UQ Holder

That's all very convenient, but does it make for a good story?

....I do hope you're not trying to be serious with that, because 1) about half of those "conveniences" don't count as such and 2) I can play that game with any fictional work ever.

edited 10th Jul '14 4:05:18 PM by Watchtower

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if Fate was just really annoyed by Eva and doesn't want to be associated with her. They're not speaking like enemies. Bitter former friends at the worst, which is why he was so willing to give into their questions.

They sound group therapy.

Problem is, that's actually (aside from what you consider to be convenient or contrived either way) what's happened in UQ Holder down to a T, with the only omission of the eight month training program that only worked as an excuse to bring the hero's up to par. For that type of expose to work for other pieces of fiction, it would require skipping out on different minor events that would otherwise give a series some more flavor to it. Despite having almost fifty chapters under its belt, there have been no real breather chapters occurring since they got to the base that could flesh anything out, and there's neither been any substantial information regarding...shit, anything yet.

We're in this weird nexus where there's nothing really going on despite the heavy amount of action and exposition right now. Its quite uncanny. The next chapter will either salvage something out of this series, or deliver on nothing substantial while we return to the standard "who gives a shit" plot that's been happening thus far.

edited 10th Jul '14 4:45:40 PM by SkormSnow-Strider

I can make Auschwitz fit into most people's moral systems too if I'm willing to stretch that much, but the problem is there's no stretching involved here.

Really? It's not just a tad stretched and silly? So the crazed swordswoman being willing to turn herself into a crazed cyborg swordswoman is a contrived convenience? The singly-minded psychopath going out of his way to continue after the one he's obsessed over is a contrived convenience? Touta having to turn himself into a vampire to save his friends and his mentor/parental guardian is a contrived conveniece? Every single expy/reused caracter design/shared name, from Xingzai to Kuromaru to Jinbei to freaking Shinobu, is a contrived convenience?

And let's be clear, when you say "convenient", I know you mean "contrivedly convenient". You wouldn't use the word in such a negative connotation if you weren't.

Also note that I said "about half". I am conceding points here. Touta developing ME when he needed it most is convenient. Touta forgetting to ask about said ME is convenient. Fate suddenly having comrades with him that weren't around in the original loop is convenient. You think this series is the biggest piece of monkey shit ever put to paper and ink, fine, but you don't need to make flimsy arguments to prove it.

edited 10th Jul '14 5:30:16 PM by Watchtower

I'll be honest, I think Tsukiyomi only made it in because she's something of a fan favorite, not because she actually brings something substantial to this series. Even though (I still think Setsuna or someone should have killed her ass at some point on general principle) her continued existence can be justified in-universe, it just makes me wonder what the point of bringing her back is when I'd much rather see semi-friendlier face at this point. At least let me know that not all the characters (The Eva I marginally liked may as well be dead) I cared for have kicked the bucket before introducing someone like her.

Never liked Tsukiyomi much to begin with. It would've actually been cool if it was someone like Graff. At least you don't need to make the "CYBERNETICS" tripe with him, at the very least.

edited 10th Jul '14 5:45:23 PM by SkormSnow-Strider

I don't mind Eva's costume too much, it's a bit silly though. I see as much weird "carnival" in it as "angel". Given an important fight against...basically her only "equal", I would have just liked to see her revert to her normal form and bust out the black frilly lace of war.

Wasn't there a breather chapter at Mahora where she dressed up the girls who didn't accompany Negi as goth-lolita-maids to kill an hour?

Napoleon did stretch it a little bit with everything being convenient, but not too much. He stretched that joke far less than Akamatsu's done with this premise.

Rough page count, where would we be around in Negima?

Also, Shlugo, I think you missed the point of what I was saying early. It's not that Karin needs to be distressed because there's no help, it's that the lunar surface should essentially be a torture chamber for her. Granted it's one where she can be rescued, but it should still be as terrible of an experience as she is likely to encounter. Turns out she doesn't mind.

