Alexander's cool and all, but I can't help but find the addition of a third Greek civ a tad unnecessary.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
It's good that he's Macedonian then. 
edited 22nd Mar '17 9:45:13 AM by DrunkenNordmann
Welcome to Estalia, gentlemen.
Disasturbator
Oh Gods that smile,that face,it can not be!
-flashbacks to my first civ game where Alexander took all my cities-
Also,he's horseless this time!
New theme music also a box
The Merry Monarch of Darkness
Meh. Still needs Mongols, Native Americans and some variety of Turks.
The pig of Hufflepuff pulsed like a large bullfrog. Dumbledore smiled at it, and placed his hand on its head: "You are Hagrid now."
In which our new additions are technically-not-Greece, and Persia as defined from a Judeo-Christian perspective. Oy...
edited 22nd Mar '17 10:22:16 AM by KnownUnknown
"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Yeah I don't think Alex was necessary right now. Cyrus is the only non-European leader added so far...
Also, since Cleo leads Egypt, it's not like we needed a Makedonian leader.
Editor of Posts
The hell do you mean with "as defined from a Judeo-Christian perspective". Cyrus the Great was a pretty big deal in Iran too, you know.
Lost in Space
Islam is a Judeo-Christian religion, folks. Just pointing that out, since people tend to forget it. Allah is the same God as the one found in the Bible and the Torah. The main split between the three religions is which prophet they consider to be the last and final one: Moses, Jesus, or Mohammed.
Let's not turn this into a fight about religious history, m'kay? Might have to get out the thump-stick if that happens.
edited 22nd Mar '17 12:53:24 PM by Fighteer
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
The Merry Monarch of Darkness
And, I mean, Cyrus was a pretty big deal in any case.
The pig of Hufflepuff pulsed like a large bullfrog. Dumbledore smiled at it, and placed his hand on its head: "You are Hagrid now."
Their ability is both named after and based around the conquest of Babylon, which given this game's track record thus far immediately struck me as something that was chosen because it was in the Bible.
It's similar to how Babylon (or at least its leader) was defined in V, and how in this one Egypt is defined from a Hellenistic perspective and Congo is defined from a Christian perspective.
Just from an initial reaction, I preferred Civ V's Persia under Darius. Though part of that is an "ugh, two more warmongers" reaction too.
edited 22nd Mar '17 1:16:35 PM by KnownUnknown
"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Editor of Posts
You do know that Babylon had been one of the most important cities in the world for over a millennia, yes? The ability doesn't even reference the event that got the Fall of Babylon included into the Bible in the first place, Cyrus letting the captive Jews return home to Israel. The ability rather seems to reference the way Cyrus allegedly took the Babylonians by surprise by diverting the Euphrates river while they were distracted celebrating one of their holidays.
edited 22nd Mar '17 1:20:37 PM by Druplesnubb
That would be the crux of my point, yes.
Before this goes on, you do realize we actually agree with each other that there's more to Persian identity than is actually being represented, right? Civ devs defining countries by specific Western perspective as apposed to by their full historical significance is the problem.
edited 22nd Mar '17 1:29:02 PM by KnownUnknown
"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Editor of Posts
A country that has existed for over two milennia has more to its history than is represented by an apearance of their founder and some special units/buildings? Well, duh!
Again, exactly.
edited 22nd Mar '17 2:12:31 PM by KnownUnknown
"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
The argument is that, because every civ has more to its history and culture than what is represented in the game, it is quite noticeable they consistently pick the parts that relate to the Judeo-Christian perspective.
I mean, I am not sure I agree with this when it concern to Persia, but Civ IV was already particularly Eurocentric to begin withnote and out of the 4 new civs since release, only 1 is not directly connected to Europe.
Always a fan of Persia in historical games, I've found the Achaemenids fascinating since I was a kid. But it definitely seems poorly planned out on Firaxis's part to have three Greek leaders out so soon, even though you can reasonably make a case for all three of them individually.
Just learned the two new civs are part of a dual package, probably because of their history together. That is a cool concept of course, but it ties with my comment in the previous post. Now 4 out of 4 new civs are explicitly connected to Europe. That is, frankly, kinda annoying considering there was already complaints about Eurocentrism in the base game.
Homicidal Editor
At least Europe is a diverse bunch, I'm still disappointed at Drifters for promising a story about a battle between famous historical figures from all around the world in a LOTR-esque fantasy land, and all I got is a bunch of Japanese being the Asian version of mighty whitey, including some dudes from WW 2 Imperial Japan.
My points are that it could be worse and the game is still fun to play. I think they are planning to release the non-Europe civilizations in one big package like in an expansion ala G&K or BNW.
Only an experienced editor who has a name possesses the ability to truly understand my work - What 90% of writers I'm in charge of said.
The Merry Monarch of Darkness
This series is apparently big in Poland and Brazil, which is what got them into the last expansion of V and the base game here.
The pig of Hufflepuff pulsed like a large bullfrog. Dumbledore smiled at it, and placed his hand on its head: "You are Hagrid now."
I only mention this because it seems like it was a step back for the series. Civ have always been quite Eurocentric, but Civ 5 was more diverse than 6 on its base game. Hell, Civ 6 has as much European civs as the rest of the world combined, without including the two post colonial American civs. That wasn't the case in Civ 5. Add in the fact that two of the non European civs are represented by leaders heavily influenced by Europe (Cleopatra and Mvemba) and the whole thing .
Doesn't explain why they had to have Norway instead of, I don't know, Tibet. Or why Australia got priority over Maori. Or why they really needed Macedon on top of the 2 Greek leaders.
