History Fridge / DragonAgeOrigins

29th Oct '17 11:25:41 PM LadyNorbert
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* Leliana's tale about Flemeth off-handedly mentions that Flemeth can steal a woman's beauty through mirrors, and Morrigan's one piece of property as a child was a stolen mirror, later broken by Flemeth. These seem minor elements, a common superstition and a cruel lesson, respectively, until Witch Hunt, wherein Morrigan escapes through a magic mirror, implied to be bound to Flemeth's will...

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* Leliana's tale about Flemeth off-handedly mentions that Flemeth can steal a woman's beauty through mirrors, and Morrigan's one piece of property as a child was a stolen mirror, later broken by Flemeth. These seem minor elements, a common superstition and a cruel lesson, respectively, until Witch Hunt, ''Witch Hunt'', wherein Morrigan escapes through a magic mirror, implied to be bound to Flemeth's will...



*** It actually makes sense. In Inquisition, Flemeth can note that she would not be able to get Morrigan's body without her approval. So gaining a lot of power might be a good argument for Morrigan to undergo the process, we don't know how much it is "taking over the body" or "merging two people".
* Morrigan's morality - players often consider her {{Token Evil Teammate}} but she isn't evil in the manically-laughing-while-starting-up-her-doomsday-machine sort of way. She has more of the 'law of the jungle" mindset. Now remember what she says about her shapeshifter training - she had to accept the way animals behave and think in order to master that skill. She basically has no other morality system available than survival of the fittest. And she can become a much nicer person under the influence of the Warden, especially if the Warden fathers Kieran and enters the mirror in The Awakening.

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*** It actually makes sense. In Inquisition, ''Inquisition'', Flemeth can note that she would not be able to get Morrigan's body without her approval. So gaining a lot of power might be a good argument for Morrigan to undergo the process, we don't know how much it is "taking over the body" or "merging two people".
* Morrigan's morality - players often consider her {{Token Evil Teammate}} but she isn't evil in the manically-laughing-while-starting-up-her-doomsday-machine sort of way. She has more of the 'law of the jungle" mindset. Now remember what she says about her shapeshifter training - she had to accept the way animals behave and think in order to master that skill. She basically has no other morality system available than survival of the fittest. And she can become a much nicer person under the influence of the Warden, especially if the Warden fathers Kieran and enters the mirror in The Awakening.''Witch Hunt''.



* If playing the Mage storyline when you encounter Uldred in the Circle Tower, you can pick options saying you aren't so different from him, to which he'll agree happily. [[spoiler: The demon possessing Uldred is a Pride demon and what demon did you encounter trying to tempt you in your Harrowing? A Pride demon. This is particularly FridgeBrilliance if you're playing a morally ambiguous or evil character]].
* DLC FridgeHorror ''and'' Fridge Brilliance from ''Leliana's Song.'' Leliana lies in a dark, dank dungeon [[spoiler: after having been betrayed by her lover Marjolaine to a cruel Fereldn officer]]. She is sobbing and crying. She never tells us what happened to her in that dungeon, and we assume it's run of the mill torture... until the corrupt officer makes a cruel remark to her later in the story [[spoiler: about simply asking if she "wanted more men."]] Note, in the prison cutscene, [[FridgeHorror where the blood stains are]].

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* If playing the Mage storyline storyline, when you encounter Uldred in the Circle Tower, you can pick options saying you aren't so different from him, to which he'll agree happily. [[spoiler: The demon possessing Uldred is a Pride demon - and what demon did you encounter trying to tempt you in your Harrowing? A Pride demon. This is particularly FridgeBrilliance if you're playing a morally ambiguous or evil character]].
* DLC FridgeHorror ''and'' Fridge Brilliance from ''Leliana's Song.'' Leliana lies in a dark, dank dungeon [[spoiler: after having been betrayed by her lover Marjolaine to a cruel Fereldn Fereldan officer]]. She is sobbing and crying. She never tells us what happened to her in that dungeon, and we assume it's run of the mill torture... until the corrupt officer makes a cruel remark to her later in the story [[spoiler: about simply asking if she "wanted more men."]] Note, in the prison cutscene, [[FridgeHorror where the blood stains are]].



