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Organ donation:

Nihilist Hippie
Well, I signed that they are allowed to take my organs when I'm dead. And it made real angry that it isn't mandatory upon death to take all usable organs. What do you think?
"Had Mother Nature been a real parent, she would have been in jail for child abuse and murder." -Nick Bostrom
 2 Deboss, Sun, 5th Jun '11 4:40:56 PM from Awesomeville Texas
I see the Awesomeness.
Most people don't die in a location where harvesting organs is useful.

I think the general consensus last time this came up was to switch it to an opt out program.
 3 Tzetze, Sun, 5th Jun '11 4:41:36 PM from a converted church in Venice, Italy
DUMB
Mandatory organ donation would cause more trouble* than it's worth.
We would certainly be better off developing artificial replacements rather than relying on harvesting.

 
Nihilist Hippie
you know, "the government is stealing our organs!", "the government is oppressing my religion!", you name it

Why do we have listen to nutcases? They can talk about oppression all they want, but their organs should still be used once they're dead.

edited 5th Jun '11 4:46:25 PM by LoveHappiness

"Had Mother Nature been a real parent, she would have been in jail for child abuse and murder." -Nick Bostrom
 6 Tzetze, Sun, 5th Jun '11 4:46:35 PM from a converted church in Venice, Italy
DUMB
Because they could raise a ruckus and do something stupid like set a high age limit on consenting to it.

What are the statistics on people donating organs anyway? My high school had a few presentations on why you should sign up, and all you have to do is say "yes" when you're getting your driver's license, in the US anyway.
Nihilist Hippie
Because they could raise a ruckus and do something stupid like set a high age limit on consenting to it.

What are the statistics on people donating organs anyway?

One less person dying would be worth it.
"Had Mother Nature been a real parent, she would have been in jail for child abuse and murder." -Nick Bostrom
[up] There are obvious problems with that argument.

I disagree with mandatory donation, agree with opt-out instead of opt-in.

Not much else to say.
<><
Nihilist Hippie
There are obvious problems with that argument.

Not much else to say.

Yes, if it's so obvious please bother to point them out for me.
"Had Mother Nature been a real parent, she would have been in jail for child abuse and murder." -Nick Bostrom
 10 Enkufka, Sun, 5th Jun '11 4:55:13 PM from Bay of White fish
Wandering Student ಠ_ಠ
While it would be great if all people were to donate their organs upon death, the problem is that its more than "a few" "nutcases." To a great majority of the population, it would be like stealing their souls if the government were to force everyone to donate their organs.

Further, it would no longer be donating. Donating is a voluntary thing.

My policy is one of two ways: 1) it no longer is an opt-in system, rather an opt-out. Sign a piece of paper saying you wish to not donate your organs.

2) keep the current system, but encourage donation through the funding of a state funeral, where the donator is treated as a hero, like a firefighter, police officer, or soldier.
Very big Daydream Believer.

"That's not knowledge, that's a crapshoot!" -Al Murray

"Welcome to QI" -Stephen Fry
Nihilist Hippie
To a great majority of the population, it would be like stealing their souls if the government were to force everyone to donate their organs

That's something people can adjust to, like anesthesia.
"Had Mother Nature been a real parent, she would have been in jail for child abuse and murder." -Nick Bostrom
Yes, if it's so obvious please bother to point them out for me.

Any time that argument is made people will raise the question "well, X would also save lives, why not make that a law?" where X is something patently unjust. Thus "it will save lives" usually isn't enough to convince people.
<><
Lover of masks.
Its not your right. Done.
Please.
 14 annebeeche, Sun, 5th Jun '11 5:02:55 PM from by the long tidal river
watching down on us
[up][up][up][up] Are there burning ships involved?
Banned entirely for telling FE that he was being rude and not contributing to the discussion. I shall watch down from the goon heavens.
Nihilist Hippie
Any time that argument is made people will raise the question "well, X would also save lives, why not make that a law?" where X is something patently unjust. Thus "it will save lives" usually isn't enough to convince people.

So the obvious problem would be that people are never going to be able to be convinced? Or are you just saying you feel it's unethical due to a slippery slope?
"Had Mother Nature been a real parent, she would have been in jail for child abuse and murder." -Nick Bostrom
 16 Mark Von Lewis, Sun, 5th Jun '11 5:04:12 PM from Somewhere in Time Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
KCCO
Way I see it, I'm taking every goddamn part with me to whatever is beyond. In my mind, no one has a right to take my organs even if I'm dead.
Run the red, won't stop at night, I don't care for traffic lights.
 17 annebeeche, Sun, 5th Jun '11 5:05:36 PM from by the long tidal river
watching down on us
[up] Except none of your godddamn parts are going to the world beyond, only your soul.

In any case, I don't care if people take whatever parts of my body are useful so long as the rest of me gets cremated.

edited 5th Jun '11 5:06:44 PM by annebeeche

Banned entirely for telling FE that he was being rude and not contributing to the discussion. I shall watch down from the goon heavens.
Nihilist Hippie
The way I see it, once you're dead you're dead. There's just a piece of inanimate rotting flesh that needs no respect.

edited 5th Jun '11 5:06:47 PM by LoveHappiness

"Had Mother Nature been a real parent, she would have been in jail for child abuse and murder." -Nick Bostrom
 19 Mark Von Lewis, Sun, 5th Jun '11 5:06:47 PM from Somewhere in Time Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
KCCO
So? Point is, I don't want people looting my corpse like liquor store left unattended in downtown Detroit.
Run the red, won't stop at night, I don't care for traffic lights.
Lover of masks.
Uber ninja fail.

edited 5th Jun '11 5:07:22 PM by TheDeadMansLife

Please.
 21 annebeeche, Sun, 5th Jun '11 5:08:07 PM from by the long tidal river
watching down on us
[up][up] I see what you mean. Just as I don't want my corpse defiled by some necrophiliac.
Banned entirely for telling FE that he was being rude and not contributing to the discussion. I shall watch down from the goon heavens.
 22 Enkufka, Sun, 5th Jun '11 5:08:43 PM from Bay of White fish
Wandering Student ಠ_ಠ
No, but a 21 gun salute is...

Anyway, merely saying that people will adjust is also not a good argument. For instance, Prohibition. Instead of not drinking, people merely took drinking underground. Instead of societal change followed by legislation, we have legislation followed by society desperately trying to go against it. Which is why I think solution 2 should be followed by solution 1 after several decades.
Very big Daydream Believer.

"That's not knowledge, that's a crapshoot!" -Al Murray

"Welcome to QI" -Stephen Fry
So the obvious problem would be that people are never going to be able to be convinced? Or are you just saying you feel it's unethical due to a slippery slope?

I'm saying that it is a generally ineffective rhetorical tactic that contributes little to your case. It's not really important.

edited 5th Jun '11 5:09:18 PM by EdwardsGrizzly

<><
 24 annebeeche, Sun, 5th Jun '11 5:10:01 PM from by the long tidal river
watching down on us
A 21 gun salute would still be damn awesome.

Bottom line is: am I still cremated? I want my grave to be portable and not take up a lot of space.
Banned entirely for telling FE that he was being rude and not contributing to the discussion. I shall watch down from the goon heavens.
 25 Deboss, Sun, 5th Jun '11 5:12:05 PM from Awesomeville Texas
I see the Awesomeness.
The issue is that the organs are a persons property. Ignoring how they want their property distributed after death rubs a lot of people the wrong way.
Total posts: 219
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