Dragon Ball Z Abridged

Felt kind of like pandering to me, really.

I'm going to have to disagree with you on that, that moment was not obscure, and often get played up or used to imply things it was never meant to.

People loved talking about it long before the Abridged came out, and it was something many were eagerly awaiting.

That's kind of their version of Tenshinhan in a nutshell.

edited 27th Apr '17 10:14:15 PM by LSBK

Eh, that didn't feel like pandering to me mainly because Cell won that exchange. In a single word.

His response, "Perfect," rubs in the fact that as grand as that moment may have been for Tien, it meant nothing. He went on to absorb 18 and achieve Perfection despite it all. Tien nearly killed himself delaying the inevitable.

^^ Mhm, one reason why I don't particularly like to see him in this series.

^ An interesting interpretation, but I'm not convinced it was the one they were going for.

There's really no reason for him to respond to Tien's question with "Perfect" if it's not meant to be a reference to him obtaining his Perfect Form.

edited 27th Apr '17 10:24:03 PM by TobiasDrake

Perfect is kind of his word and the tone in which he said it is the same one a normal person would use to say 'just fine' or 'peachy' or whatever when someone asked them a similarly gloating question.

Edit: Basically, if he was doing what you said, he would have sounded smug, not irritated.

edited 27th Apr '17 10:28:18 PM by Arha

Though Cell did undeniably win overall, pretty sure that little bit of dialogue was supposed to be seen in Tien's favor. Their demeanors say it all.

I would describe the tone he used as "pointed".

I don't know; Tien still gets to feel all smug and assured, while Cell is noticeably irritated by him being there.

Well yeah, Ten still annoyed him. And Ten clearly takes some satisfaction in knowing that he got under Cell's skin, something that his Cold War Rival Vegeta didn't do.

edited 27th Apr '17 10:37:52 PM by SonOfSharknado

I loved that Cell took an opportunity to break down Vegeta by complementing Yamcha, of all people, in comparison to him. It hit home particularly to me (besides the obvious, what with the Yamcha avatars) because that's actually something that I've said in the past: that Yamcha is more useful than Vegeta because Yamcha doesn't intentionally make things worse on a consistent basis (until Super, at least, when Vegeta grew out of that little habit).

You're not wrong on that front.

Vegeta's main contribution is that by being the guy who gets brutally, painfully, horrifically Worfed by the villain to show off how powerful he is, he spares Yamcha, Tien, and Krillin from having to do it.

When Vegeta's not around, Yamcha gets a hole violently punched through him by Android 20. When he is around, Tien gets to mildly inconvenience Cell with the Kikoho and then be whisked away to safety free of consequence while Cell achieves Perfection and plays a wacky conga beat on Vegeta's ribcage.

edited 28th Apr '17 5:19:52 AM by TobiasDrake

I see it both ways. Perfect Cell is clearly annoyed by Tien's stall tactic, but at the end of the day it was just that.

edited 28th Apr '17 5:20:45 AM by VeryMelon

As someone who didn't watch DBZ, I saw it as a continuation of the game Tien is apparently playing with Vegeta. Yeah, he knows Cell can kill him, but by this point it's a game.

edited 28th Apr '17 7:45:47 AM by God_of_Awesome

"If he kills me, I win, and he knows that."

I love the Insane Troll Logic in that, because it actually works when you're playing chicken with someone as egotistical and vain as Vegeta.

Another reason why I don't see it as pandering to Tien is that, in this same episode, Yamcha scored points off of Tien. Yamcha.

• Tien: Vegeta already passed us. Flipped us off.
• Yamcha: Yeah, we flipped him off back.
• Tien: I flipped him off back. You just laughed and waved nervously.
• Yamcha: Yeah, well, I don't have your mutually sustained hate-boner for the guy.
• Tien: (defensive) I do not have a hate-boner!
• Yamcha: Dude, it's a pretty hateful boner.

I'm not seeing how that's all that bad for Tien. Yamcha still comes off as the coward there. Tien having a hate-boner is nothing to that.

Because Tien's the only one that cares.

Yamcha tries to put on a bold face and Tien calls him out on it, so Yamcha fires back. Not only is Tien visibly irritated by the "hate-boner" remark, but Yamcha gets the final word in the exchange.

Sure, Yamcha comes across as callow, but that's nothing new for him. He's comfortable with it.

• Vegeta: Hello, earthling. How's that gaping chest wound?
• Yamcha: Just fine! How's your spine?
• Vegeta: ...I'm giving you a five minute head start.
• Yamcha: Thank you! I'm going to need it. You're very fast.

So when Tien calls him out, Yamcha's able to return fire without missing a beat. For his part, Tien is visibly bothered by Yamcha's remark, but Yamcha gets the last word. Tien is unable to defend himself or come up with a snappy retort of his own beyond a simple, "Nuh-uh!"

This isn't a debate, it's a pissing contest. As far as verbal mud-slinging goes, Tien may have had the more valid accusation, but Yamcha won the exchange because he kept his cool under fire.

edited 28th Apr '17 8:42:46 AM by TobiasDrake

Also, Piccolo's account of Tien's actions against Cell are relevant to any discussion of "Tien shilling".

To paraphrase Piccolo, "Pretty ballsy, but ultimately pointless."

Basically, in regards to the thing with Cell, Tien won the battle but Cell ultimately won the war.

Cell is however, annoyed that Tien, even if only barely, and even if only by nearly killing himself, won that battle because someone as weak as Tien (as Cell himself noted ahead of time) never even should have been a player in the first place.

Tien seems to take comfort in his small victories: getting one over on Vegeta constantly, and now this thing with Cell.

The thing with Yamcha mouthing Tien off is rather fun as well. That's two for him.

Anyway, nothing big to debate here really.

I wouldn't even call it winning the battle. It ended with Tien barely able to stand and Cell about to vaporize him, but for Goku's sudden intervention. Cell never even laid a finger on him and still came out on top.

What he did was he stung Cell. Like a bee, complete with ripping off his stinger in the process. It was a minor prick. Didn't actually do much harm, but bugged the crap out of him.

edited 28th Apr '17 9:26:24 AM by TobiasDrake

The kind of bee sting that makes you drop your car keys down a storm drain when you're late for an appointment that could get you promoted.

Thankfully, Vegeta was kind enough to fish it out for him.

edited 28th Apr '17 11:14:11 AM by Enlong

Exactly! He's so helpful. I don't know why people complain about him.

Tien's actions there could have actually been helpful if Vegeta didn't proceed to screw it up.

The Cell Saga could have ended at Semi-Perfect, with Vegeta's victory and some pre-game prep by Tien, if Vegeta hadn't... been Vegeta.

Also Krillin.

Also, 17 and 18.

The Cell Saga could have ended at Imperfect if those two ran the f*ck away at any point rather than standing around slack-jawed while everyone dogpiled Cell. TFS lampoons this mercilessly.

Android 16: WHY ARE YOU STILL HERE?!

Everyone's an idiot in this chain of events.

edited 28th Apr '17 11:48:02 AM by TobiasDrake

Except Tien?

#tiendidnothingwrong

edited 28th Apr '17 11:48:26 AM by God_of_Awesome