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Ultimatum Disasturbator from Second Star to the left (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
Disasturbator
#3451: Feb 15th 2016 at 4:48:34 AM

"Who would be suitable as Israel's leaderhead, though?"

King David,the second king of Israel

New theme music also a box
FergardStratoavis 30% Petrify from And Locations (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: Betrayed by Delilah
30% Petrify
#3452: Feb 15th 2016 at 5:09:46 AM

Either him or Solomon, though the latter has his mines as a natural wonder already.

...somehow. >.>

Big Grah
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#3453: Feb 15th 2016 at 10:20:27 AM

The one time I played as Babylon, I ended up way behind in technology. I'm still not entire sure how that happened.

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Journeyman Overlording the Underworld from On a throne in a vault overlooking the Wasteland Since: Nov, 2010
Overlording the Underworld
#3454: Feb 16th 2016 at 5:35:11 AM

Last night I started a Russian run. It's been going pretty great other than recurring happiness issues. I have five cities of my own plus three puppets. The Aztecs have been their usual annoying selves. Them and the city state right next to me are the only people I've even fought in this.

Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#3455: Feb 16th 2016 at 5:55:01 AM

The one time I played as Babylon, I ended up way behind in technology. I'm still not entire sure how that happened.

The main issue with Babylon is city growth. If you start in an area with poor potential growth - many plains, desert without flood plains, no Wheat/Bananas/Cattle, many coast tiles without resources... - then your early Great Scientist turned Academy will not help you enough to overcome your lack of Growth and you will fall behind in population rather early on.

I'd say that Babylon should go Tradition —> Hanging Gardens as a priority. From there on you will have a large enough city to always be leading (or next to) in science. It is actually more important to get Hanging Gardens than the Great Library in the long run. Unless of course you start in a desert with many Oasis/Hills/Luxuries in which case it is better to go for Liberty and build Petra with your free Engineer (or go Tradition —> Petra but you have to be careful not to lose to someone else). Temple of Artemis is another good option (but it is very early and you might get beaten to it), as is the +Growth Pantheon (which is almost never picked by the AI).

That is also why the Aztecs are such an amazing and unexpected Science Civ. Find a large lake, build a city right next to it and profit from the +Growth & 4-Food Tiles that don't require to be improved.

Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#3456: Feb 16th 2016 at 10:34:29 AM

That is also why the Aztecs are such an amazing and unexpected Science Civ. Find a large lake, build a city right next to it and profit from the +Growth & 4-Food Tiles that don't require to be improved.

There is also an amazing amount of knowledge to be gained from all that dissection they do.

And vivisection.

Of people.

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#3457: Feb 19th 2016 at 11:12:09 AM

I just watched a Narrative Let's Play of Civ V that parodies a French-German history show (called "Le Dessous des Cartes/Mit Offenen Karten"). The original show is about describing history using geographical maps as support to better understand conflicts.

Except, well, it is Civilization V. So it focuses on Napoleon (the creators are French), an immortal leader who settles in the North of the Korean Peninsula, and his struggles against his neighbors Shaka Zulu (airing from Central Asia), Washington (starting in Nepal) or Alexander the Great (Athens being in Cambodia).

A great watch. Do you know of equivalents in English?

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#3458: Feb 19th 2016 at 10:22:59 PM

Man, watching the AI deal with ocean military movement is like watching a train wreck.

I typically play on the truly random map setting, and this time it gave me kind of a mix between small continents and archipelago. I picked Korea, which meant once the Renaissance era came around I basically ruled the sea with a small fleet of Turtle Ships (and a single Frigate for variety).

The Iroquois were my designated rivals this map. I won the last few wars, and this time I notice them "covertly" moving troops towards a small city of mine on the edge of their territory. Which, since they had to move most of their troops by sea, ended up being super obvious. I maneuvered my ships to block and purchased a ton of faith troops before they even got near.

And then they turn around and make a beeline for my main continent, as though they're fooling anyone. After I moved by troops back over there, the AI seems to have dropped it's invasion plans entirely but still has no idea what to do with the troops at sea, so it's just having them drift back and forth doing nothing.

