Dota 2

Oracle is completely broken in his current state and probably won't be ported to DOTA 2 until after some nerfs. Arc Warden might face the same fate. Spark Wraith is huge lane harassment, and that's not even getting into how RIDICULOUS his ult is. Double Midas so he can farm a lot faster. And double Necro Book is insane. He could even go double Dagon and have a nuking party. Divine Rapier is actually a legit item to buy on him, because you can just have the real one sit in base while the copy is out there wreaking havoc. I expect Pit Lord to get hit with a nerf too. His ult makes Io's kind of redundant. Teammate getting ganked? No problem, summon your whole team to that spot to help him out!

Sven, mechanically, is a very simple hero executed very well. He's also one of the only two heroes that have a built-in Cleave mechanic (Kunkka being the other). Ain't no feeling quite like right clicking everyone to death in one click.

I suppose that's part of the reason he's popular. He's very simple to play, but playing him well takes quite a bit of skill. He's also got a pretty cool vibe and interesting lore, or at least I think so.

edited 12th Sep '14 9:57:16 PM by MetaSkipper

Sounds like WW is the only halfway balanced hero among them, unless you just forgot her. Dota abilities can get so over-the-top that it can be difficult to tell if one's unbalanced simply by looking at its stats and abilities.

I didn't realize that only two heroes have passive Cleave. I coulda sworn it was more common, but maybe I confused it with some active abilities.

I don't know if WW is balanced or not. I can't really tell. But her ultimate does sound pretty crazy. It can make the enemy team attack one of their own team members in a small radius. Now that SOUNDS a bit crazy, but looking at the range numbers, it's hard to pull off. The team would have to be huddled together, which higher skilled players are trained not to do in certain situations.

A bunch of DOTA abilities may look like they're OP on paper, but when you put them into a match's context, they sound a lot less ridiculous.

Yeah, there's a reason why Arc Warden is an agility hero with pitiful agility. He would be even more broken if he wasn't. Similar reasons why Ursa is an agility hero and not a strength hero, why Io is a strength hero and not an intelligence hero, why Venomancer is an agility hero and not an intelligence hero and why Nyx Assassin is an agility hero and not an intelligence hero.

My very late response:

• First of all, let me phrase something out. I like Sven. He's pretty much my favorite hero since the old days of the original DOTA and in the Valve version he's even more awesome IMO. So I don't HATE anything about him.
• What I refer on the change of Sven was this: Back in the old DOTA, his profile was more like a straightforward hero to save the ones in need, in spite of his half-breed status (he was half-Night Elf). But then, in the Valve version, he became something more of a Knight in Sour Armor and Anti-Hero, he slaughtered the Vigil Knights that taught him his codes of knighthood and how to fight, and desecrated their grounds because of a slight they committed against personal honor (being a half-Meranth). This would go against his depiction as a good knight according to his old lore. But... I accepted it and still consider Sven a chivalric person, with how Dota 2's world seems to be even more messy in alignment, I'm always open for a chance that the Vigil Knights might be a little corrupt that Sven's wrath might be justified. But bottom line, despite these changes, I still like Sven.
  • Now when compared to the Lore forum goers of Lo L, they ARE going to be super angry at even this change of things, like how they have been complaining in 2 years (especially when it comes to some retcons). In the DOTA community, backstories may get retcons, but people are still coolio about the lores. I mean, I'm sure none of you are bothered with Sven's Darker and Edgier turn in his backstory, right? (If Centaur's new more bloodthirsty personality doesn't bother you, this one won't even dent you, I'm sure)
• Sven builds: Hmmm... I thought it was pretty unorthodox for Sven to use Force Staff, but I may think about it, maybe as an alternative for Blink Dagger. I usually skip BKB if I'm too way ahead.
  • That leads to another question though: Force Staff or Blink Dagger for the tool to close gaps for Sven? My thoughts: Force Staff covers less range, but you can use that in the midst of being beaten to crap. Blink Dagger covers more range but you can't use it in the midst of being beaten to crap. In terms of Sven, he always appreciates the extra mana, and not to mention that Force Staff can be crafted so he doesn't have to play way too careful and non-aggressive to gather up 2150 Gold at once. Still, what do you think?

And speaking of that, I think I'm trying out to play Luna. The problem is...

I think I suck at using her when compared to other carries like Drow or Sniper. Unlike those (or standard Lo L ADC), Luna's attack range without her W is kind of low.

