This thread exists to discuss British politics.
Political issues related to Northern Ireland and the Crown Dependencies (the Channel Islands and the Isle of Man) are also considered on-topic here if there's no more appropriate OTC thread for them.
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As with other OTC threads, off-topic posts may be thumped or edited by the moderators.
- There is a dedicated thread to discuss LGBTQ+ rights in the United Kingdom. That doesn't mean it's always off-topic here, but unless something's directly linked to political events, that's probably a better thread for it.
- There's also a separate thread to talk about your favourite British Prime Ministers.
Recent political stuff:
- The vote to see if Britain should adopt Alternative Voting has failed.
- Lib Dems lose lots of councils and councillors, whilst Labour make the majority of the gains in England.
- The Scottish National Party do really well in the elections.
A link to the BBC politics page containing relevant information.
Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 3rd 2023 at 11:15:30 AM
A procrastination in of itself
I wonder if we'll see London separatism rear its head at some point, God knows we have the numbers for it.
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
The law in the night
Which I kinda find funny because I am under the idea that the number of people advocating the return of the city-state model is growing.
Inter arma enim silent leges
Well, the UK is basically a bunch of tribes that, over time and for various reasons, were pushed into forming alliances with or warring against each other until we eventually ended up with the UK. Unity has always been a difficult thing for the UK.
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
Captain of the Dead City
"The empire, long divided, must unite; long united, must divide. Thus it has ever been."
When I think of the seperatist causes in Europe these days, this little line from Romance of the Three Kingdoms always comes to mind.
"...in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach."
V
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Indeed. You can see that with the number of British Accents...
VTEC claims Corbyn sitting on the floor was staged.
Speaking as someone who has had to do that before, they can fuck right off.
edited 23rd Aug '16 8:45:13 AM by Deadbeatloser22
"Yup. That tasted purple."
Pronounced YAK-you-luss
The Virgin video shows Corbyn walking past.... reserved seats.
So, let me get this straight. Corbyn is criticised for walking past seats that have been reserved for other people. And what exactly would their response (and the media response) have been had he sat down in the seats that were reserved for other people?
Clearly no other commuters were sitting down in seats that were reserved for other people (because, you know, these seats were empty). Ergo, Corbyn is correct about having the same experience as everyone else.
Besides, he commented on how very helpful the staff were, so I assume that's a reference to the staff helping to reseat everyone where they could.
I've had to stand on trains (including Virgin trains) between London and Swansea or between London and Birmingham or Cardiff and Birmingham. Sometimes for most of the journey. I've seen plenty of people sitting on the floor (although I've stood or sat on the luggage shelf (if it's miraculously free enough) because I don't trust the state of the floors).
Virgin certainly have had, by far, the most helpful staff, who have guided people through carriages to seats elsewhere, tried to make sure families can stay together and even upgraded people to first class where they can see people are struggling.
None of that changes the fact that standing in carriages or sitting on the floor is common - and it's also very common to find commuters packed like sardines in one end of the train and for there to be empty carriages at the other end of the train because none of the commuters know about the empty carriages. This problem tends to happen where trains have to stop at one end of a platform, so half the train isn't accessible for people to step onto the train from the designated public areas. Some people will walk the entire train to try and find a seat, but other people won't bother because it's much more common to walk the length of the train only to find it's packed in every carriage.
edited 23rd Aug '16 4:45:54 PM by Wyldchyld
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
A procrastination in of itself
Also there's the fact that he sat down later, you know, after some people had gotten off the train or been upgraded.
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
"Corbyn had a normal train journey like thousands do: shocker!" Seriously, the press need to just chill and watch Netflix, or something. <_<
Hands up anybody whose found themselves sitting on their bag rather than the floor, and then slipping into an empty seat when it becomes available... (usually around Chesterfield). 
I've seen people wedge themselves into the luggage racks of a Voyager before. And I've bitched enough about doing the Reading-London run sat on the floor by the toilet of an Adelante before.
"Yup. That tasted purple."
A procrastination in of itself
Getting a South-Eastern train out of Victoria is always fun, at least once Bromley South is reached there's normally a few seats, but that initial run is bonkers every time.
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
V
Done that before.
As for me, I've had to stand (no room to sit!) on an off-peak Class 159, 444, or 450 for an hour on the run to Waterloo.
Of course, the problem lies with infrastructure, not necessarily the trains (which is the easiest part to fix).
edited 24th Aug '16 11:09:24 AM by Greenmantle
Keep Rolling On
Farage is exporting his BS across the Atlantic, and is set to speak at a Trump rally.
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-37177938
Wouldn't be the first time. I think he is a fairly frequent contributer to CPAC as well.
Bit worrying though that more and more right wing actors in this country are going to CPAC and linking up the people who are driving the US right. I think we've already seen for example US style protesters outside abortion clinics - I wonder what else we might see imported?
