This thread's for all of the X-Men comics and spin-offs (X-Force, X-Factor, New Mutants etc.), whether they're decades old or brand new.
- Apart from the main Marvel Universe titles, Ultimate X-Men, X-Men 2099, X-Men "What If?" stories, crossovers, guest appearances in other books, Alternate Universe tales and things like Marvel's manga adaptations are all on-topic here.
- X-Men 'family' books are on-topic (as are their own crossovers, guest appearances etc.) - e.g. Wolverine, Deadpool, Ms. Marvel and Cable.
- Characters and comics that originated in X-Men and its related books but are no longer connected to the franchise are not on-topic, unless you're discussing historical connections and crossovers. If in doubt, check before you write a long post. If this isn't the right place, there's a more general Marvel Comics thread
which covers them.
Technically, Marvel's Infinity Comics (and their predecessors, Infinite Comics) are webcomics, not comic books, but it's fine to talk about their X-Men related stories here.
Discussions that are only about X-Men adaptations in other media (films, video games etc.) are off-topic, but discussing the differences between the adaptations and the original comics is fine - as long as spoilers for the adaptations are tagged.
Please follow the spoiler policy rules
- tag spoilers for the latest issues, for any previews or content leaks, and for off-topic comics. When including spoiler tags, try to write so that tropers can make an informed decision before viewing them (e.g. which series and issue will they spoil?).
I have to say that the X Men franchise has been going on for decades. Maybe not as many as the Superman franchise has, but it still has quite a number to it.
One thing I am certain of is that the franchise seems to be subverting Status Quo Is God in recent years. Magneto and Professor Xavier seem to be fading into the background, with Cyclops and Wolverine taking their places. A lot of villains associated to the X-Men have been killed off and have actually stayed dead so far.
All this gives me the general impression that the franchise is trying to reinvent itself. Do you think that's what's going on here?
Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 29th 2023 at 10:02:23 AM
Team Rocket Boss.
Does anyone know the context for this?
Not a good look Rogue.
I'll teach you a lesson about just how cruel the world can be. That's my job, as an adult.
ππ©π―ππ°π
π‘π
he/him
X-Men annual #11, in which the team (and Captain Britain) become a Dwindling Party, as alien villain Horde forces them to break into a Celestial (?) trap.
They get psychically targeted by scenes like that, then get their minds pulled out of their body (which disintegrates) if they succumb,
The panel of Rogue after that — standing frozen against the glass. a mindless Stepford Smiler with tears streaming down her face - is suitably unsettling.
There is a Reset Button, of course.
I realize redundancies are something that should be addressed. But that's not the right way to handle them. Redundancies are often a good thing. So if life regulator one, or death regulator five dies you still have life regulator two and death regulator four to keep your plane in flight until you can stop and make repairs. So you can skip a month of regular maintenance when you face budget cuts. I was a writer and someone else wrote "All is Oblivion" I'd respond with "All isn't Oblivion, so there!" Terminus being Oblivion makes no sense, and if he can be separate why not anyone else?
he/him
Ewing's generally been quite good on that, though. He tends to use "they are connected" or "they evolved from the same source" rather than insisting they're all the same.
It's more about welding then into a structured cosmology than condensing them into fewer characters
(The example that springs to mind is the one mentioned earlier, about the abundance of sinister powers of darkness from before the dawn of the universe - Nox, Knull and so on)
Edited by Mrph1 on Mar 16th 2024 at 12:47:40 PM
One that bugs me is Amatsu Mikaboshi being 2% or what not of Oblivion. Another is Cthun and Shuma Gorath suddenly being the same kind of creature when they were clearly something different, the latter just happening to like using a form of magic the former invented. Phoenix Force is supposed to be part of that group that includes Iron-Fist's dragon, and okay, fine, there's some common ground between X-Men and Iron-Fist, but sometimes I feel writers encroach too much. Phoenix Force is also supposed to be separate from the gods and the abstracts, which would also imply the gods are separate from the abstracts, but you see, Amatsu Mikaboshi is just a part of Oblivion! See where I'm going?
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
I'd never heard anything about C'thon being the same kind of thing as Shuma-Gorath before. It seems like it was made up to shoehorn him into Cthulu expy and ignored afterward. Everyone has called him an Elder God since, as far as I can tell.
Mikaboshi's whole deal was that he was a primal being far older than all the gods who was already there when they started. He acted like part of their pantheon and dressed the part, but it was all a mask.
Edited by BobtheBoldore on Mar 16th 2024 at 9:00:28 AM
I'm hoping the C-Thun thing remains ignored, but he was shoehorned into the many angled ones, before Thanos killed them all, because Starlin.
Amatsu Mikaboshi saying those things is alright with me. Them actually being true is nonsense. He's not just a Public Domain Character but part of one of the better preserved mythologies. Sure, any writer with editorial approval can do whatever, but I don't have to accept it. If anything Oblivion should have been part of Mikaboshi! Your Christmas sweater with eye holes cut out isn't cooler than the evil kami, Marvel!
