Let's talk about beat'em ups.

I ended up getting the first DWG since it was cheap at a local store and woah man, why didn't I get into Musou sooner?

(How many fucking times do I have to kill Haman, though?)

Are beat 'em ups as a whole repetitive, or is that a biased criticism seeded by IGN and/or GameSpot. Or is it that "average" beat 'em ups are repetitive while only the good ones escape that criticism.

Because, really, I've been seeing the word "repetitive" when it comes to describing the genre.

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There was a thread on that question a while ago and I posted in it... My writing was even more embarasing back then, but I still stand by some of the thing I said.

More than any of that though, I think the lack of appreciation for arcade game design (which game journos have repeadetly shown themselves to be actively hostile to) is to blame. If you're going to take any random arcade beat'em up and just play them like Joe Mame creditfeeder, flaying around mindlessly and jamming the 5 key everytime you die, it's obviously going to be a dull and mindless experience. Good arcade beat'em ups (and indeed, most single player arcade games) only open up when you play for the 1CC.

edited 8th Jul '14 11:58:51 AM by Glowsquid

Yes they're repetitive by design but a good one varies it enough to where it's still pretty fun. Some depth is a necessity as well.

The better a beat-em-up is, the less quickly it'll get repetitive. Given the very nature of the genre, it tends to get boring quickly unless you do a lot to keep it interesting, which is probably why a lot of journalists tend to say stuff like about the genre.

Generally, what you want to do is have good mechanics that grow with the player, a lot of different types of enemies so you're not fighting the same 2 or 3 guys again and again, and just generally keeping things new. Some games, such as Streets of Rage 3, Double Dragon Neon, or Violent Storm, or example, do really well at this. Some games, like Sengoku 3, don't do this, and thus drive men to insanity.

"Great Scott! Send in the Doomsday Squad!"

The best beat em ups either offer several options to the player, or put a lot of attention to detail to both your capabilities or the capabilities of the opposition. Games like what Platininum (and Clover by extention) makes as well as the Ninja Gaiden series make a point for the player to know that everything the game throws at you can be avoided with enough practice and twitch skill. Older beat 'em ups like Capcom's days of yore make sure to vary their opponents (e.i. wake up speeds and resilience) as well as give them their own behaviors and ways to telegraph what they're going to do.

Video game journalism, especially the likes of IGN and Gamespot have shown time and time again that they do not favor high level play in the slightest and do not have the patience for it. However, Journalists aren't gamers the same way most people who love their games are.

ALL CREATURE WILL DIE AND ALL THE THINGS WILL BE BROKEN. THAT'S THE LAW OF SAMURAI.

I actually don't count Ninja Gaiden Xbox onwards or DMC/Bayonetta as beat em ups...they're more their own genre with roots in the beat em up genre.

They are more like Character Action games.

God Of War is similar, and one of the few western gaming examples that does this right (Alongside the guys who made Darksiders)

Watch Symphogear

Exactly. Not really sure what to call it though, as hack n slash doesn't quite do justice and implies more mass slaughter arcadey type gameplay. Hi-action maybe? Or is that a bit too vague?

Hack and Slash is fine. Go W is just one with a huge budget and attention to balance and detail.

I like to call DMC, Ninja Gaiden and GOW-style games hack and flash games.

edited 9th Jul '14 8:13:55 PM by DragonGeyser

Lampshade Hanging: It's a lifestyle.

I like the term Spectacle Brawlers. I also think Hack n Slash refers more to Diablo-like action RP Gs.

ALL CREATURE WILL DIE AND ALL THE THINGS WILL BE BROKEN. THAT'S THE LAW OF SAMURAI.

Lag Cancelling via Overheating your gun. Ooo, gurl u ratchet.

edited 19th Jul '14 12:06:31 PM by Schitzo

ALL CREATURE WILL DIE AND ALL THE THINGS WILL BE BROKEN. THAT'S THE LAW OF SAMURAI.

I finally got myself a PS 2 after years of being one of the three people on the planet to not own one. Quick q to the regulars here: Are The Bouncer and Urban Reign worth bothering with?

The Bouncer is seriously dated now since it's most impressive points are no longer impressive.

Never played Urban Reign. I don't have a PS 2 either though.

Well, I 1CC'd the Japanese version of Undercover Cops with Rosa. See this song below?

This song only plays if you beat the game as Rosa for some reason. And even then, just with that character alone. It is not necessary to 1CC it. Sadly, this song does NOT play on the Alpha Renewal Version of the game.

That final boss is annoying, though. I can beat the others without losing a life most of the time. The most lives I lost during a 1CC run on this game is two lives.

Don't Press Your Luck too many times in life. You'll just get whammied.

Undercover Cops is awesome, and also has a really Non Indictive Name. "Post Apocayptic Law Bringers" would be better.

And Rosa is easily the coolest character there. Her Super move is so wicked. She is also freaking JACKED despite having a few girly moves.

I can't remember, do the underground mole people explode in one hit in the original or redone version? Or both? I remember seeing a "Hit" animation on them...

As for 1cc runs... Yowch. What are the "Rules" for doing one of those? Because I've tried doing it in Armored Warriors to no avail.

'Grats on the 1cc! Rosa is my favourite character too.

They die in one hit on Japan/Alpha Renewal and multiple hits on the shitty version. If you dash into them, they'll stagger.

One sitting clear of a game on the first credit and on the default settings .

edited 29th Jan '15 3:36:49 PM by Glowsquid

I assume that means no save states.

The problem I usually have with 1cc runs is they very often require repetitive strategies, while I'm a very aggressive player that feels like he's doing something wrong if I'm not on the offensive. So I constantly barrel straight into groups of enemies. I usually give a lot more damage than I take, but all those nicks add up.

It doesn't help that the games are all absurdly hard of course.

-sigh- I'll go practice my Sengoku 3...

Tried playing Turtles In Time on Hard Mode today...and now I realize why I usually stay on Normal.

Maybe it's just my lack of experience with the genre, over-reliance on button mashing, or even the slowed-down gameplay of the SNES version, but I can't help but feel the game lacks some defense mechanisms. I know one can reflect projectiles with good timing, though. Maybe I just need to work on my reflexes?

Weird in a Can (updated M-F)

Which version? The arcade or SNES version?

Don't Press Your Luck too many times in life. You'll just get whammied.

The foot trooper slam one-hit kills any foots it happens to hit and you're invicible for its duration. Use it. Abuse it. Love it.

Which turtle are you using? Raphael has a stupidly low amount of health.

edited 31st Jan '15 9:35:28 AM by Glowsquid

Seriously, Turtles in Time on SNES is laughably easy, even on the hardest difficulty. The only boss that'll give you trouble is Slash due to his "You have to hit me from behind gimmick." Everything else is a cakewalk. Even when I was younger that game was an absolute joke in difficulty.

Don't Press Your Luck too many times in life. You'll just get whammied.

Well, I finally beat Double Dragon 2 on the NES. Finding the timing for the hyper knee and hurricane kick was annoying, though, at least until I can pull them off consistently.

Don't Press Your Luck too many times in life. You'll just get whammied.

Grats. I Almost beat Double Dragon 3 when I was a kid. Went back to it as an adult and had my ass handed to me by the first Mook.

Any good Belt-Scroll games on, say, Steam?