The Silver Ring Thing came over to the UK several years ago, too. They're the group that pursue abstinence-only sex education in schools. The teenagers who promise to protect their virginity until marriage wear a silver purity ring.
It's not doing too well over here (much like the American style abortion protests, although those are more high-profile because of their aggression and therefore not doing as badly as The Silver Ring Thing) and there is court precedence for not allowing abstinence supporters to claim wearing the silver ring is protected under the law as a religious symbol.
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
So it looks like net migration fell to 327,000 in the year to March.
V
More from Labour's insecure Conference: G4S 'rejects Labour conference security offer'
It comes amid a standoff between the GMB and another security firm, Showsec, over union recognition. Labour refused to comment on commercial arrangements but sources said the conference would go ahead as planned.
The GMB has claimed the conference could be "scuppered" by its row with Showsec, which centres on the company's refusal to sign a union recognition agreement before the conference, which begins in Liverpool on 25 September.
Security at recent conferences has been provided by G4S, which Labour's executive committee voted to boycott, over claims the company has links to Israeli prisons. The company said it had been approached earlier this week by Labour for this year's event.
G4S managing director Eric Alexander said his company had been disappointed not to continue its "successful working relationship" with Labour.
Planning for such an event would normally take up to a year, involving clearance for security officers, detailed risk assessments and planning with local police forces, he said.
"Safety for delegates and our staff is our priority and at this late stage and with our teams committed elsewhere, we are not in a position to step in and provide security for the conference."
A Merseyside police spokeswoman said the force “has not been asked to provide security on behalf of the Labour party for their annual conference.
“The force is working closely with the Labour party in terms of the overall policing of the conference.”
Roache has said the union will picket the conference if Showsec provides the security, leaving Labour MPs and members facing the choice of crossing a picket line to attend their own conference or missing the event entirely. Sources have told the Guardian such a scenario would make it impossible for it to go ahead.
The party’s general secretary, Iain McNicol, emailed members of the NEC to ask for input on the situation, and several are known to have recommended the party retract its boycott of G4S, which does recognise trade unions. That option is now off the table.
The security situation has led to a war of words between Roache and McCluskey, with the GMB accusing Unite of interfering in the dispute. The unions are backing opposing candidates in the Labour leadership race, with Unite backing Jeremy Corbyn and the GMB endorsing his rival, Owen Smith.
“As you know, we are the dominant union in the security sector, and we will not tolerate any attempt by other unions to find a solution by dreaming up an inferior recognition agreement,” Roache wrote to McCluskey.
In his reply, McCluskey said the blame laid with McNicol and warned the conference was in imminent danger of being cancelled. “It is the responsibility of the general secretary of the Labour party, Iain McNicol, to implement decisions or to deal with any problems that may arise,” McCluskey wrote.
“I am astonished that we are only four to five weeks to conference and that he has not done so. It is quite evident that in the event of a GMB boycott of conference, it simply won’t proceed and the blame would lay squarely at the feet of Iain McNicol.”
So, we have Union infighting and the possibility of a picket line outside a Labour Conference (if it goes ahead).
edited 25th Aug '16 11:44:23 AM by Greenmantle
Keep Rolling On
GMB is in trouble with its own members who are angry that so many of them did not get a say in the Labour leadership. There's a feeling in the union that their leadership is out of touch. The GMB is picking fights with everyone right now, even its own membership.
John McDonnell claims Corbyn supporters 'purged'
This includes "verifying all voters share the aims and values of the Labour Party".
The party has not commented on the suspension of Mr Draper, which Mr Mc Donnell said appeared to be "part of a clear pattern of double standards".
He asked why action had not been taken against Labour peer Lord Sainsbury, who gave the Lib Dems more than £2m during the EU referendum campaign, or donor Michael Foster over an article referring to "Jeremy Corbyn and his Nazi storm troopers".
"Both will, as things stand, be able to vote in this election," Mr Mc Donnell said.
"Meanwhile, thousands of other members and registered supporters are reported to have been denied a vote without being given an explanation or opportunity to challenge the decision or process.
"Labour party members will not accept what appears to be a rigged purge of Jeremy Corbyn supporters. The conduct of this election must be fair and even-handed."
He said he would write to Labour's general secretary Iain Mc Nicol to demand "clear information" on why members were being suspended.
The BFAWU union has almost 20,000 members in the food industry.
On Twitter, Mr Draper said he had been suspended having been a Labour member for most of his life, adding: "Democracy in action."
“I think the priority for the justice department will be prison reform and she won’t want another fight with the Scottish government [which is opposed to the policy, and already fighting Brexit],” a source told the newspaper.
“I just don’t think the will is there to drive it through.”
The report was a surprise because Theresa May has previously expressed strong support for controversial constitutional change.
