Cyberpunk 2077

Plus CDPR is also not King. They're too smart to try and trademark the word "Saga" because an Oregon Trail-inspired game about Vikings could be confused with a fucking Bejeweled ripoff.

Copyright also depends on the enforcement too. They might have a copyright on that title, but they might not enforce the copyright of it unless it directly is in reference to their game and anything else that's just genre based would be irrelevant to the issue.

Not a copyright, a trademark. They aren't copyrighting cyberpunk as a genre, they're just trademarking Cyberpunk as the title of their work. Important distinction.

Unsung: No you don't have to be zealous to protect a trademark that is frankly a bogus justification put out by those who frequently abuse it and have the lawyers and money to pay for the court fees and legal fees. That is what is causing the problem in the first place. You can protect specific trade marks without being zealous or aggressive.

In the case of Games Workshop Spots the Space Marine: Defense of the Fiddler was what got yanked. The chances of confusing that for WH 40k is pretty damn slim especially given the variety of differentiating items that clearly indicate something as part of the WH 40K setting. Bethesda did the same with Scrolls made by Majong. Again it would have been next to impossible to confuse. Neither company had any real reason to pursue the trademark as neither example was ever a credible concern or risk to either.

What is also notable is the justification often given sounds exactly the same as the one CD Projekt Red has stated. CDPR is not exactly small fish these days and could easily punch down without too much effort on others. There are no real rules or protections in place to stop that from happening short of going to court which costs quite a bit of money and invariably hurts those who don't have the money and or lawyers to protect themselves.

There are several works that have Cyber Punk as part of their title. The way trademark law works it is painfully easy for a trade mark holder to state that said products could cause confusion with their own products. There is literally no real protection to stop that from happening.

Mark: That is nice and all but nothing stops them from doing it later. This is a company not a collection of saints.

Looks folks this is real simple to understand. This is a real concern backed up by repeated and notable problems with trademark holders. This isn't a false controversy but a real one with real concerns and very visible history to back it up.

While the previous trademark holder apparently didn't really care to do anything about others using Cyberpunk they are not the ones holding the trademark now. Now we may be lucky in that CDPR so far seems to be better behaved then their competitors so far.

If they start abusing their position, I'll agree with you. Until they do, you're overreacting.

This is the way the law works. It's far from perfect, but there needs to be some way for companies to protect their brand identity or you'll get more nuisance lawsuits, not less.

Games Workshop was wrong to go after Spots, but that's what legal departments do. It sucks, and somebody ought to have called them off, but you don't get the good part of corporations (money and resources) without the bad (greed and mindless bureaucratic indifference).

There's certainly a better way, but if you want the law to change, getting mad at a labour-of-love company like CD Projekt is probably not the best use of your time or effort. Gut reaction? This is overblown. CDPR isn't about to abuse their trademark, not if it means braving the PR shitstorm that even having the trademark (which is boilerplate business procedure) has already unleashed. And there probably weren't many people out there about to name their games Cyberpunk: The Hackening or whatever anyway, so the point is likely moot.

Plus this is a game called Cyberpunk. We live in the year 2017. Are we really that surprised this is how business is done?

Unsung: First don't put words or stances in my mouth or in my posts that I have not stated. It is both dishonest and rude. Pointing out that people who are concerned about the trade mark have a very legitimate and rational reason given the repeated history of trademark abuse is not overreacting. Pointing out that CD Projekt Red can easily abuse it with nothing to stop them is not over reacting. Pointing out that trade mark covers other products that could be at risk should CDPR get a wild hair is not over reacting. I can't help but notice you completely ignored the part where I give some benefit of the doubt due to the behavior of the company so far which is also not over reacting. Seeing a theme here? Show me where I am calling for them to be pilloried, have their trade mark stripped, or actually railing against them beyond stating reasonable skepticism. I have simply stated facts and information based on events that have happened and continue to happen in relation to trade mark which fully justifies the concern of those upset with the trademark. Nothing I have stated, demonstrated, or shared is an over reaction.

Yes I am aware of the irony of the trademark which is why I commented on that very fact earlier.

edited 10th Apr '17 7:42:06 PM by TuefelHundenIV

nvm

edited 10th Apr '17 7:47:22 PM by Ghilz

I don't see how I was putting words in your mouth, but okay. If you don't feel a certain way, if you personally are not overreacting, fine, but plenty of people are, and I don't think the situation is helped by assuming the worst based on the fairly innocuous move of trademarking your game's title.

edited 10th Apr '17 7:49:41 PM by Unsung

Kinda sad that this topic is what got some activity in this forum, not any actual news related to the games development.

I hope CDPR reveal something soon.

edited 10th Apr '17 7:50:52 PM by slimcoder

I should point out that the term cyberpunk is (and has been) already trademarked under multiple areas.

