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nomuru2d Gamer-turning-maker from Port Saint Lucie, FL Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Longing for Dulcinea
Gamer-turning-maker
#2851: Oct 15th 2012 at 4:30:19 PM

It's not that hard. Bronies did it.

Long live Cinematech. FC:0259-0435-4987
0dd1 Just awesome like that from Nowhere Land Since: Sep, 2009
Just awesome like that
#2852: Oct 15th 2012 at 4:40:01 PM

[up]That only tells me that bronies have no limit on what they'll do, not that such a concept is good.

Insert witty and clever quip here. My page, as the database hates my handle.
Myrmidon The Ant King from In Antartica Since: Nov, 2009
The Ant King
#2853: Oct 15th 2012 at 5:37:14 PM

Diabetus just posted a message someone sent to them over youtube on SA for those interested, the text is.

Regarding your recent videos.

Hello, I am a long-time subscriber of your account and I have, for the most part, find your let's play videos to be very good in quality and very interesting.

However, I am quite surprised that your recent addition of videos has been an attack on another fellow youtuber and personally I seriously disapprove your tactics of doing this.

Before you believe that this is from a fanboy of Pewdiepie and that my response has no merits because of my subscription of him, I want you to consider this: I have watched your videos and subscribed to a lot of other let's players in the past, and so perhaps my viewer experience can help you accept of what little credibility I have.

You will have to pardon me on this because my reasoning will be quite long-winded. But I'm going to do this analysis to be as rigorous as possible.

From my personal experience, let's play has been an extremely niche form of entertainment that relies heavily on not only just the game play of good games, but the charisma of the host. The range of topic that the host talks about may captivate the audience and give the audiences the rewards for paying attention. In fact, many let's plays I have subscribed failed on the fact that the hosts had been absolutely dreadful in terms of communicating and their dedication to the fan base.

Target demographic has also been an extremely important part of all forms of entertainment. In fact, in many commercial ventures, the first goal of product development should be the target demographic: What sort of audience are you trying to communicate with? How are you going to reach the audience? What sort of dedication are you going to give to your audience with respect to how much they paid attention to your product? How about the visual quality of the product and the back-and-forth interaction between you and the fan base?

Now, let us consider this, what is your target demographic? For what I noticed in your video and the degree of conversation between the hosts, your video is more oriented towards adults (21-35 years old). The language, the wit, the emotional connection you have towards your audience is at the level of adults. Now you have to consider this: How much time does these people have to devote on watching your videos? For the most part, these people have other scheduling commitments: They have to make a living, they have friends, families and other commitments to make their livelihood work, they are responsible for many real-life situations that many of the younger, teenage audiences don't have. These responsibilities leaves very little room for entertainment, and what you have is that you have a lot less accessible audiences to watch your channel, in fact, having 50k + subscribers is quite a lot for your channel considering that your demographic is so narrow, and the fact that these fans are so devoted to your cause of complaint is absolutely phenomenal. Pewdiepie's demographic is on a much younger scale: teenagers to young adults. Since these people have more accessibility to free time and the internet, they can watch more and henceforth, more subscribers on his end. So in terms of scale, there is a reason why Pewdiepie has more subscribers than you.

Let's look at your dedication to your fan base: What's on your video list? How much content are you producing on a daily basis? You're producing videos on a weekly, if not monthly basis. In fact, in your last month (an estimate), you produced about 11 videos, yes, that is including your videos attacking Pewdiepie. How much videos does Pewdiepie produces? 2-3 videos on a daily basis. This means he's producing about seven times more video content than you on a monthly basis. You may say that it lack intellectual stimulation or it isn't the type of humor that people want. I digress, because the amount of video production that Pewdiepie does is far more than you, this shows his work ethic, he's doing this not just for fun, but for his fans. Despite how much you loath their intellectual capacity of the fans and the content, Pewdiepie has more dedication to his work than you.

