El Goonish Shive

I would think that a sudden and complete transition is a single day would make most people ask some fairly reasonable questions. The first one probably being 'who are you and why are you claiming to be a person that it's immediately visually obvious that you aren't?'

edited 22nd May '17 11:20:13 AM by Gilphon

To some extent, it depends on just how one conducts the transition in the first place, just what variety of transformation is done (they've shown that not every transformation is V5-level alteration), and there's still the fact that anyone who is trans still has the right to privacy. If the transitioner don't want to share information on it, other people can ask all they want; it's not the business of anyone uninvolved, and they'll get no answer.

I mean, it's worth noting that a sensible method of using Tedd's tech or related abilities would take some of that into account with some level of Masquerade to mitigate this issue, but I think that part could be sufficiently hand-waved in at least the theoretical sense. Sure, they'd probably have to do some exposition if they actually decided to do this in-comic, but I feel it's sufficient to take it on faith that they would in the non-existent scenario where that would happen. We're not getting into that simply because it's moot for the current comic.

Depends on what "transition" entails. Changing genitals, with possible small ratio alterations? Nobody would even realize unless they were already reasonably close to the person in question. Complete physical overhaul, including things like skeletal structure, body fat and muscle mass distribution, and hair length? That's going to raise questions whether imore not the actual physical sex changes.

Maybe you could set it to transform them slowly, so nobody notices.

It's not as good as "poof, you're done" but it still avoids shit like hormones and surgery.

NP 619

Everyone take a seat in the protective bunker, and put on these special glasses. The weapons test will begin in a moment.

Comic comic comic

Holy crap, Elliot. It's been a long while since we've seen that face on you.

Does that strike anyone else as a bad idea? 'Cause it strikes me as a plan that relies way too much on immortals being trustworthy.

They're probably safe asking Jerry 2.0. That's about it.

My first thought was that Elliot was being excessively naive in panel 3, but then Ellen pointed that out in panel 4, in a way. It's still on the faulty assumption that there are certain rules and realities that magic just has to obey (one rule I've learned about dealing with massively powerful individuals is, until you actually learn what limits they have, it's a poor idea to suggest that they have them because you very well might be wrong about said limits). But still, even if Elliot was right about the idea that magic can't keep changing (he might have that backwards - maybe magic can't help but to keep changing, and it merely decides which direction to change if given the chance), Ellen is right in that nothing says magic has to learn anything.

@25307 I was thinking that exact same thing, for starters. Even if you somehow overcome that hurdle, there are two limiting factors that I know of. One, Elliot only knows two, (technically three, but nobody thinks Voltaire is about to help Elliot,) he doesn't have any known way of actively contacting them, and it might be a bit much to ask them to get on "handing out magic mark" duty. Particularly because, even presuming Helena and Demetrius are cool with the idea, he's still going to have to do something in return for them - that might be asking an awful lot. Two, I think it was established that what magic marks are given out are determined by various factors inherent to the recipient. Desires can come into play, but inherent tendencies and other factors do as well. I don't think that anyone could guarantee that a recipient can get a mark that would help with body dysmorphia at all. I'll grant, though, that Elliot probably doesn't know the latter (he might be able to piece it together with information others have given him, but I wouldn't guarantee it).

@25308 I'd only conditionally agree with that statement. I think it'd be safe to ask him because, more likely than not, he'd just say no and give rational reasons for why he'd say that. He's both pretty low-powered after his rebirth and pretty intent on sticking with an Alien Non-Interference Clause when he can reasonably justify it. Also, it depends on what you mean by "safe" - like I suggested above, Helena and Demetrius are probably not going to intentionally cause problems upon being asked or by doing it... that said, I wouldn't exactly rush to call them competent, so I think there'd be a wide range of unintentional problems they'd cause.