* FridgeBrilliance and FridgeHorror (at least from the Templars' perspective) in one: in the Mage's Circle quest, why is the Templar's Nightmare by far the most difficult section of the Fade to navigate? Because the Templars are obsessed with upholding the law and order of the Chantry. Spatial relations are probably the most well-ordered thing in the world; if even they prove unreliable, we have truly entered a Templar's nightmare.
* Where Alistair presented the rose from Lothering...that that ''has'' to be the same rose that Leliana saw that made her think her vision was true. When Alistair gives the player that rose, he says pretty much the same thing that Leliana does when you ask her about her vision. "In the midst of darkness, there is still beauty." With that in mind, it makes tons of sense that they could end up as a couple in Darkspawn Chronicles.

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* FridgeBrilliance and FridgeHorror (at least from the Templars' perspective) in one: in the Mage's Circle "Broken Circle" quest, why is the Templar's Nightmare by far the most difficult section of the Fade to navigate? Because the Templars are obsessed with upholding the law and order of the Chantry. Spatial relations are probably the most well-ordered thing in the world; if even they prove unreliable, we have truly entered a Templar's nightmare.
* Where Alistair presented the rose from Lothering...that that ''has'' to be the same rose that Leliana saw that made her think her vision was true. When Alistair gives the player that rose, he says pretty much the same thing that Leliana does when you ask her about her vision. "In the midst of darkness, there is still beauty." With that in mind, it makes tons of sense that they could end up as a couple in Darkspawn Chronicles.''Darkspawn Chronicles''.



** Upon retrieving his sword, Sten's comments if the Warden isn't sure they aren't ''Ashkaari'', which is a Qunari title meaning "One Who Seeks". While his tone indicates he's joking (and making a StealthPun that the Warden does a lot of seeking), its also possible he's expressing his new-found respect for the Warden. Being Ashkaari means having complete and utter understanding of one's role and purpose in life, thus having reached enlightenment, which is the goal of the Qun. While the Warden initially confused Sten with their seemingly erratic decisions, Sten now recognises the Warden's role as an ''Ashkaari of the Grey Wardens''. This would also explain why after finding Asala, he voices his opinion but does not question the Warden's decision to go to Haven, since the Warden is ''following the demands of their role''.

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** Upon retrieving his sword, Sten's comments if the Warden isn't sure they aren't ''Ashkaari'', which is a Qunari title meaning "One Who Seeks". While his tone indicates he's joking (and making a StealthPun that the Warden does a lot of seeking), its it's also possible he's expressing his new-found newfound respect for the Warden. Being Ashkaari ''Ashkaari'' means having complete and utter understanding of one's role and purpose in life, thus having reached enlightenment, which is the goal of the Qun. While the Warden initially confused Sten with their seemingly erratic decisions, Sten now recognises the Warden's role as an ''Ashkaari of the Grey Wardens''. This would also explain why after finding Asala, he voices his opinion but does not question the Warden's decision to go to Haven, since the Warden is ''following the demands of their role''.



** It also makes sense that with Morrigan's influence, she would advise him to make choices that were more about strength, hence why he'd save the Anvil and side with the Werewolves, both of which are are good on the offensive. The problem is that this meant that Alistair's force had little in the way of defensive strategy which the Dalish Archers would have provided to take the flack off of the ground-forces. Similarly without recruiting Wynne, Alistair had no-one to keep his companions healthy and able to fight, instead relying on the sheer offensive power Morrigan provided to win battles. Without the Warden's presence Alistair became very ruthless, but this also meant there was no one to stop Alistair from being ''reckless''.

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** It also makes sense that with Morrigan's influence, she would advise him to make choices that were more about strength, hence why he'd save the Anvil and side with the Werewolves, both of which are are good on the offensive. The problem is that this meant that Alistair's force had little in the way of defensive strategy which the Dalish Archers would have provided to take the flack off of the ground-forces. Similarly Similarly, without recruiting Wynne, Alistair had no-one no one to keep his companions healthy and able to fight, instead relying on the sheer offensive power Morrigan provided to win battles. Without the Warden's presence Alistair became very ruthless, but this also meant there was no one to stop Alistair from being ''reckless''.