Though one thing I dislike is how you basically have to be surrounded by troops before you can ask the AI to step off.

edited 19th Feb '16 10:24:05 PM by KnownUnknown

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#3459: Feb 20th 2016 at 8:26:17 AM

This behavior is not only true for sea warfare. Back and forth movements when you defend one of their targets is very common on the ground too, unless they the AI thinks it has a truly overwhelming force.

edited 20th Feb '16 8:26:41 AM by Julep

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#3460: Feb 20th 2016 at 1:27:56 PM

Yeah, but couple that with very meager and uncoordinated movement thanks to the sea setting in the first place and it becomes especially silly.

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
FergardStratoavis 30% Petrify from And Locations (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: Betrayed by Delilah
30% Petrify
#3461: Feb 21st 2016 at 3:55:07 AM

If Attila is in the game, odds are you'll get to know once he takes someone's capital unless he's in close proximity to you.

So I'm playing this game as India on a Pangea; aiming for Bollywood (Cultural Victory, three cities max), but that probably won't be too easy to do; there are ten players and I've yet to meet one more (it's Arabia, Attila took their capital). Bismarck and Pocatello are getting kicked around and if they won't get extinct will likely remain irrelevant for the most part. Austria is chilling in the top left corner, mostly unpeturbed by anyone; east of that is Alexander - whom is kicking said Bismarck and with whom I had a brief war over setting his shit cities too close - then Catherine with whom I'm friendly - for now. Further East, fairly away from the others chills Casimir - who is kicking Pocatello's butt - and Attila - who is kicking Al-Rashid's unseen butt.

I'm south of Alexander and east-south of Catherine. I'm considering poking the latter at the former, maybe give Bismarck a bit of a fighting chance. Other than Athens I feel I could try and blow up the rest of his cities, was he not so tightly cluttered. They're fairly low on the defense, I could even use the few War Elephants I have left (Medieval now). Should I go for that or will warmonger penalties make it too troublesome in the long run?

Big Grah
Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#3462: Feb 21st 2016 at 5:23:02 AM

If it is a player that lost its capital, chances are it won't be too long to become influential over him. So not having met everyone isn't much of an issue really.

edited 21st Feb '16 5:23:33 AM by Julep

FergardStratoavis 30% Petrify from And Locations (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: Betrayed by Delilah
30% Petrify
#3463: Feb 21st 2016 at 6:09:35 AM

True that, I suppose. I'm only generating 6 Tourism so far, so that's still a way to go,

I mean, I can't even reach Al-Rashid because Shoshones and Poles set up a giant wall of not-open-borders there. >.>

...may I just say that having some sort of all-civs Horse Archer would be great? (looks at all Chariot Archers and their replacements that lose their ranged promotions upon becoming Knights)

Also, is it just me or is Casimir almost always a mayor contender?

Big Grah
Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#3464: Feb 21st 2016 at 6:32:42 AM

All ranged horsemen have the flaw of losing their promotions upon upgrade. On the other hand, they are incredibly powerful as long as you have them, so you trade future potential for immediate power. It is also true for the two alternate siege engines (Siege Tower & Battering Ram).

Usually you benefit from it anyway. Arabia or the Mongols are insane once they reach Chivalry, and the Huns have humongous power in the early game, enough to keep an edge once their bonuses disappear.

As for Casimir...well, Poland is the most obviously overpowered civ in the game. Great starting bias (plains are all around good), excellent UB (free Barracks for cavalry, gives you gold instead of costing gold), excellent UU (who has a ton of bonuses compared to the Lancer)...but mostly a UA that is much too versatile to be balanced.

edited 21st Feb '16 6:35:33 AM by Julep

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#3465: Feb 21st 2016 at 7:56:44 AM

I've yet to run into Poland in a game, but my list of leaders whose AI are always going to be major players (and thus problems) are Caesar, Washington, Hiawatha, Kamehameha and Alexander.

Lots of other Civs are always influential in some way or another, but these guys always end up vying for ruling the map.