Comparatively, you have created a much smaller content and showed very little dedication to your fan base, giving them very little incentives to checkup on your channel on a daily basis. So why would most people subscribe to you when there are channels that give entertainment on a daily basis? Sure, some people see past that concept, but then again, it is only "some." To say the least, Helloween4545 and HC Bailly both have about equal or even less subscribers than you, and they have way more devotion to their fan base with their uploaded content, imagine what you could accomplish if you're more diligent.

Now, let's take a look at your contents, what I see the difference between you and Pewdiepie is the audience involvement with the let's player. The strategy that Pewdiepie deploys is to include his face in the videos while playing. While this detail seems insignificant, it's actually quite interesting, in a sense, it gives people emotional investment to see how the player reacts. If the player can pull off their emotions colourfully whilst playing, it is also a sort of entertainment in itself. People watch movies not just because of how witty or good the effects and the story lines are, but also to experience the emotion of actors, to become involved with the actors in this imaginary adventure called digital entertainment. Your videos lack the sort of emotional involvement that Pewdiepie presents. While for most of your videos, the most part of your lets plays have one let's player communicate to another, Pewdiepie addresses and communicates in such a way that he is actually talking to the audience. This is a very subtle difference between addressing the audience, but the feeling of letting audience be involved despite being a recording is something very special to the audience. In fact, Pewdiepie constantly communicates with the audience, he shares the same emotion that viewers have when encountering something shocking or interesting in the video game. If you get past all the politically incorrect jokes that Pewdiepie's video has and analyze it carefully, you will see that he does make the audiences feel involved.

Now, I'm going to get into something a bit different: advertising and outreach. Take a look at your website, it's absolute shit, where's the accessibility? Where's the content? Where's the part where I can learn more about your group and more about your updated content? How active you are in promoting your product? Advertising is actually a combination of all of what I mentioned above plus more. Sure Pewdiepie "sold out" to to his old fan base by advertising himself to a broader audience, but he's has a bigger audience due to the the amount of self-promotion he has in his videos. The content of the videos, the target viewers, and the diligence of how new stuff is presented on a daily basis gives him an edge in broadcasting himself to even more people. People constantly see new videos uploaded on his subscribed channels, and they will be more dedicated fans.

There are more that I want to say, but I due to time and reading constraints, I will not do that. So here's what I have to say, you should feel good about the amount of subscribers, you have a dedicated fan base and you are an extremely intelligent person. If you think that what you're doing is the absolute correct path to do and my explanations are bullshit, then good on you, you have your ideas and visions, and there's no stopping you. I am writing to you because I see the potential in you to grow and see things at a completely different perspective, from a more rigorous marketing perspective, and trying to be objective is difficult for me, even I don't know if I'm being completely objective. I want you to think about the differences, open your mind. I cannot help but feel that you're bitter and jealous about it. But there are reasons for his success, and by learning from the experience rather than bitching and giving self-pity to yourself and having your ego supported by your fan base, you can produce better content and become a more successful channel.

Bear in mind, your fans love you, but what I'm seeing you right now is absolutely childish and unnecessary. You are actually closing yourself off from outsiders and potential viewers, you come off as being hateful and jealous in the video, and your attitude and response feels like you're absolutely close-minded and having an ego-trip. Don't do that, it will do no good in the long run.

In the end, it is you who have to decide for yourself, do you want growth from analyzing the situations more carefully? Or are you going to have the same attitude you have, and the same business mindset that you have as before. It is up to you to decide. Consider this my time wasted in writing to you about this if I can't let you reconsider your position.

Best of luck for the future.

Diabetus's response was

OK

Kill all math nerds
ninjaclown Since: May, 2009
#2854: Oct 15th 2012 at 5:38:42 PM

[up][awesome] Props to that guy whoever he is.

Otherarrow Since: Jul, 2010
#2855: Oct 15th 2012 at 5:42:58 PM

For the record, going by his formspring, Diabetus wasn't just writing that guy off (well, maybe he was) but he reacts to most of the big long text walls that way.

