Redirect hunting: Tareme and Tsurime

Square eyes and droopy eyes aren't used outside anime?

I don't know, I haven't often seen the styles that the two pages' pictures seem to convey.

And definitely not with the connotations on those pages. I want to say "saggy/droopy eyes" are usually much more pronouncedly-drawn in Western Animation, and represent someone who's old, tired, or otherwise haggard.

edited 17th Jun '11 4:31:03 PM by Jeysie

They are, but they aren't used as this trope

This is like the entire thing with the Childhood Friend tropes. Yes, there are Childhood Friends in all media, but anime, and Japanese pop culture in general, have assigned their own specific traits to it, making for a distinct sub trope.

Tsurime and Tareme are more than just eye shapes, they also imply things about a character, and subversions tend to be very, very notable.

This is not about square eyes or droopy eyes. But about the specific anime design. As it was mentioned before, in other context, droopy eyes are used as sing of age, while slanted eyes as a sing of Asianess, but not here.

Each trope indicate a particular "type" of character and it is actually, not meant to represent their actual appearance. For example, a common usage is have a pair of identical twins each with one type of eye. The one with Tareme will be the shy, quiet one, while the one with Tsurime will be the mischievous, agitated one. In-story, however, no one will notice the eye difference and will often say how they look exactly like each other. This is completely different of other usage of 'droopy eyes' and 'slanted eyes', in which not only do not represent the same 'type' of personality but also is meant to represent the actual apearance of the character.

I can't tell for Western Animation, as I haven't watched such shows for years (same for Anime, BTW: the last one I've watched some was in 2009); I'm not a TV buff in general.

But for video games and French comic books, which I have better knowledge of, I've scraped to the bottom of my mind, but aside from anime graphics-inspired works such as Moebius' works for example and unless I've missed something (errare humanum est, after all), I can't think of pure non-Japanese works in those categories that use those eye styles. Video games go realistic if they're not Japanese-influenced; and Franco-belgian comic books have a very different drawing school than the Japanese style.

edited 17th Jun '11 4:48:18 PM by AceNoctali

I've been at work so missed most of the conversation.

I started checking out the different "How to draw manga" guides on the internet.

First result of google: Here.

They use the terms "upward-angled" and "downward-angled", meanwhile they use the term "cat-like" to refer to a specific shape that can be either downward or upward slopping.

The other links didn't address this specific subject.

As for non-anime works using these tropes...

The only one I can think of would be Teen Titans, which was deliberately drawn in an anime style.

Kim Possible didn't use it.

Even The Last Airbender didn't use it did they? Well... maybe to differentiate races, but that isn't the trope.

edited 17th Jun '11 4:56:33 PM by Sackett

And characters who's personality swings between extremes, or has actual split personality, will frequently change between Tsurime and Tareme.

For example, Cliana Rimskaya, from Super Robot Wars D, has two personalities, "Chris" and "Liana". Chris is a bubbly, happy girl, with Tareme, while Liana is a no nonsense pilot, with Tsurime.

edited 17th Jun '11 4:54:59 PM by SakurazakiSetsuna

You guys are much better observers of drawing styles than I am, of course.

If these terms apply specifically to anime and will not be applied outside that art style, then they should be the terms.

When I see square eyes in a Looney Tunes cartoon, for example, I see someone startled or shocked. Clearly a different intent than is being described in Catty Eyes.

Right, that was our point from the beginning. Application of this trope outside of anime and manga, or works deliberately aping those styles is misuse.

So can we close this now?

Good we agreed.

We still need searchable redirects, though. Are the current ones good? If the term 'Droopy Eyes' can be used for other things doesn't it means it is a bad redirect?

Raso's suggestion in the first page is a bit better at passing the meaning, but still half-Japanese, which defeat the point of having a redirect in the first place.I vote to use them, as they are useful for anime fans who don't know the correct term (and most don't) but we still need a pure Enlish name.

I don't know if there are good "searchable" redirects.

Downward Angled Eyes and Upward Angled Eyes

Soft Eyes and Aggressive Eyes

I don't know...

I would like to point out the CHOPSTICKS Page.

Anyway the way the eye is drawn is by far the most important thing to an anime face. aside from the hair the eye shape is the only difference.◊ and they are twins same here the Zazie sisters in Negima the only (And I mean only) visual difference between them when the older one showed up is the eye shape. The nice one that's been around for 300 chapters Tareme and the new bad guy has Tsurime.

Tall, Dark and Bishōjo practically requires Tsurime.

Almost all animes with standard art follow this. The eyes are the window to the personality.

Now for an english redirect we could do something like Moe Eyes, Friendly Eyes, , Cute Eyes or Cutesy Eyes for Tareme or Tsundere Eyes, Harsh Eyes, Quick Tempered Eyes Tsurime However only the first ones of each adequately touch the trope.

EDIT: Amagami SS the resident Tsundere, Tsukasa Ayatsuji, has Tsurime [1]◊ Only in her story in every other story she is Tareme[2]◊ (second from the left) to hide the fact that she is a sort of Stepford Smiler.

EDIT 2: Motoko from Love Hina the normal Type A Tsundere with Tsurime [3]◊ when they make her all cutesy after losing a bet... [4]◊ Her eyes switch to Tareme.

edited 17th Jun '11 9:15:31 PM by Raso

@ Eddie: "Square eyes and droopy eyes aren't used outside anime? "

I've only seen them used in Animesque works, including some American made ones. I don't always see them used the same way as described on the page (which I guess would make them Faux Symbolism?). Not all Animes will use them either, particularly if they're shooting for a more "Western Animation" style, such as the X-Men Anime, which uses circular and more hexagonal eyes.

edited 17th Jun '11 9:01:57 PM by Deboss