The Place for Purging Porn and Pedo-Pandering (AKA P5 flag evaluations)

What's the point of having scholarly discourse if you guys just label the dissenters trolls and ban them?

Hey, I haven't done any of that. I'm usually on the troll's side!

I get Fast Eddie's motives. It's like having a pervert for a roommate. You'd want him gone and gone now.

But my deal is that I, as a long time Troper, has no idea as to what is and isn't acceptable within this grey area of "things with sex in it."

Let's say I wanna make a trope page for some new anime. It has some yuri in it. A lot of yuri in it. A story too, but also sex. How do I know if it's unacceptable? How do I know if I shouldn't post it?

That's why a rubric is needed in the long run. For right now, the P5 is dealing with major clean-up and they're playing it by ear. That's fine. But what do we do when the clean-up is done? Have a new P5 every so often?

No, we'd have a stable set of rules that would let mods and editors handle it.

edited 25th Apr '12 11:19:49 PM by SgtHydra

There's a difference between scholarly discourse(which is what I think I have been attempting with my requests about making everything that is a legitimate violation of the paedoshit policy reviewable for the immediacy, regardless of the exemptions, so everything that is exempted would be done so in a full-disclosure manner) and people throwing random works up to be reviewed because they dislike it the policy to begin with...

edited 25th Apr '12 11:21:50 PM by Swish

Just post what you don't think is porn. If your opinion of porn is too narrow, then occasionally things you add will be removed. If your opinion is too broad, then occasionally there will be pages that you won't submit for fear that it's porn. Unless you repeatedly post things that are porn after being explained why it's porn, you shouldn't have a problem. If something is questionable, ask the team ahead of time.

I really don't see how the current language is unclear.

Half of the shit up for review isn't even pornographic in the slightest.

"Oh but it was subtly implied that so-and-so underaged character had sex! Oh but there was fanservice featuring a character that was underaged!"

I could easily go through and put a good chunk of anime and manga with actual artistic value on that list because they violate the underaged fanservice guideline. It doesn't help that most of the stuff on the list anyway is Japanese.

My definition of a tasteful portrayal of sex is not everyone else's definition of a tasteful portrayal of sex.

And certainly not Fast Eddies.

This whole thing started because of complaints to Google Ad Sense. What if, after all this bending over backwards, there was a third Google Incident?

What then?

edited 25th Apr '12 11:31:22 PM by SgtHydra

That was my major concern, but apparently Porn with Plot is exempt.

Then the site simply goes full-on worksafe, and people start migrating to Fetish Fuel Wiki and make that more like T Vtropes or make another competitor to TV Tropes on their own server.

edited 25th Apr '12 11:34:20 PM by redlar

Gotta love how the problem isn't solved.

I keep trying, but some of you guys just keep insisting that this little tribunal will sort everything out.

I'm done, but just gotta wish the P5 good luck.

I ain't hoping this place fails. Maybe some of the removals will be reversed when Google Ad Sense finally removes the stick up their bums. I'm panicking cause nobody else is, but I'm still mildly optimistic.

edited 25th Apr '12 11:36:25 PM by SgtHydra

Well, I can agree it ain't. I honestly am only grudgingly supporting the tribunal since they are the best option right now.

That'll ever happen.

If someone ever got the courage/stupidity to try and take Google to court over it's Ad Sense guidelines, maybe, maybe thing's would change. As it is, this is how TV Tropes deals with it. It's messy, it's not perfect, but it's what we got

edited 25th Apr '12 11:44:09 PM by redlar

So since the "already rated" exemption is official now, is it ok to remove "safe" works from the sandbox list?

You'll need to request it of the mods, as the pages are currently locked due to trolls making troll requests.

Where are the pages? Sorry, I'm kinda lost, since there's so much on our hands.

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Sandbox/PagesPendingForPerusalByP5

Sandbox.Page Restoration Petitions and Sandbox.Pages Pending For Perusal By P 5. If you need to find them again after this post gets lost, they're each linked in the OP of their corresponding thread.

Okay, thanks. My schedule's hectic right now.

Which works is it that should be removed?

Off the top of my head: His Dark Materials, IT, Sailor Moon, Tenchi Muyo...some of them may have already been thumped

...Yeah, Shima already got it.

edited 26th Apr '12 12:32:22 AM by Elle

Ah, wait, IT is still on there. Should that stay for review? It's Stephen King - his stuff is adult, dark and gruesome, but it is mainstream.

Maybe you should have followed your own advice

But I will add a C) to you said and say

C) Please stop trying to excessively rules lawyer everything as it creates unnecessary work for people and is trolling

The Clean up isn't for Google anymore but for Eddie but saying "OMG censorship" when Eddie wants to remove some of the unsavouy elements is being hysterical to be honest.

Not sure if this question belongs in this thread, but would still appreciate an answer.

Is there any limit on how long a page can stay cut while still being possible to restore? In other words, for how long can a page stay cut, until it becomes unrecoverable?

If you're talking about system issues, Fast Eddie and the mods should be able to restore pages at any time.

Thanks for clarification.

This might be a stupid question, but I noticed that the only page on the P5's queue that's gotten more than three votes is Beat Angel Escalayer, which is evenly split 2-2. There aren't any works that have received three votes one way or the other on the queue. Does this mean that there are works that have reached a decision and have been removed from the queue?

On a related note, I echo the puzzlement of others as to why many of the cut pages that people care about most—Lolita, Kodomo No Jikan, Fate Hollow Ataraxia, and Lotte No Omocha, among others—don't seem to be on the queue (nor have they been restored). I thought that perhaps the reason for this was in the hope that the council could get much of the trivial work out of the way before the flamewars start, er, get bigger. I don't have a problem with that, but I'd like to know if that's actually the case.

edited 26th Apr '12 5:53:12 AM by Silverfire526