Justice League

Please point out the part in my post where I ever said there was no objective criticism (I acknowledged the problems with editing or pacing) or claimed people were paid to give bad reviews (as if this accusation of me isn't a straw man argument in itself)

You named two criticisms and then proceeded to say the most of the rest of it is just fanboy whining because they're mad that Batman kills people or Superman doesn't smile, and stuff of that nature.

I could spend a minute on google or Youtube and find probably a dozen examples of people giving a critical analysis of the film that doesn't have to do with "It's too dark" or "Superman doesn't smile."

I never said you did. I said it's that type of strawmanning of people who didn't like the movie that I thought we were done with.

edited 21st Aug '17 11:01:55 AM by comicwriter

Let's not go down that road, this thread has been surprising pleasant for a while now and there is no need to stir anything up. Yes, there are legitimate criticisms, and yes there are fan wank complaints. Arguing over who is doing what won't go anywhere or do anything productive.

@ unknown- Different media has different expectations, in comics the reader has some control of the pacing of the story, whereas movies you are basically just along for the ride. My argument was that there isn't some sort of trend that people didn't like deconstructions, but that the way MOS and BVS deconstructed its iconic characters was off putting to a lot of people.

The issue with New 52 wasn't so much that the comics were too dark or cynical towards its characters, as it was rather grim at first but lightened up considerably later on. It was that it was proclaimed and written as largely a fresh start to the characters and continuity, and abandoned a number of key stories that defined the characters. Rebirth was about reasserting those stories.

Martin Scorsese is producing a Joker origin movie with the director of The Hangover. Yes. You read that right.

Most interestingly, it's said that this would be the start of a series of smaller, low budget films not necessarily tied to the greater DCEU, and that another actor would be playing Joker, not Jared Leto.

edited 22nd Aug '17 3:49:06 PM by comicwriter

That is crazy news; I didn't really expect it but I would love to see it.

Funny because I just saw Shutter Island. Apparently it's not considered one of his better films but I personally kind of loved it since it does a lot of my favorite things (Mind Screw, protagonists lying to themselves to avoid confronting a horrible truth, good acting, interesting themes, etc).

And if it's not Jared Leto I figure even if you didn't like the Suicide Squad depiction you could maybe like this one.

I mean the Joker is arguably over-exposed but this might be something to keep an eye out for anyway.

Curious if it would be doing the Red Hood origin that is most well known or make up a new origin for the guy; like that Jerome kid in Gotham. At least I think he's supposed to be Joker in that. I don't watch it.

Jerome was one of the bigger annoyances for me about that show, the whole problem with introducing most off Batman's rogues gallery existing before he does, and thus foregoing the usual 'created by his actions' conflict which I actually kind of like. Then Jerome dies early in season 2, which was actually a pretty great twist, and there was this montage where it was almost like his example triggered something almost primal across all of Gotham, where the absurdity of it all became apparent to everyone who saw his death on the news, so really *anyone* could be the Joker. I thought that was pretty good. Except then apparently Jerome (or at least his actor) came back on later seasons (which I haven't seen), so who knows.

Very interesting development, they weren't kidding when they said they were aiming high. Especially surprising in that it won't be the DCEU. That actually brings up an interesting concept, they are approaching certain works as NOT part of the larger franchise. That seems self-defeating, but at the same time if that gets Martin Scorsese on board for a DC film it's hard to argue against it. I mean, one of the biggest problems of Hollywood is runaway budgets and the movies getting too big. A 40 million noir film based on Joker would be a revelation.

I like the idea of films not connected to the main continuity (DCEU) because DC used to have a line of comics for Elseworlds I see this the start of a line of films that are just Elseworlds.

The animated films have the a three film pattern: main continuity, Elseworlds, and adaptation of a classic storyline. They're pretty successful with that model.

I could see WB doing this with their films. But only having main continuity and Elseworlds.

Edit* This sounds like DC Films is making a Cinematic Multiverse; a few weeks back a director said he wanted to make a Red Son Superman movie it might still happen. DC is known for their Multiverse. They had tons of stories about their Multiverse, their current event Metal is about the Dark Multiverse verses the regular Multiverse.

edited 23rd Aug '17 7:28:47 AM by Halberdier17

Big ole' grain of salt, but it's being rumored Jesse Eisenberg's scenes have been cut from Justice League. He apparently didn't have too big a part to begin with.

