Batman: The Telltale Series

I slipped Bane the venom and ended up leaving Harley behind. I didn't see anything; to my knowledge, Bane being weakened when you initially leave him behind is its only effect/purpose.

edited 21st Apr '18 5:06:15 PM by Lavaeolus

That's pretty lame.

edited 28th Apr '18 10:02:14 PM by RedHunter543

edited 28th Apr '18 10:01:55 PM by RedHunter543

Heyo. That "Season 1 vs Season 2" review got me thinking about my own comparisons between the two Batman seasons, and I thought I'd talk about it here. I tried writing a review, but it was way too long. I tried to adhere to an informative review style, but I couldn't fit the word limit - so here's a more informal post about my feelings towards the two Telltale Batman seasons. Spoilers for season 1 will follow, some will be unmarked, and season 2 spoilers will definitely be marked.

So - in short, I think season one and season two of Telltale's Batman are polar opposites. I liked season one for things season 2 bunged up a bit, I liked season 2 for things it did better than season one, and the order in which I enjoyed each season's episodes are reversed.

I liked Season 1 for how it wasn't afraid to mess with canon and create its own lore. Thomas Wayne and Vicki Vale are two plot twists I legitimately loved, and it was a good touch to have a fully playable Catwoman romance. This is a canon where they're explicitly much closer to each other - they know each other's name, they have some quality time instead of Slap-Slap-Kiss all the time etc. Batman uses a voice modulator, which is neat, the world is slightly more futuristic with skyrails and stuff, Don Corleone is still a bastard but he gets a gentle scene, and the game is a lot gorier than usual Batman fare. And there's a good mix of familiar and new, with Lucius Fox's appearance - voiced by Dave Fennoy - being one of my favorite moments of the game. The story feels more personal, and the ongoing theme of Batman losing what makes him powerful and making do with what he has is just a really fun, great thing.

The season drags a little with the last couple of episodes, it has some of the best moments of the season but I remember feeling a bit underwhelmed near the end there. Still, I liked season one of Telltale's Batman immensely - it's my favorite Telltale game next to season one of The Walking Dead.

Season two, on the other hand, starts off... decent? but there was a lot about the first episode that left me feeling really on-the-fence about the whole thing. Lucius Fox's death really soured me towards the episode, especially after he introduces us to his daughter Tiffany. You just know she's going to be the whizzbang tech developer who eclipses her old man - she's a legacy character. And then Lucius dies, and it almost becomes an inevitability. I wasn't big on how Bruce Wayne uses John Doe like he does, more on that later, I had my reservations about Amanda Waller and came to stop giving a single fuck when the pulled the "secret identity" card, and I thought the Riddler was woefully underutilised. Robin Atkin Downes did a great Riddler, and he dies at the end of the first episode. What a bummer.

Those are my complaints from the first episode of season two. Some of my opinions changed over the course of the game, but my feelings stayed somewhere between indifferent and liking it at the bare minimum.

The best thing about this season is the character designs. Harley, Mr. Freeze and Bane look pretty great, Riddler looks gross but is still great, and any late-game redesigns look really good. I think they redesigned Alfred, and it's for the better. I like John Doe's attire and rigor mortis grin.

My main complaint right out of the box is that I didn't care what they were doing with the story. From the end of the first episode, my thought were basically "Okay, so it's a pre-Suicide Squad plot with Batman on a leash" - I got it right away. Waller's there, Joker and Harley and Bane are there - it's going to end with a Suicide Squad. The SANCTUS stuff and Waller's involvement barely shocked me - so she's a bad guy too? As she tends to be, but slightly worse? Cool, I guess. There was very little to look forward to, except handling Riddler's corpse and Mr. Freeze. The lore for Harley was good, but otherwise there was nothing as captivating as the first season's twists. The whole season was decent, but lackluster. And I really don't like "bad guy knows your secret" plots, so the whole Joker and Waller knowing your identity thing just didn't work well with me.

