Spice and Wolf Discussion

I'm really surprised we didn't have a thread for this...

Anyway, I love this show. Probably one of the only animes I can actually stand.

"It's so hard to be humble, knowing how great I am."

Didn't we? I thought that we had two of them. Maybe they got deleted.

And yeah, awesome series. Books were better, but only slightly.

Wonderful series. We need more wolf in a cart. The second season ended well character wise, but damn I want to know what they did to get Lawrence back on his feet!

If I'm sure of something it's that I'm not sure of anything.

It's disappointing, too, that Baka-Tsuki had to take it down. Though I did manage to read volume 4, which the anime skipped...it involved cookies. Unfortunately the volume after the Abe(Eve?) arc wasn't translated, so I have no idea what happens next.

Anyway, yes! Horo(Holo, whichever) is awesome...and her interactions with Lawrence are highly entertaining. The two of them just play off each other so well.

Any news of a possible season 3?

I hope so, Kalandra. Nothing I've heard so far, but...

Anyway, I have to say that it's a testament to how strong the characterization is and how likeable Lawrence and Holo are that I enjoyed S&W immensely - it sure as hell wasn't for the economics, which for the most part went right over my head. The scene in season two during the fool's gold arc (we're not using spoilers, right?) when Holo finds out about Yoitz and has a major falling-out with Lawrence in the inn was chillingly well-written, and painful to watch in all the right ways.

It's been fun.

I've had the first season on DVD for 4 months and I haven't watched it yet.

You can't even write racist abuse in excrement on somebody's car without the politically correct brigade jumping down your throat!

The novels are being released in the US by Yen Press if you want to buy them, but the covers are different and I don't know if they offer the original Japanese covers any more.

But I like the show a lot, and should rewatch it since I missed a few things. The dub is fantastic.

Heidegger, Heidegger was a boozy beggar who could drink you under the table~

The lack of news about season 3 is slowly driving me crazy.

I don't usually like to make absolute statements like this, but Holo and Lawrence may just have THE best chemistry I've ever seen in anime. And their interactions aren't just incredibly entertaining, but impressively rich in detail. All the innuendo and double-talk really means you have to pay attention, and I appreciate that Spice and Wolf hardly ever tries to spoon-feed the viewer.

^I know what you mean. Of course, anime news isn't the highest priority in Japan right now, but hopefully we'll get it announced for... maybe the Winter 2011 season? That too much to hope for, I wonder?

And yes, they have fantastic chemistry. Holo's accent is pure sex, too, even if you don't normally have an ear for dialects.

edited 12th Mar '11 10:02:30 PM by RedSavant

It's been fun.

Holo's dialect is sufficiently distinctive that it's almost impossible to miss with even a minimal understanding of Japanese. I also heard that it drove the translators for the English version nuts since it's one of those odder dialects that doesn't really have anything that could be considered equivalent... or readily recognisable.

Ah, Spice and Wolf. I just found out about it a couple of days ago and I really wish I knew about it sooner. Really, I love everything about it. Both the economics aspect and the romance.

Really, when it comes down to comparisons, Holo and Lawrence's relationship is the antithesis of Twilight.

You guys are lucky. I just learned about it and don't have cable yet so I had to watch season one on Netflix and watch the first two episodes of season two on Funimation's YouTube channel. I heard that they had seven episodes of the sub (although I prefer the dub in this instance) but apparently they took down the other five. I hope it gets released on DVD soon so I can get it from Netflix and found out what that news Mark's apprentice had.

EDIT: Does anyone know the name of season one's opening theme? I found the full version on YouTube but I'd like its name so I can, well, give it a proper name on iTunes and my iPod.

edited 4th May '11 10:49:25 AM by Zelenal

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Interesting train of thought. Care to elaborate on that viewpoint?

Really, when it comes down to comparisons, Holo and Lawrence's relationship is the antithesis of Twilight.

It makes me laugh if only because by coincidence, their relationship is the same as their actors. ;)

Does anyone know the name of season one's opening theme?

Tabi no Tochuu.

I was speaking more along the lines of development and chemistry. I used to be a fan af the series (before my eyes where opened by better works and TV Tropes) and I usually strike deals with my sister in return for watching the movies (however, I'm out of material to strike said deals so I won't be watching the last one[s]).

[[clears throat]]

In its most basic form, Holo and Lawrence's relationship is the complete opposite of Bella and Edwards. H&L's didn't not start at first site, to begin with. Theirs is much more gradually developed and is one based on trust and respect. Also, the supernatural aspects of Holo doesn't have anything to do with how Lawrence feels (as far as I can tell, anyway). Their dialog when teasing is witty and, even though their words may seem harmful on occasions, neither of them mean any harm and the compliments given during those times always seem to be true, they don't seem to by lying or saying them sarcastically.

Edward and Bella have none of that. The way I view their relationship is rather abusive and very controlling. The only thing that Edward seems to see in Bella is the sent of her blood and the fact that he can't read her mind. Bella seems to only love Edward because he's a vampire and supposedly has the body of Adonis or something. Basically, her "love" for him is based entirely in the fact that he's supernatural (and came first). Their dialog is rather dull, really, and Edward pokes fun at Bella in ways quite different from the ones I pointed out between H&L. Really, it's almost as if he sees her as a toy to play with at times.

Love can be defined as the will to put others wants and needs before your own. A clear example of this with Holo is season one's final. Despite the fact that she wasn't fond of many of the notions and favors that Lawrence asked, she still went through with them and let us not forget the whole bowing thing. For Lawrence, it isn't quite as obvious. The first thing that springs to mind is the scene in episode four or five when they're backed into a corner underneath the old well. There's also a bit before that, I do believe, where it appears that Lawrence took a stab that was aimed at Holo (although I couldn't really tell).

