Romance of the Three Kingdoms

So, I've been thinking of reading it for some time now. What are the best translations (specially public domain ones)? Also, has anyone around here read it? What did you think of it?

I'm currently reading it, actually!

If you're looking for an online translation, this is the one I use. It's clear, legible, and (as far as I can tell) doesn't try to force the work into a western cultural context.

As for my feelings on it, I'm not too impressed. This is probably because of my own lack of experience with Chinese literature (I'm more of a Graeco-Roman buff, myself), but I find the epic, succinct style hard to relate to, and the Loads And Loads Of Characters tend to confuse me. That said, it does have a certain verve and often a great sense of humour, and some of the characters stand out.

Basically, don't expect it to resemble a modern novel with lots of descriptions. It's written more in the style of an epic (only in prose) or a chronicle.

edited 22nd May '12 2:41:27 AM by DoktorvonEurotrash

My local translation is a short booklet. Apparently they didn't feel like translating most of it, so they slapped the beginning plus some of the more interesting chapters together.

I've read it, and it is the best book ever.

The best translation is probably Moss Roberts, but AFAIK none of them are public domain (but the one here is free and is apparently mostly based on the Roberts version).

But yeah, like dude above said: don't expect it to read like a modern novel. Its very much to-the-point.

What's it about?

It's about the warring states period of China. I think you would like it. very cool and competent villains...If you can really define anyone as a villain.

It has a page here, too.

Seems here that the villain Cao Cao doesn't really get a chance to shine.

Is Zhuge Liang a good guy? Cuz I don't like how competent he sounds

That's the general consensus, but everyone is a bit grey.

Cao Cao is definitely awesome, but the story takes place over a long period of time, so not very many of the characters who begin the story live long enough to see their plans come to fruition. Their children, on the other hand...

edited 23rd May '12 6:00:32 AM by gregyo

Dammit, why do all the coolest characters have to be good guys?

It all depends on who you root for, any of the three main sides can be seen as heroes. The general consensus "good guys" are led by one of the biggest cases of Designated Hero I have ever seen, and the "bad guys" for the most part are extremely loyal and badass. There are a few Complete Monsters here and there, but they don't last long because nobody likes them.

Also, be prepared for a large amount of Values Dissonance.

edited 23rd May '12 6:05:38 AM by gregyo

Like spiking babies on the ground like footballs.

...okay, so it was one time and I'm over-dramatizing, but that's how my Chinese friend described it and the mental image has stuck.

Is this the kind of novel that appeals to an ASOIAF fan like myself? It certainly looks interesting.

I have read the whole thing, and there are so many characters that you need to keep notes.

I know some releases do it for you.

Probably for the best. There are literally hundreds of named characters.

Tumblr account with fantastic historical / Dynasty Warriors character analysis. Even though Romance is ignored (or treated as "just another fictional source" at best), it provides a detailed look at the actual people behind the characters.

(Warning: Doesn't like Shu, and I totally understand why.)

Dammit! I can't find even one translation of the book at my library. Apparently the whole thing is so huge and generally split up that many libraries don't bother.

I may have to buy it from B&N.

Been rereading the romance of the three kingdoms, man those messengers had it rough! it seems like they always end up getting executed for the terrible crime of telling bad new. It seems like banquets were a popular time to execute someone, and given how many events in this novel happen at banquets the attendants must have interesting stories to tell their family when they get home.

Also, I'm the only one who felt Liu Bei trusting Zhang Fei with Xuzhou? Guan Yu would have been a much better choice.

Uugh, that Tumblr. I understand it's enriching knowledge, but seriously, I just felt like he was like telling people who actually liked Shu to be morons for 'liking a lie'. Give me a frickin' break, so what if in history they weren't nice? The story and novels were solid enough to actually like the character, not the historical figure!

I always say that, like what you like. You liked Shu characters for their ROTK portrayals, then you find out that they're not that good in history. Well, uh, so what? That shouldn't deter you from liking Shu, or make you have a Broken Pedestal moment. History isn't nice, but that's what entertainment and literature stories are about: Escapism from harsh reality.

Overall, IMO, that Tumblr seems to be more like a rambling of a man who has different values than us: That a character likability must be comparable with historical accuracy. I mean, the history bits are fine and enriching, but I think it shouldn't affect how you like a character, that's just restricting.

edited 10th Jul '16 12:35:49 AM by ChrisX

"I always say that, like what you like. You liked Shu characters for their ROTK portrayals, then you find out that they're not that good in history. Well, uh, so what? That shouldn't deter you from liking Shu, or make you have a Broken Pedestal moment. History isn't nice, but that's what entertainment and literature stories are about: Escapism from harsh reality. "

As chararter diferent from historicy yeah but I get when some writer use pure trope without caring or fumble, as hstory fan I can get that, also I disagree with the idea of "life if harsh, so look away" it make literatue look void and insipid

... I really don't get what you're trying to say. Honest.

But seriously though, I still am in complete disagreement that every Three Kingdoms related media should strive to be accurate to history. I just think that if ROTK was not conceived or the origins of it by Xi Zuochi... well let's just say China will NOT be as same as today. It's like this guy wanted Xi Zuochi to give middle finger to politics and stick with the 'truth', disregarding that such 'stick with truth' at that time can have disastrous effect for the time.

I'm reading the Moss Roberts translation now and am greatly enjoying it (thanks for the recommendation)!

I'm up to the main campaign between Cao Cao and Yuan Shao. Cao Cao is the most interesting character, due to being the most morally grey one. He has some excellent qualities: he makes an effort to treat the common people well (on at least two occasions, he makes looting and property destruction by his soldiers punishable by death); he attracts good advisors and generally listens to them; he can be a pretty canny strategist and tactician himself; and he's very willing to pardon former enemies who come over to his side. On the other hand, he is hasty and unjust on some occasions, as when he blames Tao Qian for his father's death, and he can be extremely brutal and cruel: actions in recent chapters include flaying a man alive for attempting to assassibate him, murdering the pregnant empress, and cutting off an enemy commander's ears, nose, and fingers to humiliate him. Just when those actions are losing him my sympathy, he'll turn and do something like sparing all the people in Xuchang who plotted to overthrow him, and even destroying the evidence of their treachery. So he's a complicated character.

I have no objections whatsoever to him taking on some of the emperor's powers. Better they be exercised by an intelligent prime minister than by a child who does nothing but cry. Obviously it would have been seen as a terrible crime in Imperial China and made him a villain in their eyes.

I'm mostly keeping track of the main and secondary characters, and not worrying about the minor ones. There are too many names to remember everyone.

Biggest Values Dissonance in the book: A man kills his wife and serves her as supper, because he has no other meat to offer. This is treated as a laudable act.

edited 3rd Aug '16 7:02:11 PM by Galadriel