But they really did pull it out with the final episode. I got the Vigilante joker, and while it might not be the better ending, it was a lot of fun and it was a good way to show how we had shaped John Doe up to this point. I've had a bit of an epiphany writing this post, as John Doe showing up to Lucius' funeral and us having to justify his presence there was one of my least favorite parts of the first episode, but the interactions with him become more comfortable as the story goes on. In essence, the game making John Doe more of a viable friend as the game goes on is a way to show that you do have a lot in common with him and could come to like him, or even be somewhere in the same league. That whole "we're not so different, you and I" thing? You play that process. And it's hit or miss, but I think it's definitely there.

My Catwoman is still with the Suicide Squad, but there was a tender moment after Bruce fell through the GCPD roof and Catwoman helped us up. the dialogue option I went with as she helped me along was "I love you". The relationship wasn't super prevalent for most of the game, but allowing Bruce and Selina to continue the relationship was a nice touch. And Vigilante Joker was a lot of fun. Really, some of the game's best character moments come from the last episode - especially with Tiffany, who I regarded as a Legacy Character Scrappy due to what I perceived as a cheap death for Lucius, and just generally not liking legacy characters. Look what happened to Mortal Kombat X or Soul Calibur 5. I started the game not liking this character. I ended up really liking what the game did with them.

There was a lot more to criticise in season two, I feel like. It felt like it was taking a safer route, with a few notable changes - the John Doe/Harley relationship in particular is a thing of beauty, I'm so happy they reversed it and made Harley the leader for most of the game. But it felt a lot more predictable, it had less surprises and a lot of what I liked about the last episode was just sort of average or middling for the other four episodes. I did enjoy the Relationship system a lot, and Jim Gordon's story was really good this season - but it failed to capture me like the first season did.

I liked all 5 episodes of season one, with a slight dip near the end. The first 3-4 episodes of season 2 were a dip, before getting good right at the end. Season one had unpredictability and a willingness to shape its own canon, and season two had less of that willingness. Season two had a good relationship system and stronger character arcs for Jim Gordon and Alfred, which was good in season one with Harvey Dent before things go to shit and he abandons you but not quite as good here. The seasons are more or less flipped for me.

edited 9th May '18 7:45:32 PM by MrMallard

I guess for some of the S1 and S2 divide, is that S1 is more grounded and mundane, there is more emphasis on Bruce Wayne handling more realistic affairs like a Fundraising gala, Corruption accusations, corporate drama, his identity and politics when not being Batman. The Villains in 1 except Catwoman, are pretty mundane once you strip them of their gimmicks, Harvey Dent is a corrupt politician at his core, Penguin is basically, one of those occupy wall street take down the power till he gets power then becomes another executive and Vale is basically a terrorist but with relatively grounded reasoning and is basically a journalist exposing corruption at her core. And all the villains know Bruce Wayne in his civilian life and that makes fights with them as Batman more personal.

S2 is more comic bookish, Bruce Wayne's story here is infiltrating a gang of larger than life villains. He's not pondering his place in Gotham, nor doing mundane things like giving out press interviews or managing his PR, basically his story is more fantastical here. The Pact are less grounded than the old villains and they don't know Bruce Wayne outside of work. John Doe, despite how much the game tries to build a friendship between the 2, ultimately does not know Bruce outside of the Pact. He sees Bruce as a teammate and a trusted friend, but in all honesty, if the Pact hypothetically accomplished their goals, John and Bruce wouldn't have a reason to hang out.

So yeah just comparing and contrasting Seasons.

edited 24th May '18 8:17:06 AM by RedHunter543

Wasn't that last point about The Pact breaking up something that John realizes towards the end?

Overall, I think I preferred Season 1, but Season 2 handled its villains way better. There was so much stuff in Season 1 that felt like plotholes, like Penguin knowing about Batman's console in Wayne Enterprises yet somehow not realizing that there is a connection between him and Bruce.

I distinctly liked season two more than season one. John's arc felt like Harvey's done right, and I felt like there was more going on here. I absolutely loved Undercover Bruce and I hope more games run with it. In the first season, the Waynes' criminal connections was mainly just there for shock value, but season two really pushed it in a new and interesting direction.

"Bruce Wayne poses as a crooked mobster" is the kind of story that would be hard to tell with Batman because Bruce is such a renowned public figure, but it's a fascinating direction in this particular version of the universe because of that central twist about what, exactly, the Waynes are renowned for. I'd love to see more of Bruce using his family's criminal connections to set people up to get Batman'd in future seasons.