Incidentally, the 4 first DLC civilizations for Civ 5 were Babylon, Mongolia, Spain and Inca. A reversal compared to civ 6, when relating European vs non European Civs. And that remembering Civ 5 was more varied from the get go.
edited 22nd Mar '17 6:02:06 PM by Heatth
We Are With You Zack Snyder
Australia was one of the most requested Civilizations; so that is why they put them in the game.
Disasturbator
Tibet can't be added without getting the game banned in china
New theme music also a box
Just an example. There are tons of other possibilities. (also, not sure if true. Europa Universalis haven't been banned, I believe. As long as it is in a historical context it seems to be acceptable)
But they really needed to prioritize over every non Euro civ in the game? Because that is what I am talking about. Nothing against Australia, or Norway, or anything. But it is kinda silly Civ 6 got to be so white washed when compared to its predecessor.
edited 22nd Mar '17 6:06:28 PM by Heatth
Nightmare Muse
Notes for the upcoming patch were posted on Reddit
:
This update will include a number of balance changes, AI adjustments, multiplayer changes, and bug fixes.
The Harbor balance change, included in this patch, will bring the strength of the various districts in line with each other. In addition, there will now be added nuances to the warmonger penalties so they only hit with their full strength if you are truly wresting valuable cities from your opponents.
A complete list of changes in the Spring 2017 Update is below:
[BALANCE CHANGES]
Harbors now give a major adjacency bonus with the City Center, +1 Food to all Coast tiles when the Lighthouse is built, and +2 Gold to all Coast tiles when the Seaport is built.
Australia now gets +1 for Charming/+3 for Breathtaking on the four affected districts (had been +2/+4) to compensate for the Harbor boost above.
Royal Navy Dockyard now always provides +1 Trade Route capacity, even if the city already has a Commercial Hub. This makes it more useful, even when England builds it on its home continent.
Added "Future Civic" to the end of the Civics Tree, a repeatable Civic to research and add to the player score.
Bomber units are now more effective against cities.
Swordsman are now reduced to 36 combat strength.
Damages now remain on City and Encampments when a city is traded.
Siege units with bonus movement (e.g. from Great Generals or Persian surprise war) can still shoot after moving as long as they still have 2 MP.
Adjusted Warmonger penalties for Diplomatic status:
When applying a warmonger diplomatic penalty for EITHER declaring war or capturing a city, reduce that penalty if you are enemies with the target of that warmongering as follows:
-20% warmongering if this is against a player you have denounced
-40% warmongering if this is against a player you are at war with
NOTE: This is not used in situations where you are fighting a Joint War against the target power or when Sumeria joins as ally in war (in both those cases the penalty is still zero).
EXAMPLE: Macedon is at war with Persia. If India goes to war with Persia sometime in the middle of this Macedonian/Persian War and captures a Persian city, Macedon will reduce its warmonger penalty against India by 40%.
Adjusted Warmonger penalties for City Population:
When applying a warmonger diplomatic penalty for capturing a city, reduce that penalty if the city is smaller than the average city in the game as follows: If the city's population after conquest is below the average population of all the cities in the game, reduce the warmonger penalty by the percentage that city's population is below the average.
EXAMPLE: Persepolis is conquered and its population after conquest is 6. But the average size of a city in the game is 8. So this city is 2 / 8 = 25% below the size of the average city in the game. Therefore the warmonger penalty is reduced by 25%.
[AI TUNING]
Improved coordination for multiple attacking units.
Ranged units better understand how to capture civilian units.
AI should now generally accept embassies when neutral, and reject when unfriendly.
When asking an AI to equalize a deal that has elements on both sides of the deal, it will consider a gold-only change before looking at other possibilities.
Increased AI’s desire to repair pillaged Districts and Buildings.
Minor civs will no longer go after policies that give them extra influence they can never use.
Made it easier to meet the positive side of the environmentalist agenda.
AI will now build multiple Neighborhoods.
[BUG FIXES]
The Great Works tooltip in the deal now shows extended information.
Melee units can no longer attack embarked units.
Pillaged improvements no longer provide Pantheon bonuses.
Fixed double-counting of Appeal from Improvements.
Fixed broken gossip message about Seaside Resorts that made them always mention a "lost city".
John Curtin is now referred to as "Prime Minister" and not "President" in the Outback Tycoon scenario.
Fixed an issue where previously constructed buildings were not showing up properly on the Production Chooser.
The World Tracker now keeps its open/closed state between turns.
Additional bug fixes.
[MULTIPLAYER]
Updating Global Thermonuclear War scenario's Proxy War victory condition to support team play.
Expanded internet games list to show results from additional regions.
Games list was frequently not showing all available games due to UI bug.
[MISC]
Added more civs to the True Start Location Earth map.
Separated war/peace notifications into major civs vs. city-state.
Added additional information to Defeat/Victory screens, so players will be clearer on why they have lost the game.
Added "special ability" stars to techs and civics that unlock new functionality.
Added invasion warnings to Poland scenario.
Added new Capabilities data base table to disable select game systems for scenarios and mods.
ARX functionality updates for scenarios.
Added text labels differentiating Official and Community content in the Lobby screen.
[ADDITONAL CONTENT]
In Game:
Fixed issues in the Additional Content menu with mods that contained very long strings.
The "ImportFiles" modding action now works as a Frontend action.
The "UpdateIcons" action now supports SQL files in addition to XML files.
Multiple files can now be specified in the "AddGameplayScripts" Ingame action.
Added a "DoNothing" Frontend action and Ingame action. This action is useful as a placeholder or as a container that includes other actions.
The localization database is now written out to the cache folder.
Development Tools:
The SDK launcher will now close after the user has clicked on an application to launch.
ModBuddy will no longer display a 'Parameter "escapedValue" cannot be null.' error when the Development Assets are not installed.
Added SQL syntax coloring to ModBuddy.
Guess who's back