Hearthstone: Heroes of Warcraft

The thing is that few decks really want to go into Fatigue these days, not even C'Thun Warrior in the mirror (never played it, but my understanding is that you want to cycle, dump C'Thun once you have Sylvanas+Shield Slam to steal it back if it gets stolen, then Brann+Doomcaller to get two copies once it dies). Is diluting your deck really worth it?

edited 1st Aug '16 6:09:13 AM by Pyrite

Not a substitute for a formal medical consultation.

Eh. I get a lot of fatigue wins with Control Priest — in fact, Control Warrior is one of my most favorable matches for that very reason — that plus the ridiculously high value of Thoughtsteal and Shifting Shade against such decks. I'd hate to see that go away.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

True, but it's a really specific matchup you're teching against in returning for lowering your consistency against faster decks. Still, I'm not closing the book on this card (or anything else except maybe Moroes) yet - not until it's been tested.

edited 1st Aug '16 6:29:36 AM by Pyrite

Not a substitute for a formal medical consultation.

Interesting card, I wonder if it's ends up being better in decks that draw a lot rather than control decks because it does decrease the chance of getting the specific control answers you might need (such as execute etc.)

Anyway I do hope the cards get the same voice actor from Wo W Karazhan, he had a great voice in that game.

It is definitely a great card for Arena at the very least.

It's probably not quite as overwhelmingly amazing as I first thought, but it could very well have a draw-based deck all on its own.

The problem that I have with this card however is that it introduces us to a whole new dimension of RNG, something that's already widely prevalent in this game.

edited 1st Aug '16 6:55:02 AM by FergardStratoavis

Big Grah

As a fatigue player something definitely is happening in my pants. This makes my Standard version of Fatigue Mage so much less mediocre. Now I can have a terrible 35 card deck instead of only 31 cards (with Elise). Drawing a random legendary is a downside for a deck designed to counter every single card your opponent might play, because it goes against the win condition of the deck. Similarly I very rarely play Golden Monkey.

Really cool and exciting card for actual decks, too, I guess.

Honestly, Prince Malchezaar looks like a solidly neat addition to Control and Fatigue lists (bless your soul if you can make those work in the first fucking place) but hardly overwhelming. Like, setting aside the fact that it dilutes your deck with more cards, it dilutes your deck with random cards. And while the best Legendaries in the game are obviously incredibly overpowered (hence why they consistently see play in the first place)... Most of them suck.

Like, even setting aside atrocities like Nat, the Darkfisher (even in Mill this poor bastard struggles to find a place or a point) or The goddamn Boogeymonster, there is a big majority of Legendaries no one would ever put into a competitive deck just simply for lack of room or synergy. The likelihood that the cards produced by Malchezaar are going to be of bad or "not-good-enough" quality is much higher than getting one of the typically-seen OP-as-hell Legendaries... Especially because Malchezaar obeys deckbuilding rules, and will not duplicate Legendaries already in your deck.

I think it's important to compare Malchezaar to the closest comparison he has already in the game: Elise Starseeker. She requires far more investment for her overall effect to proc (You must draw her, play her, draw the Map, play the Map, draw the Monkey, play the Monkey, and then still have cards in hand and deck to convert into Legendaries), and she adds fewer total cards to the deck for fatigue purposes... But her effect is far stronger, and, provided the player can draw her, her effect only goes off when the player chooses.

That last aspect is really important. For Control play (I.E., the only real time anyone would want to tactically use Elise or Malchezaar), you basically want to get those random Legendaries when everything else in your hand and deck no longer answers the situations you're coming against. Using the Monkey to transform weak or dead cards into potentially useful ones is immensely more strong than simply having a normal chance of normally drawing something that you didn't put in your deck at any point in the game.

So yeah, in constructed, not even getting into all the problems that Control has with even keeping up against the refined Aggro/Zoo bullshit, I am not seeing Malchezaar breaking anything. But he is cool! My only wonder now is if he adds his cards into your deck before or after the mulligan phase. I assume after.

edited 1st Aug '16 8:27:48 AM by RegisteredUser

Somebody on r/competitiveHS suggested running it in Discard Zoolock, which is a pretty interesting idea - say what you will about Legendaries, but the average Legendary is probably going to beat the average Zoolock topdeck when you start tapping (especially when your curve tops out at 5 mana), so why not?

edited 1st Aug '16 8:50:19 AM by Pyrite

Not a substitute for a formal medical consultation.

