Forest dying off world-wide

And it has nothing to do with the lumber industry:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44740060/ns/technology_and_science-the_new_york_times/

This is pretty huge. What they are saying is that we have caused irreversible environmental damage and now it is beginning to manifest itself. There's simply no way we will reverse global warming at this point, and invasive species - especially beetles - are nigh unstoppable killing machines.

I just don't get it. Why don't stories like this move people's hearts? How come we are all so quick to recognize the problems, yet throw up our hands when it comes to finding solutions. Why do we tolerate congressmen who lift the ban on wolf-hunting, or a department of energy run by former heads of the oil industry? People should care about this stuff, and they don't - not enough.

Because we live, as a general society, on the edge of disaster already. Fixing the problem costs so much as to threaten to tip us over entirely.

Those countries that have the luxury of choice in their reforms (mostly in Europe) have already done so. For the rest of us, it just isn't feasible...

I am now known as Flyboy.

Somebody Else's Problem, pure and simple. Everybody thinking "Why should I do something when it isn't affecting me?" at the same time. For example, just a few hundred miles from where I live there's a wildfire burning, and yet I do nothing about it. I don't see the smoke, or the burned homes, not even a single flame or bit of ash. No signs of fire whatsoever near me, so as far as I am aware, there's no fire to help put out.

Cynical? Yes. Do I care? No. Somebody Else's Problem at work.

Byte Me

"Cynical" in this case could also refer to "shortsighted," and also possibly "stupid."

There's your answer. Dumb and shortsighted.

Look, you can't make me speak in a logical, coherent, intelligent bananna.

What do you want me to do to prevent this dieoff?

That's Feo . . . He's a disgusting, mysoginistic, paedophilic asshat who moonlights as a shitty writer—Something Awful

^^Not the best example, since the firefighters that are dealing with it were paid for by either your taxes or your family's taxes (if you are too young to pay taxes). So in a way, you ARE helping to solve that problem.

Thing is, Tragedy Of The Commons shouldn't be an excuse. There's got to be a few people out there that care enough to call attention to the problem and get everybody together to find a solution. I don't believe that humans are inherently selfish creatures, I just can't accept it.

^Do some research on your local area, find an environmental issue, and call/write your local politician alerting them to the danger. Pay to plant a tree somewhere. Walk or ride a bike on those five-minute outings. There's lots of things you can do.

edited 1st Oct '11 11:43:25 AM by MyGodItsFullofStars

Evidence disagrees with you, regardless of your belief. The average person has fifty million far more pressing short-term concerns to deal with. You want them to do something, make it directly benefit them, rather than creating inconvenience and extra costs like it usually does...

I am now known as Flyboy.

^That's a good point. People respond to incentives.

So, is happiness something worth spending the money on? I know that a day in the park, just sitting and watching the squirrels, birds and bugs romp around in the trees, fills me with great joy. I think that this is something we all share - everybody likes seeing animals, otherwise places like zoos wouldn't be so hugely popular and the BBC's Nature documentary wouldn't have been the most popular television show of all time - not to mention keeping gardens or pets around. The problem is that our cities aren't designed with natural aesthetic in mind, so many people grow up never knowing the joys of climbing a tree or chasing after fireflies. I think that somewhere, in the back of our heads, we know that the modern urban environment is just plain WRONG - that it lacks the trees and grasses that a proper environment should have. That might be why we are all so unhappy and despondent these days.

I don't think I'm miserable because my backyard is a sterile, trimmed fascimile of nature.

People usually think material goods are better. Why spend their money on trees and squirrels when there's drugs, booze, sex, and toys to be had?

I am now known as Flyboy.

^Ah, but you haven't PAVED your backyard, friend. You planted grass - you didn't have to do that, you wanted to, because deep down inside you pine for the Savannah of your distant ancestors.

...it was like that when we moved here, though. We've planted a tree or two, granted. Fucking storms keep killing them, along with the bugs, but...

edited 1st Oct '11 12:13:55 PM by USAF713

I am now known as Flyboy.

Well, when the old tree in the park was cut down as a hazard, and the new trees were so badly planted that they rapidly started to die, my parents started tending to them. Does that get me (or them) brownie points?

(And don't you dare tell me that the contrasting greys and browns of the city are less beautiful than the forest.)

edited 1st Oct '11 12:18:40 PM by feotakahari

That's Feo . . . He's a disgusting, mysoginistic, paedophilic asshat who moonlights as a shitty writer—Something Awful

That doesn't work. I live next to a mountain range with more trees on it alone than most of the neighboring states' (and Colorado) human population COMBINED.

Guess what's going on on that mountain? We have a two fold epidemic of pine beetle and some kind of fungus going after the quaking aspens. They are killing thousands upon thousands of trees over just the last few years. So if I pay to plant one tree, what difference does it make when over the course of this next year alone pine beetle, fungus and forest fire kills over a thousand?

The "pay to plant a tree" bit of advice is trying to fix a broken arm with a band-aid, it just won't work. You need bigger actions or better understanding of why such things happen.

"Allah may guide their bullets, but Jesus helps those who aim down the sights."

I think your idea is moving into conspiracy theory range, most specifically because it's non-disprovable.

edited 1st Oct '11 12:42:23 PM by deathjavu

Look, you can't make me speak in a logical, coherent, intelligent bananna.

Why don't I care about this? Simple, I'll probably be dead in 20-30 years so it really isn't my problem.

x6 But... I like my cramped room and I hate grass. Fucking sand is where it is at. I don't think that we have some inborn want of grass fields. :)

Please.

Because one is released every third Tuesday.

Fight smart, not fair.

Let us pray that nature is strong enough to restabilise itself. It's tough for indigenous species to adapt to invasive organisms, but eventually they will. For the mean time, man will have to make up for this by planting beetle-resistant trees.

Requiem ~ September 2010 - October 2011 [Banned 4 Life]

Or, y'know, go extinct.

Yeah, not all species assimilate nicely into the local ecosystem...

edited 1st Oct '11 6:56:16 PM by Pykrete

Adapting, to death you might say.

Fight smart, not fair.

Also as to why stories like this don't move my heart, it's because my heart has a great deal of inertia.

I replaced mine with a motorized pump fueled by the screams of a thousand baby kittens mixed with turpentine.

Let's see, the actual article contains: "scientists say... may be..." "some scientists", oh look the word ecologist, I'm impressed they actually managed to look up a word more specific than "scientist", followed shortly by "a prominent tropical forest researcher" then "experts say", "perturbing the natural order" oh my, the natural order!

Can't continue. Well, I could, but bored now.

Fight smart, not fair.

EDIT: Stupid stupid stupid...

edited 2nd Oct '11 6:58:22 AM by GameChainsaw

The term "Great Man" is disturbingly interchangeable with "mass murderer" in history books.

Good. I hope the entire biosphere dies, or at least the parts of it upon which humanity depends. I'm sick of all this doomsaying never amounting to anything. Y2K was a bust, there still hasn't been a second 9/11, Planet X was a bust, and 11/11/11 and 2012 will probably also fail.

edited 2nd Oct '11 10:54:04 PM by Tongpu