* If Zevran is with you when Master Ignacio offers you a quest, they will have a dialogue where Zevran will try to justify his failure to kill you, only for Ignacio to point out it was [[TooDumbToLive suicidal]] to even take this contract to begin with. [[spoiler:It eventually turns out that not only was Zevran indeed the only one willing to take the contract, but [[DeathSeeker he was indeed being suicidal]]]].

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* If Zevran is with you when Master Ignacio offers you a quest, they will have a dialogue where Zevran will try to justify his failure to kill you, only for Ignacio to point out it was [[TooDumbToLive suicidal]] to even take this contract to begin with.in the first place. [[spoiler:It eventually turns out that not only was Zevran indeed the only one willing to take the contract, but [[DeathSeeker he was indeed being suicidal]]]].



* More a Fridge for the series as a whole, but the Warden from most of the trailers is a warrior. In most of [=DA=]2's trailers, Hawke is a mage. And in DAI's trailers, the Inquisitor is a rogue. This makes sense for each of the characters and their respective games. DAO is a Fantasy Epic where you gather an army to combat a dark evil. The Warrior Hero is best suited for it, as is with other fantasy stories. The Mage/Templar conflict is full force in [=DA=]2, and making Hawke a mage only adds to the drama and tension. Finally, the Inquisitor is a rogue, leading a Shadowy Organization with a penchant for Taking the Third Option, best suited for rogues, who use stealth and cunning.

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* More a Fridge for the series as a whole, but the Warden from most of the trailers is a warrior. In most of [=DA=]2's DAII's trailers, Hawke is a mage. And in DAI's trailers, the Inquisitor is a rogue. This makes sense for each of the characters and their respective games. DAO is a Fantasy Epic where you gather an army to combat a dark evil. The Warrior Hero is best suited for it, as is with other fantasy stories. The Mage/Templar conflict is full force in [=DA=]2, DAII, and making Hawke a mage only adds to the drama and tension. Finally, the Inquisitor is a rogue, leading a Shadowy Organization with a penchant for Taking the Third Option, best suited for rogues, who use stealth and cunning.



** It's possible though that Loghain had at least ''some'' partial reason believe Howe when he said the Couslands were in cahoots with Orlais, given his extreme pro-patriotic paranoia and the fact that their eldest son Fergus married an Antivan woman (much to the displeasure of more conservative and patriotic Fereldens) and their closeness with Cailan and Eamon, who ''Return to Ostagar'' reveals (and WordOfGod confirms he knew) were plotting to divorce Anora so Cailan could remarry the Empress of Orlais. Not that Loghain didn't have something to gain by supporting the man who took down the most powerful, influential, and loyal nobles after Cailan and Eamon, but still...

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** It's possible though possible, though, that Loghain had at least ''some'' partial reason believe Howe when he said the Couslands were in cahoots with Orlais, given his extreme pro-patriotic paranoia and the fact that their eldest son Fergus married an Antivan woman (much to the displeasure of more conservative and patriotic Fereldens) Fereldans) and their closeness with Cailan and Eamon, who ''Return to Ostagar'' reveals (and WordOfGod confirms he knew) were plotting to divorce Anora so Cailan could remarry the Empress of Orlais. Not that Loghain didn't have something to gain by supporting the man who took down the most powerful, influential, and loyal nobles after Cailan and Eamon, but still...