Good question. UQ Holder averages about 18 pages while Negima early on was from 19-20 so...not a clue. It would either balance itself out (I think UQ Holder has a few more pages over Negima's first chapter) but the whole thing sorta tapers off after that. We might actually around the beginning of the Kyoto arc in a worst case scenario for it.

edited 10th Jul '14 6:07:46 PM by SkormSnow-Strider

So the crazed swordswoman being willing to turn herself into a crazed cyborg swordswoman is a contrived convenience?

No. What is a contrived coincidence is someone being willing to spend mega-bucks on making the treacherous, murderous, psychotic, unpredictable swordswoman an immortal cyborg according to her wishes. It's like making The Joker immortal hoping it won't bite you in the ass.

Touta having to turn himself into a vampire to save his friends and his mentor/parental guardian is a contrived conveniece?

No. What is contrived, however, is that change making him suddenly all perks with no downsides going against the very rules set before by the universe. With no explanation or even lampshading whatsoever. Other than the 'Touta is super-duper special!' gospel that has been hitting us across the head over and over.

Every single expy/reused caracter design/shared name, from Xingzai to Kuromaru to Jinbei to freaking Shinobu, is a contrived convenience?

One time is never a coincidence. Two times are often a coincidence. Three times are an unlikely coincidence. By this point, it's entered Oh, come on! territory.

edited 10th Jul '14 6:29:56 PM by NapoleonDeCheese

Why would Karin particularly mind it? Even Nagumo mentioned that being there wouldn't hurt her, she can communicate with the outside world and she got picked up fairly quickly. It's not that big a deal for her.

So she can't use her own money to cyberize herself then? Really?

Firstly, how on Earth would the series even work if Touta couldn't walk the daylight and so on?

In any case, there are any number of explanations for it. Eva changed him when she was already a Shinso, so his level as a vampire is higher than Eva's was when she was first changed through magic. This is a super common trope, just check Tsukihime for example. Maybe it has to do with Touta's foreshadowed mysterious past. In any case, you make complaints like that when the series has ended.

In the case of Kuromaru, pretty much every generation in Akamatsu's shared universe has a stubborn, neurotic Shinmeiryuu swordsman. Love Hina had one, Ala Rubra had one, Ala Alba had one, now UQ Holder has one. It's less a contrivance and more a tradition.

As for Xinghai, Chao is the 7th most popular name in China. 7th. Were you under the impression that Chao Lingshen was the only person with that name in the world? If someone named Jack shows up, are you going to say the same thing?

edited 10th Jul '14 6:45:30 PM by Chaosjunction

Too bad a few chapters prior to that, Not!Chao claims that she can still feel the physical sensation of pain despite it not actually causing any type of damage. The idea of suffocating without actually dying ranks pretty high on my list of things to avoid at all cost.

edited 10th Jul '14 6:36:51 PM by SkormSnow-Strider

Nagumo clearly says that in karin's case, all she'll feel is a simple shortness of breath. That's not particularly horrible, sorry.

Which runs into the problem of that making no damn sense. Being on the surface of the moon should not result in "shortness of breath." It should result in an absence of breath, on account of there being an absence of air. That it does not is, I gather, Skorm's problem with the situation.

Wait, I've got it. They terraformed the moon into having an atmosphere and nobody's brought it up yet.

edited 10th Jul '14 6:51:28 PM by rikalous

So she can't use her own money to cyberize herself then? Really?

1) Tsukuyomi isn't a millionaire, and last time we saw her, she was either imprisoned or at least heavily wanted by the authorities.

2) We have gone through this before. Even if she pays, any specialist with a good head on their shoulders should know the first thing she's likely to do upon waking is slicing your neck open with her newfound vitality, then take her money back and walk away.

As for Xinghai, Chao is the 7th most popular name in China. 7th. Were you under the impression that Chao Lingshen was the only person with that name in the world? If someone named Jack shows up, are you going to say the same thing?

If it had been an unique thing? No. Added to every other 'coincidence' we already have? Yes.

Firstly, how on Earth would the series even work if Touta couldn't walk the daylight and so on?

Um, by having him act during nights, like nearly every freaking vampire series out there? To make the other immortals take the daylight action when needed, guaranteeing they'll always have something to do without the shadow of TOUTA TOUTA TOUTA over them? To make him overcome that weakness, without being handed everything on a silver platter?

