How do you pare a story down?

But I keep finding I usually end up with something considerably different to my intended outline.

That's fine, you should end up with something completely different after the writing process. The outline just organizes your initial concepts and puts them in order. Your story might well change completely after each draft.

I disagree.

Please elaborate.

Sometimes irrelevant information just keeps adding to a story. An irrelevant scene or detail rarely dispensed does not make a happy medium, indeed even medium use may not make a happy medium.

Why? Because the irrelevant stuff gives a sense that the characters have a life outside the story that the world they are in will keep going after the story is done.

Sometimes even, irrelevant non-plot stuff is the point of the work or a major draw outside of its core theme.

I, on the other hand, do agree with this - I just suspect the medium is not where you probably would say it is.

It depends on the medium. ie: a short story should have little to no "fat" and every sentence in it should be relevant in some way.

You must outline before starting anything.

edited 9th Feb '12 3:39:49 PM by Culex3

Using the word "must" when giving writing advice isn't the best way to convince the person to take it. There isn't one true way to write, you know.

I disagree.

edited 9th Feb '12 3:45:55 PM by burnpsy

Well, you should outline before writing. Even if your work changes drastically between drafts (and it probably will), following the writing process is essential to becoming a better writer.

^ Says who? Not all published authors followed the writing process (some even defied it).

edited 9th Feb '12 3:49:01 PM by MajorTom

I suspect they'd be in the minority, though. Who would you cite as examples? Are they critically acclaimed? How broad is their appeal?

I mean, I think I read somewhere that William Burroughs wrote a novel without any kind of prior planning, but that was after he'd gone on a bit of a bender, and he had no memory of writing it himself (somebody with superior knowledge of literature, please correct me if I am innacurate).

edited 9th Feb '12 3:54:24 PM by TheGloomer

I don't know about "the writing process", but I usually find outlines to be highly useful. Just don't be afraid to stray from them.

By writing process, I wasn't being very specific. I just mean outlines, drafting, revising, constant editing, that sort of thing.

edited 9th Feb '12 3:55:43 PM by Firebert

Varied. Examples include Dickens, Shelley, Poe, Shakespeare and others.

Yes a lot of them do predate the notion of a writing process but the fact humans wrote superb literature for thousands of years without it is a major ding in the face of the writing process itself. They didn't follow the process line by line then, so why should writers today be forced to do so?

No one said that it's a requirement, it's just highly recommended to help you become a better writer by refining your style.

Well, I don't want to be impolite, but what makes you think that your own abilities as a writer are equal to William Shakespeare or Edgar Allen Poe?

edited 9th Feb '12 4:01:52 PM by TheGloomer

^ I personally don't know yet. I don't know if they can be compared in the first place what with 400 odd years between me and Shakespeare.

So you do believe you're at least as good as them, even if you haven't reasoned out why?

(Again, I hope my manner is not mistaken for rudeness; I'm just curious)

I don't see how your line of questioning is even relevant, Gloomer.

^^ I believe I've come far enough that I can write quality work. I do not yet claim to be the next Shakespeare.

No rudeness or offense taken.

edited 9th Feb '12 4:11:06 PM by MajorTom

I suppose it isn't. Obviously I became distracted.

In that case, I apologise.

edited 9th Feb '12 4:12:32 PM by TheGloomer

But do we all agree that "you must outline before beginning writing" is a false statement?

Of course it is, must usually indicates a false statement. I hope I didn't come across as saying that it's necessary, but it certainly helps you improve your writing alongside the constant revisions and editing.