perhaps the best at evading boss attacks too, whereas other top tier DPS characters can't evade attacks anywhere near as well as he can turn around to absorb rear projectile shots.
can.
* Charizard is second on this list because boasts by far the highest DPS in the game due to Rock Smash, as all of its hits will connect on bosses and deal a massive 43%, which even on Intense difficulty will allow him to kill bosses in a handful of hits. Zard does struggle at evasion and Rock Smash cuts through the bosses' health bars like a hot knife through butter. Combined is quite laggy, leaving him vulnerable if spammed carelessly, but he can kill bosses so fast that you won't need to evade much anyway.
* Marth features fast and safe offense along
with the fact the Pokemon Trainer's down special move switches the Pokémon out, decent mobility, giving him above-average DPS and it also makes a good evasion tactic against a lot of the bosses' attacks, including [[ThatOneAttack Tabuu's Off Waves]].
* [[Franchise/DonkeyKong Donkey Kong]] is third here, mainly because of how powerful he is, his great reach, and his very heavy weight, making it difficult for
capabilities. But what puts him to be KO'd. His combination of Hand Slap, up smash, side smash, up aerial, and back aerial tears the bosses up in record time.
* Marth
here is fourth on the list for the fact that he's fast, has a good amount of power and reach, and the most important reason of all, '''his counter attack!''' This '''Counter''', which allows you him to dodge and attack the bosses most boss attacks easily while simultaneously striking back for a nice amount of damage, making evasion a lot easier and allows him to kill bosses quite quickly. While Ike, Peach, and Lucario also have counters, theirs are a lot slower, making it considerably more difficult to use them successfully on reaction, if not impossible, and the latter two don't scale with the countered attack either, not allowing them to deal anywhere near as much damage after they try to hit you with a physical attack, which makes most of the bosses a trivial aspect.
* Ness gets an honorable mention for having the same healing move (the PSI Magnet)
as Lucas, as well as some highly spammable damage-dealing moves (PK Fire comes to mind). However, it should be noted that Lucas has overall superior mobility, and Ness' PSI Magnet heals less than Lucas' and doesn't deal damage.
Marth's does.



* Lucas continues to be very useful in the side-modes, as his PK Thunder recovery goes right through the enemies and thus is very hard to interrupt, which is a godsend in Cruel Brawl; using this, he can just blast through the Alloys repeatedly until they're K.O'd. Ness can do this as well, but with less success since his PK Thunder stops when it hits an enemy, so if one of them [[OhCrap mindlessly (or not) jumps into it…]]
[[/folder]]

to:

* Lucas continues to be very useful in the side-modes, as his PK Thunder recovery goes right through the enemies and thus is very hard to interrupt, which is a godsend in Cruel Brawl; using this, he can just blast through the Alloys repeatedly until they're K.O'd. Ness can do this as well, but with less success since his PK Thunder stops when it hits an enemy, so if one of them [[OhCrap mindlessly (or not) jumps into it…]]
[[/folder]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Mythra's Foresight may potentially be the most broken ability in Smash Ultimate, being compared to Smash 4 Witch Time. When an enemy is about to hit Mythra as she spot-dodges, rolls or air dodges, Foresight activates and makes her take half the damage, but unlike Bats-Within, it also slows the opponent down, causing Mythra to get a potential kill or put the opponent in disadvantage state. Its punish window is longer than a parry, and it also is effective against projectiles from about half-way across the stage allowing Mythra a way to counter zoners by punishing them. What's even worse is that it also works against multi-hits, such as Pikachu's back air, Palutena's nair and even fast jabs or multi-hit out of shield options, which changes how each characters play effectively, as a lot of characters best moves are multi-hits. Moves that have high start up lag such as smash attacks are so punishable that you can switch to Pyra and kill them super early with forward smash. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh7ZN3h98bI GIMR explains more about how good this ability is]].

to:

* Mythra's Foresight may potentially be the most broken ability in Smash Ultimate, being compared to Smash 4 Witch Time. When an enemy is about to hit Mythra as she spot-dodges, rolls or air dodges, Foresight activates and makes her take half the damage, but unlike Bats-Within, it also slows the opponent down, causing Mythra to get a potential kill or put the opponent in disadvantage state. Its punish window is longer than a parry, and it also is effective against projectiles from about half-way across the stage allowing Mythra a way to counter zoners by punishing them. What's even worse is that it also works against multi-hits, such as Pikachu's back air, Palutena's nair and even fast jabs or multi-hit out of shield options, which changes how each characters play effectively, as a lot of characters best moves are multi-hits. Moves that have high start up lag such as smash attacks are so punishable that you can switch to Pyra and kill them super early with forward smash. It also works on any recovery with a hitbox, allowing Mythra to get an easier punish while they're recovering to the ledge at high percents from a down tilt into a forward smash. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh7ZN3h98bI GIMR explains more about how good this ability is]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None



to:

