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No works of fiction about the epicness and hardship of studying. Why?

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Ardiente I won't kill you. Since: Jan, 2011
I won't kill you.
#1: Mar 13th 2011 at 9:49:06 PM

Seriously. Studies, especially once you reach college, especially if you want a good degree and make good Masters and stuff... you need to work very hard, and to keep a thight schedule, a good nutrition, sports... you really have to use lots of skills, face lots of crises... and that's not getting romance and family problems and financial misfortunes into it.

So, do you know of any work that has been about this sort of struggle?

"Sweets are good. Sweets are justice."
Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#2: Mar 13th 2011 at 9:50:00 PM

Because no one likes studying. tongue

Ardiente I won't kill you. Since: Jan, 2011
I won't kill you.
#3: Mar 13th 2011 at 9:51:07 PM

What, you think people like fighting and getting hurt?

"Sweets are good. Sweets are justice."
SG_man_forever That one dude. from Earf. Welcome to it. Since: Apr, 2010
That one dude.
#4: Mar 13th 2011 at 9:51:17 PM

I'd see a hard time making such a subject not seem incredibly boring. Studying and doing homework is boring. That's part of why it's hard. It would follow that watching someone do it would be boring as well.

Not saying it couldn't be done, but it would be damn hard to not make un-entertaining.

edited 13th Mar '11 9:51:54 PM by SG_man_forever

Without music, life would be a mistake. -Friedrich Nietzsche
Ardiente I won't kill you. Since: Jan, 2011
I won't kill you.
#5: Mar 13th 2011 at 9:52:59 PM

Drawing manga can be very boring. But no, doing homework has never been boring for me. Just diffcult, challenging, and frightening. Very frightening.

edited 13th Mar '11 9:53:18 PM by Ardiente

"Sweets are good. Sweets are justice."
Aondeug Oh My from Our Dreams Since: Jun, 2009
Oh My
#6: Mar 13th 2011 at 9:53:31 PM

Hikaru No Go has something to do with the struggles of study and practice though it's studying to be a go professional and awesome at the game instead of studying for school.

I know of nothing about the struggle in regards to school.

As for liking fighting and getting hurt...yes.

edited 13th Mar '11 9:54:10 PM by Aondeug

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah
Iaculus Pronounced YAK-you-luss from England Since: May, 2010
Pronounced YAK-you-luss
#7: Mar 13th 2011 at 9:54:17 PM

To be honest, I remember a not-insignificant amount of the Love Hina manga involving this. Makes sense, really, seeing as the two protagonists' greatest ambition was to get into the university with the most punishing entrance exam in the country.

What's precedent ever done for us?
Ardiente I won't kill you. Since: Jan, 2011
I won't kill you.
#8: Mar 13th 2011 at 9:55:11 PM

[up]I thought Hina's protagonist was a loser who sucked at this, which was what made him relatable?

"Sweets are good. Sweets are justice."
Iaculus Pronounced YAK-you-luss from England Since: May, 2010
Pronounced YAK-you-luss
#9: Mar 13th 2011 at 9:56:33 PM

Yes, that was one of the things that made the struggle more epic.

A generous dose of Character Development helped.

What's precedent ever done for us?
Barkey Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#10: Mar 13th 2011 at 10:01:31 PM

I don't really find anything epic about studying. Then again I just went to college part time and didn't do the whole full time student bs.

Roman Love Freak Since: Jan, 2010
#11: Mar 13th 2011 at 10:17:28 PM

In the states, there are several stories, many from professors, about getting their degree a year early while working eight jobs and raising twelve Guatemalan orphans. Hell, my mom gat a nursing degree while raising me and my brother and working as a waitress. Compared to that, no one really thinks your parent supported studying abroad is very hard.

Now, life without a degree or real skills? That's work.

edited 13th Mar '11 10:22:03 PM by Roman

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Ardiente I won't kill you. Since: Jan, 2011
I won't kill you.
#14: Mar 13th 2011 at 10:51:08 PM

[up][up][up]Careers like Nursing are short and relatively easy. I'm talking about stuff like higher math, physics, engineering. Stuff that can get into your head and give you nightmares at night. Also, not going for just the degree, but for good marks, in order to get into a good master's degree or find a good job quickly.

As for a blue-collar job... physical work is tiring, but it gets repetitive after a while and once your body is attuned to it, it's not as bad. What makes it hard is the low pay level that sort of job has. I have friends who come from blue-collar families, and they insist that studying is harder, and actual engineering is way more challenging than ground work.

However, those who take such pursuits, who really want to compete at a high level... they are rare. How to make them sympathetic? How to make their plight interesting? Well, Sports Manga are about really elite individuals, sometimes to the point of Charles Atlas Superpowers. Yakitake Japan is about bread. Bartender is about a guy in a bar who makes cocktails. Kami No Shizuku is about wine tasting... in fact, there are no works that I know, either Western or Eastern, about a blue-collar's struggle with their job. Works featuring or focusing on people of that class tend to be about their private lives, including their private lives at the job, romance being the plot cow it is. Same with penpushers. There's The Office. And Dilbert. But those are comedies, right? (Never watched The Office).

"Sweets are good. Sweets are justice."
Roman Love Freak Since: Jan, 2010
#15: Mar 13th 2011 at 11:09:41 PM

My mom is not penultimate example. As I said, I had several professors with similiar stories. Probably the most interesting would be my former economics professor who was actually running his own business that distributed internet back in the 90s in a small town while working on his economics degree.

