Bravely Default Series

DeRosso will. That's kinda what 'immortal' means.

Here's a thing I'll agree with. The team shouldn't have been surprised.

Mostly because that causes an inconsistency with previous dialogue, about how "we do this to uncover our true foe."

Even just a few lines continuing that train of thought, in the true end, would've made more sense. Or even Tiz saying he heard some inner voice telling him that the Evil One was only a servant, or something.

I can deal with a clueless party. I'm more annoyed by a party who's informed status is inconsistent. Especially when it causes another damned Marche situation.

So yeah, I've been playing this lately. Just beat the Templar. Not a bad game, though I'm less than impressed with the writing. I hate the way all the characters seem to be mostly made out of cardboard.

Not to mention my biggest annoyance: the refusal of every single "villain" to explain what the fuck is going on. I mean, it's pretty obvious by now that I'll soon be running into some kind of plot twist, probably involving time travel or something, and it will turn out that I've been destroying the world somehow. The "villains" obviously know this, tried to prevent it, but none of them ever took a minute to properly explain themselves. Not even the Templar to his own daughter, as an alternative to outright attempting to kill her.

I swear, once the plot twist comes running, and it turns out the whole thing could have been prevented with a little more open communication between the sides of the conflict, I am so going to throw this game against a wall.

Rest of the game is cool, though. Nice battle system, fun class-and-levelling. Bosses tend to pull incredibly annoying tactics out of their ass, though. Fuck you, Chaugmar, fuck you Qada, and fuck you, Profiteur.

Chaugmar is so much easier if you get the Salve-Maker asterisk before fighting him. Attack items ignore his barrier.

Yeah, the first half of this game is probably the second-biggest example of nobody explaining important things that I've seen in a game.

Yeah, when the daughter of the country's leader doesn't even know the basics of his plan, you have a problem. How hard would it have been to say "We had to deal with a corrupt church for centuries, so we overthrew them and are trying to find a way to fix this problem without them. We aren't the cause of the crystals darkening. Oh, and is there someone who's pushing you to overcharge the crystals? Because that's the cause of the problem, so that person is probably evil."

You left out this part " Oh and one of your friends is likely an alternate universe version of another of your friends, with amnesia and suspiciously similar journal"

Granted I don't expect most of them to be suspicious of that similarity but you'd think Altenis would have wnated to investigate an Identical Stranger hanging around with his Childhood Friend and stepsister

What's the first then?

edited 23rd Jun '14 1:55:20 PM by MorningStar1337

Given that Alternis is like her brother, you'd think Edea would recognize him.

The alternative (ha!) is that he walks around in his helmet the whole time.

edited 23rd Jun '14 2:08:19 PM by asterism

He likes the armor that much.

Arc Rise Fantasia.

Not to spoiler things too badly, but basically: One of the major antagonists for much of the game learns the Dark Secrets behind the setting, magic, and gods, and starts periodically attacking you for the stuff you're doing, which, according to all the info you have, is still the course of action that will save the world.

Not only does he not tell you why he's doing what he's doing, he refuses to clarify himself that one time the party asks, and then starts attacking you for stuff you wouldn't be doing if he took 30 minutes to explain what he's learned!

edited 23rd Jun '14 3:05:48 PM by Enlong

Poor Communication Kills.

Also, I just realized: Eternia is a cold place with amazing health care. They're essentially Canada.

There's literally nothing to suggest that the four main characters would be able to stop it either. Assuming what you say is true, the heroes arbitrarily decided that they were the last best hope for mankind with no basis whatsoever. So, your entire argument defeats itself. Which was my point. And that's the generous interpretation of the plot.

edited 1st Jul '14 8:32:31 AM by Clarste

I applaud attempts to figure out an in-universe explanation of the start of the final chapter. I really do. But I fear it's doomed to failure. I've thought about it a lot, and I can't think of an explanation that is logically consistent with itself, and doesn't directly contradict previous scenes.

If the team was genuinely surprised by the twist, that contradicts much of chapter 6, as well as the dialogue going in to the holy pillar, about discovering their true foe, and waiting out the countdown.

If the team knew, but was in denial, that also contradicts the holy pillar scene, and makes their genuine-sounding shock make no sense.