The choices were a lot harder here, too. There were a lot more points where I really felt like I had to weigh my options carefully, as opposed to season 1 where I almost always felt like there was a Right and Wrong option as determined by my personal set of values. "Trust John" or "Don't Trust John" is a much more complicated choice than "Reveal Identity" or "Let Crazy Person Harm Alfred".

Wonder how long Bruce could keep it up before criminals realize " hey wait a minute, every time someone goes to Bruce Wayne, somehow Batman is there, BATMAN WORKS FOR BRUCE WAYNE''

Now don't get me wrong, i loved the infiltrating aspect but i always felt guilty and helpless whenever one of the Pact killed people, the ending of EP 2 illustrated that perfectly when Bruce looks at the Bat-signal.

Part of what makes Vigilante Joker compelling is that he's overexposed and always a psychopathic monster. Having it be more of a tragic friendship and have him genuinely try to curb his darker impulses is a new twist on it, and if it fails there's still the fact that it was YOUR fault. If he goes vigilante there's a chance he may actually be redeemed. It's a genuinely unique take on the franchise

Speaking of which, I think that Ra's Al Ghul may have funded Lady Arkham. Hence when he finds out that Bruce Wayne is batman he's rather intrigued.

Really? what makes you think that?

It would be entirely in character. He thinks Gotham is corrupt and would see it as a target. Vicki would be an ideal agent, and it would explain some of the more advanced weapon

I'm guessing this series is dead now in light of what's going on with Telltale.

Kind of a shame, but it is what it is.

Enemy Within didn't really leave any loose ends hanging, so I'm not particularly dismayed.

I mean, it can (Selina can end the game as part of the Suicide Squad, for one thing), but all in all, it was fairly conclusive.

Edited by KarkatTheDalek on Oct 2nd 2018 at 7:20:47 AM

I think it's a shame we can't see more of John's & Bruce's friendship. I would love to see more of that.

I'd say if it ends at 2 seasons, it's a good place to leave off. Just enough is answered that it feels conclusive as a take on this Batman, but there's some bits that can be used for a 3rd season if by some miracle it ever comes out.

Not to mention your decisions in the final two scenes can actually stick and won't be undone or rendered useless like they would if a third season ever came.

I'll admit I'm a bit sad we didn't get to see more versions of classic and obscure villains in this universe. Scacrecrow and Poison Ivy would've been cool, in particular.

Edited by GamerSlyRatchet on Oct 2nd 2018 at 6:53:47 AM

In this day and age, nothing ever dies. Someone else just comes along and tries to make it their own.

Or in other words, Telltale is "back" - which is to say, purchased and reopened, with rights to some of their previous series, by completely different people.

One of those previous series being the Batman series, in what it simultaneously interesting and concerning news.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Aug 28th 2019 at 6:39:46 AM

Honestly, I'm mostly interested if they intend to do more of the LucasArts titles or The Wolf Among Us. Original TellTale won me over early with Sam&Max, after all. Otherwise, my enthusiasm isn't super high.

Kind of the same. The Sam and Max franchise rocks, and the loss of any future video game content was imo the biggest loss when Telltale disappeared (since I doubt anybody else would be interested in them, whereas you can bet there'll be more narrative Batman or GOTG or Game of Thrones games).

For the record, I brought up this business of Telltale "returning" back in the Walking Dead game thread.

But I digress.

I was just about ready to move on from Telltale and was looking forward to AdHoc Studio to carry the Adventure Game torch forward.

...But they haven't said anything since February this year.

Plus, the freelancing part from New Telltale just sounds like a red flag...

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Aug 28th 2019 at 10:53:24 AM

I'm glad that this means that the Batman duology and most of Telltale's other works will be returning to stores: this series in particular was too good to remain unobtainable to new players.

I am very skeptical of the new Telltale's commitment to providing work for former Telltale employees, much less the new company's ability to follow in the old one's footsteps.

Thing is, my opinion can be bought real easy. The words Maniac Mansion, for instance, would make my loyalty real cheap.

I have no idea who LCG Entertainment or the new management for Telltale is.

But I know who they're not, and they're not Electronic Arts. So while I don't know what Batman Season 3 will be like, I feel confident that it won't be a lootbox-driven soccer game.