For Edward and Bella... I cannot think of one instance. In fact, Edward's refusal to turn Bella into a vampire is the exact opposite of this. She is constantly in danger from being attacked by supernatural beings and pretty much anything else; aside from pregnancy, there's nothing she can't experience as a vegan vampire that she could as a human; and Edward's reason about the whole "soulless monster" thing is just BS, really. It was because of Edward's desire to not wanting Bella to be a "soulless monster" that the plot of all of the books happens. Really, all of it could have been avoided if he just let her transform into a vampire at the end of the first book (Hell, it's the most logical move he could make).

While there is more than one way to show your love for someone, we'd be here all day if I were to go into everything (and I don't have the battery life to keep this up too much longer).

To put simply: You can see, hear, and practically feel the love between H&L. Between B&E... you can't. The closest you can get is Bella and Jacob but Meyer's OTP fucked that up real good.

Of course, I am comparing and excellently written Light Novel to a rather poorly written novel so... yeah.

lol I never thought about that.

edited 4th May '11 11:39:30 AM by Zelenal

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Nothing to add but agreement, really (though I never read Twilight, so I can't really judge). Here you can find streams for the completed subbed anime. Sorry that I got no dubs to offer, as I generally avoid those.

Do you mean the Spice and Wolf actors or the Twilight actors?

edited 5th May '11 3:01:20 PM by Bionicman

I can't believe you are making me do this, but...

Speaking as a religious person myself, if I believed that a certain course of action would cause someone's soul to be forever damned to Hell, I wouldn't do it. I would also try to prevent the person from doing it.

If Edward genuinely believes that vampires are damned, and upon death are condemned to an eternity of torment, then his decision not to turn Bella is the right choice, probably the best choice he makes in the series. Of course, if he really wanted to avoid problems he should have avoided her from the beginning and never wavered. But if he simply must love her, then you can't fault him for trying to keep her eternal soul safe.

Mind you, I have no idea if his belief is legitimate or just an excuse, as I've only seen the movies, and then unwillingly.

Anyway! My wife and I are watching Spice and Wolf season 1 on Netflix and really enjoying it so far. I also read the manga adaptation (up to a point, anyway) and really enjoyed that. Where might I find more?

You could try the light novels.

They're available in the US? Do places like Barnes & Noble or Borders carry them (I don't think I've ever seen them there)? Or am I going to have to hunt around online?

I've seen them at Borders, but they were in the manga section.

edited 4th May '11 7:29:59 PM by SilentColossus

I, too, am an religious person (I really need to work on controlling my cursing though). It's just that he really has no proof of this (since the bible doesn't say anything about vampires to my knowledge). There is no argument that I can think of that would lend support to Edward (Hell, the entire thing is dropped after book two I believe). If Meyer had continued that argument and created something that would lend some support to it then I wouldn't have brought it up. She didn't so I did.

So I take it my logic is sound? Subs will do just fine. As long as I get caught up, I don't particularly care.

Ever since I found the full version of Tabi no Tochuu that's the only song that I've listened all day long. Even after my netbook died, I already had it on my iPod kept listening to it without getting tired of it. I must have listened to it around 100 times in one day.

edited 4th May '11 9:09:41 PM by Zelenal

Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!

Okay, first: I hate Mega Video. Second: Amarti is a Jerkass (even if he doesn't know about Holo's state of emotional turmoil I still hate him). Although... I can't really pin all the blame on him. If Lawrence had just talked when given the chance instead of remaining silent, it is entirely possible that this could have been avoided. I thought of these during said scene so it's not a hindsight thing.

Let's start with the whole matting thing, shall we? Make an attempt to calm her down and reaffirm your morals: "Don't say anymore! What kind of a man, what kind of person would I be if I were to take advantage of a woman in emotional turmoil? There is no way I'd be able to live with myself if I did."

Now for the selling bit. It obviously wasn't his plan so deny it, make note that he already had a plan, and try to calm her down yet again: "That's not true. Thanks to Mark, I already have a plan going to beat Amarti. There's no way I'd be able to do something like that to you."

Lastly, him knowing about Yoicks since the beginning. Confirm (lying wouldn't work) but quickly point out a couple of things. This is his final chance to calm her down: "True, I have known about the legends for some time but they are just that: Legends. Not all legends are true, of course, so it was- and still is- entirely possible that Yoicks is still there. Even if it was true that the town was destroyed, that doesn't mean that everyone who lived there died. It is entirely possible that at least one member of your family is still alive. If that is the case then I won't just abandon you. I'd help you look for them."

Would the situation be diffused? Possibly but, honestly, it's hard to say. Also, I like to think of myself as a man of logic. While a man of logic and a merchant then do share similarities, there are differences. Perhaps he could think to say something similar to what I pointed out at the time. Hell, I might not have been able to think or say those tings. I've never been in a situation like that and I probably never will be (even if you remove the supernatural aspects) so, at the very least, I like to think that's what I'd say.

I still hate Amarti and Mega Video though.

EDIT: Well... Looks like I still have much to learn. Man, I feel as stupid as Lawrence did. How did I miss it? I knew the feathers were a sign, I knew about the bird lady, but how did it not occur that she wouldn't do that? Man, I'm an idiot. I think I should quite trying to predict and just enjoy it. You know, I think I'll do that. Well, for now anyway.

edited 5th May '11 12:36:53 AM by Zelenal

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So, how did Brina Palencia and Michael J. Tatum do in season two? I know Ami Koshimizu and Jun Fukuyama did a damn good job but what about them?

Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!

Season 2 hasn't come out yet (apparently it will be later this year). But considering those two, we don't need confirmation that Brina and Tatum did a good job.