My questions:

• The Dotafire site say that you shouldn't level her W until you maxed out Q and then E first. Is that a legit statement?
• It also states that her cores are Helm of Dominator, Manta Style and BKB. Which takes priority on those 3? Situations are considered here.
• Why Helm of Dominator instead of Mask of Madness? Was it because "Unlike some, Luna is very squishy (unlike Sven) and has no way to disable very long (unlike Faceless Void)"
• Do you suppose Luna is a carry that depends on ability or her normal attacks?
• What's the best time to use her Ult? Team fights? Because when I do that, it's like putting "KICK ME" label on my ass, and then I usually end up failing to kill anyone (they always find a time to be with creeps). Or is it if I find a lone hero meeting me and he couldn't disable me?
• Should we consider Force Staff/Blink Dagger on Luna or just use Shadow Blade in order to get in position quick?

Many thanks for answers.

edited 13th Sep '14 3:59:17 AM by ChrisX

• I never played the original Dot A, so there never was a "lore change" for me. There's less of a good-and-evil theme in the game now, which I think contributes to that change.
• More often than not, if you want a mobility item, it's because you want chase or initiation for you. Blink Dagger is the superior mobility item, since you can initiate from further away and don't need to be facing the right way. Supports tend to get Force Staff because it has more utility.

On Luna:

• As a general rule, you want to delay leveling Moon Glaive early on, since the extra bounces will push the lane, making it ultimately harder for you to farm. As for maxing it out last, I might not go that far. Depends on how the match is going (and what in-game guide I'm following).
• Helm of the Dominator is mostly a farming item. Dominate a creep, which is then used to stack the Ancient Camp without you needing to be standing by the Ancient Camp. Later, you go in with Moon Glaives, and farm out the stack. It's not really used for the stats, although it does build into Satanic later. Get this first if you know what you're doing; otherwise, don't get it at all. I usually don't.
• Manta Style offers more safe push by just sending illusions down to towers. The illusions also benefit from Moon Glaives. I'd probably get this second or third, since I don't like dying.
• Black King Bar is your standard carry item, to prevent getting disabled, status-ed, or nuked. Get this first or second, depending on your preferences.
• Every hard carry kills stuff by right clicking. Every hard carry wins games by proper ability use.
• Use Eclipse primarily in teamfights; most shouldn't be around creeps. One on one, you should be able to simply damage someone down between right-clicks and Lucent Beam.
• Blink Dagger has use on every hero; Force Staff less so. That said, remember Luna has the fastest base speed of any hero, you usually don't need extra mobility to catch most people.

A useful guide. I usually like the guides made by this guy.

edited 13th Sep '14 5:40:13 AM by MetaSkipper

Well, the problem is when do I start activating Ult in team fights. Was it before I enter or after I'm already positioning myself in the middle of the enemy? Sometimes I just get myself killed off while positioning myself.

edited 13th Sep '14 5:53:44 AM by ChrisX

Ult right as the team fight starts, or roughly when the first enemy comes into range. Don't worry too much about positioning; you should stay in range as you chase them down. You usually want to stay somewhere in the back as Luna anyway, getting into the center is usually the wrong choice.

edited 13th Sep '14 6:17:53 AM by MetaSkipper

About the lore changes from Dot A to Dota 2.

Some are basically existing Warcraft characters.

So yeah, there's a good reason why Dota 2 has nothing to do with Dot A lore wise, save for the occasional nods and references.

No. In most situations you can leave 2 points into her E, then start leveling up the W after maxing out the Q. This lets you farm the jungle a lot easier during the laning phase. You want to make sure the E is the thing that's leveled up first so you can last hit easier. But you don't need more than 2 points into it for the laning phase.

Yep. Some of the name changes happened for that reason too. It's also why Skeleton King turned into Wraith King. Valve has a deal with Blizzard thanks to what Riot tried to pull when DOTA 2 started becoming a thing.

Its also why Lina Inverse is only named Lina in DOTA 2, bercause otherwise there'd be a few anime and manga companies lining up to sue.

Oh yeah, Broodmother and Nyx-I mean Nerubian Assassin are lovers in Dot A. Terrorblade and Anti-Mage was brothers, and Furion was their father.

Dot A has the deepest lore.

edited 13th Sep '14 9:32:51 AM by Eldrake

It's a shame they threw out the connection between Terrorblade and Anti-Mage. Now Terrorblade's lore is pretty generic - he was such a badass demon that they sent him to the hell of hells and then he mastered his own reflected worst self and broke out.

1. One of the matches I've had today was 48-4, to the other team's advantage. I kid you not. It was a bad day overall for me; I got into about half a dozen matches and they were all huge losses or safe-to-leave (not sure if there's another term for it). My best game was with Lina - even if I still can't figure out how to reliably land her Light Strike Array - but that was a 3v5 (in our favor) that I left partway through.