** Cailan is clearly in on the plan, too. After the Joining is complete and the war council is discussing lighting the signal fire at the Tower of Ishal, he notes what an important task it is and says that "We should send our best - send Alistair and the new Grey Warden." Why in the world would Cailan entrust such an important task to the two newest members of the order? [[spoiler:Because one of them is ''his brother'', and the last living member of the royal family should Cailan fall. And the other? The other is a completely green recruit, someone who will need the guidance of a slightly more seasoned Warden if something goes wrong. Cailan was not only trying to save his brother's life, but was also ''giving him a purpose'' - protecting his new friend.]] Not only that, it's an important enough task that no one will question sending a Warden or two, but simple enough that Alistair shouldn't have been in any real danger (no expected the Tower to be overrun with Darkspawn).
*** Not only that, sending Alistair to the Tower removes him from the main battle and puts him in a more defensible position. In the return to Ostagar DLC we find out that Cailan [[spoiler: knew that the battle ahead was going to be difficult and that it wasn't likely that Fereldan could survive without aid.(Cailan's plan being Orlais while the Warden and companions recruit the treaty factions).]] The Tower is much easier to defend (the fact that it was already overrun non-withstanding) and being away from the main horde means that a rescue would be easier to mount if necessary.
* Arl Eamon's treatment of Alistair when he lived in his castle (treating him like a stray, making him sleep in the stables and kennels like a dog, etc) can take on a whole new light after the player learns that [[spoiler:Alistair's mother is an elf. If Eamon knew about Alistair's true parentage, then given the amount of FantasticRacism and UrbanSegregation against elves in the setting, even {{HalfHuman Hybrid}}s like Alistair,]] [[AlternateCharacterInterpretation it's possible]] that Eamon treated him the way he did at least partially/subconsciously because of this.
** It's unlikely that Eamon knew Alistair's mother was an [[spoiler: elf, because that might lead them to the fact that she was a MAGE (which would have probably made it impossible to rally the people behind him, being that magic is hated and feared as a general rule) as he is canonically Fiona's son.]] It's more likely that he was acting out on the fact that Maric (being the widower of his older sister) expected him to raise (and possibly support) a bastard child who was not his beloved sister's (she having passed away by then) AND also a possible threat to Cailan's ascent to the throne (Cailan being his nephew and kin)
** At one point, Alistair mentions that Duncan forcibly conscripted him against the chantry's express wishes, taking him away from the templars. While already in character for Duncan, it makes even more sense when you find out [[spoiler: he's close friends with Alistair's real mother and has been for years, and considered Maric something of a friend as well.]] Of course Duncan would want to get him out when he knew Alistair was miserable, even knowing it would earn him the disapproval of the Chantry! This also adds layers to Duncan deliberately rescuing a mage Warden or an elf Warden - [[spoiler: he knows from Fiona exactly how badly both can be treated]].
* Leliana very easily getting into a romance with The Warden may seem like a bug at first, however take into account she was a spy. A bard. A HoneyTrap. One discussion yields that she used these methods before to entrap targets, she's doing the same to you son except this time's genuine, romancing you the best way she knows how.