But if you're really all about the higher math, you know as well as I do that engineering students have it relatively easy. The epic students are fields medal winners. It'd be a neat trick to make their work relatable and understandable to a popular audience, even if it would have to be a highly educated one.

edited 13th Mar '11 11:10:54 PM by Roman

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Ardiente I won't kill you. Since: Jan, 2011
I won't kill you.
#16: Mar 13th 2011 at 11:14:10 PM

Fields medal winners aren't students anymore. And it'd be great to make Fields material people less alien, but the matter of the fact is, I've met my fair share of geniuses, and they're all extremely baffling and strange... sometimes by how normal they are. A guy who can solve projective geometry problems without a sweat but who thinks Morocco is close to Cuba? That's one of the least strange types you get. You generally get very little insight into how their minds work, or how they relate to the job. Some of them just don't have a way with words. Others don't want to share their personal thoughts, even with close friends. My time at the Math faculty was generally very emotionally frustrating. Less so with Engineering, but I still have lots of trouble relating to people, though I'm getting over it...

I'd love to hear contrasting experiences.

And yeah, the weirder cases can be great stories, but they aren't about studying, they are about managing time and energy. Though that's great too. Yet again, when I read about those, I only get the Success Story, not the Struggle Story. "I did this and that and arrived at that result". That just doesn't cut it for me. They focus too much on boasting and being inspirational, that's Marty Stu material, not hero material. I want a sotry about struggling with one's own laziness, with distraction and temptation, with sleep and food, with hope and despair, arrogance and worthlessness.

edited 13th Mar '11 11:27:11 PM by Ardiente

"Sweets are good. Sweets are justice."
TuefelHundenIV Night Clerk of the Apacalypse. from Doomsday Facility Corner Store. Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Night Clerk of the Apacalypse.
#17: Mar 13th 2011 at 11:21:51 PM

In short the reason is because it would be boring as hell. You can have some study in shows but it needs much more to be amusing. Tell you what digging through mountains of secondary sources to find the primary sources then jumping through hoops see first hand sources=boring as hell. There is a reason good study habits are considered a form of discipline.

edited 13th Mar '11 11:22:11 PM by TuefelHundenIV

Who watches the watchmen?
Roman Love Freak Since: Jan, 2010
#18: Mar 13th 2011 at 11:25:07 PM

Student life doesn't have as high stakes, either. Losing your job if you need to survive is a lot worse than failing a grade.

I think you probably could make a much more interesting story about say, Newton discovering calculus than a random kid learning it. Sometimes there are interesting mental activity that happens when grasping a new concept, but it's hard to write about, and if you can manage it, Newton had the same problem, so it's still more interesting. I was thinking of something like Nash writing his doctorate at 22 and such. Field Medal winners are nearly impossible.

There is the interpersonal problems between student and teacher, though. If you insist on this subject, that's where all the opportunities for tension arise. And lo, Harry vs. Quirrelmort.

edited 13th Mar '11 11:27:38 PM by Roman

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Ardiente I won't kill you. Since: Jan, 2011
I won't kill you.
#19: Mar 13th 2011 at 11:28:49 PM

[up]That final example is kinda great. Interstudent rivalry, Harry VS Hermione, was also great. Gotta leave now, see ya all later.

"Sweets are good. Sweets are justice."
Alkthash Was? Since: Jan, 2001
Was?
#20: Mar 13th 2011 at 11:34:20 PM

Yeah those examples, those are about drama between the relationships between characters. Studying isn't really the forefront there. Reading this and some of your more recent threads, one would get the impression that you want fiction more like your life, because your life at the moment is lacking in romance, adventures, deception and drama and seems very hard for you to relate to.

Deboss I see the Awesomeness. from Awesomeville Texas Since: Aug, 2009
I see the Awesomeness.
#21: Mar 14th 2011 at 12:29:30 AM

Because it's not interesting to watch.

Fight smart, not fair.
Rainbow Pomeranian Lover from Central Illinois (Veteran)
Pomeranian Lover
#22: Mar 14th 2011 at 4:59:41 AM

The plot of Seven Of Seven has a lot to do with the main girl and her clones studying for the entrance exams, including a theme song that talks about it. It has other magical things in it, but it's the main example of a fictional work that deals a lot with studying that I could think of.

Thus, you may want to look for Japanese works in general, given the "exam hell" that students go through trying to get into high schools and colleges, a theme of the "hardship of studying" might be more common in that culture's works.

The American Girl book "Brave Emily" has a lot about studying in it too, if you count practicing a musical instrument for school as studying (as well as a lot about Molly struggling with multiplication problems).

edited 14th Mar '11 5:01:17 AM by Rainbow

del_diablo Den harde nordmann from Somewher in mid Norway Since: Sep, 2009
Den harde nordmann
#23: Mar 14th 2011 at 5:43:58 AM

[up]: But beyond that they seem to never touch higher education itself.... :(

A guy called dvorak is tired. Tired of humanity not wanting to change to improve itself. Quite the sad tale.
Ardiente I won't kill you. Since: Jan, 2011
I won't kill you.
#24: Mar 14th 2011 at 6:52:36 AM

[up]Problem with high education, especially scientific: it is rare. And many, many of the students are foreign. Which some people think makes them less relatable.

edited 14th Mar '11 6:56:15 AM by Ardiente

"Sweets are good. Sweets are justice."
del_diablo Den harde nordmann from Somewher in mid Norway Since: Sep, 2009
Den harde nordmann
#25: Mar 14th 2011 at 6:57:56 AM

[up]: Not in my country. But the "a few lone wolfs" point still stands.

A guy called dvorak is tired. Tired of humanity not wanting to change to improve itself. Quite the sad tale.

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