Red Hood and the Outlaws

Any you all check this out yet? It's pretty great.

I gave it three issues to grow above "god awful", and it didn't deliver. It's going to take something really provoking to make me buy another issue.

I've been enjoying it a lot. It's definitely improved over the last few issues, and the artwork is simply amazing. One of my favorite New 52 books.

I know this comic almost entirely for the RAGE provoked by its portrayal of Starfire.

What he said. I have no real intention of reading it.

edited 21st Jan '12 12:54:33 AM by rumetzen

Your guys' loss. It's getting really good.

And my pull list is already at 20 comics anyway.

I switched the last two issues of my comic book subscription to R Hat O, and I totally regretted it. I hate, and that's a strong word for me, I absolutely hate the new portrayal of both Starfire and Arsenal. Starfire pre-Flashpoint was an amazingly complex and interesting character who also came from a species of Fanservicians, also known as Tamarans. Okay, I could deal with that. But now they've got Starfire's characterization based solely on her sex appeal, and is in this instance a blatant, insultingly simplistic depiction of an "empowered woman," and that's just a monstrous way to treat the character, as well as writers like Marv Wolfman who spent a lot of time and effort shaping that complex personality in comics.

Arsenal... okay, I'll admit I don't know much about him, but for what it's worth, he was pretty messed up before the Flashpoint re-boot anyway, and this was GREAT opportunity to forget that the, as Primary Ignition described it, craptastic Cry For Justice story ever happened, and give him back his daughter, and maybe stick him in there as a mercenary-dad. That would be awesome. But instead the writers make him this Younger and Hipper frat-boy mercenary with a death-wish and who happens to use a bow and arrow. Oh! And he has some sort of Native American-like tattoos on his chest! Recalling his Native American heritage! Great job there!

The only character in R Hat O that I'm actually impressed by is Red Hood himself, and that's only because he's supposed to be a bad guy/anti-hero whatever, this is his element. Throwing Starfire and Arsenal in there just because they were horribly portrayed in remotely similar fashion before the reboot doesn't make it a good idea (Starfire was part of R.E.B.E.L.S. or something, and Roy was hanging out with Deathstroke and his team of battle-hardened killers, for some reason).

Aside from the characters, the plot also has problems. If the rather realistic (if somewhat repetitive) portrayal of Jason Todd's training in Red Hood: Lost Days is anything to judge it by, the idea of Jason being trained by a sect of crazy kung-fu zombie old-people seems kind of silly. What the book could really work as is some sort of realistic, globe-trotting mercenary-noir type of book, with Starfire and Arsenal thrown in to make things interesting. I mean, how often do you see hugely powered superheroes like Starfire dealing with rather mundane situations, like drug smugglers or modern day pirates? But no, the writers just had to throw in all of this mystical magic kung-fu gobblely gook.

So, to put it simply, Red Hood's outlaws suck, and I should have ordered Batman & Robin.

X

edited 10th Feb '12 10:53:23 AM by XRay

The last issue was really good. Honestly I've been lukewarm on Starfire from the start, she just seemed unnecessary to me. But this issue gave a lot of depth to her and she's genuinely interesting now. Also, the art for Red Hood is absolutely gorgeous.

We get it. You like it.

The layouts are kinda counter-productive. They don't actually enhance the reading experience. Plus, I don't know, Rocafort's art isn't to my taste and I don't think it fits the book and the tone the writer wants it to take. It doesn't feel very road-movie-ey.

@feotakahari: That Shortpacked really hows just how much I don't like Willis. Teen Titans the show had a comic, Teen Titans Go!, that NEVER reached anywhere near it's TV viewing audience. No book can; a show on TV is (to kids) free to watch, while they have to pay cash to buy a monthly. Only the more dedicated fans will pay to get a $2.99-4.99 book a month because they love the show/character. The scenario also doesn't talk about the Starfire who slept with Dick Grayson and hung out in a bikini in Animal Man's pool. Not to mention the hypothetical with the "never read a DC comic again" is really f*cking stupid, especially if it does happen. It's like saying that I saw Big Momma's House, hated it (and I do) and never saw a comedy or, hell, ANY movie ever again. It's just damn stupid.

As for the topic: Really enjoy Red Hood. Arsenal is also a lot more interesting now, more so than any other time I ever read him (especially the sickeningly diabetic stuff with the daughter or the OMG!Liansdead!). Starfire is a character that frankly, I don't think has changed too much. I seem to recall when, after Fifty Two, she spent a lot of time at Animal Man's house and was fanservice-y. No complaints there! /sarcasm. Really, the only thing that's keeping her from being as like as before is that no one knows HOW much she's the same character. That or people being morons and comparing DC!Starfire to the Animated Teen Titans!Starfire.

I like it, it is pretty awesome. The art and writing is great. I suppose I came to it as a Red Hood fan, who has been changed only for the better. Starfire is pretty interesting, the best portrayal since and comparable in character to 52. Arsenal has been bland but likable. Easily Lobdell's best current book.

I like it. Pretty good so far. Everyone is freaking out over the Starfire thing for no reason. It was the first issue and nothing on her backstory was revealed, and people seem to forget Earth customs mean nothing to someone not born on Earth. People are just too sensitive these days.

They sexed up a pre-existing character who had a backstory which is the opposite of what was betrayed here. Old school fans have a right to be upset.

No they didnt sex her up. She was always like this. She just hadnt been in a book starring role for a year so people forgot.

I read the comics. She was not always like this.

Did you read Teen Titans Go? Cause she was like this in the Titans and during 52. The only difference now is she is acting like she doesnt remeber her past.

My earliest memories of Starfire was here casually walking around Animal Man's house, in the nude, not giving much of a shit. So yes, she's always been casually sexual.

IMO, they should reveal that "Starfire" is really Blackfire with some serious memory problems. It would solve a lot of people's complaints and allow people to see that the character had its own merits. They could introduce a more family friendly Starfire.

There is a major difference between casual sexuality and casual nudity.

Eh, the book is average, but I really didn't like how they changed Starfire's personality. She was one of my favorite DC characters.

So this series has been ongoing for the last two years. How is it now compared to before?

I don't think the objection to casual sexuality is the issue so much as they made her amnesiac, had Jason make some skeezy comments about her that was retconned into him being a skeezy liar, and the fact that she was apparently willing to use sex as a way to just shut people up. And also Roy was okay with sleeping with a friend that appear to have some severe issues. Seriously, he was not at all concerned about her amnesia in that first issue. This is a problem when two characters are supposed to have previously been friends. As evidenced by the fact that he was listing of names of people they were both supposed to have known. Instead he just says "yeah I'll sleep with you."

I would say that it's improved since it's very bad start. Isobel was a good character while she lasted, and she didn't get forgotten after that Joker thing. I think Isobel was the stewardess's name.

I wonder if Red Arrow fans are hoping that they'll bring Lian back somehow. Considering Roy still has his drug addiction past it might not be so hard. They did decide to bring back Wally, after all. Although very different.

Just to clarify, Kory and Roy weren't friends before the Outlaws. Kory was way too smitten by Grayson to pay attention to someone else and Roy was way too shy to push the subject. When they meet again it was like the nerdy kid suddenly was working alongside the class princess.

Jason was just bragging to make Dick look bad, douche move but understandable between very competitive 'siblings'