Markup View

Author: KingZeal

May 1st 2013 at 12:09:45 PM

''Neither does Winter Royal Lady, in fact. The only requirement is that you are winter-themed royalty. The trope description only requires that. It goes on to list what else generally follows. In fact, as you point out that theoretically you can have on a Sexy Santa Dress in yellow or pink, you can theoretically have a Winter Royal Lady in orange or purple, since the only hard-and-fast definition of the trope is that she is a winter-themed royal lady. Is it really unlikely? Of course, but it's really unlikely to see a Sexy Santa Dress in anything but red. But it would be an example if created.''

It's a hell of a lot less likely to see a WinterRoyalLady in any color except one that invokes winter and pure white snow/ice.  If the colors change "theoretically", it will still be themed around that.  A SexySantaDress can be any color at all, even if mostly red.  The colors do not even have to have anything to do with Christmas.  The design of the outfit is what invokes "Santa", with the color being a bonus.

''No, it's winter royalty = femininity, which often comes with the implication of wearing white, blue, silver.''

I fail to see the difference.

''Actually, yes, it's this trope. But I was giving you an example. Don't be obtuse.''

I'm not.  According to this site, it's not a trope.  It's the name of a story, but that character is a WinterRoyalLady.

''Which this one isn't. That's about tropes that don't seem to be tropes unless you like at society, a whole genre, etc. [snip]''

''But this doesn't suddenly become a trope by looking at society or a genre. This is an index.''

That's not what it is.  It's when a pattern is used over and over again, period.  The page says, "Until you look at a whole genre, or even all of fiction, and notice that this particular artistic choice happens a lot."  Where are you getting this "society" thing from?

Women being associated with snow and the color white is an aggregate trope because it happens often enough in fiction that a pattern appears merely from the association.

''For instance, Most Common Superpower. That's just big breasts, right? Well, not when you're looking at superheroines. Then it's a trope. ''''

No it isn't.  It's specifically big breasts being the default body type for superheroines.  In other words, because of the prominence of its use.

''Yes! But the thing is you're actively killing that pattern when you include tropes like Winter Royal Lady. You're taking out what should be a trope and making it into an index. The trope that this is is the idea that certain colors imply certain things on different genders. That is the super trope. But the color on Winter Royal Lady is because winter is colored blue and ice, not because women in blue and white mean something.''

No it isn't.  As I said, I started this entire trope merely to catalog the different types of colors which are associated with gender, and the ways in which they're associated with gender.  Women being associated with ice and snow, if it's this problematic for inclusion, might need a MissingSupertrope added to this ''in addition'' to WinterRoyalLady.  But as it stands, WRL is this trope because it associates women with the ''AESTHETICS'' of snow and ice.  It's about her APPEARING like winter itself, which includes color.

''The difference being that virginity has a female association. White on a female means purity, innocent allure. White on a man doesn't. See, that has a unique association. The color, as seen on a woman, is what is unique. ''

Since when does white on a man not mean "purity"?  [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_clothing_(religious) Says who?]]  Are you saying that because of the write-up for ManInWhite?

White only has a female association because we give it one.  The same with "pure snow" and it being associated with gentleness and purity and, yes, femininity.

''''But what about Winter Royal Lady? We know that winter + person isn't unique. We have An Ice Person. We know that blue, white, silver = winter isn't unique. We have Color Coded Elements. So what's unique here? The royal aspect. It's winter + royalty = female trope. Not blue + winter = female or blue + royalty = female.''

Again:  so what?  Winter and royalty being associated with femininity is exactly my point.  The winter theme ''includes colors associated with femininity''.