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#3466: Feb 21st 2016 at 11:22:30 AM

Mine would be Casimir, Bismarck, Catherine and Hiawatha. "Hit or miss" leaders - as in, either they get taken down early, or they are major threats - are Ramesses, Alexander and Wu Zetian.

Meanwhile, Maria, Gandhi and Maria Theresa are consistently irrelevant.

edited 21st Feb '16 11:23:14 AM by Julep

DarkDestruction Dread Pirate Captain from 'neath the underwater skies Since: Apr, 2011 Relationship Status: RelationshipOutOfBoundsException: 1
Dread Pirate Captain
#3467: Feb 22nd 2016 at 7:52:57 AM

Montezuma is pretty fun to play as when you're going for a non-domination victory. With him and Raging Barbarians turned on, it's rather easy to get an early leg up on other civs in terms of social policies. The Culture bonus seems to stack with the base bonus from adopting Honor and Jaguars regenerate on each successful kill, so it's a better incentive to hunt down and "farm" culture from encampments. Even small gains can pile up over time.

On another note, I've found another quirk in modded games - it's apparently possible for other civs to earn UUs that serve as Great General replacements, even if they themselves aren't the "owner" of said Great General UUs. Here's an example, where Sailor Moon is the source of the UU ('Sailor Senshi').

edited 22nd Feb '16 7:55:39 AM by DarkDestruction

Don't stop, just proceed, 'cause this is what you need-proceed, just proceed, 'cause this is what you need!
Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#3468: Feb 22nd 2016 at 7:55:33 AM

It's true in the default game. Swedish Khans might actually be the best Great Generals in the game.

KnightofLsama Since: Sep, 2010
#3469: Feb 22nd 2016 at 12:06:12 PM

[up] Ditto. Somehow I wound up with a Merchant of Venice when playing as Indonesia (I think one of my city state allies gifted it to me). So I went and yoinked the nearest city state to my capital (Island map and a very dispersed empire)

FergardStratoavis 30% Petrify from And Locations (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: Betrayed by Delilah
30% Petrify
#3470: Feb 22nd 2016 at 1:19:29 PM

I was given a Hwacha as Venice once, but that was almost certainly from a City-State.

...how do you acquire UU's from other Civs? Like... I don't get it. ._.

Big Grah
Blueeyedrat Since: Oct, 2010
#3471: Feb 22nd 2016 at 1:29:40 PM

[up] Certain types of city-states give different bonuses if you befriend/ally them; Militaristic states give you military units, and each one can give you another civ's unique unit if you have the tech for it. One UU per city-state (though you can get more than one of said unit), and you can check which one it'll give you.

edited 22nd Feb '16 1:31:06 PM by Blueeyedrat

Journeyman Overlording the Underworld from On a throne in a vault overlooking the Wasteland Since: Nov, 2010
Overlording the Underworld
#3472: Feb 22nd 2016 at 3:40:28 PM

In my Russian game I got my hands on a Legion from a city state. It was nice not having to send backup to protect my road builder.

FergardStratoavis 30% Petrify from And Locations (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: Betrayed by Delilah
30% Petrify
#3473: Feb 22nd 2016 at 4:51:43 PM

Oh wait, I've read that wrong. The phenomenon is in modded games.

Also, my India game seems to be finally rounding up the leaders: me, Casimir and Catherine; with Attila as a runner-up (he is generating Tourism; why is Attilla of all people generating Tourism). The others I feel it's time to beat up a bit to limit their influence; especially Maria Theresa sending her missionaries where they don't belong.

Also, don't deny Catherine some help; odds are she will build two Wonders back-to-back to spite you. >.>

Big Grah
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#3474: Feb 22nd 2016 at 4:56:53 PM

[up] You know how some people watch car racing just to see the crashes? I'd imagine Attila-sponsored tourism is something like that.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#3475: Feb 22nd 2016 at 7:00:49 PM

"...and on the left we have the Museum of Hunnic History, composed entirely of treasures, knick knacks and gift-wrapped souvenirs which the Great One personally 'liberated' from the corpses of the insolent..."

edited 22nd Feb '16 7:02:03 PM by KnownUnknown

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.

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