“This is Great Britain, the country of Magna Carta, parliamentary democracy and the fairest courts in the world,” she said in a speech in April this year.
“And we can protect human rights ourselves in a way that doesn’t jeopardise national security or bind the hands of parliament.
“A true British bill of rights, decided by parliament and amended by parliament, would protect not only the rights set out in the convention, but could include traditional British rights not protected by the ECHR such as the right to trial by jury.”
She had also however conceded that there would be “no parliamentary majority” for pulling out of the European Convention on Human Rights, of which the Human Rights Act is the current British implementation.
Another Labour purge has begun, and this time it’s massive [TWEETS]
Another member of several years has been suspended, apparently over an email. This person is retired, lives with mental health problems, and is devastated. They have not been given the details of the alleged email, and cannot work out what it may be. They have contacted their Constituency Labour Party (CLP) for support.
John Dunn, a campaigner for the Orgreave Truth and Justice Campaign, has also just been blocked from voting. He has been a member of the Labour Party for 45 years.
And one anonymous member got in touch to say:
"I am one of those suspended from the Labour Party. Allegedly for sending Tweets which contravene party rules. I haven’t commented on Twitter since last May and have NEVER made racist remarks, abused anyone and I don’t use foul language even in my own home. I am 65 and a Labour member for over 20 years. I will not be able to vote in the leadership election and I feel like a criminal despite having done nothing wrong."
Even Ronnie Draper, General Secretary of the Labour affiliated BFAWU union, is subject to the purge:
"Just been suspended from the Labour Party, a member most of my life. Democracy in action @jeremycorbyn @NSSN_AntiCuts @resistunite #bfawu"
It would seem that there is no rhyme or reason to the rejections and suspensions of membership that are taking place. Innocuous tweets, valid criticisms of the party or its M Ps, differences of opinion. All cited as reasons, but all would appear less than watertight.
Labour and famous? Say whatever you want
What is clear is that this process is highly selective. If you’re a grassroots member who says anything deemed inappropriate? Sorry. No vote allowed. But if you’re a political commentator writing in right-wing newspapers, or a senior party member? You can apparently say whatever you like.
Smear people as “lying Trots“? Apply to be a Labour councillor. Call people “Nazi Stormtroopers” in The Daily Mail? Fine, you can vote (and we’ll take your money, as well). Threaten an SNP MP with violence, and call for a trade union to be crushed by the Tories? You’ll be welcomed with open arms. Refer to other members as “Trots” and a “rabble“? Consider yourself Deputy Leader of the party. Use mental health slurs at public meetings? Why not run for the Labour leadership?
But don’t you dare support progressive ideas or stand up for what you think is right and just. If you do, you may also face the Labour purge.
edited 25th Aug '16 3:02:57 PM by Wyldchyld
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
Pronounced YAK-you-luss
Just to confirm: this election is properly monitored isn't it?
A procrastination in of itself
Why would it be monitored at all? It's an internal election, private clubs are allowed to set whatever rules they like their own internal election.
This process has nothing to do with the he public, the electoral commission or any other monitoring authority.
edited 25th Aug '16 4:47:01 PM by Silasw
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
So they can assure us - the people they want to vote for them in future - that we can trust the results they declare?
According to the wikipedia entry it's overseen by the Electoral Reform Society, which aims
Was monitoring the wrong word here? I just meant someone impartial to verify the facts.
edited 25th Aug '16 5:41:24 PM by annemarisa
I think the only thing that's really hit the mainstream press recently was Michael Foster insulting Loveday Jenkin with the special c-word during the local elections.
One success Mebyon Kernow has had recently is helping a local pressure group convince Westminster to revisit the speed at which women are being accelerated up to the male state pension age and look for a fairer way to do it.
The party is pretty tiny, but before the referendum campaign kicked off, they did have 10% of the Cornish electorate in favour of Cornish devolution, and there are signs that more people are showing interest in that now given that Westminster have all but confirmed that they're not going to make any attempt to plug the financial hole left by the loss of the EU funding.
That fits in with Wales. Prior to the referendum, Welsh support for independence from the UK was at an all time low of less than 10%. Since Brexit, support for Welsh independence has risen to 28% and is rising - the catch being that the support is coming from people who want a Scottish deal (independence from the UK so that Wales can return to the EU - when the EU question is removed, the figure is 17% in favour of independence, which is lower, but is still much higher than before Brexit). That support has been growing since Westminster all but confirmed that they're not going to make any attempt to plug the financial hole left by the loss of the EU funding (in fact, May's government has told Wales to find non-financial alternatives to the EU funding).
That appears to be what Mebyon Kernow is finding as well. And, as a note of interest, the Yorkshire Party is finding the same thing.
edited 17th Nov '17 8:33:30 PM by Wyldchyld
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.