In other news, they spruced up the old youtube page.

edited 15th Oct '12 5:44:05 PM by Otherarrow

Don't PM me. We don't like being PMed.
0dd1 Just awesome like that from Nowhere Land Since: Sep, 2009
Just awesome like that
#2856: Oct 15th 2012 at 6:00:35 PM

he shares the same emotion that viewers have when encountering something shocking or interesting in the video game
I can see that. I normally start screaming my lungs out like a shrieking three year old having a temper tantrum when I'm playing a video game and something happens in it.

Insert witty and clever quip here. My page, as the database hates my handle.
Justin_Brett Since: Jun, 2010
#2857: Oct 15th 2012 at 7:16:50 PM

So....

He only cares when someone is attacked if it's someone he likes. And he basically says that quantity is better than quality. I don't even know what he means by advertising, they don't do this to make money.

edited 15th Oct '12 7:19:40 PM by Justin_Brett

Marioguy128 Geomancer from various galaxies Since: Jan, 2010
Geomancer
#2858: Oct 15th 2012 at 7:20:41 PM

That's way too many words for silly internet videos. People are taking whole thing this way too seriously and getting too worked up about it.

edited 15th Oct '12 7:25:53 PM by Marioguy128

You got some dirt on you. Here's some more!
Lopiny also known as Oryutzen from somewhere Since: May, 2011
also known as Oryutzen
#2859: Oct 15th 2012 at 7:23:09 PM

I think they're going to war. This has gone beyond the "kicking a hornet nest" part into something that might light a portion of the net on fire for a few days.

Oh, the thread? Don't worry, it's just dead.
Marioguy128 Geomancer from various galaxies Since: Jan, 2010
Geomancer
#2860: Oct 15th 2012 at 7:23:38 PM

Eh, it'll die down in a day or 2.

You got some dirt on you. Here's some more!
ninjaclown Since: May, 2009
#2861: Oct 15th 2012 at 9:07:10 PM

Hopefully. This is not going to benefit anyone.

betraylawl S. is my middle name from Little China Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Wishing you were here
S. is my middle name
#2862: Oct 15th 2012 at 9:08:09 PM

this always happens when they do a big internet celebrity but when they do a smaller lPer no one is complaining

Gifted like Christmas
Marioguy128 Geomancer from various galaxies Since: Jan, 2010
Geomancer
#2863: Oct 15th 2012 at 9:41:25 PM

It's happened 2 times before. Only difference between now and then, was that the 2 guys didn't mind the Retsupurae riffings, and told their fanbases to back down. (They didn't listen) Pewdiepie on the other hand, is encouraging fans to retaliate, so it might last a little longer than those 2 shitstorms.

Oh, and apparently, they had to go with the reaction video format, cause a regular riffing over his videos probably would've gotten them banned because of his "scare cam" thing. (Apparently, riffing over real life footage like that could count as a personal attack of sorts.)

edited 15th Oct '12 9:50:17 PM by Marioguy128

You got some dirt on you. Here's some more!
BalrogKick Since: Jan, 2011
#2864: Oct 15th 2012 at 9:59:20 PM

Using videos of people's faces was part of a Youtube rule they added later on. Retsupurae had to remove some of their older videos when their account was temporarily closed during that time. Which is why videos like Big Al and the Vimeo ones are gone.

edited 15th Oct '12 10:00:16 PM by BalrogKick

0dd1 Just awesome like that from Nowhere Land Since: Sep, 2009
Just awesome like that
#2865: Oct 15th 2012 at 10:10:15 PM

It's happened 2 times before
Far more times than that. Almost all of which nobody cares about anymore.

Insert witty and clever quip here. My page, as the database hates my handle.
hassanico Since: Dec, 1969
#2866: Oct 16th 2012 at 12:47:20 AM

Diabetus just posted a message someone sent to them over youtube on SA for those interested, the text is.

Was this posted in "The State of LP" topic? I haven't finished it, but it's a very interesting read/discussion about LPing as a whole, and I'd recommend reading it if you can.

Marioguy128 Geomancer from various galaxies Since: Jan, 2010
Geomancer
#2867: Oct 16th 2012 at 1:16:14 AM

... If you have an account that is. The paywall's been up for a while.