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** Cailan is clearly in on the plan, too. After the Joining is complete and the war council is discussing lighting the signal fire at the Tower of Ishal, he notes what an important task it is and says that "We should send our best - send Alistair and the new Grey Warden." Why in the world would Cailan entrust such an important task to the two newest members of the order? [[spoiler:Because one of them is ''his brother'', and the last living member of the royal family should Cailan fall. And the other? The other is a completely green recruit, someone who will need the guidance of a slightly more seasoned Warden if something goes wrong. Cailan was not only trying to save his brother's life, but was also ''giving him a purpose'' - protecting his new friend.]] Not only that, it's an important enough task that no one will question sending a Warden or two, but simple enough that Alistair shouldn't have been in any real danger (no one expected the Tower to would be overrun with Darkspawn).
darkspawn).
*** Not only that, sending Alistair to the Tower removes him from the main battle and puts him in a more defensible position. In the return ''Return to Ostagar Ostagar'' DLC we find out that Cailan [[spoiler: knew that the battle ahead was going to be difficult and that it wasn't likely that Fereldan Ferelden could survive without aid.(Cailan's plan being Orlais while the Warden and companions recruit the treaty factions).]] The Tower is much easier to defend (the fact that it was already overrun non-withstanding) notwithstanding) and being away from the main horde means that a rescue would be easier to mount if necessary.
* Arl Eamon's treatment of Alistair when he lived in his castle (treating him like a stray, making him sleep in the stables and kennels like a dog, etc) etc.) can take on a whole new light after the player learns that [[spoiler:Alistair's mother is an elf. If Eamon knew about Alistair's true parentage, then given the amount of FantasticRacism and UrbanSegregation against elves in the setting, even {{HalfHuman Hybrid}}s like Alistair,]] [[AlternateCharacterInterpretation it's possible]] that Eamon treated him the way he did at least partially/subconsciously because of this.
** It's unlikely that Eamon knew Alistair's mother was an [[spoiler: elf, because that might lead them to the fact that she was a MAGE ''mage'' (which would have probably made it impossible to rally the people behind him, being that magic is hated and feared as a general rule) as he is canonically Fiona's son.]] It's more likely that he was acting out on the fact that Maric (being the widower of his older sister) expected him to raise (and possibly support) a bastard child who was not his beloved sister's (she having passed away by then) AND ''and'' also a possible threat to Cailan's ascent to the throne (Cailan being his nephew and kin)
kin).
** At one point, Alistair mentions that Duncan forcibly conscripted him against the chantry's Chantry's express wishes, taking him away from the templars.Templars. While already in character for Duncan, it makes even more sense when you find out [[spoiler: he's close friends with Alistair's real mother and has been for years, and considered Maric something of a friend as well.]] Of course Duncan would want to get him out when he knew Alistair was miserable, even knowing it would earn him the disapproval of the Chantry! This also adds layers to Duncan deliberately rescuing a mage Warden or an elf Warden - [[spoiler: he knows from Fiona exactly how badly both can be treated]].
* Leliana very easily getting into a romance with The the Warden may seem like a bug at first, however first; however, take into account that she was a spy. A bard. A HoneyTrap. One discussion yields reveals that she used these methods before to entrap targets, and now she's doing the same to you son - except this time's genuine, time it's genuine. She's romancing you the best way she knows how.



* Caladrius, a late-game enemy blood mage, [[spoiler:can use a blood ritual that sacrifices a room full of slaves to give himself...1 measly point of constitution (5 HP)]]. Then you think about how much HP he has compared to almost anyone else in the game...

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* Caladrius, a late-game enemy blood mage, [[spoiler:can use a blood ritual that sacrifices a room full of slaves to give himself... 1 measly point of constitution (5 HP)]]. Then you think about how much HP he has compared to almost anyone else in the game...



* Broodmothers are made through forced exposure to the taint. They're not actually darkspawn - they are blighted elves/dwarves/humans/qunari, who progressively turn more and more into ghoulish versions of themselves. Eventually, the process reduces them to mere animal instinct, leading them to devolve into consuming the men and submitting to whatever horrific procedure makes them reproduce.

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* Broodmothers are made through forced exposure to the taint. They're not actually darkspawn - they are blighted elves/dwarves/humans/qunari, elves/dwarves/humans/Qunari, who progressively turn more and more into ghoulish versions of themselves. Eventually, the process reduces them to mere animal instinct, leading them to devolve into consuming the men and submitting to whatever horrific procedure makes them reproduce.



** Another specialization, the Spirit Healer one, says in its description that it is the result of the mage making a covenant with a benevolent spirit, making it the flipside of blood magic and being regarded with wariness. Said covenant, at the very least in Wynne's case but also possibly in the cases of others, involves the spirit entering their body. All well and good you think? [[spoiler: Wait for VideoGame/DragonAgeII...]]

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** Another specialization, the Spirit Healer one, says in its description that it is the result of the mage making a covenant with a benevolent spirit, making it the flipside of blood magic and being regarded with wariness. Said covenant, at the very least in Wynne's case but also possibly in the cases of others, involves the spirit entering their body. All well and good good, you think? [[spoiler: Wait for VideoGame/DragonAgeII...''VideoGame/DragonAgeII''...]]