See here

So not sure what CPR's decision to trademark it under a different type of good and service is such a shocker. It's been owned under C 028. US 022 023 038 050. G & S by Talsorian games since 89

Unsung: Lets call this topic done for the time being then.

Have we had any recent news on what they are doing with the game lately? Last I saw was possibly shifting some people from Witcher 3 over and that was it.

Only two new things so far.

Supposedly they are pretty far along in development but are not looking to release anytime soon. The general window is 2017 to 2021 and they say they won't be sharing a lot more until they are ready to show something off. Also Witcher 3 has sold quite a few copies.

They are also supposedly tinkering with new techniques in Mo-Cap and "making living cities" whatever that means.

And there have been a spate of hirings for gameplay, AI and graphics designers specifically to work on the project - not sure if that's a good sign or a bad one (I.E - early development still, or late hirings to polish already completed assets?)

Didn't they say they wanted to show something later this year?

In one of t hose articles I am fairly certain they said this may be one of their biggest project teams yet something like 700 plus employees for the project.

For those that missed it. Some smuck claims to have some old files from the project and tried to ransom them.

CD Project Red of course shrugged and said they weren't going to bother cooperating with them. Official Response on Twitter here.

I like the response. Basically "Yeah, and?"

Reminds me of the half life 2 leak - but that was overenthusiastic fans. This is just malice.

Pretty much. If their response is accurate they have dated information that likely is no longer relevant and I noticed the overt mention of legal force being an option.

Was Cyberpunk at E3 at all? Just asking because it crossed my mind that I hadn't heard anything recently.

I don't think it made a showing or will make one this year.

Related article here

It looks like Cyberpunk 2077 is going through Development Hell.

Also, probably no classes and a single main character.

http://gameplaying.info/former-developers-cd-projekt-red-told-about-the-problems-cyberpunk-2077/

edited 12th Nov '17 2:53:31 PM by CharlesPhipps

Ouch, that doesn't sound any good. Let's hope this doesn't become a massive case of What Could Have Been.

If Yong Yea's findings are true, it sounds like CD Projekt's offices were never a very organized place, along with the upper management's habit of changing things mid-development and thus resorting to crunch times when it could've been avoided with better planning. This is such an issue with them, that each time one of the Witcher titles were completed, over half of their teams chose to quit and move on.

CD_Projekt Red is one of those companies which has done almost the opposite of what every other company in video games have been doing for the past few years. Whereas everyone else seems to be leaving behind lore and story for gameplay, they doubled-down on it. While everyone else was doing microtransactions and nickel/diming folk—they released all of their DLC free except two expansions which were not only the size of actual video games but also expertly made as well as story-heavy.

BLOOD AND WINE, in fact, I'd argue is probably one of the best RP Gs of the past decade even if just played by itself (which you can do).

So CDPR has gotten a huge amount of slack from me on this. Honestly, I also believe the dreams they've been promising on this game were a bit ridiculous to begin with. The Witcher 3 is a MASSIVE game and I mean that not entirely in a good sense because the travel times are ludicrous even with fast travel. It's also a place with a lot of open ground with nothing in it just to give a sense of scale.

I think dialing it back a bit (a lot) and making it so a voiced protagonist (or two like Fallout 4) is probably the best option to take in this. What made the Witcher 3 so great was the heavy focus on characterization and storytelling. I hope we don't get a "blank slate" protagonist who is someone we can press ourselves on because what made Geralt awesome was the fact he had opinions, history, and relationships.

This comes with its downside of not being able to be as free with your character but it means a better story, IMHO.

I am also kind of REALLY desperate for this game because of the announced retirement of the Deus Ex series following Mankind Divided's disappointing sales (in the middle of a cliffhanger no less). As a huge cyberpunk, I'm kind of horrified at the loss of one of my favorite franchises when it looked like it was just about take off and Cyberpunk is really my only hope now.

I don't know. I kind of want to see them get out of their comfort zone with a more flexible protagonist. Particuarly since, with not many LGBT RP Gs out there, I kind of want more options than 'OH MY GOD LOOK AT ALL THE TIDDIES FOR OUR HERTO DUDE'. That... started to get annoying fast in Witcher.

I have my fingers crossed and hope that it's just the rumblings of some burned out employees (Which we shouldn't discount, but should take with a bit of a lens - you've just finished delivering a major MAJOR RPG, maybe the environment was pressured and tense - are you going to be on top form?)

But I suppose it could be an issue around vision. With the Witcher, they had an identifiable central protagonist to hang the story off, as well as a set world. Cyberpunk is an existing setting, but probably no set central characters, only themes. They're good writers now, but building a compelling narrative from scratch, alongside a new engine and mechanics is going to be a challenge.

Shadowrun scratched the itch, but the three games didn't quite have the flexibility I wanted. DX: MD I haven't finished because I know there's NOTHING ELSE coming out afterwards. Which depresses the heck out of me.

Also, that article seems pretty poorly translated...