Persona series

Right because Japan, let alone Persona's developers, don't know a thing about the Camp Gay stereotype. They'd never think to include it in their work.

Its actually the macho camp stereotype I believe.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

Also Shadow Naoto threatening Naoto with a sex change is not so much connotation as denotation.

I do agree in general that P4 is a very Japanese game dealing the Japanese issues of Japanese people, and if stuff gets lost in translation to other cultures that's not really Atlus's fault.

Not really? The spinoffs go all out with Kanji x Naoto Ship Tease, which isn't really bad, but doesn't really implies that he's interested in guys. If anything, Teddie's the one who's implied to be bi/pan, since he "wants to be loved by anyone".
I think it's safe to say that Kanji's shadow as a whole is just intended to be one giant gay joke, and doesn't serve as indication of Kanji's sexuality. It's why I've pretty much given up on analyzing Kanji as a queer character, since I don't see any authorial intent to make him actually "queer", only to keep it ambiguous enough so people can play their shipping game. Which is exactly queerbaiting. Gotta earn the brownie points from the yaoi fangirl.

edited 19th Feb '18 9:05:04 PM by HottoKenai

Hotto: Teddie is definitely straight. He doesn't want guys near him (see Kanji) and exclusively flirts with and assaults girls.

I am opening a Pandora's Box with this, but what, the localization should have completely changed Naoto's problem to pander to oversea audience?

Continue the bloodline, Fujimaru!

No? People aren't taking issue with the localization, they're taking issue with what's in the game proper.

An important thing to note here is "cultural relativity" only goes so far. Most of us don't even know how the japanese LGBT+ community feels about most of these things (whose opinions are far more important than mainstream japanese sensibilities), for all we know they could think P4 does a garbage job at tackling their issues as well.

edited 19th Feb '18 9:51:21 PM by Draghinazzo

I don't think anyone is asking for or saying that at all.

It is okay to be critical of things you like.

edited 19th Feb '18 9:50:00 PM by Mr.Badguy

We also don't really know if they got they message Atlus was trying to do with Naoto.

Continue the bloodline, Fujimaru!

Kanji's main thing is with Naoto, but he has gotten flustered and hot and bothered when dealing with other guys. Much like how the only other time he display any attraction to other females is just once when the two girls had swimsuits and he was nosebleeding, but otherwise doesn't hage it.

And spinoffs have also made Naoto put off by the idea of Kanji x Naoto when she's the focus while giving Ship Tease when he's the focus. Like everything involving him in his Arena route.

Teddie is not into guys and people don't get that. He's attracted to Yu, who actually would have gone a bit with him in Golden if Dojima didn't show up and spoil the mood.

And Yu tends to do that on purpose. Like tempting the one cop in Golden who is more than interested in the white/silver/whatever haired Narukami that keeps coming on to him.

Every accusation by the GOP is ALWAYS a confession.

I think with Naoto specifically, the issue is with bringing up a sex change operation. That can change the context from "Naoto is a woman with issues pertaining to societal sexism" to "Naoto is a closeted Trans man."

FWIW I think Naoto's arc is important, because those issues are relevant today, but I don't blame people for seeing a Trans narrative in her.

Beyond the whole construction of the tv world, what bothers me about Naoto is the end of her s link. You can basically force her to act more feminine in order to suit your desires despite her clear discomfort with it. It feels kinda dicey and reminds me of a common thing I've seen in japanese pop fiction, where tomboyish girls have to become more conventionally feminine in order to be accepted as "mature" adults (it's not quite the same thing in the game, but an annoying trend all the same).

Yeah, that's why I loathe her romance arc.

Being more comfortable in feminine clothing is one thing because I don't believe that femininity should be treated as a weakness, but it's basically pressuring Naoto in prancing around in a schoolgirl outfit for you.

edited 19th Feb '18 10:02:45 PM by Mr.Badguy

^^ Now that is something that genuinely bothers me about the way Naoto is treated. Being given the option to ask her to change who she is for you is a total asshole thing to do.

edited 19th Feb '18 10:02:45 PM by Arha

ok, people not getting the nosebleed thing really bugs me. Kanji was looking down at the guys who got knocked down into the water when he got the nosebleed, not the girls. its one of the few times the story even barely shows him attracted to guys, and I really don't get how people think it was because of the girls. (maybe because they though it was because of the swimsuits, but the girls go off on them for almost nothing anyways)

edited 19th Feb '18 10:03:12 PM by Jetyl

I'm afraid I can't explain myself, sir. Because I am not myself, you see?

Yeah the end of the Naoto arc is pretty dreadful and generally why I always go the more platonic route.

Probably because the girls are assholes and it's something we'd expect.

Except Naoto.

edited 19th Feb '18 10:07:53 PM by OmegaRadiance

Every accusation by the GOP is ALWAYS a confession.

You don't have to take those options. You're just a dick if you do.

Oh man I genuinely burst out laughing when I saw the P5 protagonist for the first time.

Still looks like Harry Potter to me.

Should have kept his original grins more villainous smirking during All Out Attacks.

Every accusation by the GOP is ALWAYS a confession.

Just looking at him trying to act cool is hilarious, is it supposed to be?

Judging by the way he first looks, I think he's meant to be somewhat dorky, yeah.

No but thats what makes it amusing.

Every accusation by the GOP is ALWAYS a confession.

Okay we got blue hair, white hair, now black hair.

50 bucks the next protag will be either a blonde, redhead or just pink.

Mostly pink....... I'm gonna bet primarily on pink. If the protagonist of Persona 6 does not have pink fluffy hair I will fly straight to Japan & riot.

edited 19th Feb '18 10:54:46 PM by slimcoder

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

I thought Yu was more Frey than white, personally.

Oh God! Natural light!

Somebody mentioned the P4 localization with Naoto and I'm reminded of something I read somewhere, maybe here, that the localization actually did change something with Naoto. Like, I think her pretending to be a man is still a thing but it's incredibly obvious? Like, I genuinely thought Naoto was a guy but in the original everyone knows she was agirl?

I dunno, I just heard somewhere that there was a change for her in the dub compared to the original.