Troper's Beliefs

This is something I've never understood about Christianity, or most major world religions for that matter. Apparently, there's a way to be a "false" follower of whatever faith you hold, just as there is a way to be a "true" follower of whatever faith you hold. It sounds a bit loony to me, to be honest *

EDIT: Though thinking on it now, I find that it serves primarily to distinguish one religion from either its many sects, or from other religions. It still sounds a bit wacky to me though.

edited 31st Aug '11 1:55:07 PM by Newfable

There we go.

Actually, I wonder if justification can be seen as somewhat similar to enlightenment in that they're both more important than your sins/negative karma.

Though, key difference, obviously, is justification granted through Gods grace in believing in him and enlightenment is reach through hacking one's own brain.

I only meant "true" Christian in the sense that if one is saying their Christian but treating others like shit, they're doing a pretty bad job of following Jesus's teachings. I'm not really pro "insisting on a very specific way to follow a religion" as long as people can get the basics right.

edited 31st Aug '11 1:59:01 PM by Justice4243

I don't use "true" whatever to refer to sect differences. In my case it has more to do with whether or not you fucking hold to your beliefs or actually believe in them. You can say you are a Buddhist, but are you a Buddhist? Do you live for The Dhamma at least somewhat? Or do you just go to temple for weddings and such because your family does?

Do you give a shit?

No?

Not a true Buddhist.

That's different from me. Nichiren Shoshu The website explains it all.

That's the thing: the whole "true" and "false" shtick just sounds as if you're being measured by someone else's religious standards. I consider myself a Christian, but I never go to church, I've never read the Bible, don't go out to make disciples, never outreach, don't do any kinds of public worship, or anything else that 9 out of 10 people would consider the actions or mental outlook of a "true" Christian.

It just sounds a little off to me, primarily because very few can provide a precise answer.

You're very different from me indeed. I'm Thai Theravadan. The wat I go to is Thai Forest which is one of the more popular Theravadan sects in the States.

So long as you give a damn about your tenants and teachings to some extent or another you get a true Buddhist card. You can be an absolutely horrible Buddhist, but so long as you care and try you get a card. You can be the most knowledgeable bastard in the world and lose your card for not really caring or trying.

LOSE.

CARD.

Also Justice apparently you people have a group of Thai Forest monks out near you...

I MUST VISIT THEM. MORE REASON TO GET THERE ONE DAY IN THE FUTURE.

^I judge it very, very loosely. You need one thing. An actual emotional attachment and love for it. A feeling of "YES I AM THIS THING". If you lack this you can practice every damn tenant in your books and still not be true.

You must care.

edited 31st Aug '11 2:05:34 PM by Aondeug

Aon: But I thought Buddhist was about not giving a shit! :O

YES IT IS BUT THERE ARE MANY SHITS TO GIVE AND NOT GIVE, ZERSKY.

OH I SEE.

SO IT'S COMPLICATED.

LIKE A UNICORN.

Anyhoo, are there any Native American Spiritualists on TV Tropes, I wonder. :3

edited 31st Aug '11 2:08:04 PM by Zersk

I think for “true Christian” you really only need to follow Mark 12:28-31

Also, Good Samaritan for some extra context and I love me some Good Samaritan parable.

I'd like to know that as well, actually.

edited 31st Aug '11 2:15:29 PM by Justice4243

I would be very interested in learning about that as well...I won't get my hopes too high though.

Or whatever the followers of Native American religions are called.

Even if they ARE very different.

STILL.

I think that varies on which tribe their beliefs come from.

We should research this topic. Which means that Justice should. Because I'm up to my ears in Buddhology.

I know Raven is a Creator/trickster god in many of the religions, Coyote serves the same function in others.

Other basics include the concept of Indian after life which seems to vary from "Happy hunting ground" types to sucky, cold, wintery places where the woman or ugly (I didn't make that last past up, I remembered it from school way back when...pre-college, so take it with a grain of salt)

http://www.near-death.com/religion.html#rel11

Other basic things I know off hand was Souix vision quests involved going out into the woods and starving until one had a vision. At least, Sitting Bull did that, but I'm pretty certain it was a tribal thing.

Also random stuff like Wendigo and Skin-walkers...

edited 31st Aug '11 2:39:57 PM by Justice4243

Lunars! :D Well, almost. :P

Buddhology on Wiki. Eternal Buddha, Buddha dhatu, and Trikaya are related articles.

RE: Native american beliefs. Modern practise of their beliefs sometimes fall under the Reclaiming school of Wicca, headed by Starhawk. But that's the package for the white man, the real natives probably keep their religion to themselves.

I read somewhere on The Other Wiki that, IIRC, Acts of the Apostles mention some dude who travelled to India and began to call himself "Buddas" afterwards.

Okay, I didn't say I'm betting on me being correct on all details.

edited 1st Sep '11 11:38:47 AM by lordGacek

...Yeah, that's not in Acts.

Related...

The Buddha is a Catholic saint called Josaphat.

In Japan the Christians there would mask their beliefs in Buddhism. Prayers were altered to sound like Buddhist chants and images of Guanyin and The Buddha were used to represent The Virgin Mary and Jesus. They are called Kakure Kurishitans.

Very small pockets of these Christians still exist.

God bless you.

I honestly didn't know that though. I tell ya', I'm learning quite a bit with this thread.

Some Muslims consider the Buddha to have been a prophet.

Buddha in world religion

edited 1st Sep '11 10:42:27 AM by secretist

I'm guessing one major reason the Kakure Kirishitan people exist in such a small quantity nowadays is because Christianity became legal again in Japan, and there was no longer any need for Christians to hide their beliefs.

My beliefs are rather... fucked up complicated. Start with a basis of Discordianism then add dashes of Gnostic Christianity Buddhism, shamanisn and Jungian psychology. Basically I believe that Something created the universe and the laws that govern it but that that is all we can know about it because it's just too frakkin' big to comprehend. I also believe that what i call "the little g gods", which are all the gods anyone has ever believed in exist. They are basically projections of what one can variously call "biospheric energy", "chi", "mana", or, if you will, "the Force" and are molded by humanities mass subconcious. We dream, therefore they am.

edited 1st Sep '11 11:00:48 AM by tricksterson