** The soon-to-be Warden meets a [[spoiler: Pride Demon, but doesn't actually have to fight it. As if turns out from VideoGame/DragonAgeOriginsAwakening and VideoGame/DragonAgeII, though, that's for the very best- you encounter a Pride Demon and have to fight them in both, with your party at your disposal at both times, and it's still a tough boss-fight. Which begs for the question... what would have happened if the demon in the Harrowing hadn't just decided to settle for the young apprentice seeing through its cover? What are the chances that young mage about to be out of apprenticeship and armed with nothing more than a weaker staff acquired from a Spirit of Valor could have won an actual fight like that?]] True, the First Enchanter does say you have to use your wits, but think about it, this IS exactly what Mouse describes it to be: throwing hapless and helpless young mages to the demons with barely any means of protecting themselves. And this is what the Chantry has been doing. For centuries. IN EVERY SINGLE CIRCLE.
** In light of new information regarding the nature of spirits and demons in VideoGame/DragonAgeInquisition, there is a possibility that Mouse was actually a spirit. According to [[EnlightenmentSuperpowers Solas]], a spirit often manifests as what its mortal viewer expects it to be. Spirits of wisdom are sometimes turned into demons of pride by this way, simply because the latter is the expectation. Following that logic, Mouse may have appeared as a pride demon to the Warden, when, in-fact, was not. The Warden deemed Mouse to be the true challenge of the Harrowing, which the Templars and senior mages warned to be a demon. Therefore, Mouse adapted to the Warden's expectation. This theory can be supported by Mouse's choice to spare the Warden, whom it could have easily possessed.
** Alternatively, [[spoiler:The Pride Demon knows that if he possesses the Mage, he'll just be cut down by the Templars that must be prepared for that possibility. So he's probably just messing with him/her.]]

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** The soon-to-be Warden meets a [[spoiler: Pride Demon, but doesn't actually have to fight it. As if turns out from VideoGame/DragonAgeOriginsAwakening ''VideoGame/DragonAgeOriginsAwakening'' and VideoGame/DragonAgeII, ''VideoGame/DragonAgeII'', though, that's for the very best- you encounter a Pride Demon and have to fight them in both, with your party at your disposal at both times, and it's still a tough boss-fight. Which begs for the question... what would have happened if the demon in the Harrowing hadn't just decided to settle for the young apprentice seeing through its cover? What are the chances that young mage about to be out of apprenticeship and armed with nothing more than a weaker staff acquired from a Spirit of Valor could have won an actual fight like that?]] True, the First Enchanter does say you have to use your wits, but think about it, this IS exactly what Mouse describes it to be: throwing hapless and helpless young mages to the demons with barely any means of protecting themselves. And this is what the Chantry has been doing. For centuries. IN EVERY SINGLE CIRCLE.
** In light of new information regarding the nature of spirits and demons in VideoGame/DragonAgeInquisition, ''VideoGame/DragonAgeInquisition'', there is a possibility that Mouse was actually a spirit. According to [[EnlightenmentSuperpowers Solas]], a spirit often manifests as what its mortal viewer expects it to be. Spirits of wisdom are sometimes turned into demons of pride by this way, simply because the latter is the expectation. Following that logic, Mouse may have appeared as a pride demon to the Warden, when, in-fact, was not. The Warden deemed Mouse to be the true challenge of the Harrowing, which the Templars and senior mages warned to be a demon. Therefore, Mouse adapted to the Warden's expectation. This theory can be supported by Mouse's choice to spare the Warden, whom it could have easily possessed.
** Alternatively, [[spoiler:The [[spoiler:the Pride Demon knows that if he possesses the Mage, he'll just be cut down by the Templars that must be prepared for that possibility. So he's probably just messing with him/her.]]
27th Jul '17 10:31:28 AM akanesarumara
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** Another specialization, the Spirit Healer one, says in its description that it is the result of the mage making a covenant with a benevolent spirit, making it the flipside of blood magic and being regarded with wariness. Said covenant, at the very least in Wynne's case but also possibly in the cases of others, involves the spirit entering their body. All well and good you think? [[spoiler: Wait for VideoGame/DragonAgeII...]]
24th Jul '17 6:07:28 PM nombretomado
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** It always seemed a little bit odd that Wynne would turn on you if you destroyed the Urn of Sacred Ashes as she never seemed to be overly devout, certainly not to Leliana levels. Then comes ''VideoGame/DragonAgeII'' when we see that joining with a Spirit of the Fade can have pronounced alterations on the mage's personality. So of course Wynne would try to kill/abandon you. You've just destroyed one of the most highly regarded holy relics in Thedas, and Wynne is joined with a spirit of ''Faith''. The brilliance on that point kicks in even during the first game: [[spoiler:Eamon's son, Connor]], who is [[DemonicPossession possessed by a desire demon]], becomes completely different from his usual self. Also, in a moment of FridgeBrilliance [[XMeetsY meets]] WildMassGuessing, if you defile the ashes, the two party members who immediately attack you, regardless of approval ratings, are Wynne and Leliana. Maybe the Cult of Andraste was right about their prophet being reborn - they just had the wrong entity.

