Super Smash Bros.

Mii is actually pretty fun. Tall Thick Swordsman moves a lot like Ike, but I can change his specials and make him look like me. Gunner is pretty boss, at the right weight. Tiny Brawler is a slightly slower Sonic that kills at 80%.

edited 14th Feb '16 7:34:19 AM by SalFishFin

I've got no DLC, I'm planning to get all the fighters and stages though. Costumes I'm not terribly interested in since I almost never use Miis anyway and they don't add anything but a bit of sparkle (or bragging rights).

The only costumes I've actually considered getting so far are Gilgamesh's armor. But now that I've been reminded there's inkling costume I might consider getting that too. Splatoon is a cool/cute/fun game.

edited 14th Feb '16 9:16:33 AM by BlitzTrain

My Miis are all plainly dressed. My personal Mii's a Brawler, and he and my top Gunner and Swordsman are all in blue.

I like amiibo though. I have at least 20, but I still want more...

So long as Nintendo keeps making games that use them too.

I have most of the fighters and stages. Plan on picking the rest up eventually. I don't have Roy or Lucas, and I haven't gotten the Mario Maker stage yet. Mainly because I'm cheap.

Mario Maker is great. It has almost all Smash's Mario songs and the normal stage is never the same twice.

And Roy is cool. Lucas is mostly the same as he was in Brawl, but Roy got a cool tweak where all of his power is in the bottom of his sword and it makes him fight really scrappy.

Not like....scrappy, but like...you gotta get in really close to do good damage, and it's pretty fun.

edited 14th Feb '16 9:53:56 AM by Keybreak

Also, I'm only missing Cloud and Corrin. I'll make sure to get them eventually, but Bayonetta was first and foremost.

[Please don't link to offsite drama - Septimus]

edited 14th Feb '16 2:26:22 PM by SeptimusHeap

That comment is an entire salt shaker that someone spilled some random sexism into.

From what I've seen so far, Bayonetta's definitely not broken. She needs balancing, yeah(same with Corrin), but it's not nearly as bad as some people make it out to be.

And yet, there's at least even odds that they're not going to get that balancing.

You guys do realize you can DI out of all of her comboes right? And her ending lag prevents Smash spam? And that Witch Time stales so you can't spam it? And that she's a pretty light character?

edited 14th Feb '16 2:56:10 PM by EpicBleye

Most people sadly don't. The ENTIRE SUBREDDIT looked like that since she was released.

Keep in mind that those that don't really follow the competitive scene aren't likely to look at a character's flaws.

You can't DI out of her jab combo, and even if Witch Time stales, if you don't hit her while she's doing it, there's probably 2 frames of endlag, and it comes out within the first 5 frames, so she can Literally Witch Time Back flip across the stage if she's so inclined.

1. Her jab combo isn't great, nor is it actually a "combo"

2. Prediction and grabbing will go a long way.

3. She's still light and you can DI out of anything that isn't her (not great) jab "combo"

If you're at the ledge you can try and DI down out of it. I've done it a couple times.

Witch Time does not have enough cooldown for most characters to try and grab her safely.

Doesn't Witch Time only activate if she struck with an attack while it's active, like most counters?

edited 14th Feb '16 6:27:06 PM by BlitzTrain

try going on for glory and seeing if spamming witch time works, then try again.

yup.

You've missed what I'm trying to say.

Let's say you're playing against a Greninja, and it uses Substitute. There's a moment where he flashes, and for about half a second after that, if it gets hit, it'll instead disappear in a puff of smoke and attach from one direction or other. If he is not hit, he stays in position almost a second before he can actually do anything. That's the window you have to punish. It's a rather large one, and most characters who have a counter have a window.

When Bayonetta does her little backflip, Witch Time will activate if she's during the first, say, 7/10 of the flip. And that's a very lenient guess; she almost has one foot on the grund before she stops flashing. But once both feet touch the ground, she can move IMMEDIATELY. You have fractions of half a second to punish her for just throwing it out, and that's on top of the fact that she actually moves backward when she does it, so you have to time your punish with near-frame-perfect accuracy, AND space it properly

Again, you can't spam it because it (noticeably) gets stale, and it can get predictable. Plus the fact that she can still be hit by any multihit moves she counters.

Not to mention the fact that having a good counter does not make Bayonetta broken. It means she has a good counter that can be effective at the right time.

1. :It doesn't matter how quickly Witch Time ends when you're over 100%. It's not gonna end before she can throw out an Fsmash.
2. : I never said she was broken, just that her counter (and jab combo, which by the way does 25% once all hits come out) are a tad unfair.
3. : Having a good counter is one thing. Having a good counter with no drawback is another thing entirely.

edited 14th Feb '16 7:09:17 PM by SalFishFin

It stales even if you just spam it, and will eventually get so slow that it's nigh useless, but its recharge time is quick enough that it's still really, really, good. Easily one of the best counters in the game.

It has drawbacks, but realistically you need to bait it thrice within a 20 second block before it stops being a threat:

This guy did the math on how reliable it is.

Also: "Bat within hasn't been calculated, but a guess given her first acting frame is on 45 and Bat within starts on 22, at most, 22 frames of being punished. This has the record for the the safest counter in the game."

edited 14th Feb '16 7:24:06 PM by Hashil

Yes she has a great counter, I'm not denying that.

I don't even think that's unfair for her to have.

Very few of her moves are safe on shield, her non-jab comboes can be comboed out of, her moves come out relatively slow, she has serious end lag, and she's quite a light character.

She's definitely a good character, but people are freaking out about her for no reason.

I've only fought 2 Bayos, and neither have tried Witch Time on me yet. But if you can read/guess that's she's going to counter you can still punish with grabs even if she isn't a sitting duck afterwards like with Substitute. Might be a bit trickier, but I imagine it's still doable.

I just came back from the Bayonetta section of Smashboards, and scrounged up the Frame data , The entire move, in total, lasts 45 frames before she can perform another action. At 60 FPS, it's 3/4 of a second.

Frames 5-21 are when Witch Time will activate if she gets hit. Frames 17-29 are when Bat Within will activate if she gets hit. Not sure what this means for frames 17-21 as to what activates, but during g those 29 frames, she can't be grabbed.

Frames 29-45 are when she's actually vulnerable.

16 frames.

4/15 of a second.

The majority of Dash Grabs (which 80% of the time is your only option for grabbing her unless you have a ranged grab, because she actually moves) don't even "come out" until the twelfth frame, and are only active for 2 frames.

16 vulnerable Bayonetta frames. 14 frames to grab her.

You basically have to start moving while she's back flipping to have a chance at getting her. And if you miss your 2 frames when your grab animation will actually... grab, you know what happens? You have to wait 20 frames before you can input another move.

Bayonetta can buffer any attack she wants during Witch Time, and if you miss that tiny window of opportunity, she punishes your attempt at punishing.

So yeah, you kind of just have to watch her Witch Time Cartwheel herself across the stage and pray.