You got some dirt on you. Here's some more!
Bookyangel2438 from New York City Since: Jul, 2011
#2868: Oct 16th 2012 at 4:17:48 AM

Oh no not the paywall! sad

Alt account of Angeldog 2437.
sifem Since: Sep, 2012
#2869: Oct 16th 2012 at 4:42:42 AM

Props to that guy whoever he is.

Oh yes. Props to him. Now to go back to our scheduled program of RAPERAPERAPERAPERAPERAPERAPE HAHA RAPE IS FUNNY GUYS WHY ARE YOU NOT LAUGHING and WAH THE MEAN INTERNET PEOPLE MADE FUN OF MY RAPE SPOUTING IDOL

Even if you ignore the quality vs quantity debate (and why would you anyway? the first choice is always better), the person writing this rant seems to have completely forgotten that Retsupurae members do in fact, GASP, have jobs! Oh boy, they actually contribute to society?! And this making fun of people thing is just something they do in their spare time?! SACRILEGE! Everyone should quit their jobs like PDP and earn money by doing nothing but posting hours upon hours of worthless screaming ever day!

nomuru2d Gamer-turning-maker from Port Saint Lucie, FL Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Longing for Dulcinea
Gamer-turning-maker
#2870: Oct 16th 2012 at 6:18:32 AM

@Balrog: They're not gone. Most of them are just over at the old Retsuplay account.

edited 16th Oct '12 6:18:43 AM by nomuru2d

Long live Cinematech. FC:0259-0435-4987
FalconPain Since: Feb, 2015
#2871: Oct 16th 2012 at 6:44:35 AM

[up][up]That is a theme I've seen in their angrier RPs: bitterness toward those that manage to make a living doing these kinds of videos, particularly when they don't actually entertain them.

Which raises the question of what audience the videos actually do draw, and if the RP is implying that this audience doesn't deserve them. (This may actually be a theme of SA in general.)

This may be more complicated than I thought at first, considering that there is a vocal anti-TGWTG fanbase (TGWTG being the one RP subject I genuinely follow) and that at least two contributors to that site have admitted in the past few months to enjoying the Jackass movies.

edited 16th Oct '12 6:45:07 AM by FalconPain

sifem Since: Sep, 2012
#2872: Oct 16th 2012 at 8:12:37 AM

The problem with TGWTG is that it's been less about the content the people talk about and more about a cult of personality born around them (in fact, just look at the incredibly weird and creepy pages for the critics themselves here, that is, if they still exist). So you're not watching, say, a critic talk about XCOM because you want to hear about XCOM. You just want to hear someone angrily shouting about a game/movie/comic/etc.

Though I personally just feel most of the stuff there is unfunny garbage. It'll either be super opinionated, gimmicky as all hell, or a screaming match. Or Spoony, who's just pitiful nowadays after the incidents in the last few months.

emeriin Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: She's holding a very large knife
#2873: Oct 16th 2012 at 8:15:49 AM

To Boldly Flee made it pretty clear that it's less about official reviews and more about characters doing sketch comedy with reviews as a backdrop, but this isn't the TGWTG thread. I've watched some Pew Die Pie the last few days and he seems like fun, so hoping the drama will blow over.

I cut up one dozen new men and you will die somewhat, again and again.
MightyKombat And? And? And? And? AND? from New PC Land Since: Jan, 2001
And? And? And? And? AND?
#2874: Oct 16th 2012 at 8:18:48 AM

Surprised nobody here or there's gone for the lol "YOU CANT JUDGE YOU HAVENT MADE ANY LPS!" thing to Beef or Betus. Retarded as fuck as that may be,

I'm quite confident in my shitposting you know
sifem Since: Sep, 2012
#2875: Oct 16th 2012 at 8:24:35 AM

Actually, I've seen "What do you mean they helped make L Ps? Whatever, they still suck for being mean. HOW DARE YOU MAKE FUN OF THE BRO ARMY" being thrown around.


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