If the team knew, and was playing along to expose their enemy, that contradicts their genuine surprise and the skits just before the reveal.

Fooled, villainous, smart... None of these inerpretations make sense. I can come to only one conclusion. The writers made a "shocking reveal" scene without consideration for the plot that came before. Much as it pains me to admit it, this is a gaping, irreconcilable plot hole. The story can't be logically consistent without throwing some of those scenes out in favor of ones that make sense with the others.

edited 1st Jul '14 8:48:45 AM by Enlong

I think that's the most likely explanation, yes. Mostly it just bugs me, a lot, that millions and millions of people died during the finale yet it's still treated as a happy ending compared to the other one where no one dies but the villain is stopped for "only" 50,000 years, which is several times longer than the entirety of recorded human history.

I think their basis was more of personal guilt (sort of a My God, What Have I Done? moment) and said guilt may have impeded their judgement.

Buy if this is your most generous interpretation, then I actually want to hear your most "selfish" (as in not so generous, not actually selfish) interpitation.

edited 1st Jul '14 9:11:58 AM by MorningStar1337

They're really really stupid.

edited 1st Jul '14 9:16:02 AM by Clarste

Can I just point out that The Jackal and Praline make an adorable couple?

Also, why didn't Alternis himself Recognize, y'know, HIS OWN FACE?

Alternis never actually met Ringabel until the reveal. Plot conspired to keep him in another room or whatever every single time the party was confronted. For the actual battle itself I would assume Alternis was distracted by his emotional turmoil.

edited 1st Jul '14 9:46:36 AM by Clarste

What gets me is that they could have easily made the story consistent. First, lose the utter shock at the reveal. Have the characters ready to fight, because by this point, nothing else in the game is even trying to pretend that you don't know the twist.

Second, give a reason why they're following along. The holy pillar scene is a start, but it requires that the party has info from the short ending. I can actually see three ways that could be explained.

1: Agnés hears a voice for her pendant, during the last crystal charging, who says something to the effect of "the Evil One is a servant of a greater evil."

2: Tiz hears a voice from within that names Urouboros, and tells him that the Evil One's master would yet live

3: Ringabel discovers new passages in his journal, detailing the short ending and his own doubts that their quest is truly over.

Sorry, Edea, but you don't have anything to act as a source of outside info.

Really it's not like it's hard to keep things connected, which is why the plot hole bugs me so much.

Edit

Alternis has never taken his helmet off, in years. He doesn't recognize his own face because it's been so long.

edited 1st Jul '14 9:52:06 AM by Enlong

Much like with Darth Vader, it's impossible to see out of his helmet.

You know... I have to wonder how Off the Rails the plot would have been had Edea actually been told ANY of her father's plan.

Or if, Y'know, her Dad had bothered to explain anything to anyone.

Braev nothing. How about Yulyana? That "bring your trusted companion" thing oils have been done two worlds ago, man.

You know, though, it WOULD have been interesting to actually see how it would have Turned out if Edea had Been able to out Airy's machinations in the beginning. Or at least be distrustful of the little gnat.

The heroes were really lucky that their counterparts were already dead in the last worlds since otherwise Airy would have just killed them at the Pillar and started tricking the new heroes. The gang stands no chance to Airy before getting better equipment and experience in the other worlds. Airy needs them to live for her plan to work.

edited 1st Jul '14 10:02:43 AM by LordofLore

I always thought that the reason Airy didn't attack them was because Ringabel/Alternis was there. From what I gathered, the earlier worlds only had Agnes, Tiz and Edea awakening the crytsals

Anyway, I always thought the idea of the heroes needing to beat Ouroborus because they'd screw things up for the next generation was silly. After beating Airy in the false ending, the Great Chasms close up again and the Great Chasms were the only things linking the worlds, so it was back to square one. Although De Rosso and Yulyana might not like having to wait 1,100,000,000 years for the next chance to finish Ouroboros off

PS Why are we on spoilers again?

edited 1st Jul '14 12:45:21 PM by Skullman

On the one hand, I'm still in Chapter 5, but on the other, I haven't touched the game in about a month. Leaving a game unfinished is something that's become a lot more common for me as I get older, but would it still be worth it to try to finish this story?

edited 1st Jul '14 4:28:10 PM by Lightblade