* Mythra's Foresight may potentially be the most broken ability in Smash Ultimate, being compared to Smash 4 Witch Time. When an enemy is about to hit Mythra as she spot-dodges, rolls or air dodges, Foresight activates and makes her take half the damage, but unlike Bats-Within, it also slows the opponent down, causing Mythra to get a potential kill or put the opponent in disadvantage state. Its punish window is longer than a parry, and it also is effective against projectiles from about half-way across the stage allowing Mythra a way to counter zoners by punishing them. What's even worse is that it also works against multi-hits, such as Pikachu's back air, Palutena's nair and even fast jabs or multi-hit out of shield options, which changes how each characters play effectively, as a lot of characters best moves are multi-hits. Moves that have high start up lag such as smash attacks are so punishable that you can switch to Pyra and kill them super early with forward smash. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh7ZN3h98bI GIMR explains more about how good this ability is]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* Pikachu qualifies as well, for many of the same reasons as Pichu. While he doesn't hit as hard as Pichu, he's also much harder to effectively damage despite his larger hitbox, as most of his moves have a very small window in which to effectively punish him. And Pikachu's grab/n-air loops are capable of doing extreme amounts of damage, especially if Pikachu has already weakened the opponent with the very spammable Thunder Jolt. And at high percents, an up-toss followed by Thunder is usually fatal. His dash attack kills at 150% (and it isn't hard for Pikachu to get opponents to that point), and it's also too fast to dodge if you aren't dodging already, meaning you have to shield against it and risk getting grabbed when you try to follow up. And if you fall off the stage, you might as well take the fall, because Pikachu's excellent recovery makes edge-guarding as easy as a down-air and an up special. That's to say nothing of the half-dozen other kill-confirms Pikachu has.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
"Some of the most balanced roster"? It's one roster. Also, it is the most well-balanced game in the series.


* While ''Ultimate'' has some of the most balanced character roster in a ''Smash'' game, there's still characters that are top tier. Peach and Daisy are both characters with extremely good aerial mobility due to their float mechanic and their aerial attacks such as their normal air and forward air are very dangerous, with forward air being a kill move at around 100%. In addition, recovering against them is extremely hard due to great edgeguarding thanks to Toad and the buffed turnips while possessing a great combo ability. She does end up being a case of DifficultButAwesome similarly to ''Melee'' Fox due to being a very technical character, but that doesn't stop Peach getting third at Genesis 6. (While Daisy doesn't have as good results, their movesets are identical.) Both characters were significantly nerfed in patch 3.1.0.

to:

* While ''Ultimate'' has some of the most balanced character roster in a the ''Smash'' game, series, there's still characters that are top tier. Peach and Daisy are both characters with extremely good aerial mobility due to their float mechanic and their aerial attacks such as their normal air and forward air are very dangerous, with forward air being a kill move at around 100%. In addition, recovering against them is extremely hard due to great edgeguarding thanks to Toad and the buffed turnips while possessing a great combo ability. She does end up being a case of DifficultButAwesome similarly to ''Melee'' Fox due to being a very technical character, but that doesn't stop Peach getting third at Genesis 6. (While Daisy doesn't have as good results, their movesets are identical.) Both characters were significantly nerfed in patch 3.1.0.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None



to:

* While it's random, Sephiroth's Final Smash, Supernova, has a chance to be this by inflicting the target with random effects. While some of these, like flower sprouting or just launching aren't so bad, it can also inflict devastating ailments like slowdown (like the Timer item), Reversed Controls or even straight-up forcing a Shield Break. It's not just the dizzy state that happens- it literally forces the target to go through an entire Shield Break- this makes that particular effect, which is already devastating, spell certain doom for Jigglypuff, because, well, [[OneHitKill you know what happens when Jigglypuff's Shield gets broken.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Lucas. His up smash is already super powerful with decent range. However, when you combine that with ArtificialStupidity, how often battles reduce opponents' defenses, and some of the Smash Attack related boosts from the Skill Tree, it becomes ''very'' useful. And for battles that like to shoot a lot, PSI Magnet allows for a lot of healing. His down smash is useful in stamina battles, since all three parts of the attack will very likely connect and take off a large chunk of your opponent's HP.

to:

* Lucas. His up smash is already super powerful with decent range. However, when you combine that with ArtificialStupidity, how often battles reduce opponents' defenses, and some of the Smash Attack related boosts from the Skill Tree, it becomes ''very'' useful. And for battles that like to shoot a lot, PSI Magnet allows for a lot of healing. His down smash is useful in stamina battles, since all three parts of the attack will very likely connect and take off a large chunk of your opponent's HP. Finally, his Final Smash if angled can send opponents into the blast zone or far enough off the edge so they can't recover.