A photographer did a shoot of children with diseases and disabilities while they were dressed as members of the Justice League

http://www.fulltimephotographer.com/single-post/2017/08/14/Photographer-does-photoshoot-of-the-REAL-Justice-League

Matt Reeve talks a little bit about The Batman, says it's going to be standalone and not terribly tied to the DCEU.

Mackey: Sure, but comic book movies are very conect with comic book themselves, and for what I see part of what people like of Marvel is their lighter aproach, more focus on hero being awsome and some drama every now and them.

About the multiuniverse: I like the idea, while Marvel continuity heavy aproach is good, is also....annoying in that it have to repeat stuff every now and them like Stephen Strange and Antman who are the same damn movie, this could shake thing a little bit.

DCEU = Clusterfuck

It's weird that the Matt Reeves interview was over a month ago and those comments are only now coming out. Something that needs to be said on that front is that, especially in an interview setting, the terminology he used may not be what we are assuming. He says that WB came to him saying it was going to be a standalone, it's not as though he is stating firmly that the movie is not connected to the other films and he refuses to do so. What makes the most sense to me is that the film will be its own contained thing, when he says "not part of the extended universe" he means it's not going to be an unofficial sequel to Justice League the same way Iron Man 3 was to The Avengers. Truth be told that is the prime source of contention in the MCU between the filmmakers and the studio, Favreau didn't like the Avengers shilling in Iron Man 2, Taylor didn't like the GOTG stinger in The Dark World, Whedon disliked the added baggage setting up Thor 3 and Civil War weighing down AOU.

Worst case scenario is that yes, it will be a completely separate Batman. But none of the news coming out lately have been from WB themselves. It's been scoops reported on by the media. At any studio there is at least three times as many movies "being worked on" as what actually gets produced.

According to Variety, Justice League Dark is back to the drawing board as WB hasn't liked the pitches from Liman's replacement directors.

Forbes Writer Scott Mendelson on all the rumors and gossip. Hollywood Reporter actually affirmed in the article about the Joker Origin movie that The Batman was going to be separate from the DCEU and not star Affleck, and then retracted that paragraph several hours later. All this stuff is absurd.

Rolling Stone interview with Gal Gadot. She brings up Justice League and says straightforward "Look, Joss, to my understanding, was Zack's choice to finish the movie. And the tone can't be completely different because the movie was already shot. Joss is just fine-tuning."

In different, I saw some rumors on Reddit that Snyder is going to step back in for the last leg of production, since reshoots are pretty much done. Given all the clickbait news I reiterate this is just rumor, but it makes sense. He stepped away because he couldn't be in England for several months and away from family, now this part is just going in to the office from 9-5 like anyone else.

Reeve clarified on Twitter that Batman will be in the dceu (which I thought was obvious) just that it will be a complete standalone story and not feature cameos or spin-off hooks like BVS or Suicide Squad.

edited 24th Aug '17 12:00:55 PM by comicwriter

Matt Reeves clarified his comments about The Batman not being in the extended universe.

Ahem.

Not even Batman telling Superman to stay out of Gotham on the comm? And that he requires no help due to having dealt with Gotham for twenty years with no pesky alien farm boy's help.

How would Clark react if Bruce faked that Clark accidentally killed him somehow? I don't think Clark could be fooled given x-ray vision and super hearing, but Batman could play unconscious. Until Clark picks him up and take him to the Batcave/Smallville to get Alfred's/Martha Kent's help.

Geoff Johns has some fun over recent shenanigans.

Interview with the production designer, Patrick Tatopoulis about creating the unique worlds for each of the Justice League.

Apparently the home release of Wonder Woman features some new information about Justice League. The promoted additional scene has Etta contacting Sameer, Charlie and Chief for a new mission, retrieving a Mother Box. It has the hallmarks of a stinger but was obviously not used. It does strengthen its already existing similarities to The First Avenger. This is actually really interesting, and could be a precedence for DC films finding their own version of how other films use The Stinger to hint at other movies. In addition, another way to get around the paradox of director driven movies in a massive Shared Universe franchise.