Tough Love Boot Camps

@JB: Make sure your child knows his shit, then make sure the camp is reputable. If worse comes to worse, be ready to go down there and bring your kid back.

I'd just prefer (if I had the option) to take my child on holiday with me.

@Bugman That's why it's a good idea to research places before just randomly sending one's kids off.

I saw enough of my family the rest of year, I would've been happy to spend a summer away.

Also, what Kino said.

edited 15th Feb '11 5:36:39 AM by KCK

^Summer camps aren't that bad; parents and children need a break from each other. If you're lucky you'll get an awesome camp counselor; like me.

Spending time with extended family are what the summer holidays are for, I mean besides going out with your friends.

@Bugman Well, gee, I didn't know you had a monopoly on how other people should their time in the summer.

Sorry, the meaning must not have carried I meant the prior statement to seem sort of shocked and bewildered/self mocking (how I can not understand other peoples Po V) not as if I was dictating what other people do on their holidays.

@Carbon:

Yikes. That is pretty mucked up.

I'd steer clear of religious summer camps in general, but I was sent to computer camp a few times and a YMCA-run camp (which is technically religious but not in the way that the camps my cousins went to were, where it's all about re-affirming your faith). It was a great chance to learn some practical camping, horseback riding, and hiking skills, and get some exercise.

That sounds like a lot of fun, actually.

-*shudder* urgh, horses. Rest of it sounds fun though.

...yeah, I could skip the horses part, too. My neighbor growing up had two of them. Fearsomely huge animals to a seven-year-old...

I just don't like the damn things. Mad as hares and twice the size of you. S Hire horses are alright though, if only because they are too huge to react quickly.

The effectiveness of a tough love boot camp, ultimately differs from teen to teen. Some teens have benefited from its existence while others have negative experiences wherein the effects have been irreversible. The result is always dependent upon the attitude of both the teens and their parents, particularly the teen’s willingness to change.

edited 4th Apr '12 5:45:15 PM by jaimehill

Posting this under a sockpuppet because I'm not entirely comfortable using my realfake name.

I have a friend, let's call her Melissa. And no, this is not me.

Melissa was getting into all sorts of trouble. She was drinking, partying, having sex and she was only seveteen! I know, shocking right? One day she thinks she's pregnant and tells her parents what she's been up to. Luckily she wasn't pregnant but they decided she needed to be brought back into grace.

So logically they kept her close to home and kept a gentle but assertive stance with her, allowing her to understand the- wait. what is thread about? Oh yeah. They sent her off to a christian camp in the states. Since A: we don't have that kind of thing in Canada and B: They are horrible fucking people.

So Melissa spent six months in this camp. You couldn't talk to anyone of the opposite gender. Contact with family was strictly monitored and taken away with the slightest of infractions. Education was not provided, except bible studies, of course.

Punishment was swift and painful. You could be made to heft a pile of logs and walk around in a circle for hours. Outside. At night. In close to sub-zero weather. And if you stopped walking you'd have to start over.

Isolationist tactics were also used. Spending an entire day or more locked up with no contact or food was not uncommon.

Which I can say is actually probably worse then physical punishment. I got into a spot of bother at juvie once and spent a day in isolation. It was not fun.

Anyway, back to Melissa's story. Psychological abuse was the rule rather then the exception. You were a horrible slut who would burn in eternal hellfire for your misdeeds and only the power of christ could save you. typical stuff.

Finally, after you'd been made holy once more you could leave and being- oh wait, no, you got to go home for christmas. Where you couldn't talk to anyone outside your family. Including me. It made for an awkward conversation when we met up at wal-mart. I really should apologize to her dad for the yelling I did. and telling that security guard that man wasn't her dad...aw fuck it.

So after christmas you had to come back for further indoctrination. Once you had been broken down into a little pile of bits they remade you in their image and set you after the new recruits, explaining how much better you are now and how terrible they are.

Finally, after all that Melissa was released back into her parent's custody. It took about two months for the indoctrination to wear off. Funny thing about brainwashing, when it's done poorly even something as weak as logic can destroy it.

So Melissa went back to her old ways soon enough and once again her parents sent her off. This time to a different camp. She hasn't returned yet but I somehow doubt the second time's the charm.

So there you have it.

edited 4th Apr '12 7:51:51 PM by GarroshHellscream

I've heard enough bad stories to know that there's just too much risk of things becoming abusive and going wrong.

Now if you want to voluntarily try a ROTC-type camp for your own experience, that's different. In fact, the boot camps should be more like actual army training and less of a punishment.

edited 4th Apr '12 8:05:14 PM by abstractematics

Mostly with Barkey on this one.

Myself, I am very worried about the logic (or lack of) when it comes to Tough Love Boot Camps.

Firstly, if you are at the point where you need Tough Love, you are dealing with abarent behaviour.

Secondly, if this is real Boot Camp we are talking about, complete with weapons use training, then you've managed to make bad problem worse.

edited 5th Apr '12 1:42:24 AM by Natasel

I'm guessing, since these things are in the US, that they are privately run?

Ideally these places would be state-run, used as an alternative to a prison sentence and very tightly regulated.

I bet that's not how it works at all, is it?

They could, if run properly, be a great way to turn useless, freeloading scum into worthwhile citizens, but you'd need to focus on mental and moral training (and not just freaky religious indoctrination, either) just as much as shouting and PT.

edited 5th Apr '12 2:03:56 AM by InverurieJones

Personally, I think that the whole "boot camp" stuff is freaky even without the cultish going's on. Even the ones that don't fall into full-on Crusader territory are fucked up just on account of being creepy reeducation camps ran by crazy people. It's the sort of thing that makes you want to get violent with the arseholes responsible.

edited 5th Apr '12 2:58:06 AM by TheBatPencil

I am not a fan of the concept of "though love" to begin with: frankly, it mostly looks like an excuse to behave like a jerk and pretend that it's for the victim's own good. Obviously children have a need for rules, and — although I think that this should be a last measure, and only to be considered in case of repeat offenses — for (reasonable, and non physical) punishments in case of infractions; but the idea that hurting and humiliating somebody is going to make them into a better person is all kinds of wrong.

edited 5th Apr '12 3:05:18 AM by Carciofus

It works really well if you do it just the right amount. In fact, it's the only thing that does work.

edited 5th Apr '12 3:23:48 AM by InverurieJones

[citation needed]

So people who are not hurt and humiliated on a regular basis cannot improve as people?

Huh. And I was under the impression that routine degradation was bad for a person.

Why, by that logic, being in constant pain, I'd be some kind of Gandhi by now.

It must be directed. If you push at a block of clay from random angles, and hack random bits off, all you get is a corrupted mess; but if you push and cut in the right ways you can make a beautiful work of art.