In the case of Kuromaru, pretty much every generation in Akamatsu's shared universe has a stubborn, neurotic Shinmeiryuu swordsman. Love Hina had one, Ala Rubra had one, Ala Alba had one, now UQ Holder has one. It's less a contrivance and more a tradition.

You say to-ma-to...

Regardless, it's a tradition that should be put to rest already. Hell, even the Naru clones were given a break already.

edited 10th Jul '14 6:55:55 PM by NapoleonDeCheese

Hell, Touta could just put sunscreen on to go out in the day. At least that could be milked for comedy or drama if he forgets to put it on or runs out.

In defense of the chapter, I will say that I could buy Fate being less able to curb-stomp the remaining immortals after he's been stabbed a few dozen times in the throat by magic. Assuming we aren't working by RPG rules where you can be down to your last hitpoint without your fighting abilities being impaired.

Too bad the Naru clones (Karin just doesn't give a shit) are the only ones that would call people out on their stupidity, as opposed to Kuro the doormat.

But then again, the others don't listen to them anyway...

At this point, I just want someone to at least recognize the insane shit that's been going down. I mean, I know you're immortal and that probably impedes your sense of self-preservation, but really now, there's only so much the audience can take.

Karin has a divine blessing that prevents her from dying, I think the usual rules don't apply to her.

Tsukiyomi's a mercenary by trade, who knows how much money she's got stashed away, putting aside the absurd implication that she couldn't have made some money in 80 years.

Because wanted people can't do anything at all, right? Underground doctors aren't a thing, not at all!

That's assuming whoever operated on her even knows who she is, or that she might have some relationship with her doctor, or any other number of things.

Nitpicking.

What other vampire series has a vampire protag that can't go out in the day anyway? Sounds deadly dull to me.

Your opinion.

Not so sure about that, what with Kirie....

edited 10th Jul '14 7:45:43 PM by Chaosjunction

Tsukiyomi's a mercenary by trade, who knows how much money she's got stashed away, putting aside the absurd implication that she couldn't have made some money in 80 years.

1) This isn't a simple surgery. It's still a very uncommon procedure, and I doubt 'a lot of money' is going to cover it. Try 'a freaking huge lot of money' instead.

2) Tsukuyomi was never shown with any financial acumen or deep insight. She was highly erratic, and I doubt she ever invested or handled her money wisely.

3) 80 years also gave a lot of time to spend jailed, and/or to be pressed by other expenses. Especially when your enemies include people with connections with some of the most influential political and business branches on two worlds. Even more so when global crises hit, which takes a dent on almost everyone's money, directly or indirectly.

Because wanted people can't do anything at all, right? Underground doctors aren't a thing, not at all!

Again, this isn't a freaking knee surgery. It's the kind of thing an underground doctor could never achieve, unless we've reached a point where you can freely see cyborgs walking all around. Which we clearly aren't seeing here.

Your opinion.

Gee, don't tell me. Thanks, I hadn't realized it.

edited 10th Jul '14 7:51:38 PM by NapoleonDeCheese

It wasn't called Vampire:The Angsting for nothing. There is enough wrong already. No need to pick on the stuff it did right.

Although Touta is a vampire the same way Eva is a vampire(i.e....she was a vampire when she found it amusing). Or the way any nun in the entire Negima series was christian for that matter.

Never seen a cyberpunk series? Underground docs can do anything. Also, you forgot Touta being Kotaro without ears.

Honestly, it's been more or less established at this point that Ken doesn't feel like putting to much effort into the character design department anymore.

edited 10th Jul '14 7:57:10 PM by kiukiuclk

And I repeat, what exactly is stopping her from earning a 'freaking huge lot of money', as you put it?

That's quite an odd thing to say. Nothing we've seen of her suggests that she doesn't at least have the basic ability to handle money. Being a fight crazy psycho doesn't disqualify from having that ability. Even if she didn't, she can hire a financial advisor. Or are you going to tell me that financial advisors don't assist criminals?

Come to think of it, were we ever told that Tsukiyomi was wanted?

edited 10th Jul '14 8:03:45 PM by Chaosjunction