Added: 1014

Changed: 584

Removed: 419

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Ridley's ability to cancel his command grab, Space Pirate Rush, yet still launch characters away makes spirit battles in walk-off stages immensely easy. Even ones as infamously hard as the Giga Mac battle can end without taking so much as scratch damage thanks to it. If uncancelled, it kills Ridley first, but correct timing just after Ridley is offscreen will end battles that would be hell for any other character.



* Ridley's down special, Skewer, is normally immensely tricky to land on any aware opponent, especially with the precision required. However, giant characters and slow, metal characters, especially combinations of both, can't really do much to prevent being shish-kebabbed due to their gigantic size or sluggish movement making them a very forgiving target to land the sweetspot with. To make matters even better, most giant battles are also Stamina ones, where Skewer is even better. Add power from skills and Ridley's own spirits, and it may very well one shot {{Mighty Glacier}}s with ease.

to:

* Ridley is a particularly powerful character in World of Light, mainly due to how abuseable 2 particular specials become in this mode:
** Ridley's ability to cancel his command grab, Space Pirate Rush, yet still launch characters away makes spirit battles in walk-off stages immensely easy. Even ones as infamously hard as the Giga Mac battle can end without taking so much as scratch damage thanks to it. If uncancelled, it kills Ridley first, but correct timing just after Ridley is offscreen will end battles that would be hell for any other character.
**
Ridley's down special, Skewer, is normally immensely tricky to land on any aware opponent, especially with the precision required. However, giant characters and slow, metal characters, especially combinations of both, can't really do much to prevent being shish-kebabbed due to their gigantic size or sluggish movement making them a very forgiving target to land the sweetspot with. To make matters even better, most giant battles are also Stamina ones, where Skewer is even better. Add power from skills and Ridley's own spirits, and it may very well one shot {{Mighty Glacier}}s with ease.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Fixed a spelling error that I missed in the last edit.


** In addition, his advantages on 3DS Smash Run (high mobility, teleporting Side-B) also apply to Master Fortress, whith the extra bonus that the charged Water Shuriken can take out the enemies and hearts from a safe distance.

to:

** In addition, his advantages on 3DS Smash Run (high mobility, teleporting Side-B) also apply to Master Fortress, whith with the extra bonus that the charged Water Shuriken can take out the enemies and hearts from a safe distance.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Spelling fix.


** Against the Hands in particular, the ONLY damage you will receive is the progressive damage from jumping above the blast line (wich won't kill you).

to:

** Against the Hands in particular, the ONLY damage you will receive is the progressive damage from jumping above the blast line (wich (which won't kill you).
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Eventually, the 9.0.0/[[VideoGame/{{Minecraft}} Steve]] patch attempted to make "Hitstun Arts" less of a strategy by increasing how much knockback Shulk takes during Shield Art, but many are already believing this to not be ''too'' significant of a nerf in the long run, especially since the same patch compensated for this giving his actual counter more knockback power, bringing it more in line with its destructive ''Smash 4'' counterpart.

to:

** Eventually, the 9.0.0/[[VideoGame/{{Minecraft}} Steve]] patch attempted to make "Hitstun Arts" less of a strategy by increasing how much knockback Shulk takes during Shield Art, but many are already believing this to not be ''too'' significant of a nerf in the long run, especially since the same patch compensated for this by giving his actual counter more knockback power, bringing it more in line with its destructive ''Smash 4'' counterpart.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
What I will now call "Hitstun Arts" for ease is still in the game, but the best art to use with this has finally been nerfed.


** To put the Shield Art's increased strudiness and flexibilty of use in perspective, as well as just how oppressive it feels against opponents, when [[https://twitter.com/roebruh/status/1192119697585651712 a Twitter post]] [[{{Troll}} jokingly-claimed]] that the Version 6.0.0/[[VideoGame/FatalFury Terry]] patch of the game outright ''removed'' the ability to use Monado Arts during hitstun, ''including the Shield Art'', there were as ''very'' many players [[ThisCannotBe that were in sheer disbelief, if not outright mourning about it]] as there were players [[AndThereWasMuchRejoicing singing praises of what would've been a very signficant nerf to the Monado Boy]]. However, [[FailedASpotCheck such a significant nerf would've certainly been noted in the official patch notes]] as savvier players noticed, and using Monado Arts while under attack [[AllThereInTheManual being an acknowledged and suggested tactic in the game’s tips about using Shulk]] ([[OlderThanTheyThink and has applied to the previous game, as well]]) means that this is not expected to be changed or removed anytime soon.

