Games that you did not yell Ruined Forever and mostly everone else did

^^ The thing is that most people are used to the backdash being mostly unnecessary, like in every other Metroidvania. So when a game comes along that requires full use of it, they don't know what to do. Same with the slide.

Or you can just equip two Nitesco's and pwn...everythiing...in less than a minute. Even better if you equip Death Ring to greatly boost your damage output...

Seriously did they need to make that attack so devastating?

The game is only hard if you try to beat all bosses without getting hit...but the challenge in that is made trivial once you get yourself the Death Ring.

---

In the end, the hardest boss in that game is the crab, and only because it's easy to miss the gap in the ceiling you can jump into. The closest thing to a really difficult boss in Metroidvanias is Abaddon without using barrier skills.

edited 6th Feb '11 5:11:03 PM by Signed

"Every opinion that isn't mine is subjected to Your Mileage May Vary."

This topic has made me realize I don't stick with franchises for very long....

....Well, I guess I'll say Mario and Zelda, they're the only games I been buying for a long time.

Dumbo

Metal Slug 4. It may not be one of the most original games in the series, and I can't play as Tarma. However, it's still a pretty quality game by the standards of the run-n-gun genre, and it's also a lot less bullshit than Metal Slug 3.

http://twitter.com/raydere | http://raydere.tumblr.com

@ Tsunde Ray I'm surprised as well to hear people dismissing Ecclesia, its my favorite DS castlevania. The fact you spent a good chunk of the game in the Transylvania countryside reminded me of Simon's Quest, not to mention its one of the first games since Simon's Quest(off the top of my head) you actually interact with the regular people who live in fear of Dracula. The fact that Ecclesia expanded on that aspect and offered sidequests for the villagers was a step in the right direction for me. Furthermore hearing Michelle Ruff play something of an emotionless girl was a nice change of pace for me.

You don't get Nitesco till end game, and the Death Ring till the second to last boss.

Command And Conquer 4 and Starcraft 2, Metal Slug 5, Sonic 4

Command And Conquer Generals

My other signature is a Gundam.

I agree. Generals has nothing to do with Command And Conquer but its still pretty good.

Yeah that crab is a cunt because of that. Everything else was easy enough to figure out and get to a point where I could clear it without taking a hit. A few of the bosses were amazingly easy to achieve that with. Thankfully most of those bosses were the earlier ones.

I guess using the backdash and slide takes a bit to get used to, but eh. Seemed like the natural course of action to me though. "I keep dying because I keep getting hit. Maybe I should experiment with the backdash and slide. Those are things,".

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah

Nitesco was gotten early mid game...forgot death ring, but every boss after acquiring death ring was immensely easy because of it...including Dracula.

PS-backdash makes killing some of the bosses faster in Dawn Of Sorrow.

edited 6th Feb '11 6:57:07 PM by Signed

"Every opinion that isn't mine is subjected to Your Mileage May Vary."

After the first boss of Dracula's castle. That's hardly early mid game.

Considering how large the castle is, I consider the castle the halfway point.

Conveniently, the bosses you face after getting Nitesco are also severely weak against it.

"Every opinion that isn't mine is subjected to Your Mileage May Vary."

It does. Using the slide and backdash can make boss fights in other games go by faster too!

You know what is really hard though? S-ranking things in Megaman Zero. Apparently this is even more horrific in hard mode because you can't level weapons.

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah

Depends on which games really...

For example, some of the bosses actually become easier when you fight him as an S-Ranked boss in MMZ 3. Mantisk is the most obvious example.

On the other hand, it was impossible to unlock armors and get a A/S-Rank in MMZ 2 at the same time.

edited 6th Feb '11 7:03:32 PM by Signed

"Every opinion that isn't mine is subjected to Your Mileage May Vary."

What was his A/S rank attack again?

It's the one where he summons a block and slices it. It easily becomes lots of free hits.

Of course, when he's not using the S-Rank attack, he's easily the hardest of the first batch of bosses even in their S-Rank forms.

Kinda ironic...

Anyways, it's in the player's best interest to S-Rank his stage even if they don't care for learning new techniques.

edited 6th Feb '11 7:07:44 PM by Signed

"Every opinion that isn't mine is subjected to Your Mileage May Vary."

2 hated my soul.

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah

I can't even beat Megaman Zero 2.

I can beat it. I just didn't for a long time because my poor grades sickened me. I couldn't continue like that and the grading system is unforgiving.

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah

And some people may like Superman 64 better than Chrono Cross.

It still doesn't stop Chrono Trigger from being more innovative in that gameplay mechanic.

And I'm not just talking about "immersion", the areas are more coherently put together, as well as the battle system. If you compare the technology, Trigger did just about everything that was possible. Laying out areas carefully. Where enemies would be, when you would learn moves. Intelligent combinations. It takes more expertise and effort to lay out levels like that than simply rely on the screen change. You actually have to pay close attention to where monsters and the like are on levels.

The "gripping" thing isn't meant in a person to person fashion. It's that Chrono Trigger is fast paced and focused. Going into battle and changing screen is a delay time. Because of this pacing speed up, Trigger can make battles more frequent without adding too much time. And while some people may have any feeling, having a transition to another screen is objectively less "immersive" in some ways. Something things are individual, but some things are a tendency and can be spoken of objectively. And having a screen switch is a disconnect. In reality, you don't have a screen switch when you fight someone. And you, as a player, whether you like that or not, it is something you have to interpret figuratively to make coherent sense. Anything that requires more interpretation on the part of the player is objectively less immersive in some ways.

The RPG largely chose the screen switch due to hardware limitations. It wouldn't be feasible on an NES system to do away with because they couldn't show as much on the screen as with a 16-Bit System. That they were able to ditch this so early, shows innovation on their part. Something that many RPG fans had desired for a great while.

Genkidama for Japan, even if you don't have money, you can help![1]

And yet Dragon Quest 1 with its screen changes, waits between fights, random encounters, and action menu hell is still loads more immersive, fun, and engaging than Trigger ever will be for me. Even with it's lack of screen changing, random encounters, and so on.

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah

I'm thinking y'all are looking for a different word than "immersive".

Genkidama for Japan, even if you don't have money, you can help![1]

And what word would that be? Sadly while you do have a point at the end of the day whether or not something is gripping is by and large a subjective matter.

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah

Bioshock 2 (which I prefer to the original).

Prince of Persia 2008. (which isn't as good as Sands Of Time, but it miles away better than any of the other Sands Of Time games. Which are mostly poor. Outside the most recent one, which is a suspiciously similar sequel in my book.)

Final Fantasy VIII (which, while there seems to be a significant hatedom for each game, seems to have a lot of rational detractors mixed into the bunch)

edited 7th Feb '11 2:34:14 AM by Nicknacks

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