Pandora, at least, can sense what someone would get from a mark before she gives it to them. So she'd be able to tell if the transgender person turns out to want the ability to nuke cities more than the ability to switch genders. Of course, she might give them the crazy dangerous mark anyway, but if they get her to swear a vow, that would reduce the risk.

I'm presuming that all immortals that can give out marks can tell what they're about to give out - Jerry certainly could when he discussed it with Sarah, and Susan's story suggested that Helena and Demitrius, presuming that was them pre-rebirth, could as well.

The reason I bring that up isn't the "empower someone to destroy the world" scenario, (though that is a possible legit issue). It's to bring up what's a more likely scenario - someone hoping for a mark that could help with body dysmorphia, but does something completely different. I could see that being a heartbreaking letdown, particularly if you were expecting the ability to take a form you always felt you belonged in.

NP 620

The rampage begins.

Ellens rampage continues.

edited 26th May '17 3:12:26 AM by stevebat

Comic 2352

Scheme a little scheme with me...

This feels like it's a bit padded out - let's get to the part where Ellen points out all the flaws in this idea.

Also, if we're talking about sticking to "the good eggs," oh, you sweet summer child, you think Pandora falls into that basket? That's pretty naive.

Pandora is a Neutral egg at best.

I would put her down as "Scrambled" myself.

Scrambled is a good description.

Of course, she might just do it anyway because as previously joked, she is so desperately lonely that she holds emphatic conversations with herself, using real people as stand-ins for imaginary friends and prodding them for reactions they can't give.

The Power of Friendship might just make Pandora boundlessly loyal.

edited 26th May '17 6:21:15 PM by TobiasDrake

Comic 2353

Details, details...

NP 622

I'll have to use... Both hands.

Ellen just became my new favorite person.

For today's comic... Thank you, Ellen. Thank you. I'm also recalling Ellen being the voice of reason with Nanase, too (not that Nanase listened...). I'm not saying she's my favorite... but yes, Ellen is making a strong argument for being up there with Susan and Justin for the best character in this series.

And if we're talking about comparing Pandora to actual eggs... I'm going with Pandora being a century egg. Way older than you'd expect, gone through things that you may question as whether or not they'd be healthy... and definitely fermented. That said, "scrambled" is pretty good too.

@32_Footsteps:(not that Nanase listened...)

...

And now I am wondering what particular incident you are referring to.

Because, you see, the first thing that popped into my mind was the whole revealing Susan's possible parentage vs keeping it secret episode. And in fact, I cannot think of any other episode in which the two disagreed and Ellen made her case.

But truly, it cannot be that episode, because, morality posturing aside, it would make your insinuation factually and demonstrably false.

So, giving you the benefit of the doubt, what were you referring to, exactly?

edited 30th May '17 11:09:00 AM by jaff

Comic 2354

If/Then

NP 623

Exploitation Now!

edited 31st May '17 11:12:57 AM by Daremo

Exploitation Now?

(Pretty sure Michael Poe and Shive would NOT get along at all, given their respective personal views.)

@25323 Minor point - you accidentally linked to the previous strip.

Though on that point, I realized that Ellen brought up a point that I had overlooked - even if you can count on a given immortal today (which, as multiple people, including Ellen, have pointed out, is not a guarantee in the first place), you can't necessarily depend on them being just as cool tomorrow. Granted, Ellen pointed that out in the reverse (that younger Jerry 1.0 was much more of a jerk than older Jerry 1.0).

For today's comic... seems a little odd that Ellen didn't bring up the point that they have no way to guarantee contact with an immortal - immortals only show up on their schedule. I mean, even if they get over the obstacle of "on board," "not a jerk," and "magic doesn't change," there's still the contact issue. Granted, it's not like she hasn't come up with several other good points, but still. Elliot's plan just has way too many flaws.

Also, for that new spell... well, if nothing else, I can see that possibly working as an emergency disguise for a whole group (and Ellen doesn't have time to manually hand them out), but it sounds like there's very little control over it. That sounds like something with a Godzilla Threshold attached.