to:

** To put the Shield Art's increased strudiness sturdiness and flexibilty flexibility of use in perspective, as well as just how oppressive it feels against opponents, when [[https://twitter.com/roebruh/status/1192119697585651712 a Twitter post]] [[{{Troll}} jokingly-claimed]] that the Version 6.0.0/[[VideoGame/FatalFury Terry]] patch of the game outright ''removed'' the ability to use Monado Arts during hitstun, ''including the Shield Art'', there were as ''very'' many players [[ThisCannotBe that were in sheer disbelief, if not outright mourning about it]] as there were players [[AndThereWasMuchRejoicing singing praises of what would've been a very signficant nerf to the Monado Boy]]. However, [[FailedASpotCheck such a significant nerf would've certainly been noted in the official patch notes]] as savvier players noticed, and using Monado Arts while under attack [[AllThereInTheManual being an acknowledged and suggested tactic in the game’s tips about using Shulk]] ([[OlderThanTheyThink and has applied to the previous game, as well]]) means that this is not expected to be changed or removed anytime soon.
** Eventually, the 9.0.0/[[VideoGame/{{Minecraft}} Steve]] patch attempted to make "Hitstun Arts" less of a strategy by increasing how much knockback Shulk takes during Shield Art, but many are already believing this to not be ''too'' significant of a nerf in the long run, especially since the same patch compensated for this giving his actual counter more knockback power, bringing it more in line with its destructive ''Smash 4'' counterpart.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* As much as some people wanted it to be tournament legal for the sake of more flashy matches and to resemble more traditional fighting games, Final Smash Meter is unbalanced for many reasons. The meter fills up as you attack your opponents and it fills up fast when you get hit, and a portion of the meter is lost whenever a stock is taken. This means that MightyGlacier and StoneWall characters get an advantage as they can fill up their FS meter more easily than most other characters. The Final Smashes themselves are nerfed but some of them get it easy as some of them still deal a large amount of damage while also instant killing if the opponent is over 100%.

to:

* As much as some people wanted it to be tournament legal for the sake of more flashy matches and to resemble more traditional fighting games, Final Smash Meter is unbalanced for many reasons. The meter fills up as you attack your opponents and it or get attacked, but the latter fills up fast when you get hit, and a portion of the meter is lost whenever a stock is taken. much more. While the Final Smashes used through the Meter are weaker, they're still very powerful, and ones with [[OneHitKill one-hit KO]] effects can still do so. The Final Smashes themselves all range from "fairly avoidable" to "nigh-impossible to avoid," notably Zelda's and Bowser's(both of which can OHKO as mentioned). This means that MightyGlacier and StoneWall characters characters, like King K. Rool or the aforementioned Bowser get an advantage as they can fill up their FS meter more easily than most other characters. The characters, and that a player essentially gets punished for winning as they'll inevitably have to deal with a potential ThatOneAttack before they can use theirs. A charged Final Smashes themselves are nerfed Smash eventually disappears if unused for a while, but some of them get it easy as some of them still deal a large amount of damage while also instant killing if anything this results in ''more'' camping when the opponent opponent's meter is over 100%.
full.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Typo


** Because the Shield Art significantly raises Shulk's resistance to knockback, it can even be used to set up the opponent for a deadly secondary psudeo-counter similar to Incineroar's Revenge, namely by reducing the hits of several multi-hit jabs and multi-hit special moves (such as Donkey Kong's Spinning Kong, R.O.B.'s Arm Rotor, and most infamously Bowser's Whirling Fortress) into CherryTapping, then, depending on the opponent's damage, retaliating with a Forward Smash or a similar attack powered by a quick switch into either the [[GlassCannon Buster or Smash Arts]] during the endlag of the opponent's finishing hit of their multi-hit move. Even without the use of his actual CounterAttack, Vision, the Shield Art can potentially allow Shulk to get in kills even after the enemy successfully hits him.

to:

** Because the Shield Art significantly raises Shulk's resistance to knockback, it can even be used to set up the opponent for a deadly secondary psudeo-counter pseudo-counter similar to Incineroar's Revenge, namely by reducing the hits of several multi-hit jabs and multi-hit special moves (such as Donkey Kong's Spinning Kong, R.O.B.'s Arm Rotor, and most infamously Bowser's Whirling Fortress) into CherryTapping, then, depending on the opponent's damage, retaliating with a Forward Smash or a similar attack powered by a quick switch into either the [[GlassCannon Buster or Smash Arts]] during the endlag of the opponent's finishing hit of their multi-hit move. Even without the use of his actual CounterAttack, Vision, the Shield Art can potentially allow Shulk to get in kills even after the enemy successfully hits him.


Added DiffLines:

Top