Civil war in Ivory Coast

Abidjan has been under siege for the past couple days, with scores dead and an estimated 100,000 refugees fleeing into neighboring Liberia.

Discuss.

So, I assume we're moving disussion from this thread to here? OK, then.

It seems that things won;t be calming down anytime soon. If Gbago's forces continue to lose, they'll just retreat and try again.

Dammit, my Dad's family is over there...

Either way, this can all only end in pain.

Gbago doesn't control a single acre outside of Abidjan. Why he won't just give up now is anyone's guess.

I have to hand it to BBC News. They had been covering developments in the Ivory Coast since its election, if only more sporadically than those in Egypt, Libya and Japan. Plus it hadn't been front page news for months, so it's no surprise all this was forgotten until now.

Well, Gbagbo had it coming. First he refused to admit defeat in the polls, then went all dictator-like and kicked out every foreign element that compromises his position while imposing an information blackout, which ironically strengthen Ouattara's resolve. Of course, Gbagbo still has his supporters, but I didn't expect pro-Ouattara forces to corner him to one city so quickly.

That said, I've been reading that both sides of the conflict have been massacring civilians. And the refugee crisis there is much worse then in Libya.

edited 3rd Apr '11 7:41:14 PM by MalagasyParrot

Yeah, once reports were coming in about people using machetes, it's... yeah.

France has taken over the Abidjan airport in order to secure a way out for 1500 or so foreign nationals, 700 of whom are French. There are UN peacekeepers there who are now focusing on the refugees and, according to the map attached to this article, protecting the hotel where Ouattara in based in the city.

Gbagbo's days are numbered. He's cornered, no chance of escape, no support outside of the country. The chief international concern seems to be for refugees and civilians injured by the crisis.

My god, people are fleeing to Liberia.

edited 3rd Apr '11 6:48:12 AM by SomeSortOfTroper

There any indication this new guy is any better than they guy he is replacing?

All I know about him is that he won the election, which means that he should legally be in power. Which is about as close to "objectively a better leader" as we're going to get.

Whether that makes him morally superior, or less likely to engage in this kind of shitfit himself if he loses the next election cycle, is anyones guess. Although one would hope that seeing this sort of thing happen, and the inevitable result, would prevent him from trying it.

edited 3rd Apr '11 12:11:55 PM by deathjavu

Things just got worse. The Army Chief serving under Gbago (who had fled to the South African embassy just before the Northern forces entered Abidjan) has now left and is back in the fight. I dunno what Gbago hopes to achieve. The country itself is gone from him.

Also, the French took over the airport. And no one is happy about that.

With a dictator like Gbagbob, he probably wants to take the country down with him.

Think like...

"If you wish to rule Ivory Coast, I will destroy the Ivory Coast."

edited 3rd Apr '11 7:33:59 PM by NickTheSwing

There also seems to be accounts of militias from Liberia brought in to fight for both sides, and some of these guys have taken to looting while they're at it. Typical.

edited 3rd Apr '11 7:50:20 PM by MalagasyParrot

I wonder what'll happen to Gbagbo. His best shot at survival is to try to escape to some country that'll hand him over to the ICC, after which he'll have a relatively comfortable rest of his life in jail in Geneva.

Since he doesn't seem to be surrendering, I guess he'll be cut to pieces by angry, machete-wielding crowds.

I'm worried about the massacre(s) carried out by Ouattara's supporters, but in a West African country, there's no way anyone could lead a major political movement without some group or other that has attached itself to the fringe (I'm assuming the perpetrators are something like that) taking the violence beyond the necessary and into crimes against humanity-territory. I really hope Ouattara doesn't have blood on his hands. Those who do, at least the ones in powerful positions, should be trialed but that's unlikely, as the winning side usually gets a free pass.

Fleeing to Liberia...? The hell are they smoking?

NPR had been mentioning Ivory Coast for some time now. I usually hear a mention about this that or the other at least twice a week. More often now, though.

There hasn't been an awful lot of media coverage, which doesn't really surprise me. In the west, we heard relatively little of the Rwandan genocide or the Second Congo War, because the general consensus seems to be that Africa is a "dark continent" where so-called "ancient ethnic hatreds" are the norm, so trying to do something about it is pointless.

I think this crisis has gotten plenty of coverage. It's been consistently featured on the BBC News front page pretty much every single day for a month or so, maybe more, and I remember the BBC watching the elections closely and reporting on the immediate aftermath.

In the Finnish press, this thing's always on the front page of the (site of the) most read newspaper (I don't read the paper version, only the site) in the country and I assume other papers are reporting on this constantly, too.

It's true that Libya's been getting more attention, but this thing hasn't been hidden or forgotten like was initially feared, at least not by the UK or Finnish press. (Don't know about other European or American press, but our headlines are usually the same as other Nordic countries' major news and the same goes for Germany, so I assume this has been making headlines in those countries, too.)

edited 4th Apr '11 2:53:46 AM by BestOf

To be fair to Liberia, things have gotten better since Sirleaf was elected President. Well, it's more stable. Still officially the most corrupt country in the world apparently.

The most corrupt countries in the world are probably the ones where most charts will say "no data".

Referring to North Korea, Somalia ,Russia and the US here.

Okay, that was needlessly cheap.

^ S'okay, I smiled.

Don't forget Chad and the DRC.

If anyone wants to know, here's the Human Development Index and here's the democracy index.

edited 4th Apr '11 12:31:56 PM by OurGLORIOUSLeader

This is a legit three way war. I remember there was a thread a while ago where someone was disappointed war was always two-sided. Well, you got your wish.

Hells yeah democracy ftw.

Yay, a negotiated surrender. If not by Bagpuss himself then by all his military forces although "I'm not surrendering" talk may be just directed at his low level supporters to stop them from going "Oh well screw this then, I'm going home" while he negotiates.

edited 5th Apr '11 2:41:23 PM by SomeSortOfTroper

Awww, look at his face in that BBC story's photo! Sad tyrant is sad.

Same here. I almost felt sorry for Gbagbo when I saw this◊ on the front page.

Gbagbo's like "Aw damn it, it was fun while it lasted. :( :("

edited 5th Apr '11 8:19:50 PM by MalagasyParrot

Eventually got round to finding something about Ouattara.