Catalan Independence

They win in seats, not in votes.

In votes, unionists win. 52% unionists, 48% separatists (so far).

If this were a referendum, unionists would win.

Will it matter in practice?

As an aside, it's mathematically provable that no election system is perfect. But this is beside the point in a binary proposal.

If nothing else they've a strong mandate for holding a specific referendum and telling Madrid to get bent.

edited 27th Sep '15 1:12:44 PM by Silasw

It matters because it proves that the majority of Catalans (or the ones who bothered to vote, at least) aren't separatist, no matter what separatists say.

Also, compared to the last election, separatist parties have lost seats. In 2012, the separatists had 74 seats, in 2015 they look like they're going to have 72.

edited 27th Sep '15 1:13:37 PM by WackyPancake

Sounds like it's going to be the Scottish Referendum, Catalan-style...

edited 27th Sep '15 1:14:24 PM by Greenmantle

A very close win for the unionists, but one that still changes the political landscape durably?

* Shrugs *

Not impossible.

No, it doesn't really change anything at all. With these results, Catalonia will stay in Spain and separatists will keep loudly demanding independence, as always.

All it has done is evidence that there is a serious and incredibly worrying divide in Catalan society, and sooner or later it'll blow up in some way.

Madrid should respect the spirit of democracy and self-determination and allow a proper referendum to be hold, the chances are that there won't be a majority for Catalan Independence.

They need to go back to anarchism. Should work out fine with no Franco in the picture.

Sarcasm?

While Scotland stayed in the UK, the referendum changed the parameters of political discourse and caused tangible changes both in voter habits (voters who had voted yes for independence felt cognitive dissonance at voting for unionist parties, so a lot of votes moved to the SNP) and relationships between Scoltand and the UK: concessions were made, laws were passed.

Changed happened there, and it stands to reason that they will also happen here.

edited 27th Sep '15 3:18:24 PM by TheHandle

We'll have to see.

Speaking as a Spaniard, I believe few things, if any, will change.

Court move deepens Spanish standoff over Catalan secession

And that's the WAAAAY the news goes!

edited 12th Nov '15 3:20:23 AM by TheHandle

"...Do away with democracy. I will not allow it"

Hilarious.

Yes, he's so committed to democracy for sure.

Why is the demonym 'Catalan'? Shouldn't it be 'Catalonian'?

Demonyms make no sense.

It's sad to see that the unity of a country is determinated by its economy (and even then).

Maybe I'm ignorant, but wasn't Spain more tolerant about the regional identities unlike England with the welsh or France with the bretons and occitans? Or it only lasted through the Habsburg period?

More tolerant then we were with the Welsh isn't a high bar, that's like saying more tolerant then the Turks are with the Kurds.

Plus we've improved, we let the Scots have a referendum.

I think that can partly blamed on the War of the Spanish Succession where Castile and Aragon fought on different sides. From what I remember, the Bourbons further centralised Spain post-war.

And then there was Franco.

In the case of a fair vote on this issue, does Madrid have a prayer at keeping Spain together? Catalonia looks far more likely to break off than its closest analogues (Scotland and Quebec).

I doubt it has much of a chance to get separated, really. Last I read, even interviews and all said the majority of the people in the region would not bei nterested in seceding.

Yeah, well, that would have been properly known if they'd had a proper referendum. That's the trouble when you mess with democracy; you create some nasty two-way streets by antecedent.

Rajoy's rhetoric definitely doesn't help matters. There has been so much fearmongering in his latest speeches on the matter I'm surprised he didn't said something to the tune of 'the end of Spain'.

Also, he's trying to get the PSOE (led by Pedro Sánchez) - the Spanish centre-left party - on his side in regards to this matter. Considering the long-standing rivalry between Rajoy's party and PSOE, that speaks volumes.

Well, at least they can attempt to put aside political differences in the face of a major problem.

edited 13th Nov '15 5:35:54 AM by raziel365