2. If there's one thing (well, I suppose two things) I'd like Valve to add to the game, it's tutorials on rune control and creep stacking/pulling. To me, they are by far the most esoteric part of Dota 2, but the tuorial doesn't even hint that doing them is possible. It seems a lot of MOBAs neglect to mention important aspects of the games, though Dota 2 seems better than most in that regard.

edited 17th Sep '14 10:08:05 PM by doctrainAUM

Safe-to-leave is the proper term, if there is a "proper term" for matches where someone has abandoned.

The most reliable way to land Light Strike Array is after another stun. It works best while stun stacking.

Rune control is less a mechanic and more good warding, map awareness, and a wee bit of luck.

Stacking and pulling aren't hard, really. It's matter of learning how to do them in the right circumstances and doing them without sacrificing awareness or presence that's the challenge. As a general rule, you'll either be stacking and pulling because you're a support (with a whole lot of other duties) or stacking remotely as a carry (with a whole lot of other duties). If you're good enough to need to worry about stacking and pulling, you'll be put into a situation where you need to. And then you will learn.

About Light Strike Array: If there's a Shadow Demon on your team, try and convince them to be your roaming buddy, because Disruption + Light Strike Array = Easiest gank of your life. Just keep disruption's duration in mind.

edited 18th Sep '14 4:24:25 AM by Eldrake

After being terrorized by Bloodseeker in several matches (I wonder if there's a console command so that double-selecting your TP Scroll sends you to the fountain), it felt really good to pick Night Stalker and constantly kill him as if he were nothing. It was the first time I tried roaming and ganking and I don't think I could've picked a better hero to practice that with. I never used Stalker's W because I forgot it could silence enemies, but I won't make that mistake again.

Brewmaster has some micromanagement that's easy and safe to use, but only for his ultimate, so I don't know if I would consider him a good hero to start practicing micromanagement with. Some time soon, I'm going to practice jungling with Axe, who's simple to use and durable enough to actually take some hits.

edited 19th Sep '14 4:34:20 PM by doctrainAUM

If you enable double-tap self-cast in the options you can double-tap the TP scroll to send you back to the fountain directly.

The last time I tried double-tapping the TP Scroll, it sent me to my closest tower, rather than the fountain. I'll check to see if changed the options makes any difference.

I gotta admit, these days I seem to find a lot of pub-goers using Tinker and Phantom Assassin, more than they do Sniper, Riki or other Skill Gate Characters. And especially, Tinker LOVES rushing Boots of Travel. And Tinker usually gets annoying when he just bum rush and burst me down before I get my BKB. Meanwhile, Phantom Assassin seems to like sticking with the target and have every of the normal attacks get blurred out.

Any tips on how to stave those guys in pub?

Ganking Tinker usually works. He can't escape from a well-coordinated gank.

TP Scrolls seem to get less useful as the game goes on. Late-game, it feels like a waste to carry two, since the fountain i the only remaining place worth teleporting to, though I suppose I still need them to quickly respond to attacks on the inner towers.

Would it be possible to pick a hero with a ranged stun and then nuke her with highly damaging spells? I assume that if it's hard to get a BKB, an MKB would be even harder to build towards.

edited 19th Sep '14 9:40:02 PM by doctrainAUM

About PA: Early game you can just nuke her. All hexes (like scythe or lion hex) disable evasion (It also disables bristleback, in case you wondered. Doom works well. BKB cuts her damage, because she can't blinkstrike+dagger. lategame the carry should always get a mkb.

About tinker. If he's good, you probably can only get storm and be more fed then him. Maybe enigma with blinkt+some damage dealer. Or batrider.

Btw, I just love this video and especially the epic game it's covering in the first part: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFPRYRXzp44&list=PLgqxP-AQTfYYhdZyODsb06zJwa8IKxlqu&index=2

edited 20th Sep '14 2:20:12 AM by Uchuujinsan

Well that would depend on the heroes you chose that have disables. It seems that you speak as if "Pick counterpicks". But in places like pubs, I think it was rather hard to guess who comes to what lane to guess. The DOTA meta is a little harder to guess. May as well ask then...

In LOL, I can pretty much guess which hero goes where, and it'll more likely to be correct. Fighters/Tanks go top, Marksmen go bottom with support, Mages/Assassins go center, and leave someone with ganking potentials to be in the jungle. In DOTA, it's hard to guess who goes to which lane and since solo jungling is only possible with very few heroes, more likely it's going to be solo mid, along with two duo lanes (or one solo lane if someone picked Techies). My problem is that I cannot guess who would go where, usually. A little help here? It may help me decide which lanes I can reserve depending on the hero I pick. I mean, best I can come up with is that "If I pick someone like Crystal Maiden on mid, they're going to laugh at me."

Also another thing: Dragon Knight. Once you get his Ult, do you activate it everytime you encounter an enemy or you get close to them first and stun them first before you turn into a dragon?

edited 20th Sep '14 6:30:30 AM by ChrisX