"You face not Malchezzar alone, but the legions I command!"

So i take the final boss of the adventure has not been revealed yet? Any speculation regarding it?

Or will we have a dance-off with Funky Medivh?

edited 1st Aug '16 9:42:41 AM by fasoman1996

Uni cat

According to the descriptions of the wings, the last revealed one ends in a fight with Shade of Aran, but that isn't the final "wing" of the original raid, so I imagine that Malchezzar is in there somewhere.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

Malchezzar was the original Final Boss of Kharazan, right? Why wouldn't he reprive his role?

Particularly if they give him some semblance of a character this time.

edited 1st Aug '16 10:22:16 AM by FergardStratoavis

Big Grah

Malchezzar was at the top of the tower, but Karazhan was sort of nonlinear. When my guild was clearing it, we considered Nightbane the final boss.

From what information I can gather, Prince Malchezaar is the boss and reward for the first, free Prologue wing of the adventure. (Which is a great idea, because giving new players this kind of thing to toy around with is a fantastic incentive. Good on you, Blizzard, you're not complete fuck-ups!)

I guess Blizzard is also doubling down on (from what I've heard about the raid, not having ever really played WoW myself) that Malchezaar was, like, the least interesting part of Karazhan by getting him out of the way out of the gate. :P

The least interesting part of the Karazhan was the basement full of animals that had a random animal boss that didn't even drop epic loot. Luckily it was entirely optional so everyone skipped it.

Hearthpwn has a new card out.

Kara Kazham! - 5 mana Warlock Common spell - summon a 1/1 Candle, a 2/2 Broom and a 3/3 Teapot.

No info on what these three do, assuming they do something.

edited 1st Aug '16 11:02:49 AM by FergardStratoavis

Big Grah

That's not inherently bad, I mean, it's pretty similar to existing cards like muster for battle and forbidden ritual which see plenty of play. My concern though is that it's highly antisynergistic with warrior's gimmick of doing 1 damage to everything on the board, and as such I can't see it being played much. It'd be way more viable in some other class, particularly paladin, druid or warlock.

If that really is 'at the start of the game', holy shit.

Hard to say whether it's really much good, though. It's obviously a control card in the sense that you'll tend to get high-mana minions and protection against fatigue, and aggro decks won't run it because they don't want to dilute their decks with expensive cards. However, it also dilutes whatever removal spells you're running in your control deck (although maybe you'd just swap out some minions for removal spells to account for this). In a C'thun deck it has a chance of giving you extra C'thuns, but C'thun decks also want to avoid diluting their deck in case they take longer to draw C'thun, and given the number of legendaries in the game it sounds like this would be the dominant effect (especially if the five legendaries can be from any class, which is presumably the case). In any event, you always run the risk of getting shit legendaries, and for that reason I'm a bit skeptical this'll see much play outside of dedicated fatigue decks.

Also, if he shuffles a copy of himself into the deck, do you then get five more legendaries? o.O

Join my forum game!

It won't give you copies of Legendaries you already have in your deck, per deckbuilding rules. This extends to Prince himself, I imagine.

Big Grah

Malchezzar cannot violate deck-building rules, meaning he can't give you a Legendary minion that is from a different class or that is already in your deck, which would include himself.

Edited to add: Malchezzar also only triggers his effect if he's in your deck at the beginning of the game. He does nothing if added to your deck later, such as from steals, Discover, Golden Monkey, etc.

edited 1st Aug '16 11:38:59 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

Malchezzar follows deckbuilding rules, meaning no duplicates (and probably only legendaries from your own class). Which at least makes him compatible with Reno decks, I guess.

@ Kara Kazam: Even if it doesn't do anything, that is still 6/6 for 5 mana spreading through 3 body. I imagine this would be insane in arena.

I mean, Silver Hand Knight does the same, but with two bodies. SHK is a pretty good Arena pick, so yeah.

Now consider that Force of Nature does almost the same and is an Epic.

Big Grah

Aren't those minions in the boss video Toast posted?

I find it weird that it's a Warlock card but then again, it kinda fits the zoo theme.

Do zoo run a 5 drop that isn't Doomguard or Leeroy? Because unless they have Darkshire Councilman on board, i don't see the card being used that often.

But it's a fantastic card for arena

Uni cat

Cool, that this expansion features a crossover with Beauty and the Beast.