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** It always seemed a little bit odd that Wynne would turn on you if you destroyed the Urn of Sacred Ashes as she never seemed to be overly devout, certainly not to Leliana levels. Then comes ''VideoGame/DragonAgeII'' when we see that joining with a Spirit of the Fade can have pronounced alterations on the mage's personality. So of course Wynne would try to kill/abandon you. You've just destroyed one of the most highly regarded holy relics in Thedas, and Wynne is joined with a spirit of ''Faith''. The brilliance on that point kicks in even during the first game: [[spoiler:Eamon's son, Connor]], who is [[DemonicPossession possessed by a desire demon]], becomes completely different from his usual self. Also, in a moment of FridgeBrilliance [[XMeetsY [[JustForFun/XMeetsY meets]] WildMassGuessing, if you defile the ashes, the two party members who immediately attack you, regardless of approval ratings, are Wynne and Leliana. Maybe the Cult of Andraste was right about their prophet being reborn - they just had the wrong entity.
11th Jul '17 3:07:11 PM PocketFox
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** In addition, the Templar Order uses a flaming sword as their symbol; Archon Hessarian mercifully ended Andraste's suffering using his sword.
6th Jul '17 6:15:26 AM Imjustme
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*** But, notably [[spoiler: Fiona, a former grey warden,]] was cured of the taint and there are others actively looking for a way to replicate that success. Added with the fact that Grey Wardens carry but don't pass on the Taint, there could eventually be a way discovered to neutralise it's contagious nature for friendly ones like the Messenger if sufficient effort was dedicated to research a way to do so.

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*** But, notably [[spoiler: Fiona, a former grey warden,]] was cured of the taint and there are others actively looking for a way to replicate that success. Added with the fact that Grey Wardens carry but don't pass on the Taint, there could eventually be a way discovered to neutralise it's contagious nature for friendly ones like the Messenger if sufficient effort was dedicated to research a way to do so.so. Their gained sentience would make researching that easier too: it would, after all, be very hard to get close enough to a living darkspawn still connected to the hivemind to properly look into such a possibility, as it would be trying very hard to ''kill you''.
6th Jul '17 6:08:11 AM Imjustme
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*** But, notably [[spoiler: Fiona, a former grey warden,]] was cured of the taint and there are others actively looking for a way to replicate that success. Added with the fact that Grey Wardens carry but don't pass on the Taint, there could eventually be a way discovered to neutralise it's contagious nature for friendly ones like the Messenger if sufficient effort was dedicated to research a way to do so.

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*** **** But, notably [[spoiler: Fiona, a former grey warden,]] was cured of the taint and there are others actively looking for a way to replicate that success. Added with the fact that Grey Wardens carry but don't pass on the Taint, there could eventually be a way discovered to neutralise it's contagious nature for friendly ones like the Messenger if sufficient effort was dedicated to research a way to do so.
6th Jul '17 6:07:53 AM Imjustme
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Added DiffLines:

*** But, notably [[spoiler: Fiona, a former grey warden,]] was cured of the taint and there are others actively looking for a way to replicate that success. Added with the fact that Grey Wardens carry but don't pass on the Taint, there could eventually be a way discovered to neutralise it's contagious nature for friendly ones like the Messenger if sufficient effort was dedicated to research a way to do so.
5th Dec '16 8:50:21 AM HakkyounoTenshi
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** It's unlikely that Eamon knew Alistair's mother was an elf, because that might lead them to the fact that she was a MAGE (which would have probably made it impossible to rally the people behind him, being that magic is hated and feared as a general rule). It's more likely that he was acting out on the fact that Maric (being the widower of his older sister) expected him to raise (and possibly support) a bastard child who was not his beloved sister's (she having passed away by then) AND also a possible threat to Cailan's ascent to the throne (Cailan being his nephew and kin)

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** It's unlikely that Eamon knew Alistair's mother was an [[spoiler: elf, because that might lead them to the fact that she was a MAGE (which would have probably made it impossible to rally the people behind him, being that magic is hated and feared as a general rule). rule) as he is canonically Fiona's son.]] It's more likely that he was acting out on the fact that Maric (being the widower of his older sister) expected him to raise (and possibly support) a bastard child who was not his beloved sister's (she having passed away by then) AND also a possible threat to Cailan's ascent to the throne (Cailan being his nephew and kin)
5th Dec '16 8:48:40 AM HakkyounoTenshi
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** Cailan is clearly in on the plan, too. After the Joining is complete and the war council is discussing lighting the signal fire at the Tower of Ishal, he notes what an important task it is and says that "We should send our best - send Alistair and the new Grey Warden." Why in the world would Cailan entrust such an important task to the two newest members of the order? [[spoiler:Because one of them is ''his brother'', and the last living member of the royal family should Cailan fall. And the other? The other is a completely green recruit, someone who will need the guidance of a slightly more seasoned Warden if something goes wrong. Cailan was not only trying to save his brother's life, but was also ''giving him a purpose'' - protecting his new friend.]]

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** Cailan is clearly in on the plan, too. After the Joining is complete and the war council is discussing lighting the signal fire at the Tower of Ishal, he notes what an important task it is and says that "We should send our best - send Alistair and the new Grey Warden." Why in the world would Cailan entrust such an important task to the two newest members of the order? [[spoiler:Because one of them is ''his brother'', and the last living member of the royal family should Cailan fall. And the other? The other is a completely green recruit, someone who will need the guidance of a slightly more seasoned Warden if something goes wrong. Cailan was not only trying to save his brother's life, but was also ''giving him a purpose'' - protecting his new friend.]]]] Not only that, it's an important enough task that no one will question sending a Warden or two, but simple enough that Alistair shouldn't have been in any real danger (no expected the Tower to be overrun with Darkspawn).
*** Not only that, sending Alistair to the Tower removes him from the main battle and puts him in a more defensible position. In the return to Ostagar DLC we find out that Cailan [[spoiler: knew that the battle ahead was going to be difficult and that it wasn't likely that Fereldan could survive without aid.(Cailan's plan being Orlais while the Warden and companions recruit the treaty factions).]] The Tower is much easier to defend (the fact that it was already overrun non-withstanding) and being away from the main horde means that a rescue would be easier to mount if necessary.


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** It's unlikely that Eamon knew Alistair's mother was an elf, because that might lead them to the fact that she was a MAGE (which would have probably made it impossible to rally the people behind him, being that magic is hated and feared as a general rule). It's more likely that he was acting out on the fact that Maric (being the widower of his older sister) expected him to raise (and possibly support) a bastard child who was not his beloved sister's (she having passed away by then) AND also a possible threat to Cailan's ascent to the throne (Cailan being his nephew and kin)
28th Nov '16 3:09:40 PM fiona249
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** At one point, Alistair mentions that Duncan forcibly conscripted him against the chantry's express wishes, taking him away from the templars. While already in character for Duncan, it makes even more sense when you find out [[spoiler: he's close friends with Alistair's real mother and has been for years, and considered Maric something of a friend as well.]] Of course Duncan would want to get him out when he knew Alistair was miserable, even knowing it would earn him the disapproval of the Chantry! This also adds layers to Duncan deliberately rescuing a mage Warden or an elf Warden - [[spoiler: he knows from Fiona exactly how badly both can be treated]].
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