Cthon isn't a Many-Angled One though? There is a briefly-mentioned MAO with a similar name, though. Cthon himself is still an Elder God.
Cthon is an Elder God and Shuma is a Many-Angled One and neither has anything to do with the other. I don't know of any story that suggested otherwise but I presume that it's functionally non-canon.
he/him
Just a reminder that this is specifically the X-Men thread. Cosmology changes Ewing's doing in Resurrection of Magneto are on-topic, unrelated stuff about Marvel's various elder gods and cosmic horrors outside the X-books isn't.
We have a general Marvel thread for that.
Oh, bother.
NVM
Edited by M84 on Mar 16th 2024 at 10:46:58 PM
Disgusted, but not surprised
I was building up to The Phoenix Force being retconned as Thor's mother! You're killing my momentum!
he/him
I think anyone would struggle to argue that the Phoenix Force is off-topic in an X-Men thread, mind you...
I'm certainly not going to try.
Edited by Mrph1 on Mar 16th 2024 at 5:44:30 PM
That whole "Phoenix is Thor's mom" bit was probably the singularly most hilarious instance Jason Aaron's bullshit ever. The way he tried to make such a massive continuity change so casually only to ignored by the actual Thor writer of the time, immediately responding by doubling down on it and pettily including scenes where characters tell Thor he has to accept Phoenix being his real mom, STILL being ignored, and finally having to pathetically backtrack it and spew some bullshit about how Phoenix is TECHNICALLY maybe if you blink sideways Gaea's metaphorical midwife kinda who helped deliver Thor and this is why she was calling Thor her son.
I mean, we've had Gaia not be Thor's mom in the movies so going against mythology isn't unprecedented.
Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
It isn't a matter of going against mythology - the Thor comics have as much in common with real world Norse religion as Ultrakill has in common with Christianity, so it really doesn't matter what the original myths describe. It's within the Marvel Universe's own continuity that Thor being Gaea's birth son was a long-established and extremely important piece of lore, one that's only become more so as time goes on (and is arguably reaching the zenith of it's importance over in Immortal Thor, where Gaea is one of the main antagonists). So Aaron trying to arbitrarily declare that ackshully the Phoenix was Thor's real mom was akin to waiting til the last episode of Avatar to say that Aang wasn't actually the Avatar.
I could also point out that it was nonsensical and contradictory in regards to the way the Phoenix has been portrayed, but frankly, the Phoenix is so comically incoherent in how she's handled that that's kind of a nonissue. More than any other element of Marvel lore, absolutely nobody can agree on how the Phoenix works or what it even is.
Edited by immortaleditor on Mar 16th 2024 at 11:38:25 AM
I know the ship has sailed, but personally I think Marvel cosmology, when it comes to Cosmic Entities at least, should have stuck with what was originally established in Strange Tales. That run made enough sense, with Doctor Strange investigating it all. Maybe a combination of Doctor Strange, Thor and Fantastic Four, with Strange approaching things from a magical containment or extermination angle, Thor living it, and The Fantastic Four coming at things from a scientific study angle.
As for deviations like Secret Wars and The Beyonder, like X-Men and their Phoenix Force? They should have been treated just like that. Shocking developments that defied everything previously thought about The Cosmos. In fact in the X-Books, it could be used to fuel the mutant histeria, since that's an angle Marvel isn't going to give up on any time soon. William Stryker be like "The muties are changing the natural order! With their adversaries and their phoenixes! They must die!" Cyclops would respond "That's absurd, The Phoenix originates beyond space-time as we understand it! How could we possibly be responsible?" "Can you provide definitive PROOF you didn't create the Phoenix? Hurry muties, my deacon's got an itchy trigger finger!" "Wait, you think we created a star eating monster and your solution is to shoot bullets at us?" "Enough gamma irradiated bullets can kill anything mutie! I thought everybody knew that!" "Why don't you go shoot at Satan then?" "Satan lives in the hearts of the muties! Shoot him in the chest!"
The Head of the Hydra
I really hope the upcoming Phoenix book at least gives the firebird back to Jean and the general Grey family.
Cause that bird has seriously been reduced to just a generic power-up that anyone can use.
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Oh, bother.
Tbf that is more because the Phoenix can choose whoever it wants to empower. It just has a strange obsession with Jean Grey.
Disgusted, but not surprised
The Head of the Hydra
I believe thats been explained as the Grey family being perfect hosts.
Out of all the sentient beings in the universe, Jean's destiny was to be molded into its shape.
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
he/him
That said, if the new book has a meeting between Jean and former host Echo, I'd be happy to see that.
Takat Empress
Echo: Fire hot. Jean: That's all you have to say after becoming Phoenix? Echo: It was very hot.
Mileena Madness
Owl House / Infinity Train / Inside Job Fan
Question: is there still a rule that says Marvel canβt come up with new mutant/x-men characters, or has that been thrown out since the merger?
The Owl House and Coyote Vs Acme are my Roman Empire.
Awww its sweet how Magik is just ride or die for Scott without being a romantic interest for him.
Thats a great friendship.
Edited by slimcoder on Mar 16th 2024 at 1:21:21 AM
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."